* Posts by Dave 126

6073 posts • joined 21 Jul 2010

Apple stuns world with Donald Trump iPhone

Dave 126
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Re: The important bit

I have a Z3 Compact (4.6"), and it is significantly wider than the 4" iPhone 5.

I have average-sized hands for a British male, and my thumb can easily reach 80% or so of the Sony's screen, and 100% with a slight stretch. If the dials on my use-case were twiddled so that I spent more time speaking on the phone, I might have chosen a 4" phone (if a 4" Android with fast internals existed) because it is just that little bit more secure in the hand (the hand is closer to it's relaxed, slightly curled position).

A 4" phone is like playing cards, designed to be easy to hold in a hand. A 5"+ phone is like a postcard, better for displaying a picture. All design and engineering is compromise.

>It looks like Apple may be starting to reduce prices in the face of the Chinese starting to think about Europe and the US.

Also Apple's plans regarding China and India. Don't overlook how much cheaper the new iPhone 5 SE is compared to all of Apple's previous new up-to-date (internally) iPhones.

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Dave 126
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Re: 4 year old phone design resuscitated

> but I was a bit surprised to see this new phone in an ancient (in tech terms) case.

This iPhone 5 SE is in an old industrial design to differentiate it from the pricier 6S and 6S Plus models, with which it shares most of its critical components (SoC, camera).

The iPhone SE is cheaper at launch than even the plastic iPhone 5C. This is the first time Apple has offered a fully up-to-date iPhone at such a low (by their standards) price.

I like Sony's Xperia phone designs, and don't think they should change for change's sake, though I can't help but note that if my Z3 Compact had an aluminium bezel like the iPhone 5S/SE it wouldn't currently have a broken screen (The Z3 Compact is a great phone, but the official Sony case is rubbish, and only protects the phone on three sides... and guess which side fell against a sharp edge)

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Dave 126
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Re: Differentiation is skin deep.

>They have had a pretty good run and there main job now is not to lose customers. They are definitely in maintenance mode.

I largely agree, though I will note that 'the next big thing' is an 'unknown unknown'.

In support of your statement, the iPhone SE is the cheapest ever new iPhone, cheaper than the plastic iPhone 5 C was at launch. For the the first time, a new iPhone with the latest internals and camera (more or less) is less than £400. This is the price range that I bought my last Android phone (Xperia Z3 Compact) just over a year ago, and until recently was full of Chinese phones with the same specs as pricey Korean flagships (though these have begun to drop to the £200 ish range, if you can find one).

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Dave 126
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Re: What makes a Pro?

Apple's nomenclature is becoming a little unwieldy, it's true.

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Dave 126
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Re: Snide remarks

>Yep, 'cos my ever increasing photo collection is so easily stored on some poxy little device with only 128GB storage.

I wouldn't trust my photo collection to any one device, be it a laptop with two HDDs or a tablet. At a minimum, you should have any data you care about backed up to another device. Ideally in another building. Many routers have a USB socket for doing this on the cheap with an external HDD, and better performing NASs aren't much more - especially if you compare all the time you've invested in taking 500 GB+ of photos.

You can even configure your NAS to encrypt your data before copying it to the cloud, or get a second unit in your shed or friend's house - in case of fire or theft.

If you're that serious about your photos, you'll nip over to Anandtech and review the colour accuracy of screens from Apple, Samsung, MS, Lenovo etc. For serious workflows, local storage really isn't the chief criterion http://www.anandtech.com/show/9766/the-apple-ipad-pro-review/8

(Typed on a Dell with a 128GB spinning-rust HDD that is perfectly good for CAD and Photoshop. I'm not the only one using a 5 year old laptop, either)

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Dave 126
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Re: maybe next year ...

>They will discover there is also a market for candy bars,

These are widely available and cheap.

>flip, sliders and BB style QWERTY.

Get on Kickstarter then - easy enough to test the waters. If portable text input really is your thing, a phone case incorporating a Microwriter-style chorded keyboard would be a very good solution (and cheap to prototype and manufacture). The only downside would be the learning curve, but typing speeds faster than a small QWERTY would soon be achieved. It would also be suitable for blind users, and discreet note taking.

As for a BB style keyboard... give it a year or two and see if BB's hardware IP gets licensed out.

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Dave 126
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Re: Miniature big iPad

>I'd also like a machine with a bigger screen, say around the size of a book for when I want to read stuff, like when I'm on the train. ...

>Microsoft - you might also want to consider this too

The crazy thing is, Microsoft had a prototype years ago that was the size of a thin paperback that opened out to reveal two screens. It was called the 'Courier', and rumour is that Bill Gates told Ballmer to kill it. Obviously it wasn't suitable for watching films, but would have been very good at collating and annotating information, and making notes and sketches. It would also be the perfect companion to a 4" phone.

I really want a jacket-pocket sized tablet with high-end stylus for making sketches on the go (and of course, CAD allows sketches to become virtual models, force diagrams, rapid iterations, whatever). Think a iPad Mini Pro, but I don't care who makes it as long as the screen and digitiser are up to par.

It's interesting to note that Apple's Marc Newson has always recorded his initial concepts on a conventional A5 notepad (you don't need acres of space to sketch the essence of a concept - you can expand upon it later when you're back at your desk). Jony Ive isn't much of a computer user either - he prefers sketches and hand-formed materials at the initial design stage.

Of course designers have niche needs (greater than twittering or watching movies), which is why MS killed the Courier, and why Apple never bothered (before the iPad Pro) to step on Wacom's toes with something like a stylus-driven MacBook.

Interesting times.

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Dave 126
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Re: Good phone makers start to recognize there's a market for 4" devices...

Aye. I have a Sony Z3 Compact, but even that has a 4.7" screen and is quite a bit wider than an iPhone 5.

We all have different preference and compromises, but it'd be good to have a choice.

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FBI backs down against Apple: Feds may be able to crack killer's iPhone without iGiant's help

Dave 126
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>How annoying would it be if, as stupid as it sounds, it turned out they did actually just copy all the data and crack the pin code in a VM?

That wouldn't work. You would also need the device's hidden ID, so get your acid and diamond tools ready.

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Dave 126
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Re: Iceberg aircraft carriers

A boat made of ice is self-repairing. It works.

However, espionage by psychic flying on the astral planes or whatever is pure hokum.

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Dave 126
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Re: Entirely predictable...

>Edward Snowden said weeks ago that the NSA didn't need any help from Apple.

Apple have released a few iterations of hardware and firmware since Snowdon was in the game.

This Apple/FBI spat actually goes back 18 months when Apple released iOS 8 and closed a loophole the FBI had been routinely using. Apple even sent the FBI a beta of iOS 8.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2016-03-20/the-behind-the-scenes-fight-between-apple-and-the-fbi

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Something useful from Cupertino?! Apple sees the light – finally

Dave 126
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Re: Already baked into my phone

Apple didn't copy 'Android'. Apple copied f.Lux because it is a good idea... and available on Windows, OSX, Linux and iOS, but not Android. So what? Further more, Apple bake it into a popular OS and bring it to people's attention.

f.Lux is great, but useless to you if you've never heard of it.

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Dave 126
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Re: Meh

>I hope they don't think they can patent or copyright this?

No, many similar products already exist. f.Lux say their product is patent pending, but I've heard of no great spats between them and makers of similar software. Nor can it copyrighted, naturally.

>It MAY work for OLED screens, but LED lit LCD are violet/blue LEDs with yellow phosphor to provide the "white" backlight and this idea is poor on them

You''ve misunderstood LCD screens. The resulting white light is filtered through LCDs. Hence the name. And I can confirm that f.Lux works very very well on my LED-backlit LCD screen.

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Dave 126
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Re: f.lux on PCs does the same

Likewise. It's possibly the one app I've spread the word about in real life.

It's good that it's been baked into an OS. f.Lux have never charged for their software, and doesn't carry advertisments. I did notice this on their website, though:

f.lux is patent pending. Do you make a cell phone, display, lighting system, or other cool sleep tech, and want to talk about collaboration? Email us:

Reading behind the lines, it's as if they've always wanted Apple to make them a deal. I don't know that has happened. Of course granted patents only cover the 'how', not the 'what', and Apple could likely have found their way around any fLux patent.

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What to call a £200m 15,000-tonne polar vessel – how about Boaty McBoatface?

Dave 126
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Re: Good Ship Venus

Upon the wretched penguins

The crew committed grave sins

The birds they trussed

For a might thrust

Whilst grabbing hold of their wings

- I'm sure Loudon Wainwright III could pen better, filthier lyrics.

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Intel in 3D and virtual reality dash

Dave 126
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Re: Didn't we do VR back in the '90s?

We also did PDAs in the nineties, but the Apple Newton and even PalmPilot never achieved the ubiquity of today's capacitive touchscreen phones.

Tablet computers had been kicking around for a long time, but again were niche and largely built around Intel chips and WindowsXP Tablet Edition. They didn't become popular until SoCs became more efficient and more suitable GUIs had been developed.

Today's VR has some big advantages over efforts in the nineties:

- very low cost of entry for consumers to test the waters, if they already have a 5" smartphone they can cobble up a headset with some cardboard and lenses. More sophisticated integrated headsets are cheaper to make today (LCD screens, gyros and accelerometers) than they ever have been.

- content is easier to create. Live action VR content is easier to create today, with multiple HD cameras and clever software trickery allowing passible 360 scenes to be captured.

-support from some big players in the consumer space, such as Sony, Samsung, Facebook, Steam, Intel etc. In the nineties, Forte Technologies made a VR headset - but only really Gravis Ultrasound users had heard of them.

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Facebook, WhatsApp farewell BlackBerry

Dave 126
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>Quite a clear example of why the concept of downloadable "apps" for phones was stupid from the very beginning.

In the beginning, apps were a solution to:

-sub optimal text input

-low mobile data allowances

-integration with phone hardware that the browser couldn't do.

Things are different now. There are still some good reasons to have apps, and also moves by Google to use an app without installing it.

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Dave 126
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>Quite possibly due to the fact I don't see the point in CandyCrushSodaFarmStoryFriendsVajazzle.

That's akin to saying you don't see the point of a record shop because you don't like the high-selling pop music aimed at teenagers. Nor do I. There will still be a Jazz and Classical section towards the back of the store though.

Okay, that analogy is showing my age!

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A Logic Named Joe: The 1946 sci-fi short that nailed modern tech

Dave 126
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>I don't know, linking human psychology to the internet and bringing out the worst in people is a bit far fetched.

Libraries give information, but within the context of a dry, academic, lethargic environment. On the internet, some impressionable fools are able to find like-minded idiots, and achieve confirmation bias. A little knowledge is a dangerous thing.

Beyond that, it is hard for me to judge in personal experience. I'm just glad that I came of age after 'gonzo' pornography became the norm (through the internet*). It's weird being with women ten years younger than myself and have them ask me what I want in such a way to infer that their perspective and that of their past partners has been informed by stuff they've been watching since their early teens**.

As an adult, I have no problem with the Marquis de Sade... it's clear from his comments about wanting to rape the sun that he was expressing a vector, not a destination, and that itself was a valid comment upon the insatiability of desire. Or whatever. The point is, I'm not taking him literally in a 'monkey see monkey do' kind of way. My views are informed by drinking lots of tea and beer with individual females.

*Of course, teenagers in mainland Europe in the 1990s could get their fill of smut from cable TV. Knowing them as adults in their twenties they seem just as well adjusted, if not better, than us censored Brits. Somerset Maugham commented about the inverse relationship between sexual material and sexual violance.

** Nothing new. According to one old dear, sat in her garden with a pith helmet and a garden gun because "the herons are after my gold fish again", anal sex was "all the rage" in the 1930s. One can't get pregnant in that way!

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Dave 126
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...there was no tin-opener to be found. . .I took the tin off myself and hammered at it till I was sick at heart, whereupon Harris took it in hand. We beat it flat; we beat it back square; we battered it into every shape known to geometry - but we could not make a hole in it. Then George went at it, and knocked it into a shape, so strange, so weird, so unearthly in its wild hideousness, that he got frightened.

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Dave 126
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Re: 3 men in a boat

I read Three Men on the Brummel after reading Kurt Vonnegut's Slaughter House Five. The latter, being set during the fire-bombing of Dresden in WWII read as a lament for the city. Three Men on the Brummel clicked with me for being an account of the city as it once stood.

That, and the narrator's observation that all by-laws are enforced by exact fines, thus any normal young Englishman could visit Germany and steal a policeman's helmet and walk on a lawn, and able to budget for his holiday down to the pfennig.

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Dave 126
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Re: I Keep Remembering It

>someone who asks how he can murder his wife

Poison her with chocolate. All chocolate is deadly toxic to wives.

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Dave 126
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>The web as a store of information is basically the old Public Library system with wider scope.

Yep! In the Victorian book Three Men in a Boat, the narrator becomes a hypochondriac by reading medical textbooks in the British library. I have since seen a parallel with people self-diagnosing on the internet.

There were other Victorian phenomena that could be seen as precursors to those in A Logic Named Joe. For example, subscribers could listen to live concerts, delivered over telephone. 'On demand entertainment' wasn't that unheard of.

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Apple engineers rebel, refuse to work on iOS amid FBI iPhone battle

Dave 126
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>How do the FBI crack one iPhone without being able to crack *all* iPhones?

The FBI's request was that Apple write a custom version of iOS that allows an unlimited number of pass-code guesses without locking the phone (currently, iOS allows you three guesses, then makes you wait thirty seconds for a fourth guess, then a minute for a fith guess, then ten minutes... etc), and then an FBI agent would take the iPhone in question to Apple. The FBI could claim that they were not asking to be given the custom iOS version, but ionly for Apple to use it under their supervision.

However, Apple claim that if the do write said software, the doors would be open for the FBI to ask to use it again in future (the 'thin end of the wedge' argument).

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Dave 126
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>Any one want an anti democratic phone?

An ideal democracy might be one in which private citizens can privately communicate with each other to discuss who to vote for. Or discuss forming their own political party and hold themselves up to be voted for (or not) by their peers. There have been in history cases of US government organisations infiltrating and smearing groups with political views that differ from their own.

>A phone or tablet produced by a terrorist supporting company?

Terrorists also use Casio watches and Toyota vehicles. Some might use Sure For Men anti-antiperspirant deodorant for all I know (I can image the advert now... "When you have spent all day trekking across a hot desert carrying a heavy anti-aircraft missile, you need protection you can trust!" )

I notice that Donald Trump's iPhone boycott lasted all of about three days.

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Dave 126
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Re: The end of Apple

>A. For most people in the US, China has little to no interest in spying on them 24/7. Unlike the US Government."

>>Are you kidding? The Chinese government would love to be able to tap into any US phone any time they wanted.

The Chinese (corporations and government) are more interested in corporate and strategic espionage. So they would be interested in what was on the HDD of a US aerospace engineer, but not too bothered about Mrs Trellis's (of North Wyoming) holiday snaps.

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Astronaut trio blast off to space station with ... er, rearview mirror toy?

Dave 126
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Or a nodding Churchill Insurance bull dog voiced by Bob Mortimer.

Also, the very first appearance of the Sega character Sonic the Hedgehog was as an air freshener dangling from the rear-view mirror of a car in the arcade racing game Rad Mobile.

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Dave 126
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>probably started by Gagarin like so many other traditions.

I like the tradition of cosmonauts and astronauts peeing against the wheels of the crew transporter on the way to the launchpad. Gagarin first did it out of necessity, and subsequent crews have done it because it is lucky. Apparently female cosmonauts bring a pre-filled bottle of pee (cue a Blue Peter style "Here's one I made earlier!") with them to splash on the wheels.

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Woz: World-changers to Apple Watches, why pay for an overpriced band?

Dave 126
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>WTF is "The Internet"- as a representation of a social group- supposed to mean these days anyway?

What the fuck does 'WTF' mean?

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Dave 126
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Re: watch bands

>I'm not a wrist-band guy myself, but Woz isn't either, and doesn't pretend to be.

Woz takes some delight in gadgets and tinkering. He's been known to wear an expensive, unusual, impractical (and I think fun) Nixie-tube watch.

http://www.cathodecorner.com/nixiewatch/

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Dave 126
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Re: Who actually wears a watch anymore, and why?

>Who actually wears a watch anymore, and why? Serious question.

@ jake

You've told us before that Mrs jake keeps horses, and so I assume she also rides them. Surely it would be easier for outdoors people such as her to tell the time without letting go of the reigns with one hand digging into a pocket?

Not everybody wakes up next to an alarm clock, eats their breakfast under the kitchen clock, drives to work with a clock on their dashboard, sits in front of a computer with a clock on teh desktop etc etc. Many people do, I grant you, but surely you can agree that not everybody does?

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Dave 126
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The obvious to Woz. I have a lot of respect and affection for him. I like that his personal watch is huge and impractical, since it uses Nixie tubes to display the time. It's an item of 'self expression' for him, since he's a proud hands-on geek.

However, leaving to one side the argument over the utility of smartwatches, if you wish to sell lots then you have to appeal to people who have a different view about their own image.

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NASA celebrates 50-year anniversary of first spaceship docking in orbit

Dave 126
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Re: On a positive note...

>It does however feel like playing number games when the entire Middle East and swathes of Africa appear to be on fire.

Maybe. But then sometimes people become apathetic because a situation is reported as hopeless.

In any case, we should never let ideas of 'what should be done' inform our perception of the facts. Get the facts clear first, and you will be better empowered to do the right thing. If you bodge your outlook to fit an ideology, no matter how well intentioned or benign, you will do nobody any favours.

(And for sure, the situations in parts of the Middle East and Africa are terrible and complex in their causes and possible solutions, and are not to be underestimated.)

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Dave 126
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Re: On a positive note... / Dave 126

>Care to share your data on that?

My pleasure:

http://ourworldindata.org/VisualHistoryOf/Violence.html#/2

(Though it was probably something I originally heard ion the radio)

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Dave 126
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Re: On a positive note...

Ah well.

Still, there are billionaires who are set on going to Mars, and who seem to have a working business model to develop the required kit.

And the percentage of the world's population caught up in violent conflict is at a historical low.

And yeah, we have a massive world population, some of whom have miserable lives, but still leaves a few more billion souls leading happy enough lives today than there were a few decades ago.

I'm not an unalloyed optimist, but sometimes you need to look at things afresh to maintain an approximation of objectivity.

There are going to be some challenges ahead of all of us.

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Remix OS: China's take on an Android operating system – but for PCs

Dave 126
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Re: @naive - Promising

>"Android is a bugger to keep up to date and patched...

>>That's wrong. Native Android devices (Nexus) for example get security patches on a regular basis

Sorry, I mean that Android is a bugger for the *vendors* to keep patched and up to date.

Google release the new code, Platform Development Kit, to the chipset vendors (eg Qualcom) who then release a Board Support Package to the ODM (in the case of Nexus, that might mean LG or HTC or whoever). Test, and repeat if needed. With Nexus devices is no carrier involved to slow things down further, but the update might still have to be tested by regulatory authorities. Repeat if needed.

So updates for Nexus devices will be quicker than for others, but it still requires more effort on the part of the involved parties than it would if Google were to create a mobile OS from scratch today.

Or course this is transparent (not a bugger!) for the end-user, so you're correct in that way.

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Dave 126
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Re: Hmmm, Intel and Android...

>If you want fast graphics with low power requirements, an AMD APU craps all over the Intel + separate graphics card equivalent.

That's as maybe, but are you going to be using your fast graphics 100% of the time? Probably not.

If you use high-performance graphics for most of the time (you're a gamer, or run engineering simulations etc) then you'd do well not to stray too far from a wall socket, regardless of your CPU vendor.

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Dave 126
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Re: @naive - Promising

>Combined with google apps, google could offer an alternative for Windows PC's which would be hard to ignore by CFO's.

Android is a bugger to keep up to date and patched. Some technical reasons dating back to Android 1.0 mean that keeping Android promptly updated and patched is a mess. Hence Google's ChromeOS, which can be kept up to date very easily.

>I keep finding the lethargy of google on this area quite amazing, there is an enormous opportunity for an unified android for phones tablets and desktops.

Android apps are largely geared towards a touchscreen interface. ChromeOS apps are more geared towards mouse and keyboard. ChromeOS is more modern than Android, and was no doubt designed with knowledge earned from the development of Android. i.e pitfalls were avoided.

>Also with phones which can be used as PC.

Meh. So say MS and Ubuntu. I can't be arsed. Much better user experience from buying discrete SoC-on-a-HDMI-stick - the bill of materials is pretty low. Software should be used instead to manage syncing active documents etc between phone and stick. More akin to Apple's (actually existing and used) 'Continuity' feature twixt iOS and OSX machines. It's the better idea - so steal it.

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Dave 126
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Re: Disappointed, no "new" OSes

>Well, a new non-Linux, non-Windows, non-BSD OS is a tall order.

Nor is QNX new (indeed, it is long battle-hardened in safety-critical systems), and it underpins BB10 which can run some Android apps (with some voodoo).

QNX's small size and real-time nature actually make it a better fit for most IoT applications than Linux. However, it is not open source, so organisations will build their wares on the potentially sub-optimal* but cheaper and more convenient starting point of Linux.

*sub-optimal in the horses-for-courses sense. I'm not knocking Linux per se.

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Dave 126
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Re: Hmmm, Intel and Android...

>there is AMD as well as Intel in the x86 sphere

There is AMD, but they have been struggling to match Intel's performance/Watt for a while now, making them sub-optimal for mobile applications.

The trend over the last few years had been for laptops et al to be sold on the duration of their battery, as opposed to how fast they are outright. Since the tasks that most consumers put laptops to are already fast enough with existing CPUs, it seems a sensible choice.

- http://www.anandtech.com/show/10000/who-controls-user-experience-amd-carrizo-thoroughly-tested

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Who'd be mad enough to start a 'large-scale fire' in a spaceship?

Dave 126
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>But what about the whole, everybody dies thing

?

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Dave 126
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Re: Saffire-4?

Maybe, as long as they are certain that an 'uncontrolled fire' doesn't result in debris being propelled into an orbit where it might interfere with other spacecraft.

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Dave 126
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Re: Why would NASA want to turn a strip into a crisp? (Or into smoke)

>Or is it that they came to realize some materials classed as non-flammable still may be ignited, given the right amount of heating?

There is also the scenario of an oxygen cylinder leak, and in such an oxygen-enriched atmosphere many materials that we think of as not flammable can catch fire.

Sadly NASA do have experience of this on Earth. Apollo 1's three crew members died in a launch rehearsal test, because their cabin was pressurized with pure oxygen.

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Why should you care about Google's AI winning a board game?

Dave 126
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Re: As Emo Philips said...

Give Boston Dynamics another year or so and you won't be so cocky! :)

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Dave 126
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Re: @Dave Bollocks

>So can humans think 80 moves in advance?

No, we don't. And even before DeepBlue beat Garry Kasparov, computers were calculating far more moves ahead than the humans that beat them at chess. Humans tackle the problem differently. Go players talk of 'intuition', i.e they aren't calculating the the decision tree in a formal manner, but relying on familiarity and a 'feeling' in some situations.

Mr Gumby - just play some Go, and things will become clearer. There are free versions (you vs CPU) you can play on your PC or tablet. For a quick game, you can play on a 9X9 grid. It's very easy to learn. Enjoy!

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Dave 126
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Re: @FatGerman

Here's Murray Campbell, one of the leads in IBM's DeepBlue computer that beat Garry Kasparov, on the difference between Go and Chess:

I don’t play Go, I’ve only played a few games in my life, but I certainly know a fair amount about it. Both games are immensely huge and once you get past 10 to the hundredth power, 10 to 120, 10 to 170 [in number of possible positions], they’re all just immensely huge, very complex games. But Go has the characteristic that wasn’t true in chess, that it’s very difficult to evaluate a Go position just by looking at it. A medium-good chess player like myself can sit down and in a few hours probably write an evaluation function that is pretty good at evaluating chess positions — nowhere near grandmaster level, but it’s good enough that when you combine it with the search it produces very high quality play.

- http://www.theverge.com/2016/3/12/11211306/ibm-deep-blue-murray-campbell-alphago-deepmind-interview

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Dave 126
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Re: @Dave Bollocks

>(Do this for 10 levels of recursion deep.)

That is the issue, Mr Gumby: the advantage or otherwise of a certain move might not be apparent until the later stages of a game, often 80 moves or more later. (In this respect it is very unlike chess, where generally materiel and position can be analysed).Certainly well beyond the ten moves you give it. So even if you whittle your choice of roughly 19*19 choices down to 100 (?), you could still be looking at 100^80, and still not know if the individual move helps you.

>I'm not sure of how fast this would be..

to asses a possible 100^80+ moves? How many universes have you got?

>but if its too slow...

It will be. By dozens of order of magnitude.

> but that should be more than enough to beat a human.

No, it never has been. Not even against amateur club players, let alone professionals. Which is why this AlphaGo team have not used the approach you have outlined.

>While I am not a Go player.

That is clear. But hey, you're not an idiot. You just overlooked an aspect of a game you haven't played, that's all. It's like the proverb of the man who takes as payment from a king of a grain of rice, doubled on each square of a chess board. 1,2,4,8... (and 60 squares later...)

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Re: Poker

>GO which is afterall basically a game of logic.

Go is not really logic in the traditional sense. Certainly not basic logic. You can't know whether a certain move is good or bad until many, many moves later. Have you played?

>Poker Seems to me to be a better game to evaluate human type 'thinking'

That is not their goal. Baby steps and all. Also, poker just wouldn't make a great example of any single thing, such as face recognition, or narrow-bandwidth IR sensors. Detractors would say the poker-bot had an unfair advantage (no face, no tell). It's just unclear.

Anyway: https://xkcd.com/1002/ "Difficulty of various games for computers"

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Dave 126
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Re: Maybe it's not all it's cracked up to be?

>That sounds to me much more like human programming than genuine machine learning

No, it isn't human programming.

Why are you repeating to us something you've roughly grasped from the BBC didn't who didn't fully grok a tweet by a man who was just exhibiting good sportsmanship? Surely you've heard the expression 'Chinese whispers'?

Go to the source:

https://deepmind.com/alpha-go.html

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Dave 126
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It can't learn from anyone on the internet.

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