321 posts • joined 16 Dec 2009
Re: Special @terry 6
that must have been the SAP CRM system at work !
Re: Aunty Shirley off on one again.
and don't forget all the boddles of lolly that OFCOM get in access fees & (FM) spectrum sell off fees.
I suspect OFCOM will be the real thieves/winners here
Re: Spectrum is go?
it costs a lot more to licence a multiplexer than a straight forward FM/AM tranmitter(s)
It costs a lot more to run
and - you can cram a lot more (low quality) DAB channels onto a multipexer than you can squeeze FM transmitters into the same broadcast bandwidth
It may just be all about maximising OFCOM's income - to the detriment of the public
Re: Digital radio
AM is the lowest power consumption
FM comes next
iPlayer/TuneIn radio app would come along behind FM
and then a long long way behind that is DAB - particularly if you want a 'hi-fi' solution (decent stereo bit rate not the cut down minimum spec (often mono) bit rate used in the UK DAB system - the 'new' 'improved' standard for DAB used to squeeze as many channels as possible on the the multiplexers is nowhere near CD standard - never mind BBC FM Broadcast standard)
Equal pay - it would be good if it was
Lets take a well publicised real world example
Wimbledon Tennis Final
After years of screaming & shouting the proze money for both men's & women's finals are the same.
except this is a very good example of why it is so hard to get this right.
Women play 3 sets
Men play 5
And they play that through all the rounds; so by the time a person gets to the Final; the male has been vastly underpaid; all because many people seem to confuse SAME with EQUALL VALUE
Which also explains why there is a massive failure to understand the importence of experience in SOME jobs; taking a year off; needs more than a year to regain the lost experience & exposure; even 3 months off can cost more than a year's experience in some fast moving industries.
Re: Antactica is melting too
what are the error margins on that sir ?
oops - the so called warming is less than the error margin which means it is merely NOISE not a trend or anything else.
There has been no statistically significant warming over the past 18 years. If you insist on being pedantic (in which case never stoop to talking about Carbon - its CO2; never complain about the risks of Climate change - its CATASTROPHIC climate change that could be a problem).
CATASTROPHIC climate change is a myth - CLIMATE CHANGE is natural and the observerd changes over the last 100 years are with in bounds of previous changes and are not unique nor unprecedented over many thousands of years.
The null hypothosis that the observered changes to the climate are entirely natural has yet to be disproven; therfore the CATASTROPHIC climate change hypothosis remains just that - an unproven hypothosis. But don't let the scientific method get in the way of the hysteria; or the correct interpretation of noisy graphs.
Re: Antactica is melting too
but to melt the ice; the air temperature has to be > 0C.
Which only happens rarely over the Antartic.
And only in the Antartic Summer - which is still a couple of months off
Yes there is some anomolous warming (probably caused by vulcanism) around the Antartic peninsular - but that is a comparatively small area (.. of the Antartic land mass) and last time I heard; vulcanism is nothing to do with man; or CO2 emmissions (on the contrary; vulcanism is a large producer of CO2).
The climate models used to predict Catastrophic global warming failed totally to predict an increasing Antartic ice extent; just as they failed to predict the 18 year lack of warming; or predicted the non existant tropo hot spot. In short the climate models are a busted flush. Let me put it in IT terms - if your model of your corporate network predicted that you coud not exceed 1MB bandwidth; but you constantly achieved 1GB bandwidth; what would you do with the model ? Junk it; or insist that reality is wrong and the model right ?
am I just paranoid ?
cutting through the “jungle” of technical standards, developing safe and fair contract terms and conditions, and establishing a European Cloud Partnership
sounds more like a way to enforce one monolithic arbitary (but probably the worst possible) set of standards on EU companies & people.
It wil then be made llegal to offer anything that some ignorant politician can broadly define as 'Cloud Computing' using any other standards, methods or contracts. Especially once they work out how to tax it all.
No doubt there will be lots of compulsory back doors so they can keep an eye on things (for our own benifit -not).
Re: Could we have some screenshots on a widescreen monitor
well of course you can
You've been able to put the task bar on any edge since W95
the fact that most WIndows programs & WIndows OSs can't cope with it is the fault of the user not the naff programming by Windows OS devs
Of course; with wide monitors it is obvious that no one would want to move Application menus to one side or the other as well I mean; look at all that height you have to fill up with ribbons & stuff
what;; you wanted useful stuff for users from Redmond ?
Re: Windows 7 with a flat theme
because there is an old old Engineering saying (probably pre-dates Brunell)
'If it ain't broke; don't fix it'
which is fully understood by Engineers to be an ironinc play on English (and the 'ain't' construct).
But then Engineers tend to be clever people; wot can speak english proper like what they was taughted to when having to deal with non-Engineers; and can recognise an old chestnut when they see it as well !
but the basic (and most common ones) are all Windows standards
and work just about everywhere in MicroSoft Office - all flavours and in just about every Windows OS since Windows was first foisted on us.
And amazingly they almost always work in every other WIndows hosted program too !
OF COURSE this requires a small smidgeon of effort - most people will only need about 10 any way (select all-copy/cut - paste-save-close window-close program-print-open explorer-undo-redo)
Now they can get stuff done with less risk of RSI & a damn sight faster !
Re: It would save time if ...
and Churchill also said that the UK did not need to have an HRA - because we had the far supperior Common Law & Bill of Rights (yes we do have a written constitution - oh my; they had to break it illegally to get the stupid HRA into law)
that depends if they re-instate Common Law & Habeas Corpus that they had to (illegally) abrogate before they could REDUCE our rights with the un-needed by Common Law jurisprudence EHRC & the enabling act.
When originally mooted the EHRC was not deemed to be as strong as UK Common Law rights & therefore it was not only unnecessary to 'enable' the EHRC but would in fact (and did) remove our Common Law rights leaving us all less protected (30 day detention ring any bells ? Illegal under Habeas Corpus).
You did know that Habeas Corpus is no longer part of the law didn't you ? Because Habeas Corpus & assorted other Common Law rights PREVENTED the EHRC from working.
So get the right end of the stick - get rid of the pathetic HRA and restore Common Law rights; so for instance just one example of REDUCED rights :
- No extradition unless
-- it is a crime in the UK
-- there is prima facia evidence that there is a case to answer under UK law
-- No foreign governments/courts would have primacy over the Law Committee of the House of Lords ( now replaced by the very inferior Supreme Court - a court that is NOT supreme because it can be overruled by FOREIGN courts who run a complete different jurisprudence that is NOT compatible with Common Law)
Shove the Human Rights Act; Common Law countries don't need an inferior copy of what we have (because that is what the EHRC is; an inferior copy; weakened because Code Napoleon can not tolerate the State NOT being supreme)
Re: Proper clipboard support
so that is 20 years of abject stupidity then
it is such a stupid concept; where the hell did they ever come up with it ?
along with some 15 other defaults - mosty in Explorer
Re: lets look at this in another way..
But it is normal people NOT geeks who make up the market
as has been shown time & time again geek sales != profit (quite often geek != sales | geek = give away)
so geek sales are either niche; marketing or supported by volume sale to normal people
since Thatcher ?
since long before Thatcher - probably since the end of the 1st World War.
WIlson & co had no truck with engineers or scientists either - unless they were party credentialed (lysenkoism)
What is it with people who blame Thatcher for everything - ? She's been gone these many years; we've had Blair and Brown who definatlely hated engineering & science; & Cameron who wouldn't understantand what a thesis was if you made him learn the definition by rote; using single sylable words ! News for you - NONE of the governments following Thatcher have attempted to reverse any of her most conservative/capitalist/sane anti-big government policies; so if you don't like Thatcherism you must hate all the modern political parties.
Perhaps the only hope we had was a secretary of education who was prepared to fight the establishment so ALL kids had a chance at learning to try to excell instead of being told how useless they are (indirectly of course; what else is the refusal to allow competition but a subtle way of saying you aren't goog enough ?)
Why do we not value producers & doers - because kids are taught NOT to that's why - science/maths/engineering ts too 'difficult ' so do a gcse in hair straightening or grass growing. Gove had the guts to challange that and finally halt the academic dumbing down.
Why has this come about ? Many reasons no doubt; part of it is that science & technical studies demand ABSOLUTE answers that are mostly either right or wrong - unlike all the soft skills where there are as many right answers as there are politically correct views. And the current powers that be do not believe in ABSOLUTES; evrything is realtive (to their political leanings); to have to face the posibility of being wrong is just too damned soul destroying for the poor things.
Re: Ask a policeman
no no no no
the Home Office (despite lunny left governments [blue & red] trying) MAY NOT issue instructions to any Police Constable or Police Force.
The Home Secretary MAY issue GUIDENCE which is non binding.
The Constables ( a CROWN appointment; not a governement appointment) are responsible (have a legal duty as sworn Constables ) for KEEPING THE PEACE.
As Sir John Peel observerd; every arrest is a FAILURE of the Police. (Look up the meaning of the verb 'to police' as used by the Royal Navy for a better understanding of why this is so)
AND overerly prescriptive laws are BAD laws not good laws in this COMMON law soverign nation. Laws are subject to the 'reasonable man' test - something control freaks (Blairs; governments; etc) hate with a passion; which is why so many of their laws are so bad; they try to prevent Common Law reasonable man tests.
COMMON law is what seperates the civilised Anglosphere from the madness of Code Napolean aka Eutopean Law.
Common law countries are supposed to rely on JURIES being GUIDED by Judges in interpreting the law in respect of the CIRCUMSTANCES under which the accused MAY have broken the law. They are also supposed to consider the INTENT of Parliment in passing said laws as modified by case law and the changing times.
But never mind; let's all vanish down the horrible Code Napolean law you find in the EU ( as rammed into UK law bu the EU) and outside Commonwealth/Anglosphere countries. Freedom IN the law; not continental tyrany UNDER the law.
God Save King George and death to Napolean and all tyrants !
the civil service is out of control
read this stuning cv of the person responsible for the debacle
and then weep that she is not on benefits
it would help if Vaz was not such a slime ball party hack; and actually cared about what went wrong
(Hint to Vaz; it started with the incompetent administration who allowed such an applaing contract to be signed; that would be your lying mob; as against the current lying mob)
Re: QR Menu ?
put the qr on the menu
scan (using table scanner) hit ORDER button
the waiters and waitresses can then concentrate on looking after the clients; keeping tables clean & clear of dirty plates/glasses so their meals become a pleasent experience
and may be they will stop the usless 'is everything ok there ?' noddy questions - because if it isn't ok; you; the waiter/waitress will be 1st to know !
Wow - Real Science
let's see :
Model observed to differ from reality; conclusion model is wrong; model needs to be fixed.
This; as we all should know; is the correct way of doing science; unlike some branches of science where the models are all ways right and it is reality that's wrong; so the data will have to be 'adjusted' to make it match the models.
This novel approach that reality is right would never get any funding in East Anglia or the Pen State ! Next thing you know is that they will have the nerve to make their models and data freely accesible as well; heavans forbid !
Such a warming concept that models may be wrong; not reality !
@DaLo : Ever had a phone call from your bank
Ever had a phone call from your bank
yup & they get asked who what and why; and I refuse point blank to discuss anything other than why they have called me and the fact that THEY have called me; and the fact that it was YOU who called me so no I am not going to do ANY security with them; nor am I going to call back any number they ask me to either. I do tell them that I will phone on the relevent 0800 number so I need their name & reason for the call.
I then phone back on the 0800 number for my bank's general enquiries and ask to be put through to who ever is trying to contact me
Score so far :
3 that were genuine
2 that were sales (with resulting complaint made at the time and by secure email) - sales calls are not of course any reason for having security; I actually consider them to be scams ...
1 that had the bank go charging off soemwhere else to shut down some scam or other .
My bank tends not to phone me now; except by express invite
Re: I rewrote it for you...
or a global car hire company a coupleof years ago charging €800 for a sat nav for 2 weeks in Skanderholigan land.
And the company beancounters agreeing that this was 'good value' despite being able to BUY a decent Europepean satnav next to the Hertz counter for about €300
I take it you are talking about the bastardisation that is SI ?
neither cgs nor mks; just a mish mash of two DIFFERENT metric systems to allow them to come near to proper human (imperial) friendly sized measure.
iirc Drax now has one unit doing biomas fuel the other 5 are undergoing conversion one at a time.
What sort of idiot makes a power station replace high energy concentrate fuel with low energy concentrate fuel that uses a massive amount of fuel to ship it in from the USA ?
what a stupid waste of money; time and energy that is - I wonder whuch politician (or their chums) have their sticky little fingers in that money making scam ?
Re: Oh fsck. Not Lewis Page again.
who don't believe in AGW,
there you go; Science & Engineering do not have room for 'believe in' - they both use demonstrable empiracle FACTS. And models != fact.
I don't not believe in AGW ( and you forgot the all important 'C' for CATASTROPHIC btw; 'cos if it ain't catastrophic what the heck is all the fuss about anyway ?). cAGW just has no facts backing it up; well apart from (sneer) model outputs; 100s of bloody model outputs; so many damn model outputs they can show a model which gives that result which demonstrates that cold/hot; snow/rain/drought; you name it it must be cAGW in action (/sneer)
It's the same with Fukishima & Nuclear power; no factual evidence to support the belief that it must be bad for us.
Belief != Science
Belef != Engineering
Climate changes; politicans tell lies and theft is illegal only because the government hates competition
IT - sometimes my friend - sometimes my enemy
I do Process Control.
I do Remote Support.
Sometimes the IT guys are my best friends; helpful & prepared to learn that a Process system with a life expectancy of 15-20 years is NOT going to do WIndows upgrades; nor is it going to arbitarily shift from its current OS (which could be DOS or later) just because of some new fad from MS. They work with me (& my colleagues) to get it working. Wow; I could almost love them.
Then you get the IT department that RUNS - but still interfers (without asking or checking; blowing a badged CISCO router back to Cisco firmware and trashing all the automation preferential stuff that our Cisco firmware handled correctly; and then crying 'cos the Production manager screamed at the dozy idiots).
Then you get the ones who shove their damned group policy/ arbitarily changed service account name rules onto production servers crashing entire factories. Oh yes; the service account that looked after the SAP connector; just changed; just like that; 3 days loss of production -- moroons. Not even one of their servers.
Then you get the corporate supplier of all things server based; who don't even know how to maintain an SQL server. Tell our clinet they will have to charge them for even looking at the problem they have caused - then having the damned nerve to ask US to inspect their cock up and help their cleint for free; Holy Pisstake; if I wasn't talking to the factory IT guy ( one of the many good guys) about why I thought we were justified in saying NO WAY - and he agreeing with me; I would not have believed what I was seeing/hearing.
Then you get the moroons in OUR IT trying to get a VPN through the moroons in the CLIENT'S IT. Lock them all in a room with no food or water until they sort it out is my answer. How long to fix a site to site VPN you may well ask - try 3 to 6 MONTHS.
And when it comes to running Process Control in VMWare - I've been told by the IT people in a UK factory the ONLY VMWare servers are in the US; and yes please can the DCS run on VMWare servers in the US. Of course bloody well not; IT people ?
Guys - Process Control is NOT the same as Windows Office; or even SAP. And NO we can not test every piece of fixit code that comes out of MS and tell you it will work with ALL our kit. Especially if you work in Pharma or Food & Drugs.
We like to LOCK it all down when we've finished building it. And your factory Process Engineers get kind of antsy when some idiot comes along to fiddle with something that's been working for weeks/months/years.
And since your factory techs & Egineers no longer specialise in our kit; they expect us to remote in & help them fix problems. SO it really is a no brainer - we must have remote access - via a nice secure VPN with proper passwords and proper accounts; of course; what do you think ? That we're as stupid as the damned suits ?
Please remember that if the factory is not making widgets; there is no need for all that back office IT that keeps you employed. So no; I'm afraid 'my' process network is way more important than your network; and no; I do serriously expect to PUSH my data out to your servers and suck your data in; even when I'm playing on the Middleware box.
Please help us to help you; and remember - the devs who make our software ARE Rocket Scientist when it comes to process programing; and don't have time (because we also have stupid suits making impossible demands on us) to pander to the latest IT craze/good idea/sensible recommendations that have just surfaced to replace the last bright ideas the last head of IT had.
And no; I can't make that DCS running on WIndows 2k run on W2k8; it's going to cost £500 000 to £1 000 000 to make that happen - something your company can't afford to do (what with paying some incompetent 3rd party IT 'support' company to break Process servers by pushing unquallified patches on them).
Most of us want to work with you guys in IT to help make BOTH our companies money. We (well most of us) aren't IT specialist (though we've had to learn a lot); most times all we want is a little help and advice; and an understanding that we are trying our damdest to get YOUR factory working efficiently & profitably. So maybe it really is YOU who should be discussing possibilities with YOUR Process Engineers & Techs.
Let's just work together - looking after our mutual client; resolving issues in a nice flexible way. We are not your enemy; honest !
Re: Be afraid...
Wangi in Zimbabwe used to have a power station that was run off a ZX81.
Unfortunately there were too many bullet holes in the place to attempt to recommision it
Wow & I thought comintards were IT literate !
IPads have remote lock & remote factory reset functions built in.
So tea leaves may as well not bother nicking the things
Autocorrect - amazingly you can actually turn this OFF ! Yes, really; it has an OFF button
Witness statements, well what do you know ? I suggest you look up "Self Evident" as an example of a PUBLIC SECURE statement system. Perhaps the free public front end is there because plod is going to use it (idle speculation ). (Did I say plod there or pleb? Darned auto correct )
The Government set up the Tax Avoidance Laws - stop drinking their kool aid !
In the EU a company may choose where it is domiciled for EU tax purposes.
Under EU tax law; that company may only be taxed in the country it chose to domicile itself in.
Only paying tax in Ireland; even though you operate a subsiduary in the UK - well OF COURSE you only pay tax in Ireland
BECAUSE THAT IS EU TAX LAW
Ok add to that charging outrageous 'licence' fees and Head Office 'Services' is not mandated; but a single point of taxation is
(sorry for the USA-ian but it does describe this rather well)
please ask your MP to explain just what Starbucks/Google etc should do - BREAK THE LAW ????
And if you really feel that a company should voluntarily hand over any of its money to the Government I do trust you are leading by example ?
Re: False statment and lack of understanding where retirment accounts are invested.
UK State Pension is paid out of current receipts (current tax take)
It has NEVER EVER come from investments - that is the cause of the black hole in the UK State Pension sector.
What State employees need to understand is that every penny they earn has been TAKEN from some one (or some company) in the Private sector.
If only the NI payments were invested in a Soverign fund; then the State employees may have had a case for whinging when their pensions rights were cut. The sooner they are cut to be no better than the WORST private sector pension the better (because then we'd get proper pensions again)
I must remember to add my grateful thanks to one Gordon Brown who single handledly destroyed the world's best private sector pension system by taxing it and totally cocking up the rules under which they operated. Thanks Gordon; nice to see you linning your pockets with our money after screwing up MY pension; you blithering ignorent idiot.
Re: Virginmedia hardware
After a firmware update or if they just decide to reset it for you; it wakes up in factory reset mode
Why on earth they can not do basic easy stuff is beyond me - if you Virgin (and BT are worse) decide to reset my router; why can't I bill you for setting it up properly again ?
Re: What about the kids who have no aptitude for programming?
and the labour party is the destination for those who can not even manage that level of competance
Re: The real issue with the Dodd-Frank Method @wEASELnO7
Pony burgers come to mind
Re: More details
government blackmail again
nothing new then
Re: In a heart beat 1G ?
Why do they need to retain 1G capability ???
It's a ONE WAY JOURNEY
they won't be coming back down the gravity well .....
they just need to adapt (sucesfully) to their new home's version of 1G - the results of that particular experiment are probably enough on it's own to justify the entire cost
Re: one small problem : "both halves of the debate"
Hideki - did you think to include the SOUTHERN hemisphere in your figures ?
you know; of course that the ANTARTIC is currently 2 standard deviations ABOVE average ?
or how about the TOTAL ice cover for the entire planet - - oops that's about the same as it has been for the whole of the record - which of course doesn't even go as far back as the 1950s when a US submarine surfaced at the North Pole.
We DON'T actualy know what the ice cover is on average EXCEPT over the last few years.
Just like we don't actually know what the earth's average temperature is - but we do know as an absolute piece of empirical science is that it VARIES naturaly. We don't know how or why in detail - we have some theories that appear to explain some long term trends - but we still have no idea what triggers an ice age or an interglacial.
Here's another importent piece of empiracl evidence you can prove all by your self - Life does better when it is warmer not when it is colder.
Lowest temperature on earth - -93C
Hotest temperature on earth - +58 (might be a bit higher)
where is OUR comfort zone - ~20C
So why the panic ? I still fail to see why we can be worried over a couple of degrees warmer - unless you don't believe in science that is (ever heard of Darwin & Survival of the fitest?); life will adapt - just like it always does therough all the climate variations that have ever happened.
disprove the null hypothisis (its natural mate; natural) using empirical observarions not models. Models ain't worth spit; not even simple models of simple systems (like refinaries or economies); for predicting real world outcomes. When there is empirical proof that some other hypothisis explains what is happening BETTER than the null hypotesis; then and only then should any one bother to take any notice.
Re: Keep one asset with XP...Has anyone ever tried XP compatability mode?
and pray do say - what happens after support has ceased ? That's right one massive hole in your security if you allow it access to t'internet
Not to mention XP mode is a pile of kludge compared to VM palyer or workstation (player licence some €70 -ish so compared to a windows licence dirt cheap)
Re: Oh dear...
if it isn't pure scare mongering/green delusion you will of course have a WHO or equivelent reliable organisation's reference for this claim ?
WWF; TEPC, Greenpeace, Japanese Power Ministry are all excluded from the concept of reliable organisation due to past failures to tell the truth
Re: Well, two thoughts...
stirling summary sir !
Anyone pushing for 'Renewable Energy' is either corrupt; ignorant or a political idealogue - or perhaps all three
about the only thing you forgot was :
and doesn't 'think of the children' the majority of whom will live short brutalised peasant lives
There should be a law
That makes any business making such claims identify which piece of 'renewable' energy boondogle will be supplying X% of power requirements; then said business can only use that X% iff and only iff the 'renewable' energy thing is actually working at faceplate value.
At all other times you can only draw the actual percantage produced by said piece of 'renewable' energy thing.
Since wind turbines typically only supply less than 30% of faceplate amount of energy; then the Facebook farm could only AVERAGE less than 30% capacity use. Which would mean Facebook would have to build it big enought to operate at full capacity when the local wind turbines produce 100%; at all other times (some 2/3rds of the time) some to much to all of the bulding would be powered OFF.
And they should have to pay the true; unsubsidised costs (build; generation; maintenance AND return to green field costs) per kW/hr (Note; in the UK land based wind turbines actually cost around 5 to 10 times the cost of conventional generation; marine based cost 10 to 20 the amount)
People then may start to realise; that until we invent a practable form of storing industrial amounts of energy; any 'renewable' energy thing is just an exercise in appalingly bad engineering.
once upon a time
there was a nice little app that let you phone & IM through any firewall/route
and it was secure
hell Tambo Mbeke (sometime successor to Mandela) stopped South African Telkom from trying to make it illegal - because; as he recalled it had allowed him to stay in contact with the ANC in South Africa while he was hidding safely in the US. Winnie Mandela also claimed to have used it to circumvent spies (presumably to help her 'football team' plan on where the spare tires were going). Even Tutu apparently used it - along with thousands of good SA citizens eager not to pay SA Telkom stupid money.
Since MS aquired it; it has become another piece of bloated crap; and; the firm's security team have quite easily blocked it,
unlike most fairy stories that start 'Once upon a time' this story has an unhappy ending.
What on earth is it for now it's been perverted ?
it's modern cheap/efficient manufacturing and design
almost everything nowdays is glued/heat wealded : http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/10/23/surface_pro_2_teardown
it's not just an Apple thing
Re: Oh come on... @ Duncan Macdonald @AC
the adjective is broke
it is a deliberate piece of bad gramar - to underline the lunancy of fixing stuff that ain't BROKE.
when you was taughted english as good as like what i is; then and only then would you perhaps have a chance of gaining a smattering of enough common sense to understand such gramatical constructs.
Re: Oh come on... @Ross K
if your control system is embedded in your plant (as they tend to be)
your capex was based on a 15 to 20 YEAR life
a shut down of the plant of more than 3 hours means a total re-build of the line (or plant going bankrupt)
why would you take the risk ? By the way the plant I am thinking of has been running now with out break for about 10 years - another 5 to go before we can take out the Win2K kit in there; the one with the Win NT kit turns 15 next year and is being shut. The company expects to do a rebuild on the WIn2K plant - it will take about a year - the control system will be some 10% of the cost of the rebuild. It is a multi million euro bit of plant - when rebuilt it will be 1/3rd of the factory (currently just 1/4). The plan for the rebuild is currently 2018 to 2020 window. Fortunately this is not a validated plant - so its fairly cheap to do.
your control system is VALIDATED so ANY change to it requires mountains of paper work and man weeks of validation; a MAJOR change (such as changing the control system to one that will work with the latest fad from the IT world) imposes a masive cost. Example - approx £20K of engineering time for a small upgrade in an Oil & Gas plant (less stringent than Pharma) after going through the validation process required to ensure it is safe put the final bill at £250K. AND there was NO PC hardware changes; the alternative we looked at with a SMALL hardware update doubled the final cost - but only added about 8 hours more engineering time and a couple of £k for equipment.
obviously; you sir; have NEVER been in a modern automated factory. Get hold of this fact : in a modern factory you can NOT just arbitarily change bits of the control system; and courtesy of MS nor can you mix not very old (XP) with more recent kit. We have to deal with 15 to 25 year PLUS life spans.
Re: Oh come on... @ Duncan Macdonald
Not to mention the factories - Pharmaceutical & Food & Drugs Admin compliant sites that would have to completely re-validate the entire control system - AFTER the control system supplier has validated their kit with the new system
That'll be a couple of million in Engineering costs per plant - the cost of the hardware and its licencing is trivial.
I have pharma companies running plant 24x7 on Win NT servers and NT clients.
Not to mention off shore rigs still running DOS box based systems
Engineers 1st rule : if it ain't broke - don't fix it
XP ain't broke - which leads to the interesting question - if MS release a patch that exposes XP boxes to risk; could the Pharma world start a class action ? (I think a few Pharma firms working together may be able to afford more expensive lawyers than even MS could)
Re: Robin Hood etc @codejunkey
and you also forgot
Where was the process that brought Clinto to book for *persuading* Fany Mae & Freddy Mac into making loans to people who were NOT qualified to borrow a cent; never mind the cost of a house.
And the *regulators* who then allowed garbage mortgages to be wrapped up with good risk ?
The crash started when a numbskull who believed he knew better than everone else & insisted that percieved *racism* rather than proper econmics was the reason poor (non-white) people in the States couldn't get mortgages. The crash simpley prooved just how wrong Clinton (and like minded useful idiots) was about the reason poor people (of every colour) couldn't get mortgages. Economics may be a psuedo science - but I'll take it over wishfull thinking any day of the week.
but then they'd have no case
and they's all have to get real jobs
or learn how to do real science based science
that is if they can ever get over their inability to do basic arithmatic
Re: Fear peddling doom mongers surely not?
no - it's not just you !
- Comment Renewable energy 'simply WON'T WORK': Top Google engineers
- All ABOARD! Furious Facebook bus drivers join Teamsters union
- Webcam hacker pervs in MASS HOME INVASION
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