* Posts by Richard Plinston

1266 posts • joined 27 Apr 2009

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Microsoft and Oracle are 'not your trusted friends', public sector bods

Richard Plinston
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> For instance Munich Council spent itro €50 million (subsidised by IBM) just getting a working Open Source stack. Then about €12 million migrating (more than the cost of updating their original licences!).

More of Richto/TheVogon/AC unsupported nonsense.

There is _no_ support for the claim that IBM spent 50million (previously it was claimed to be 30million) on Munich. It may be that IBM has spent 30 or 50million in total on developing open source and Linux for all uses, such as developing it for their mainframes, and having their other software run on it (WebSphere, etc). But they make billions in revenue from having done that. You are attempting to conflate all that development to just one project.

The claim of 12million for migrating comes from a report by HP paid for by Microsoft and has been shown to be complete nonsense. For example it includes costs for new machines every 3 years or so when the reality is that Munich reused the machines that it originally ran NT on. For example it adds costs for re-training to use Linux and ignores any retraining costs to go from NT to XP to Vista to Win7 to Win8 and also to go from Office 2003 to 2007, 2010.

There was _no_ reference to the _actual_ costs that Munich paid, they just invented stuff and claimed it cost more.

> 20% of their stuff - so now have to support both environments.

There are some legacy applications which occasionally need to used. These cannot be converted because they are propriety and the developers either have gone out of business or will not convert them. An excellent example of why closed source applications should be replaced to avoid lock in.

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Hey, Microsoft, we can call Windows 10 apps anything we like – you're NOT OUR REAL MOM

Richard Plinston
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Re: Please, please market it this way MS

> our new world of confusion and non compatability,

It is not a 'new world'. Windows Mobile 6.5 apps (and devices) were killed off by Windows Phone 7. WP7 apps (and devices) were mostly killed off by WP8 (though there was some conversion which may have worked). Now 'Windows apps' are different again.

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Richard Plinston
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Re: Terminology

> 'Script' had to wait for the 80's...

Before that they were job card packs.

> Didn't right many 'programs'..

It that recovering a program that went 'belly up' ?

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Metro app meets Windows 10. A Microsoft win? Maybe after a little improvement

Richard Plinston
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Re: Only techies care about phone OS

> Google won't even supply a WP version of Youtube,

I don't know why you think that Google should write Windows Phone apps.

WP phones and RT can access Youtube quite well - using a browser. What happened is MS wrote a Youtube app for WP that broke the Youtube terms of service, so, like every other user that disobeyed the terms of service, using that app was banned. But they can still access with the browser. MS could change its app to conform to the terms.

It seems that there still is a Youtube app for Windows Phone that is not banned, though it seems to view them in the browser.

http://www.windowsphone.com/en-us/store/app/youtube/dcbb1ac6-a89a-df11-a490-00237de2db9e

> let alone allow MS to use their app store.

MS _is_ using the app store. They have several apps available there such as Office, OneNote, Outlook, OneDrive, Lync, ...

What you probably meant is that Windows Phones can't access the app store (why would they at the moment). They certainly could do if they contracted with Google to install Google services on the phones. WP users _can_ access Play Store (and Google Earth and maps etc) using a browser.

So your assertions are simply wrong.

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Richard Plinston
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> The idea of identical code working on all platforms has been tried so often and just doesn't work. Pick the example of your choice, HTML and the web? Java? CP/M? Unix?

I have written COBOL systems that ran unchanged on CP/M (MP/M actually it was multiuser), DOS/Windows, Unix, Linux, and OS/2.

I have written Python/Glade/SQLite applications that ran unchanged on Windows, Linux and Nokia 800/850 (tablet/phone) several years ago.

> But this is about three (or four, counting the XBone) platforms that MS have absolute control over.

Which is nowhere near _all_ platforms. I suspect that many will be dissuaded from using this _because_ "MS have absolute control".

> That hasn't been done before.

... to your knowledge.

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Richard Plinston
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> a single project that runs on all supported platforms, which will include Windows 10 PCs, tablets, phones, Xbox One and Windows 10 IoT (Internet of Things).

Is the 'Windows 10' transitive ? It seems that these apps will not run on Windows 8 phones, nor on Windows RT (which won't get Windows 10 update). While some Windows Phone 8 phones may be able to update to Windows 10 (phone) it has been said that not all will do so. This means that, yet again, [some] Windows Phones will be left behind as new apps will not run on their devices*.

* WM6.x could not run WP7 apps, WP7 could not run WP8 apps.

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ARM plans to win 20 per cent of the server market by the year 2020

Richard Plinston
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Re: The problem is still the lack of a decent common hardware plattform

> Windows already runs on Arm though,

Windows CE, Windows Phone, Windows RT run on ARM. Not quite server grade are they. But that is not particularly important, what MS would need is MS-SQL Server, IIS, Active Directory and much else to run on ARM.

With Linux it is already there.

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NZ used XKEYSCORE to spy on World Trade Org election emails

Richard Plinston
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> World Trade Organisation elections ... Wellington intercepted emails

And was able to do this because all emails in the world are routed via a couple of lumps of rock in the South Pacific.

It seems more likely that an American government organization intercepted the emails as they went through the network in USA and made them available to other countries. Whether those emails were actually intercepted and whether NZ GCSB viewed them seems to be entirely speculative.

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PIRATES and THIEVES to get Windows 10 as BOOTY

Richard Plinston
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Re: "It is free for the _supported_ lifetime of the device"

I am unsurprised that you posted this anonymously.

> the sheer mangling of the English language in an attempt to make an announcement look sinister

The 'mangling' was adding back the word that Microsoft had deliberately used but was dropped by posters. If it looks 'sinister' then that is what was in the Microsoft statement.

> swollen, self-appointed authoritas

And then you, as a "swollen, self-appointed authoritas", make a definitive statement as if you have a direct brain-feed from Gates. In fact there has been a statement from Microsoft about this:

"""Microsoft's Jim Alkove reiterated the free upgrade for consumers, but a set of guiding asterisks (**) led to the following clarification:

**Details on our device’ supported lifetime policy will be shared at a later time.

"""

http://winsupersite.com/windows-10/microsoft-not-yet-ready-describe-what-supported-lifetime-device-means-windows-10

> There is no subscription model.

Microsoft does have subscription models: 'Software Assurance', 'Office 365'. The question is whether Microsoft's statement that the business plan is 'Windows as a service' will require subscriptions in the same way as 'Office as a service' does.

"""Myerson made it semi-clear in a statement on the Windows blog yesterday…

We'll deliver new features when they're ready, not waiting for the next major release. We think of Windows as a Service -- in fact, one could reasonably think of Windows in the next couple of years as one of the largest Internet services on the planet. And just like any Internet service, the idea of asking 'What version are you on?' will cease to make sense." """

http://winsupersite.com/windows-10/windows-service-windows-10-versionless-windows#comment-740411

Microsoft appear to be changing their revenue model from charging for new versions of Windows every few years to a service model where the increments are small and frequent, and the revenue will also be small and frequent.

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Richard Plinston
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Re: "It is free for the _supported_ lifetime of the device"

> I'm still supporting a 386, and 486,

You won't be worrying about what the Windows 10 supported lifetime is for those.

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Richard Plinston
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Re: Warning

> you'll have to find another hooky copy of win7.

And all the documents that you wrote with Office 2016 will not open in the hooky copy of Office 2007.

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Richard Plinston
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Re: What kind of free is this?

> it's free for the lifetime of the device.

What Microsoft said is: "It is free for the _supported_ lifetime of the device".

The device is supported by the manufacturer during its warranty period. Once the warranty has expired then it will no longer be free and, most likely, a subscription will be required.

> Most consumers get Windows for 'free' anyway, with their purchase of hardware

Completely wrong. It may be bundled into the price of the computer but it is _not_ free. Except for recent small devices the OEM cost of Windows is part of the cost of building the computer and this increases the selling price.

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IDC downgrades sales outlook for PCs AND tablets

Richard Plinston
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>> a fair indication that Microsoft want everyone to be on some sort of 'Software Assurance' plan with an annual, or monthly, fee. What else would 'WAAS' be?

> An attempt to reduce their support base by having run _one_ version of Windows.

... with a monthly or annual fee.

> And your Secure Boot FUD is littered everywhere and provably false. You keep posting it though.

Don't just make vague assertions, get an actual quote and _prove_ it is false.

As the last comment that I made mentioning secure boot was over a year ago (I checked) I don't know where you got the 'keep posting it'. And that one certainly was not 'provably false', nor are any others.

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Richard Plinston
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>> 'Free update' does _NOT_ apply to businesses

> Yes it does. It just doesn't apply to Enterprise editions.

So, you do agree that your blanket 'free in first year, even from Win7 ' was not correct, it is not everyone.

Also, existing Software Assurance customers will still continue to pay and will get the upgrade within that "outside of this offer".

> Also, I don't believe you about "weasel words".

I seems to me that: "Myerson also branded Windows 10 as a "Windows-As-A-Service" platform" is a fair indication that Microsoft want everyone to be on some sort of 'Software Assurance' plan with an annual, or monthly, fee. What else would 'WAAS' be?

> making up lies ... I can easily go find examples from these very forums if necessary.

Fine, do so. They may be things that you don't like, that doesn't make them lies.

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Richard Plinston
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> I agree that business won't buy hardware but it might go for the OS for two reasons.

> 1. Free upgrade if you do it within one year of release, even from Win7

'Free update' does _NOT_ apply to businesses, it is for consumers. Businesses will still pay the 'genuine advantage' or whatever else they are on.

Also the weasel words 'free for the supported life of the device' plus 'Windows as a Service' implies that after the end of the hardware warranty period there will be a recurring charge. I would expect that OEM PCs would have that the price of the service within the warranty period to be included in the computer price.

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Pathetic PC sales just cost us a BILLION dollars, cries Intel

Richard Plinston
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Re: Mobile and Communications segment saw its revenues plummet by 85.3 per cent.

> Intel HAS an ARM licence.

Intel _used_ to have an ARM licence when they bought XScale, but they sold XScale to Marvel.

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CONFIRMED: Tiny Windows Server is on the way

Richard Plinston
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Re: Did no one else notice the trend

> Microsoft announced a version of windows 10 for Raspberry Pi - an ARM processor.

I am sure that conjures up images of a full desktop system running just like Raspian Linux does, or even something like Surface RT or even Windows Phone. In fact MS have stated that it is the 'IoT' version (Internet of Things) and will provide similar facilities to 'other boards'. The other board is the Intel Galileo and this provides _no_ display at all, no GUI, no command line.

> Now they announce a small footprint for a core server.

Windows 10 or RaspberryPi is going to be more like an embedded server. It may even manage some display capability and possibly a command line text interface.

> I predict the next announcement is some kind of runtime / install time utility to allow Intel binary to run on ARM. This will allow migration of developed code to the new platform.

This is the usual highly optimistic speculation often made by uninformed MS fans whenever an announcement is made. Emulation of an x86 or x86-64 on an ARM chip is extremely unlikely for anything other than trivial stuff. I would run so slowly and be so bloated that it would not be worth while.

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He's baaack: Microsoft's axeman Nadella to give Chinese staff the chop

Richard Plinston
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> The biggest problem with Microsoft's phone strategy is that they were far too late to market.

Microsoft's first phone OS was in 2002. In 2007 they had 42% of the US smartphone market.

'Being late' was not the problem.

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Microsoft man: Internet Explorer had to go because it's garbage

Richard Plinston
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Re: Revisionist History

> When web apps were first being developed there was really only a choice of Netscape or IE

It sounds like you were rather late to the game. Before IE existed there were several browsers: Mosaic, IBM WebExplorer, MacWeb, ...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Timeline_of_web_browsers

> The fact that the standards bodies chose not to adopt MS extensions but go another way is really a large cause of the problems we have now.

Nonsense. There were established standards but Microsoft added extensions (as you say) that were deliberately non-standard is order to encourage web developers to make IE-only sites. For example FrontPage (a bought in product) was changed to generate those non-standard extensions to ensure that IE-only sites were really easy to make.

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Richard Plinston
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>> "For users that upgrade to Windows 10, the engine will be evergreen, meaning that it will be kept current with Windows 10 as a service."

That sounds like a subscription model.

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Richard Plinston
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Re: New Can be good

> Internet Explorer started life as Spyglass Inc "Mosaic" browser code.

Almost true. Spyglass said that they originally planned to use Mosaic but wrote new code for IE.

MS did not pay Spyglass though. The deal was that Spyglass would get some amount ($5?) for every copy sold. MS then 'gave it away' and claimed that none were 'sold'. Even when MS claimed that it could not be removed from Windows they also claimed it was not 'sold'.

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Richard Plinston
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> I am damned happy it does not

IE 6, 7, 8 and/or 9 can run on Linux.

Because Windows cannot install more than one version of IE at one time it was useful to use Linux and install multiple versions so that web pages could be tested on the variations that occur with those different versions.

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I'm the wire starter: ARM, IBM tout plug 'n' play Internet of Stuff kit

Richard Plinston
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Re: "But how do I connect it to a lightbulb?"

> No, he is right. It's Duck Tape (brand name).

It is not only a brand name but it refers to the material used in the tape. 'Cotton duck' is a type of tightly woven cotton fabric, often used for tents. The name derives from the Dutch 'doek'. 'Duck tape' is made from duck fabric. 'Duct tape' is any tape which can be used to seal ducts (such as air ducts), and may be 'duck tape', 'Duck Tape (tm)' or other.

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Now with Grunt and Gulp: Cross-platform ASP.NET in new Visual Studio 2015 preview

Richard Plinston
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Re: Dragged, kicking and screaming, into the 21st century

> I suppose I should welcome the fact that MS still try to produce their own compiler ...

The MS C compiler was originally bought in from the people who made the Lattice C compiler.

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HELP! Windows Phone update 8.1 broke my Lumia

Richard Plinston
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Re: Well, since the 930 isn't affected...

> But Panasonic have just brought out a better camera phone on Android

I never understood why Panasonic did not sue Nokia over their trademark LUMIX. LUMIA is only slightly rearranged in the last letter.

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Death knell for Windows with Bing, licences carved up

Richard Plinston
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Re: wouldn't want to rely on google

> Acer AC700 is a paperweight in August 2016

So you are saying that it will stop working on that day, exactly like all the XP machines stopped working last year ?

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Microsoft: Even cheapo Lumias to get slimmed down Windows 10

Richard Plinston
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Re: The great app pissing contest...

> This is tosh. Almost every app that was written for WP7 ran on WP8 unchanged - I know because I switched phones at the time and installed almost everything I had on the new phone.

https://msdn.microsoft.com/library/windows/apps/jj206947(v=vs.105).aspx#BKMK_BreakingchangesinWindowsPhone8

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Richard Plinston
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Re: The great app pissing contest...

> I understand that a large company may opt not to make a Windows Phone version of their app for whatever reason - because they don't perceive it as financially viable, because they want to keep exclusivity for their own smartphone OS, whatever.

It seems to me that there are many reasons for not developing for Windows Phone. This starts with the complete discontinuity that MS has wrought with zero compatibility from WM 6.5 to WP7 and then again from WP7 to WP8. Now they are moving to 'Universal Apps' so WP8 apps will be another dead end. Then it is alleged that MS has paid developers for WP versions of iOS and Android apps. Other companies will also want that subsidy so will wait for MS money rather than invest their own.

> If there's something you're after specifically - again, regardless of platform - why not try building it yourself? There's enough cross-platform toolkits out there, and your creation just might be the next killer app...

Many cross platform tools require licensing, either per seat, or per end user. Others require development in non-native languages or are web-based. Either way they require a large investment in time and/or money. Also, of course, they need testing on each target so you are suggesting that instead of buying a phone that already has the app available they should write their own version and buy several phones to test it on.

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Richard Plinston
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Re: Wait,,,,What?

> unwavering support for Lumias from Anonymous Cowards on this website.

No, there is just one, otherwise known as TheVogan.

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Microsoft explains Windows as a SERVICE – but one version remains a distant dream

Richard Plinston
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Re: @Dan 55

> When was the last time you heard about a customer rebellion against Microsoft ?

Last time I looked at the XP usage statistics.

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Richard Plinston
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Re: Lifetime of the device.

I have some Verbatim diskettes (5.25") that are clearly marked 'Lifetime Warranty'. Is that the lifetime of me or of my computer ? No. It is the lifetime of the diskette, some sort of average, maybe a year.

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Richard Plinston
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Re: Lifetime of the device.

> Meaningless, because they haven't defined it.

That is correct, they haven't defined the terms. Elsewhere this is know as 'weasel words'.

> So the lifetime of the device means until they drop support.

The phrase used by MS was 'supported lifetime of the _device_', not 'supported lifetime of the operating system'.

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Behold: The touchy-feely future of Office on Windows 10 fondleslabs

Richard Plinston
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> those people with Surfaces and transformer type Windows tablets generally have a keyboard/trackpad to hand.

The keyboard on Surface is an extra cost option, though it seems to be required to use the device effectively. This keeps the apparent price down while increasing the actual price..

> iPad user and many Android tablet users do not have the input devices to hand.

There are many more options, for iPad especially, because they can have bluetooth keyboards and keyboard/covers. These are also less restrictive, Surface keyboards must be connected in landscape while bluetooth allows portrait mode or disconnected use: eg tablet on aircraft table and keyboard on lap.

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Why Windows 10 on Raspberry Pi 2? Upton: 'I drank the Kool-Aid'

Richard Plinston
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Re: @YAAC Not a problem

> a platform that has commands that are so unforgiving they have to be in the right case, in the right place

It sounds like you wouldn't cope with modern computer languages either. You should stick to COBOL - that is case insensitive, though you do have to put stuff in the right place (such as columns 7, 8 and 12 and not beyond 72).

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Richard Plinston
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Re: Excellent

> more than one distro which needs > 756MB RAM to install.

That would be if one is using a graphical installer to install a distro that includes a (or several) GUI.

OTOH other distros will install and run on RPi model A with 256Kb with a GUI (LXDE).

I used to run FreeSCO Linux on a 386 with 20Mbyte RAM booting from a diskette (1.44MByte). It was a router/firewall that ran other services.

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Richard Plinston
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Re: Not a problem

> Surely the UEFI is on the SD card? So you just replace the SD card with one loaded with whatever OS you like.

On current computers the UEFI is in ROM and switching the disk does not replace it. That does not mean the the Pi will implement UEFI in ROM, nor that they will make it locked.

Apparently a cut-down version of Windows already runs on the Galileo Board in some crippled way (no display). Microsoft have said that on the Pi it will be 'similar to other boards'.

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Richard Plinston
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Re: Not a problem

> As long as one has the freedom to remove Win 10. Why all the bitchin'?

Current Windows RT (Windows on ARM) devices are _required_ to be UEFI locked without the option to unlock them.

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Turbocharged quad-core Raspberry Pi 2 unleashed, global geekgasm likely

Richard Plinston
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Re: Maker community?

> Presumably the version will be an App store only version, reducing its usefulness.

It appears to be an IoT version - no GUI. It won't be running any AppStore Apps.

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Planning to upgrade your Lumia to Windows 10? NOT SO FAST

Richard Plinston
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Re: Redmond cuts off Arm, fewer legs to stand on...?

> Well, since the update will not come for about a year, any phone would be at least a year old or any owner would be able to know that they bought a phone which might not get an upgrade.

I think that the first part of that is correct, up to the 'or'. Any phone would be a year old because they won't be buying a phone that they don't know if it will get an upgrade. As developers will drop WP8 as a target, moving on to 'universal apps', the app store for WP8 will become static, just as WP7's did when WP8 was announced.

At the time of WP8's announcement many commenters were stating that WP7 would get the upgrade in spite of WP8 requiring dual core, which no WP7 phone had. In the end all they got was some new colours and box sizes with 7.8. an '8.10' may be similar.

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Richard Plinston
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Re: is it because they're ARM?

> Fool me once shame on you (7.1), Fool me twice shame on me (8.1)

There was also the complete deadending of WM6.5. No phones or apps could go to WP7. WP7 and apps were deadened by WP8. Now only some phones will be upgradable to W10.

Also it is unlikely that 'universal apps' will run on WP8 so effectively WP8 phones and apps are dead. Just as WP7 phones went unsold, except in the bargain bins, after WP8 was announced and was not going to be an upgrade, now WP8 phone sales will tank and developers will drop WP8 as a target.

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Free Windows 10 could mean the END for Microsoft and the PC biz

Richard Plinston
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> "You mean I buy the computer now but then I have to pay extra for Windows 10 in a year?"

That has happened before. Some small (8") Intel tablet were being sold a few years ago (2011?). These came as dual boot with Android and Windows 7 but were advertised as 'Windows tablets with Office'. Small print mentioned that Windows and office were _trial_ versions and after some months a full version of both would need to be purchased.

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Richard Plinston
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Re: supported device <> hardware warranty

> How is MS supposed to know when each of our hardware warranties are expired?

By obtaining that from the OEM. In particular it may be that the OEMs will configure the warranty details into new builds, and/or report them to MS to associate with the licence key.

> What if your HW warranty is already expired when you obtain a free Win 10 upgrade?

Excellent question.

> The term "supported" in the context given has something to do with MS and Win 10.

MS did not say 'the supported life of the Operating System', they specifically referred to _device_ support life.

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Richard Plinston
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Re: WTF.....

> 2. For the supported lifetime of the device, you will ALSO get every following versions of windows for free.

That was not said at all. What was said was:

"""once a Windows device is upgraded to Windows 10, Microsoft will continue to keep it* current for the supported lifetime of the device** “at no cost”."""

* 'it' refers to _Windows_10_ (normal pronoun rules). They will keep Windows 10 'current' with updates. New versions you will buy.

** 'supported lifetime of the device' means 'until the warranty expires'. After warranty expires you will pay for updates and new versions.

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Richard Plinston
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Re: - Stealing MS-DOS

> Wasn't it selling MS/PCDOS before they'd actually bought it? (QDOS)

Initially MS licenced SCP-DOS as an OEM for 8086 based computers. It was a breach to sell it on 8088 computers (such as IBM-PC). later the purchased all rights for (allegedly) $50,000 and SCP has the right to sell MS-DOS with a computer for free (ie no payment to MS). When the SCP factory burned down they started selling MS-DOS plus a V20 chip (faster 8088 compatible) and MS had to buy them out of the agreement, allegedly for $1million.

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Richard Plinston
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Re: Triggers broom

> At what point is it no longer the same device?

It was no longer a _supported_ device when the warranty expired. This may have been when the warranty period expired or when you opened the case or when you changed one piece of hardware.

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Richard Plinston
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Re: Triggers broom

> Undercutting Netscape by giving IE away free with their OS,

And not paying Spyglass who wrote it for them.

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Richard Plinston
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Re: This isn't hard. It's just unbelievable.

> I'm willing to bet this is what MS told the manufacturers in advance of these announcements to cool them out. Dell, HP, Lenovo, et. al. are all in on this, because it's supposed to keep them relevant.

What is more likely is that the OEM version of 10 will expire at the end of the warranty period (the _supported_ life of the device) at which time a charge will be required to keep Windows working. The problem that MS have with XP and 7 is that the users of these are no longer sending money to Microsoft or OEMs, and may never do so again.

In the 90s and 2000s MS could rely on most users paying for a new version of Windows every few years. Now they have to enforce that or face declining revenues with the majority staying with XP and 7 as being 'good enough'.

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Richard Plinston
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Re: This isn't hard. It's just unbelievable.

> That clearly means as long as machine is supported by the OEM who shipped it. That's probably longer than the base warranty period.

It does not say "the supported life of the model", it specifically says 'device', singular. When your warranty expires so does this 'no cost'.

It may well mean that if your Windows 7 machine is older than the warranty then you will begin paying immediately.

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Is Windows RT not invited to the Windows 10 upgrade party?

Richard Plinston
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Re: ARM vs ATOM

> When the Surface RT came out a lot of the analysts were saying that MS *had* to have a ARM tablet, Android and Apple devices, running ARM were so popular and making so much money that MS would be a dead company by tomorrow.

It seemed to me that RT was not so much about selling Windows ARM tablets and was more about stopping the OEMs making ARM tablets with some other OS. Following on from the success of killing off Linux Netbooks by threatening to remove all discounts on all MS products if the OEMs did not 'loyally' change to using the regurgitated XP, they could use a similar threat on Dell's Android tablets and HP's WebOS.

And it worked.

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YEAR of the PENGUIN: A Linux mobile in 2015?

Richard Plinston
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Re: Don't write off the desktop

> It's not really the same as an EFB is it.

No, but there are many more pilots than designers. Thus there are many, many, more tablets and other mobile devices than workstations associated with designing, building and flying aircraft.

You seem to be arguing that 'desktops will never die'. 'Desktop' is merely where the device is placed, just as 'mainframe' refers to the structure that supports the electronics (ie the main frame), and does not describe the class of computer except by association. 'Workstations', which are used by designers, architects, and other professionals, happen to now fit on desks and may use the same components, or be the same machines, as 'desktop PCs'.

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