1960 posts • joined 26 Jan 2009
> Having owned a mac mini for years I wasn't even aware that intel
PCs have had standardized low profile form factors since before Steve came back. Some of us even suggested these as alternatives to the "desk lamp" Macs back in the day.
Re: Far too expensive
> Ask yourself why laptops sell more than desktop PCs
Laptops are portable and self contained. A NUC is none of those things.
Some laptops are even far more expandable than this NUC and will run circles around it.
HELL. I can probably get better hardware in laptop form for less than this NUC.
Re: Far too expensive
> One of these days you're going to figure out that your personal wants aren't representative of the general buying public.
You need to stand in front of a mirror and repeat that.
Re: No passive cooling!
>> "The NUC (new and old) is very quiet indeed, despite the active cooling"
> Until the fan bearings get sad.
I've been a low profile PC user for a long time. I used Minis for awhile and then switched over to IONs.
I will let you know when "the fan bearings get sad".
My most aggressively cooled machines continue to chug on and not bother the end user with the bionic ears.
Re: Far too expensive
Small and quiet are only selling points for stupid fanboys that think that Apple invented the low profile PC.
This kind of machine is far less exciting when you've got stuff from the likes of Alienware, or Dell, or any random white box builder that combines better performance and lower cost while still being sufficiently small and much more maintainable.
Past a certain point, the extra cost of smaller just doesn't make any sense to the vast majority.
Re: No passive cooling!
> Intel's web site makes it clear: active cooling, so it would be useless as a media centre even if it it were not massively over priced for that task.
My projector generates more fan noise than any of my other AV components including the HTPC.
Re: Desk Clutter
> couple of days of dropping the monitor face down on the desk while you prat about cos you cant get at it
There are these things called HUBS. Perhaps you should look into them.
Re: Power Usuage
500 Watts? Even my Hex core AMD tower with 10 drives and a discrete video card doesn't draw 500 Watts.
Re: Neat in a way, but too "middle ground" for me.
> I'd rather the built in power in the Mac Mini - yes harder to replace if it does wrong but neater and less chance of being pulled out.
The "tidy" aspect of this is of very little value in the average home viewing setup. On the other hand, putting another source of heat in your HTPC just complicates things.
Re: Far too expensive
In general, all machines like this are a bit silly as general purpose machines. They represent a set of engineering tradeoffs that are pretty much the opposite of what people at large value.
Re: Don't panic
> The idea is that the dashboard will provide visual information such as mapping like you find already in plenty of inbuilt vehicle satnav systems.
I recently had the displeasure of using the built in SatNav system in an upscale BMW. It was the single worst nav system I have ever used in my life. It had data that was 8 years out of date. Sure the HUD was flashy but the data behind it was pure crap. And that was a NEW car.
Meh. Meh I say.
The nature of these corporate behemoths means that they are always behind the curve. Your cheap truck with an aftermarket head unit will likely run circles around this stuff and cost a lot less. It really doesn't pay to embed this kind of rapidly moving tech in a car with a much longer useful lifespan.
Re: I don't get it
> Also if you need something that needs for example color management,
Are you posting from a the other side of a wormhole that leads to the 80s? That kind of thing hasn't been a compelling argument for the adoption of Macs for a very long time.
Re: So if we award all desktops to Microsoft then I make it...
I have a very respectable broadband connection but I still don't want my desktop to depend on it. I don't even like my video streamers being entirely dependent on their connection to the mothership. I understand the limits of current tech and networks too well.
Re: I don't get it
Most people simply don't buy into the hype. It doesn't help that they have been fed the "must be DOS compatbable" line for 30 years. This tends to put a damper on any alternative platform that looks anything like a PC.
As just another PC, the marginal value improvement of an Apple product is grossly overrated.
Re: Nothing new here move along
Whatever "lack of polish" you see in the Linux desktop isn't the problem. It never was. The market was won by the crudest command line interface available that subjected you to manual memory management.
"Quality" has nothing to do with this.
It's all about the apps and legacy interfaces that date back decades.
Something like Steam or Oracle or AutoCAD is far more important than KDE vs GNOME.
Re: "Linux UI"
> Linux doesn't have a UI, unless you count printk.
> The rest is actually completely unrelated to Linux,
Yes. But all of that stuff can be built for Android just as the Mac desktop could be built for PhoneOS. There's no reason that a phone couldn't run a conventional desktop if the right inputs are attached. If the device is fully in your control, that becomes a lot easier.
People already jailbreak their devices or install SSH servers on them in order to treat them more like old school Unix servers.
Running conventional desktop software is just the next logical step.
An X server is perhaps the wrong thing for an Android device. However, X libraries would allow any other X server to connect to your Android phone and login to it graphically from across the network.
Re: Interesting concept.
This could be useful for old devices that you would otherwise send into the landfill. Boot it into a new OS and give it a new lease on life. I really can't see putting this on one my current devices though.
Re: I thought I'd seen it all...
> I don't think you are Apple's target customer.
This is supposed to be a workstation for professionals, not a consumer toy to demonstrate how much money you can waste.
Some mindless conspicuous consumer is hardly the target market for this kind of device. Although the Apple faithful seem to think that's who is likely to buy a Mac Pro. Pro users of any sort are much more like the "geeks" you are always trying to denigrate and marginalize.
If you are willing to declare that power users are no longer welcome in the Cult of Apple then I would not disagree with you.
Re: I thought I'd seen it all... - @Psymon
> Where do you get this "cannot be upgraded" crap from?
You will need to get yourself an extra desk to accomodate the sprawl and rats nest of cables that you will need to pull all of that off. That 's just the thing you need when you are working in one of the planet's most expensive cities (SFO, NYC, London).
Re: I thought I'd seen it all...
> Usually when something doesn't suit you, just leave it.
Easier said than done when you have bought into a single vendor proprietary solution.
Although at least some of the old Mac Pro gear (hardware) is standard enough to move over. Anything spent on software would be money just p*ssed away.
Re: The *other* G4 Cube feature
> True, but then I didn't see any standards organisations, or consortia of companies, even trying to create something similar.
Perhaps because it really is a stupid idea that is best avoided.
Re: Not just beautiful, quiet too
I can't help but think that this fetish for aesthetics and silent operation will just lead to poor performance of the cooling system and a machine that just cooks itself (like my nv9400 Mini did).
Cute and silent is a nice goal but the system needs to be able to maintain a sane operating temperature. The design and parts need to allow for that even if it would be deemed suboptimal in terms of appearances.
Re: Time they bought it back
There is nothing to solve. PC vendors have been successfully building machines in this form factor for years.
Just approach the problem with a little bit of pragmatism.
Re: Why not just use SSD or flash
Again we are dealing with the issue of unacceptable latency that I have complained about before. Pretending that you can throw together wildly different use cases and call it done won't necessarily make it so.
I may not be "in charge of any serious storage" but I am a victim of those that are.
Re: Britain has led the way
What Apple usually does is to add that last 1% of what a device needs in order to appeal to the mainstream and then couple that with lots of visible marketing.
If some bit of computing tech has reached the consumer then it has probably been cooking in academia and research labs or non-consumer computing for a long time beforehand.
Britain didn't invent the tea chest sized Walkman this time. Microsoft did.
Re: The assumption here
> Did you ever play with the PocketPCs (CPQ iPaqs etc - note the name carefully) and HandheldPCs (HP Jornada 720 etc) starting in the late 1990s
These would be devices running hardware on par with an Mac Plus?
They only supported relatively primitive UIs that you had to be a really dedicated geek to tolerate.
They are a fine example of a type of device not yet being ready for the masses due to tech not being sufficiently advanced yet.
A little too open for Germany perhaps...
The seem to have had very lax commit policies for their source repository and include the results of that in their nightly bleeding edge package builds. This appears to be their community or "cooker" environment rather than their commercial product which is vetted more thoroughly.
Re: Exclusive rights
You aren't necessarily "stealing" when you use an unaproved media decoder either.
On the other hand, speeding is related to actual occurences of real grave bodily harm and property damage.
Re: Exclsive rights
So is the enforcement of penalties. The offending party should have the opportunity to resolve the situation in the quickest and least disruptive manner possible. Something like a C&D letter or a DMCA takedown request should have been an option.
They don't need to be that fascist.
Re: The first hurdle....
> HR (the automated systems that are used for recruitment nowadays) always ask for an official transcript before appointing.
Must be a European thing then. I've worked in all sorts of companies over the years including the kind that subject you to a month's worth of red tape before hire, and I doubt if one of them ever verified my credentials. I would know if they tried.
References are another matter though...
More crap for the landfill...
How many discarded tablets will you have thrown away by 2017? ARM based appliances don't have a very long shelf life. It's like PCs in the 90s. Every year's performance improvements are drastic enough that you want to buy a new device even if you can't quite afford it.
My current PCs will probably still be perfectly useful in 2017.
Re: Low power PC
> Frankly, my life has become personally too valuable to spend time on tech.
You are trying far too hard to perpetuate a false dichotomy that's bogus anyways.
If you even know what a NAS is to begin with, the "time" issue really is irrelevant. In general, my devices don't require a lot of babysitting. What little upfront setup is done and forgotten about very quickly.
If that's all you got then Synology products are a total waste of money.
More open solutions are cheaper, more flexible, and don't require more special proprietary hardware if something goes wrong. Being cheaper also helps enable better redundancy in case something goes wrong. That redundancy moots many of the more relevant bells and whistles of this kind of "turnkey" device.
Plus the performance of this thing is just crap. Nevermind all the other stuff.
Re: The ipad's big fail
> You could more productively have spent that half hour installing e.g. FileBrowser
Why would it take half an hour to install an iPhone app? Is this some kind of Plex or AirVideo nonsense where you need a special proprietary app running on the PC on the other end? The Android version of this just browses common CIFS shares with no extra special configuration required beyond the app install on the tablet.
Re: Hard for hardware manufacturers - not so for the rest of us
It's just bubble economics mentality. We've reached the point where no one is satisfied unless we are in some kind of bubble. All corporate growth has to be constant and unsustainable or people think we are in some kind of recession.
Anything that isn't explosive growth is seen as a tragedy.
Re: How many are waiting for Windows 8 to be "retired"? @Steve Knox
> I think that modern PCs are used for more than those from 1981.
Fine. Then move the goalpost to 2003 or even 2001.
I have Atom gear that's comparable to my laptop from 2001 but with a better GPU. This thing is a cheap trailing edge product but still runs circles around any ARM device when it comes to either pure computation or media decoding.
I have 3 generations of ARM streamer that have yet to catch up to that crufty old stuff. That's 3 cycles of "need to buy something new" with no end in sight really. Meanwhile the sad little Atoms chug along in the corner picking up the slack for the ARM devices.
Re: And for 2015 I predict
This will be like HTPCs and servers. The rubes will flee for tablets leaving only the serious power users with PCs. That will cause a mass exodus of Windows users. Linux will gain more prominence in the PC market that remains.
You could call it the Disraeli Effect.
Re: To me its an obvious flaw...
> 1) As a sysadmin, i don't give a shit about its look, it has not tools to incentivies me to switch.
That "look" is the default user shell. It's not just window dressing. It actually does matter.
Re: I tried Linux
Anyone that's got enough of a clue to even think about doing RAID on Windows should have no real problem with Linux. It's like that one competent NT admin in your company that sits for a Unix cert just for giggles.
Re: if you had to migrate your business from Windows XP
> If you had to migrate from your outdated windows to a newer version would you upgrade to the newest or the the next one down?
As someone that actually does business computing, I would say whatever actually supports my applications. Despite the usual Lemming propaganda spouted here, it's not a forgone conclusion that the latest and greatest will even support your bespoke or 3rd party apps.
If it's really about those apps that aren't available for any other platform, then it really is all about the apps.
Re: Not pleasant reading for Redmond
> What distribution offers 10+ years of support at a price lower than Windows?
You only need that support because you would be like a bound and gagged gimp left alone in the bad part of town otherwise.
Re: Wintel irrelevance == x86 irrelevance
WinDOS legacy software allowed x86 to outlast all of it's other rivals. While it sucks when compared to Alpha or PPC, it really isn't that bad when compared to SPARC and that was the leader of the alternatives. Sun was like the Microsoft of the Unix world. They were the big player but they were mediocre themselves.
Now we're down to ARM vs x86 and ARM just doesn't have the horspower. It's nice for low power appliances but still kind of sucks for computation.
I'd much rather see a revial of SPARC then people try to shoehorn ARM into a compute bound server role.
Re: Clenches jaw, takes deep breath . . .
Actual streamer appliances may need to keep track of what you are doing in order to tell you what you've already watched to to suggest something new. However, collecting this information in the course and scope of actually presenting you with content to watch is entirely different than what this LG TV is doing.
LG is engaging in pre-emptive data snooping not related to any end user requirement.
LG and anyone else that does this crap should be nailed to the wall by their family jewels.
Re: And yet... @bob
> And since when has the average teenager been able to afford apple products anyway?
The idea that Android phones are "just the cheap option" is something that butthurt Apple fanboys tell themselves in order to sleep at night.
Android phones aren't any cheaper and Apple phones have the same kinds of subsidies where that kind of thing is relevant.
Re: Should've used *BSD
> Doesn't matter where OpenSSH originated, it's the OS that's the problem.
Until the exploit vector is identified, you can't claim that.
In Escape from New York, the computer display of Plisken's combat glider was faked by putting glow-in-the-dark tape on their model of Manhattan and filming over it.
That sequence holds up a lot better than other contemporary attempts to do genuine computer graphics.
Re: So fix it!
I still use scripting tools reminiscent of BASIC in order to write simple programs to do things that aren't already pre-packaged for me in some higher level language with a nice shiny happy GUI. I also automate non-GUI tools in order to deal with tasks more effectively than I would be able to in a GUI.
In some ways, the allegedly new and better suffers from the same old problems. Except now there's shiny graphics to distract you from the problem. We try to convince ourselves that things a "different and better" when quite often they are mostly just prettier.
Also, GUIs are often not recognized as such just because they aren't pretty enough.
> Just like you need a Google account to use Android or a Microsoft account to use Skydrive.
No. I can side load an Android. It's very trivial actually.
I can also acquire applications from someone besides Google. I don't even have to jailbreak the device.
Re: IT Managers (in a windows world) dream of
The problem with large IT environments is that they are filled with idiots. You get companies to scale up by employing a bunch of trained monkeys who follow a processes designed for trained monkeys. This leads to an office full of trained monkeys that you simply can't trust with root.
I despise what Fortune 500 IT policies do to a desktop machine. I can also kind of relate to why it's done that way.
...another completely inexperienced poster.
> Why fool with mechanical drives? SSD's are 1000 times faster.
What's 1000x 150MB/s? What SSD has that kind of performance? What bus does? How many of those do you have to string together to get 4TB?
- Review Is it an iPad? Is it a MacBook Air? No, it's a Surface Pro 3
- Game Theory The agony and ecstasy of SteamOS: WHERE ARE MY GAMES?
- Hello, police, El Reg here. Are we a bunch of terrorists now?
- Worstall on Wednesday Wall Street woes: Oh noes, tech titans aren't using bankers
- Kate Bush: Don't make me HAVE CONTACT with your iPHONE