First Windows Phone 7 handsets sell out The first Windows 7 handsets are flying out of shops faster than they can be supplied. Orange has started pre-booking for handsets, and is offering customers £20 HMV vouchers to help them cope with the wait while new stocks come in. Meanwhile, HTC and Samsung handsets are selling out as they fast as they can be shipped to the …
MS have done good - I've got a Dell Venue Pro on pre-order with Clove and I just can't wait to get my mitts on it. The press are going bonkers over it, there are many people saying how it makes Android and iPhone look boring and antiquated, and what with Antennagate, the bugs in the iPhone's alarms that caused everyone to show up an hour late for work, and the one that lets people into the phone by using the emergency number feature, I think consumer interest will start to switch over to WP7, and the initial sales rush seems to back this up.
Consumers don't care about the missing bits - the copy 'n' paste, ringtones etc. They didn't stop people buying the iphone in droves, and they won't stop people switching to WP7 either. MS have a winner on their hands, it leapfrogs Google and Apple and will leave them in the dust.
There is always room for an innovator to capture a market - Apple showed that with iphone, and now MS are showing that is still as true as it was 3 years ago.
The "Grid of App icons" is dead. Long live app integration into hubs!
Go, MS! Go!
So you've played with one for a bit and "tinkered" with the emulator .... so you've not actually used the phone properly in the "wild"?
But apparently this is the best phone in the world ever and makes every other phone look antiquated.
Other posters are right - you sound like an MS shill and your number of posts on this thread would seem to support that notion
I've been using a Samsung Omnia 7 for over a week now and so far I've had no requirement to copy/paste text. Bit odd, I know, but I think the reason for it is all down to the fluidity of the interface and the instant availability of your information (for example, the way that contact data is automatically filled out for you using mail and social networking connecting, and contacts from multiple sources group together automatically and sensibly).
It's hard to explain until you've had a chance to use a WP7 phone. Totally recommend going into a phone shop and trying one - not with the intention of pointing out the lack of copy and paste at the earliest opportunity, but examining it as a device for making calls, staying in touch with people and managing personal data (plus a bit of entertainment on the side). A few friends of mine have been pleasantly surprised after playing with my phone for a bit, including a fellow programmer and devout Android supporter :)
Talk about contradicting yourself.
How can you "leapfrog" the competition, if you have these so-called "missing bits"? (Does that mean the phone doesn't have any balls?)
The reason why people didn't care aboutthe lack of those features on the original iPhone was because it was the best phone around. Nothin cam close. Now, Microsoft is trying to compete with Android and iOS, so there is a ton of competition around.
As for your distaste of grid app icons, we'll see how well WP7 fares when you have fufty apps installed.
Either way, I wish you good luck with your phone.
Whoa, Not the Nine O'Clock News flashback there!
The Barry Took/Points of View skit. ( Substitute the word BBC. )
"Well done the BBC! Another winner!"
"I would gladly sell my house and all it's contents to help the BBC!"
Well here's the kicker...
"Well I think the BBC is a load of old crap!"
No other smartphone has such a high degree of Exchange intgration. None can match its support for SharePoint 2010. It doesn't let you create Office 2010 documents, but then neither do any other smartphones (AFAIK).
All of that sounds more business-centric than Crapple or Android.
(and no, I don't have a WP7)
Locking up!! I;ve gotit for 2 weeks now, never had to re-start or do anything. What model did you have? There might be dodgy applications, the quiz app I got wouldn'tb start up but that's not to do with the phone. The quiz app decided to work now. There are aspects from the old windows mobile I like but WP7 is an excellent experience so far.
What make and model have you got? Samsung Omnia 7 here and I have to say it's rock solid and hasn't required restarting for the week and a bit I've had it.
I'm not doubting you, just curious to learn which handsets are having problems. A few friends are interested after seeing my phone and I'd like to direct them away from the bad handsets!
...you do realise that when you turn it off and turn it on again, the screen-lock activates, right?
Seriously though, I've had an HTC Mozart fro almost 2 weeks now and it has yet to suffer a single issue with the WP7 OS. It is a truly awesome phone, and while I would love it even more if it had more memory, I haven't found the 8Gb to be too restrictive (yet).
For everyone else, my thoughts on the WP7 experience so far are:
Zune Pass is truly awesome (seriously, it's as simple as: (1) plug in phone (2) find song or artist in Marketplace (3) drag & drop song, album, podcast, or entire artist's collection straight onto your phone. You get 10 songs per month to keep, and the subscription costs £7.50 per month. The same 10 songs on iTunes cost £7.90, and all you would get would be those 10 songs.) I cannot say this enough: ZUNE PASS IS THE FUTURE OF MUSIC CONSUMPTION.
Xbox live is also excellent. If you're unsure, go in-store and play a demo of "The Harvest".
I have let a bunch of my friends have a go at using it, and the worst thing anyone has said is that it is "on a par with the iPhone."
I wonder that the reporter has not picked up on the situation with the HTC7's sister handset, the Desire HD? They seem to be in short supply in Europe too - with no obvious reason being forthcoming. Is HTC struggling to fulfill ALL it's orders? its not just Win7 customers who are waiting.
Phase 1: Push your new platform to the meeja
Phase 2: Under-supply so there's a good chance stock runs out
Phase 3: Push lack of stock as if it were amazing demand
Phase 4: Slowly increase supply to meet rising demand, but ensure it still looks like the platform is mega-popular regardless of truth
Phase 5: Profit
This "story" stinks of PR bullshit as does the first comment.
...it is a genuine supply issue - various sources believe that at least in Samsung's case it is a lack of AMOLED screens.
What makes you think Microsoft are able to somehow magically prevent Samsung and HTC from shipping phones to Orange?
Apple can restrict supply because they control the manufacturing process. Microsoft just make the OS, so the same simply isn't true in this case.
I'm having a hard time seeing this as a PR stunt... I'll tell you why!
Quite simply I think manufacturers underestimated the initial orders for WP7 devices. They expected uptake to be low because of the anti-Microsoft sentiment and the laughable launch of the Kin. Therefore they agreed initial basic orders with mobile operators, ensured they had enough stock to fulfil those first orders, and sat back waiting to see what happened.
Now I'll be the first to admit that there's going to be quite a few curious people obtaining WP7 handsets for the sake of being able to offer qualified opinions on the pros and cons of the new mobile OS. I'd be very surprised if the exceeded expectations we're witnessing are purely the result of curious individuals though.
"The first Windows 7 handsets are flying out of shops faster than they can be supplied."
Underestimated demand?
Margins are so tight these days, they try not to make too many of a product just in case the worst happens and you get a warehouse full of crap you can't shift. The big advantage is that you can claim that stock has all sold out in seconds flat!
All the name brands do it, Sony, Apple, Tosh, Hitatchi, you name it.
For posting a real explanation why these gadgets have launch supply issues. I'm tired of the bunk that the PR you gain from having a sellout product is worth more than actually selling your widget to a consumer before they decide to buy somebody else's widget.
A customer who walks out of the store disappointed because he couldn't buy your product is a lost opportunity, not a PR coup. The next time that customer walks into the store, he might not have the money for your product, he may have decided he'd rather have a competing product, or he might decide he has no use for it in the first place. You've got to strike while the iron is hot.
> HTC seems to be having some software problems with its pair of Windows Phone 7 handsets
That's why there's a shortage, I'm not surprised they sold their two handsets even with software problems. I'm sure that they could sell a few more than that to Microsoft employees, etc.
The iPhone sold in hundreds of thousands at launch, even when it was overpriced.
BTW, if the WinDog7 software turns out to be a, well, dog, can one just install Android?
Err.. in the UK alone, HTC provides 3 phones - the Mozart (Orange) the HD7 (O2) and the Trophy (Vodafone). In the US, there's also the Surround (not sure about the carrier). So that's at least 3, potentially 4 HTC WP7 phones if they bring the Surround over here. And then there's Samsung, Dell, Acer etc. who are bringing their phones to the party too...
As for calling the software a dog, have you even tried using it? ZunePass alone makes Android look old and tired. Your post really just makes you look like an ill-informed hater.
Or a Cockney using the parlance of London: dog & bone = phone. Happens to fit the moment as "Windows Phone 7" trips off the tongue about as elegantly as a kebab hits the pavement on a Saturday night.
Why would I want to use the software? I don't do Facebook, think twatter is a bore and I've as much motivation to use WinDog as I have to downgrade my iPhone 4 from version 4.1 to 1.0.
You MS philes really are a sensitive bunch aren't you.
BTW how does WinDog work with YouTube? Can it render H.264 video in the browser?
Wibble, the trouble is, you're so convinced of your own rightness that you're not prepared to let little things like the facts get in your way (I note that you were wrong about the number of available phones, not that you acknowledge that fact, of course...). Instead, you childishly make up insulting names for products you dislike. Way to set an example.
Now I'm not going to just slate your choice of the iPhone 4. I've used one, it's not bad, but it has drawbacks. In my opinion, the following are particularly relevant:
- The first massive advantage of WP7 over iOS is that you get your choice of hardware. For example, the iPhone 4 had a 5Mpg LED flash camera (i.e. the bare minimum) whereas the HTC Mozart has 8Mpg Xnenon flash. You will probably say you don't care, but the point is, you don't get a choice with iOS - you just get whatever his Jobsness decides to give you. Alternatively, if you want a physical keyboard, there are WP7 phones with those - but on iOS? Not a chance. If you want a bigger screen, WP7 goes up to the HD7's massive 4.3" - but on iOS? "Thou shalt take thine 3.5" and thou shalt be thankful for it! So sayeth the Jobs." In your other posts on this article, you rant about things that are missing from WP7, but the above choices are all missing from iOS - hypocrite much?
- The second massive advantage of WP7 is Zune Pass. I *really* cannot stress this enough. With iTunes, I could listen to a preview of the song I wanted, but it wouldn't really leave me with a feeling for how the album sounded all together. For that information I would have to pay iTunes so that I could listen to the whole album - which is pretty much a gamble. With Zune Pass, I pay £7.50 per month (and I get to keep 10 DRM-free songs a month - which would cost £7.90 on iTunes for those same 10 songs) and it's this simple:
1) Plug the phone into my computer;
2) Open the Zune software and browse the Marketplace;
3) Drag and drop any music I want onto the phone (songs, albums, podcasts, whatever) onto the phone & it plays flawlessly and costs nothing extra.
If I download 20 albums, and only 5 turn out to be any good, that's no problem - it didn't cost me anything, and I can simply delete the 15 I don't like and download another 20 albums, to see what they're like. And so on. This is the future of music consumption, and iTunes simply doesn't offer anything that even vaguely competes.
- I could go on about the joys of Sharepoint, proper Exchange integration, Xbox Live and the usefulness of dynamic tiles, but I get the distinct impression that you would probably ignore all of those advanatages as well, in order to maintain your myopic world view
Mine's the one with the manual in the pocket 'cos, you know, I actually like to check my facts sometimes...
I'm enjoying, nay relishing, no I'm "really excited" that Microsoft have eaten crow pie and finally come up with something that will be a worthy opponent in the forthcoming great SmartPhone wars. This is a genuinely good thing. It'll even improve Apple and Google's products.
What can't be denied is that Microsoft has released something that's truly a version one product when the competition are on their 4th major version (iOS), or second major version (Android - or is it the third?). Microsoft have an enormous chasm to bridge, and given their recent lack of innovation their biggest challenges are internal.
That said, I'm sure there's some good things about WinDog (I like that name, so I'm going to use it from now on). But you have to accept that there's a shed load of rubbish things about it. Having read some of the better reviews -- that's the ones that aren't paid for by Microsoft's PR department or written by barking MS fanboi shills. They all say there's a load of issues, as is quite reasonable given it's only just been released. Give it three more years...
Zune maketplace - only £90/year. Oh do leave it out. I've never bought a single track from iTunes, so what would I want with another DRM infested shop. I buy CDs and rip them. Or I buy tracks directly from the artist.
You didn't mention Office on WinDog. Wot a larf that would be to edit a document using a microscope. Still, at least it's not wrapped up in a ribbon. But in any case, Microsoft always add Office to their DogOS's. I've a 10+ year old HP Journada running Whince with Office. I never used Office cos it was crap then and nothing's changed since. Of course, if it were ported to an iPad with a decent screen size, that would be an entirely different story...
Sharepoint: snake oil. I once attended a 4 day introduction to Sharepoint course. I walked away with the feeling I'd wasted 4 days of my life staring in a marketeer's porn flick.
The fact is I, in common with absolutely loads of other IT *professionals*, have turned our backs on Microsoft. They make shoddy products, have the morals of a stoat, milk their cash cow markets dry; I'm tired of being lied to and Microsoft wasting my and my client's time and money. I'm thinking of IE primarily, but years of shoddy Wince phones, unreliable Office products and >100,000++ viruses tend to be rather significant factors.
For years I observed Microsoft release a product, pretty much any product, saying it's "the best", "they're really excited", etc. and that the previous product wasn't much use, certainly compared with the current release. Look at Office 2011, or Vista, or Exchange. When you've swum around the goldfish bowl a few times you recognise the same old rubbish and that it's really good to skip a few releases. I'm sure you'll grow to recognise it eventually.
So what makes you so happy about WinDog? Do you work for them or something?
Finally got my HTC Mozart from Orange. The rep at the Orange store (Trafford Centre) mentioned that they were selling really well! And he was surprised that Microsoft would do so well!!! Anyway, the phone is very good, it's extremely responsive, more so than my 3GS, but would have liked this model on O2, but Orange isn't too bad!
Wow, the MS shills are out in force today.
The comments section reads like no other Reg comments section I've seen before. Very bizarre.
The WinPho7 looks nice enough, but not exactly the breakthrough device the slavering hordes (well, Jim and a couple of others) on here would suggest.
Dunno, I'm willing to take the comments at face value as being from folk who have bought their phones and are pleased with them, especially since 99.999% of them are from one person (sorry Jim only kidding).
Very much doubt it's down to MS shills though. Blinkered enthusiasts I would perhaps accept, but only if I'd tried WP7 for myself and knew it to be a rancid pile of festering cack, which I haven't, and the reviews don't seem to suggest that either.
Seems fairly simple - a good proportion of folk actually like WP7.
Nice use of the troll icon. Anyone notice how any post that's not rabidly anti-MS gets down-voted?
At 12:43 GMT, Jim Coleman simply posted that he hadn't experienced a crash on his WP7 phone and 4 people down-voted his comment. Seriously, El Reg readers, what gives? Do you just really hate Jim? Do you WANT phone operating systems to crash?
Even if you're a fanboi/fandroid, you surely see it as a good thing that MS is bringing some competition to the market, to spur your supplier of choice into offering a better device? (Well, maybe not... Some of you are probably just haters).
"At 12:43 GMT, Jim Coleman simply posted that he hadn't experienced a crash on his WP7 phone and 4 people down-voted his comment. Seriously, El Reg readers, what gives? Do you just really hate Jim? Do you WANT phone operating systems to crash?"
Jim has a phone on pre-order and does not have one.
So downvoting is probably in order.
Jim is a fan - no better or worse than Apple fanboys, but MS have paid for astroturfing/shilling before so any fanboy posting is always a bit suspect. Apple fans posting.. that is another story as Apple probably haven't paid them...
I'm a fan of technology, yes, and a Java and XNA developer, yes, and I have tried iPhones, Android, WM6.5 and WP7. As far as I see it, WP7 is the best.
If that makes me an MS fan then hey, fair enough. But don't assume everyone that's praising WP7 is necessarily an MS fan, because if you do, the world must be swarming with MS fans. It's time for MS haters to admit that this time Redmond have got it very, very right.
"But what is clear is that this isn't an artificial shortage created to give the impression of popularity, attractive as that explanation might be."
Being in airborne software verification (mostly level A) for ~15 years I like phrases like the above one. :-)
Apparently the author has some undisclosed source of information that told about the enormous quantity of WinPhoMob 7 devices shipped to providers. May I ask for some numbers, please? ;-)
Maybe WP7 is a good platform. But the hype is annoying.
The breathless adulation that comes through in many of the articles and a lot of the comments just doesn't right true.
It started well before the platform was available, with 'ordinary citizens' posting positive reviews and comments on net forums when it was pretty unlikely that any ordinary citizen could even have seen a handset, let alone had time to form such strong opinions on the platform.
Maybe I'm just cynical. But I don't think so. Even if it is just fanboi-ism it makes me sick.
You get fans (typically people who want a platform to succeed) promoting phones before their release all the time. Just look at the comments on any one of the dozens of iPhone or Android related articles on El Reg in the lead-up to a product launch and you will see this. So complaining about this issue in relation to WP7 alone is a bit hypocritical.
"The breathless adulation that comes through in many of the articles and a lot of the comments just doesn't right true."
I assume you mean "ring true"? In any case, I seriously recommend that you try actually using one and then see whether the comments are true or not before you claim that they are untrue. Personally, I have an HTC Mozart and I really cannot recommend it highly enough - it is without a doubt the best phone I've ever used. Don't get me wrong, there are some phones with better individual features - I'd love an AMOLED screen from a Samsung, the camera from the N8 and about 32Gb of memory - but even without those things, the Mozart is a brilliant phone. You can read my previous comments regarding ZunePass and Xbox Live for examples of why this is the case in respect of the software, and the hardware is both beautiful and functional. For me, the major selling points were:
Biggest advantage over the iPhone: Choice - you can pick the hardware that suits you best.
Biggest advantage over Android: Updates come direct from MS (no waiting about for a manufacturer to fiddle with the updates for a few months before you get them). Also, no Android phone can compete with ZunePass.
Have I warped into a parallel universe or am I genuinely reading a post on El Reg?
Someone posts about why they chose a product and gives their real world experience of it without vilifying those that picked something different?
Well done whiteafrican! Your opinion is worth considering in my view.
Mock funerals for iPhones on the Redmond campus are unreliable indicators of future success in the market.
It will be interesting to see shipment figures for the next two quarters.
I reckon all this is just Microsoft's marketing department getting their excuses in early for continued failure to stem the obliteration of their market share.
Windows Phone 7 wasn't my idea™
Considerinhg WP7 is effectively a complete reboot, the product as it is, is quite impressive.
You have to give credit to Microsoft. Yes they are a little late, and Yes, there are a number of features missing compared to iOS and Android. [Although you could argue that WP7 has a few features that are unique/exclusive, that the competition don't have aswell!].
But anyway, I don't understand the hate coming from some individuals, a blanket dismissal without firsthand experience and ignoring (generally excellent) reviews is puzzling. If Arstechnica and Endgadget (both hugely Apple-centric/biased sites) can be impressed with WP7, doesn't that say something about how well Microsoft have done with this product?
:)
> Yes they are a little late
Wow, the master of understatement.
> doesn't that say something about how well Microsoft have done with this product?
No. Not until it's in general availability and 'real' people have 'real' experience using it. At the moment it's very much a version one product with huge numbers of features missing and the only people reporting are either paid to report or have vested interests.
We don't know how reliable it is (fanboi shill opinions don't count); what it's like to live with; how long the battery lasts; if the missing features are really painful to live without; if the 'new' features are of any real use; being Microsoft, how much it crashes... It's a long list.
Ok, seriously Wibble, your myopic hatred of WP7 for no apparent reason is really starting to grate, and you need to check your facts.
You said: "No. Not until it's in general availability and 'real' people have 'real' experience using it."
Err.. it IS in general avalability, and 'real' people have 'real' experience of using it (unless you think we're all stuck in the Matrix imagining all of this... :p ). Before you post your ill-informed comments, do some research: you can go down to your local Orange/Vodafone/O2 store and ask to use a WP7 phone (unless - as El Reg recently reported - they've already sold out... but don't worry - they'll be getting more).
You said: "We don't know how reliable it is (fanboi shill opinions don't count)"
So basically, anyone who uses WP7 and has something positive to say about it is a fanboi and their opinions don't count? Way to express an open mind!!
For what it's worth, I have owned an HTC Mozart for a little over 2 weeks, and these are my answers to your questions:
- "what it's like to live with;" Pretty good - build quality is excellent, no 'creaks', no light leakage, no loose bits if shake it. Unibody aluminium is obviously a good thing. The screen is beautiful and bright. Call quality is solid. The UI is super-fluid and very easy to use. Zune Pass has now completely replaced my reliance on iTunes (to the extent that I have given away one of my two iPods, as I really no longer have any use for it).
- "how long the battery lasts;" obviously it depends on what you use it for. Average use for me is some browsing the web while listening to podcasts on the way to/from the office, some calls, some games and some texts and emails each day, and I have yet to see it get down below half-way (I tend to charge it overnight). I love the fact that you can play 3d games *while* listening to music or podcasts (with no apparent lag) but it does reduce the battery life quite a bit if you do that.
- "if the missing features are really painful to live without;" I honestly haven't had a scenario yet where I needed cut & paste (mostly because the integration of contacts is superb, and pulls in your existing SIM contacts, facebook and email contacts and matches them up, so you don't end up with four entries for the same person - and you can merge contacts if you do happen to find any duplicates). Flash isn't a big deal for me, since I rarely feel the need to watch skateboarding dogs on my phone, so I can't really comment... but Adobe have announced that flash is coming, so by the time I do get that skateboarding dog itch, I'm sure they'll have it covered.
- "if the 'new' features are of any real use;" OH YEAH! I really cannot stress enough how awesome ZunePass is. As I said above, I literally have no use for my iPods any more. It is dirt cheap - for £7.50 per month, you get all-you-can-eat music, and 10 DRM-free songs to keep forever. Those same 10 songs on iTunes would cost £7.90 and you would get literally nothing extra. Secondly, as set out above, the contacts integration is brilliant. Exchange & Office connectivity is top notch (as you would expect, from MS, really). Xbox live is also brilliant (although I don't actually own an Xbox... yet).
- "being Microsoft, how much it crashes..." Surprisingly (and I say this as a guy who has owned several previous Windows Mobile phones, and who has also had to fix my wife's iPhone on more than one occasion) it has not crashed once in all the time I have owned it.
Personally (as I explained in an earlier post) I think it's the best phone I've ever used. If you have any more questions, do let me know.
Mine's the one with the troll-seeking missiles in the pockets.
"Operators are frustrated by the delays, knowing that consumers eager to get their hands on a new toy can be easily distracted by equally shiny competitors"
Which would be a problem for the operators why, exactly? I would have thought that anyone walking out of the shop with a new handset was a win. Only those consumers who are waiting specifically for a Windows Phone 7 handset would be causing any hand-wringing, and I imagine they are few and far between.
"Microsoft has promised that operator billing for applications is a possibility"
Promising that something is a possibility is like insinuating that there's a chance something might definitely happen.
i was in Orange's Oxford St store @ 8am on the 21st Oct! Had my Omnia 7 since then - best phone i've EVER had.
Only prob i've had is that i bought it on Orange and the signal sucks, so after two weeks of failed network, i switched to t-mobile and all is good again (and i know about the sharing of networks but it didnt make difference - Orange shows full signal but doesnt ring out - because it's showing full it never comes off and tries to look for T-mob)...but anyway, now on t-mob and the world is good again! this phone is absolutely BRILLIANT.
i have to feel a little proud when standing next to the sheep, err, sorry, iphone crowd! the screen on the Omnia 7 is unbelievable - makes the HTC devices look like cheap plastic toys.
highly recommend A+++++++++++++++++ Nice one Microsoft :)
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