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back to article T-Orange: How it's going to work

The T-Mobile and Orange brands will survive for at least the next two years in the UK as the telcos combine their operations here - though their employees might not. The merged operation of Orange and T-Mobile is expected to save €445m in operational expenditure annually, a saving that will come from shutting shops, …

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  1. jon47

    Actually, it costs Deutsche Telecom £625m

    You said "That starts with Orange chucking in £1.25bn to make up the difference in value between the two companies" - that's not right, it starts with Orange chucking in £1.25bn of *debt* - i.e. the new venture starts off owing Orange £1.25bn. And then Deutsche Telecom throw in £625m of real cash, which goes straight out to Orange to balance the debt to the parent companies.

    So in effect Deutsche Telecom are paying Orange £625m to take on T-Mobile UK.

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  2. Anonymous Coward
    FAIL

    Bye bye

    Well if this deal goes through then I for one shall be saying cheerio to T-Mobile, I don't like Orange, never have done, don't like the company or their practices, same goes for O2.

    Hello Vodafone... :)

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  3. Fazal Majid

    One of the two partners is disengaging in 2 years' time

    I used to work for FT in the second half of the nineties, during the time of the so-called DT-FT-Sprint alliance. There was really no operational cooperation between the individual companies, the DT-FT alliance had been wished for by the French and German political leaders, but grudging at best at the base. This also led to some unfortunate side-effects like a demonization of BT in an effort to rally the troops around a common enemy, to no avail. The alliance later dissolved in acrimony.

    One of the two partners is disengaging from the UK market. The 50-50 arrangement is purely here to save face, but this is not a sustainable solution. You would think FT is the stronger party because of Orange's stronger position, but DT is the one pumping cash in, which is not something a disengaging party does.

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  4. Anonymous Coward
    Thumb Down

    Oh...

    Bugger.

    Now who do i turn to for mobile internet? Not orange, 3, O2, Virgin or Vodafone.

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  5. Anonymous Coward
    Go

    ...what it's going to call itself..?

    How about #FF9966..?

    (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pink-orange)

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  6. Campbeltonian

    3

    3 also use Orange for 2G roaming, so perhaps it suits them to only have to deal with a single company for 3G network sharing and 2G roaming.

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  7. RichyS
    FAIL

    T-Angerine?

    Well, it begins with T, and is orangey. Certainly the 'Anger' bit covers off the Orange customer services experience.

    And to think, they used to be so good when Hans Snook was in charge, before the France Telecom takeover.

    In fact, on that thread, if the regulators at the time forced Vodafone to sell Orange when they bought Mannesmann AG (who, I think, had bought Orange from Hutchison Whampoa). While I realise that 3 where not in the marketplace at the time (are they really yet?), is the current situation so different?

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  8. Justin Clements

    poor old Vodafone

    From 1st place a couple of years ago in their home market, to third.

    Oh well.

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  9. amanfromMars 1 Silver badge

    The Future is Definitely SMARTer when IT is Brighter ....

    "But that's going to take a couple of years and it won't be until that process is completed that we'll find out what the new venture's going to be called."

    Presumably though the new venture is already Running in a Master Pilot Replacing Control Levers and Drumming Up Clients for New Ventures in Venerably Vicious Vivacious Virtuous Circles..... InterNetworking Cloud Base Modules ... for SMART Guided Missives to Mobilised AIMissions into Fast LAINs Communication ... Locale Advanced IntelAIgent Networks Communicating.

    Or is not the New Venture not interested in the Future Placement of Reality with Technology .... with a Dazzling Display and Array of Infinite Options for the Colourful Allusion to Inclusion with the Addition of Choices.

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  10. TeeCee Gold badge
    FAIL

    What's in a name?

    I suspect that it won't be "O-Mobile" or "T-Orange"*. They'll get some branding outfit, pay 'em millions and come up with something like "Ungthuvi", along with a logo that looks a bit like a warthog having a shit which is supposed to inspire something-or-other.

    *Hmm I wonder if those old Outspan Minis are still available? They could save some advertising cash with a canny secondhand purchase and going with "OrangeMobile" here......

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  11. I ain't Spartacus Gold badge
    Joke

    Move the HQ to Yorkshire

    And call it: t'Orange

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  12. Antony 2
    Coat

    New French Name

    How about Merde for a new name? It would give them the French feel and define them as a company.

    "The futures bright, the futures Merde"

    Mine's the one with the mittens on the string.

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  13. Mark Lockwood
    FAIL

    37% of the market

    Unless they pay some serious bungs, there's not a snowballs chance that this will get through the Monopoly & Merger Commission.

    Slow news day

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  14. Robert Ramsay

    After the 2012 Olympics logo...

    ...of Lisa Simpson engaging in a sex act, nothing would surprise me...

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  15. Slartybardfast
    Happy

    @TeeCee - Outspan Minis

    There's one at the National Motor Museum Beaulieu.

    http://www.mantaworld.com/gallery/classic-cars/beaulieu2005/outspan_mini.php

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  16. Anonymous Coward
    Happy

    How about..

    A-GEN T-Orange??

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  17. Anonymous Coward
    Black Helicopters

    Who is disengaging

    DT is actually disengaging to concentrate on the US market which it feels needs more support, and as the UK is "saturated" with operators, it has decided to walk away.

    Orange is the daddy on this, while T-Mob is the mommy

    AC Cause I dont want to be hunted by either :-)

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  18. Anthony Cunningham

    New Name

    T-Mobile + Orange

    Tangerine?

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  19. John Helliwell

    Network performance?

    T-Mobile has the most disgustingly poor network performance and coverage. Orange's network is fantastic. I hope they dismantle the T-mobile cell transmitters. Or will we have to put up with 1 bar of signal strength in the open air in a major city centre like I saw when I used my wife's T-Mobile phone the other day?

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  20. Number6

    @Mark Lockwood

    You're assuming they'll maintain a 37% share. Some of us are likely to switch elsewhere next contract renewal if their customer service gets worse, given that we migrated away from Orange for that reason.

    Perhaps they could rebrand as Lemon.

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  21. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Bye bye t-mob

    The first five letters of Orange's brand - the last letter of T-mobiles.

    Lets be honest about this, Orange are a much stronger brand than t-mobile. I've worked with both and Orange are far more clued up.

    T-mobile have a strong set of tariffs - but that's easy to migrate. I wouldn't want to be working for, either but my money's on the Orange rather than the pink (oh, sorry magenta)

    Lets watch the unemployment figures in Hatfield ....

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  22. Anonymous Coward
    Go

    Equilibrium?

    Orange have a great network with poor customer service.

    T-Mobile have a poor network with great customer service.

    Hopefully a merger will see the best of both sides in one network.

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  23. Anonymous Coward
    Unhappy

    The new name will be...

    Orange. This is DT saying goodbye to the UK. In time, the T-Mobile HQ and all the IT bods therin will be redundant.

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  24. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    T-errible news

    Everyone is treating this frivolously. It amazes me - this is terrible news for the customer. Orange are just not competitive for anything at the moment - what do you think this is going to do to the market.

    So lets see now - no competitive hardware / tarriff combinations, terrible customerservice (orange). Hmm looks like Voda and O2 might well be wringing their hands with glee at this deal behind the scenes. O2 might no longer be the biggest but sure - who has to be the biggest - surely happy and spending customers are better + dont forget all those that will be leaving T mobile in droves and wont go to the terrible orange.

    There are some places in Scotland where believe it or not only T-mobile give me decent coverage for data. Thats completely going to be trashed when that lot start their cost cutting and frankly wont give a stuff for the customer as long as they can take out some sites. This is disgusting!

    Not a 3 fan but I think they should be worried at this.

    GRRRRRR!!

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  25. pctechxp
    Joke

    As they do fixed and mobile phones its got to be

    Phone a la Orange.

    Failing that I think I ain't Spartacus has the right idea in calling it t'Orange

    t'future's bright. t'future's t'Orange

    Have to agree though they were a much more interesting company when Hans Snook was in charge and they built a house with voice controlled everything

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  26. Christopher W
    Thumb Down

    T-M-Orange?

    Say it fast. It'll catch on.

    Well, I predict two things will happen: 1) Orange will play a massive game of thumb wars with the two companies' billing systems until they magically 'fit together', never mind the massive struggles for CS staff and customers alike over that time.

    Then, they'll dump all the (brilliant) remaining UK CS staff from T-M and outsource to hapless Indian callcentres which I can't understand or even get a sensible answer out of (yes, I've also been an H3G customer within the past 18 months). URGH. NO.

    The saddest thing is that I've been a customer of theirs for a long time for the excellent customer service, the UK call centre staff and the market-leading data and call tariffs. However, in the past few months whenever I've rung 150 I've ended up speaking to someone in the Phillipines (or some other bizarre country like that - very worrying) and they won't let me move to the newer Flext tariff and keep my accrued loyalty discounts. Smacks of a loss of interest in customer base.

    What finally confirmed it for me was when they superceded their WinMo handset range with their shiny Android exclusives, and didn't even bother to release the Touch Pro 2 (Voda have been offering it for a while to business customers and I covet it greatly).

    TMUK is dead, long live TMUK. Hello T-M-Orange! (more like Hello goodbye, I must be going)

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  27. John 62

    I'm shocked

    there've been a few t'orange comments, but no-one's done the Peter Kay one:

    Get on t'internet wi' t'orange!

    Chorely FM... etc.

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  28. Blubster
    Happy

    @Move the HQ to Yorkshire

    That's Lancastrian ala Peter Kaye's t'internet.

    We say th'Orange, th'internet, th'otel etc. etc.

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  29. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Don't see the problem

    Whilst I didn't see a merger coming (was convinced Voda would not let this go without a fight) it seems to make perfect sense for both parties.

    Most likely scenario, use T-Mobs network and Oranges Brand. Given that 3 are hanging off TMob's network and the optimisation process is in full swing, bar a few additional orange sites to fill in some coverage gaps it would make more sense to turn off Oranges network. Orange has the stronger brand. Synergies gained will allow the combined org to be more competitive whilst making better returns for the parents - sometimes bigger is better and this has been Orange and T-Mobiles problem for years, first against Voda and then O2.

    Possible scenario - both parents were in mind to leave the UK but couldn't get the value they needed to save face in the current economic climate. This strategy buys time to allow a bigger, leaner and and better entity to be sold for more money when the market has picked up in a couple of years.

    For those saying it won't go through, you're wrong. Most European countries have a network with 40%+ market share. The UK was odd in that it didn't.

    I agree that many good people will be left without a job which is sad and I wish them all the best.

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  30. Andus McCoatover
    Joke

    Name? Terry's, obviously.

    Terry's Chocolate Orange. 'Cos it couldn't get more like brownware*, and taste less like an orange. See Nokia and Siemens merge? Seen their figures?

    *Thanks, BOFH

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  31. Jon 52

    title

    ORAnge t-moBiLE --- 'Orable

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  32. Kamal Hashmi

    new name ....

    For god's sake people - Tangerine obviously!

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  33. Nicholas Wright
    Go

    iPhone

    Oooo.. if T-Orange is now the biggest, who do you think will pay loads of money to exclusively carry the iPhone?

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  34. Equitas
    Thumb Down

    Geographical Coverage?

    Since neither of them have coverage of any sort in many of the areas I travel in, neither are of any use to me anyway.

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  35. Richard Hodgson
    Thumb Down

    As a T-Mobile customer....

    If Orange kept T-Mobile's excellent, and far superior customer service team and decided to take on their generous data plans, I'd be a very happy T-Orange customer.

    Unfortunately, I don't hold out much hope for either of these possibilities.

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