back to article Windows 10 market share jumps two per cent

Microsoft's sometimes hard-ball tactics to get people running Windows 10 look like they're working. All three of the desktop OS market share data sources we track report a nice bump for Win 10 in May. Desktop OS market share March to May 2016 Desktop OS market share March to May 2016. Click here to enlarge There's the …

  1. Tchou

    PC upgrades were compelling...

    ... and Microsoft would force feed Windows licenses on buyers.

    Now PCs aren't selling, so they force feed "free" upgrades to a never finished OS to ensure their presence on the market in future years.

    Numbers are misleading.. which % is actually "voluntary and somewhat informed" ?

    1. Bob Vistakin
      Windows

      The carrot and the stick

      You are spot on. You can smell their desperation.

      Microsoft predicted the decline of the new PC market, where traditionally all their windows license sales came from. They knew it was being displaced by mobile, so someone took the strategic decision to let Blamer handle it for in the crucial decade all this was playing out. Hence they are in todays position of not only being nuked out of that market, but scrambling round to try to squeeze money from their existing PC users, because as we've just seen the number of new ones is declining dramatically. Forcing W10 down the throats of their current customers is about the only option.

      In their minds they think they've tried the carrot and are just now turning to the stick. Users would disagree with the former.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: PC upgrades were compelling...

      PCs are selling - 20,000,000 a month - but they are buy-if-needed or replacement sales - and not as much upgrade-to-latest-and-greatest because-I-want-something-faster sales.

      Moreover, with the world's increasing population etc. etc. the prediction is for their sales rate to increase somewhat over the next few years.

    3. fung0

      Re: PC upgrades were compelling...

      Microsoft lost faith in the PC, even though they were exactly the one company that should have been supporting it. They previously did the same with the tablet and the handheld.

      Today, we're seeing a huge chance for revitalizing PC demand - VR - which just happens to be yet another paradigm-shifting technology that Microsoft has somehow managed to completely avoid! Instead, we hear rumors of a VR-capable Xbox One (maybe two years from now), indicating that instead of accepting a free gift to the PC - its core product - Microsoft continues to follow some demented corporate roadmap of its own.

      Intel is clearly doing its best, but it's an uphill battle without a proper software partner. Valve has had the right idea, not because everyone is eager for Linux games, but because the PC world really needs an exit strategy from Microsoft's padded cell.

      1. a_yank_lurker

        Re: PC upgrades were compelling...

        VR will probably be a niche market as most uses are not really enhanced by it. It will be driver for some high end gear for gamers and the like but for the rest a big yawn. Often gamers are BIY so even there the sales may be lower than one might expect.

        1. Bob Vistakin
          Facepalm

          Re: PC upgrades were compelling...

          Well surely Office in the car will save them? What could possibly go wrong with that? After the mandatory multiyear microsoft delay its once again something they've just begun their usual comedy catch up act with.

          1. Destroy All Monsters Silver badge

            Re: PC upgrades were compelling...

            I like to search the Ribbon while barrelling down the highway!

        2. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: PC upgrades were compelling...

          I agree that VR will be niche. Gamers will want it, but no one is going to wear VR goggles to run Office, browse the web, check Facebook or watch cat videos on Youtube.

          Pretty much the only people that can be relied upon to upgrade their gear every 2-3 years are gamers, so the addition of VR isn't "revitalizing" anything. It is just another reason for them to do the upgrade they were already going to do anyway.

          I think waiting a few years before supporting VR on a console makes sense. The current generation of consoles weren't designed with VR in mind and probably wouldn't do it justice.

  2. David 132 Silver badge
    WTF?

    Microsoft aren't helping matters

    The PC market is slowing, so what's needed is a cool, compelling new version of Windows that makes people say "wow!" and enables really exciting new usages - instead of which, Microsoft have given us a succession of complete fusterclucks from Windows 8 onwards. Diminishing sales? Lengthening refresh cycles? A general feeling that what people have now is "good enough"? What a PERFECT time for Microsoft to decide to turn the thumbscrews on everyone, enforce mandatory upgrades/updates, introduce the TIFKAM wtf-batshittery, and generally poison any remaining goodwill towards PCs. Oh yes indeed.

    How do we think Michael Dell and the other OEMs feel about Microsoft right now?

    Grrr.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Microsoft aren't helping matters

      How do we think Michael Dell and the other OEMs feel about Microsoft right now?

      Dell have been vacillating near the exit door on retail PC assembly for a while now, and focusing more on server and enterprise services. So I think Michael is probably fairly indifferent to whatever happens for the desktop and for home users.

      For people like Asus, they have exposure to tablets, mobile, and to the Android and Apple device markets, and it is the saturation of all those markets that create a problem. But at least tablets and phones generally have a two year life expectancy.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        @Ledswinger

        I agree with your comments on Dell, but this paragraph made no sense to me:

        For people like Asus, they have exposure to tablets, mobile, and to the Android and Apple device markets, and it is the saturation of all those markets that create a problem. But at least tablets and phones generally have a two year life expectancy.

        First of all, how does Asus have exposure to the Apple device market? Do they sell some Bluetooth keyboard accessory or something? I'd hardly call that exposure to the Apple device market...

        Anyway, tablets most certainly do NOT have a two year life expectancy. That's the whole reason the tablet market has been declining, current thought is that it has a PC like replacement cycle. My parents are still using their iPad 2, and I know a couple people still using the original one and it works just fine. Sure, a newer model would be faster, better etc. but a lot of people just don't use tablets or computers in a way that is at all demanding and doesn't need better performance. They might think it is nice to have, but not nice enough that they're willing to pay for it. PCs and tablets have more of a "when it stops working" replacement cycle these days.

        With phones, yeah, they have a short replacement cycle but that may be changing. What reason does someone who has an iPhone 6 or Galaxy S5 have for replacing it with a Galaxy S7 or an iPhone 7? Is there any new functionality they can't live without? Will it make a big difference to them to have the improved performance? Phones may have reached the "good enough" point for most people....if Apple and Samsung see their replacement cycle start to lengthen, you can bet it will hit second tier phone manufacturers like Asus twice as hard because they are already playing in the budget market segment to begin with.

    2. Mage Silver badge

      Re: Microsoft aren't helping matters

      " Microsoft have given us a succession of complete fusterclucks from Windows 8 onwards."

      Actually since XP and Server 2003. (NT 5.1 & NT 5.2?)

      Windows 7 was after all not a new OS, simply a fix up of disastrous Vista, should have been free to Vista users.

      The release of Vista (NT 6.0 I think) and Win 7 (NT 6.1?) left out almost all the "interesting" new features promised after Win2K/XP/Server 2003. Bugs in Explorer and other parts of windows since NT4.0 still are not fixed.

      The GUI has become more inconsistent and each version of windows since NT4.0 has gratuitously moved were admin / set up settings accessed from GUI.

      Mostly the default install is STILL based on a Server not a workstation with too many server type services and other stupid services running.

      We are seeing the result of bad management over the last 15 years coming home to roost. It's like what Nokia did since 2002 (Killed S80 and touch GUI development back then, high point was the the first few Nokia Communicators). Where will MS be in 2020?

    3. Doctor Syntax Silver badge

      Re: Microsoft aren't helping matters

      "The PC market is slowing, so what's needed is a cool, compelling new version of Windows that makes people say "wow!" and enables really exciting new usages"

      If W7 has been doing pretty well what its users need then I can't see most users regarding anything as cool or compelling (unless you're thinking of enticing Apple users to move over ;). New uses, yes, if they need something that wasn't in W7 or, even better in their existing PC hardware(because it's sales of PC that the industry needs to stimulate.

      However I don't think anyone has invented anything in that category for a good while now. Innovation seems to have moved over to what can be done online. If that needs a PC then the existing PCs are capable enough but the indications are that most such innovations can be done with a tablet, phone or chromebook.

  3. N2

    And

    XP refuseniks around 10%, 7 - 48.57% & even 8 holding on to 8.77%

    So 'hardball' tactics not really worked then? & only galvanised those who dont want it by installing Never 10, un-installing KB3035583 or do whate ever else stops the feckking malware downloading & screwing up your other wise perfectly good PC.

    Because Microsoft wont give a toss if it does.

    1. Mage Silver badge

      Re: And

      Which doesn't count old PCs never on Internet or PCs replaced by phone / tablet and rarely used online.

    2. Mage Silver badge

      Re: And

      The Win 10 débâcle was even on BBC R4 You & Yours today. They were not kind to MS.

    3. MrTuK

      Re: And

      Yeah well, from having one Win 7 Laptop I now have upgraded to Ubuntu and so impressed I have purchased a laptop of eBay and ungraded that to Ubuntu too !

      So far from getting me to use that dodgy data slurping OS I now have two secure laptops on a completely different OS altogether - So shove that where the sun don't shine MS - Thanks for 20 years of Windows now F**k o** !

      That might just be me being stubborn, but Linux isn't as difficult as everyone made out and I haven't found anything I can't do that I could do in MS Windows !

      And all without being data slurped and for free !

    4. Updraft102

      Re: And

      "& only galvanised those who dont want it by installing Never 10, un-installing KB3035583 or do whate ever else stops the feckking malware downloading & screwing up your other wise perfectly good PC.

      Because Microsoft wont give a toss if it does."

      I think they'd actually prefer it if a PC was rendered inoperable than if the upgrade was never attempted. At least there was a chance the upgrade would work, and now the owner of the newly-bricked PC has a good reason to go buy a new PC with Windows 10 on it. It fits perfectly with their "throw caution to the wind" approach to pushing the upgrades without ever informing their own customers that there was risk involved and that a full backup image is a must.

      If Windows users truly had informed consent before going forward with the upgrade, a certain percentage would decide it to be too risky and decline; that is an outcome MS is not willing to accept. Better to keep people in the dark and take the chance; any chance of success, no matter how slim, is worth pursuing, and no chance of bricking a PC is great enough to outweigh the chance that the upgrade may work.

      With that kind of attitude from Microsoft, it is no wonder that people have dug in their heels and declared that Windows 10 will never be allowed on their computers. Even a lot of people who think 10 is otherwise a good product have been put off by this; personally, I find the product to be as bad as the techniques used to force it onto us, so I have no such dissonance.

      I used to say that I have 3+ years to wait to see if 10 becomes a good product, but now I don't think I would take 10 even if they fixed all of the many things wrong with it. I've never liked MS the way that Apple fans like Apple; it's mostly been a grudging admission that they're not so bad rather than actual admiration, but now it is nothing but contempt.

      Consequently, I'm writing this from Linux Mint (KDE), which is now set to dual boot with Win 7 on my main PC. The plan is to gradually transition to Mint fully, except for the things that won't run on Linux at all, and for those I'll keep Win 7, even beyond the cutoff date if necessary. Hopefully, WINE will be at a point in 3 years where the things I want to run won't need Windows at all, or there will be native Linux versions. I understand that the Linux forums are seeing a flood of new users who have previously only used Windows.

      Congratulations, Microsoft; you've accomplished in a year what 25 years of propaganda from the Mac cultists have not: You've made me think Windows is terrible.

  4. Flocke Kroes Silver badge

    The other columns

    Analytics.gov give Microsoft 100% of the desktop market. The March, April, May figures for the others are:

    Netmarketshare: 86.50, 83.64, 84.86

    Statcounter: 85.91, 85.34, 84.61

    So ABM have about 15% market share, and gain about .75% per month. As the figures are for desktops, not phones or servers we are looking at Apple, Linux, and a *BSD user, not Android, Openwrt, or the commercial Unixes. If Windows 10 can keep growing at this rate, Microsoft will be out of the desktop business in 10 years. In real life, Microsoft would need a sequence of spectacular fails to maintain this trend. Although I have confidence in their ability to screw up, they would need Stephen Elop back for such a consistent run of failure. On the other hand, ten years is far enough in the future for the desktop market fade into insignificance.

    1. bombastic bob Silver badge

      Re: The other columns

      "Analytics.gov give Microsoft 100% of the desktop market."

      that seems kind of, "odd", to me. or 'rigged'. I guess Obaka and Mrs. Clinton have received sufficient payoffs in the form of campaign contributions and contributions to things like "The Clinton Foundation" in order to play favorites in the analytics?

    2. fung0

      Re: The other columns

      Gartner recently reported that in Q1 2015, Microsoft’s share of the global smartphone market was about 2.5%. In Q1 of this year, it had dropped to 0.7%. Clearly, everyone is really excited about this Windows 10 ‘universal platform’ thingy…

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      No, the figure the Reg shows from them only show Microsoft

      Visit their home page (analytics.usa.gov) and you can see their overall stats. Windows has just over 50% of their visits, iOS 21%, Android 16%, Mac 9% and "other" (Linux, Windows Phone, Blackberry, etc.) has 2%.

      Obviously since these are measuring US government web site access it is mostly a snapshot of the USA - though 18% of their visits are international. I would have guess more like 1.8%! I remember seeing something where they showed how the stats changed on M-F days versus Sat/Sun to show the effect of access from work versus home - there was more Windows during the workday, more Mac and phone/tablet on the weekend.

      The stats for browsers was particularly interesting. Is Firefox really only 8% of their visits, and IE only 18%? I can understand Safari at 23% given the iOS and Mac numbers, but where is Android? Are they all getting lumped in with Chrome regardless of what they're really using?

      1. Richard Plinston

        Re: No, the figure the Reg shows from them only show Microsoft

        Is Firefox really only 8% of their visits,

        I suspect that more Firefox users have NoScript, Ghostery, AdBlock and similar and thus don't run the Javascript that reports back to the stats site.

        > and IE only 18%?

        Yes. IE has been declining year by year.

    4. MrTuK

      Re: The other columns

      Sorry thats not soon enough for MS to disappear with the complete arrogance they have shown that they don't give two hoots for security or privacy or anything except force feeding us what they want ti give us - and they say they want to listen to users feedback - but to do so you have to have a MS account ? Why, it would be simple enough for them to get the MS Widows S/N but no, what they really want is for you to register to get an MS account and then completely ignore what people want and to say look x million are using feed back and we are really listen to everything users say and then ignoring them and giving them what we feel is best for them like it or not !

      Its a bit like the get Windows now or later debacle - no choice really except to jump ship to another OS !

      The only real users that are willingly jumping are maybe gamers as they want access to DX12 - Well they don't need to - Soon Vulkan games will be out and they work on all versions of Windows and Linux and Mac and PS4 and Nintendo and Android and Xbox !

      Yes it will take time, yes I know you are impatient and can't wait - All gamers are the same, they want it now, actually they want it yesterday ! Well this time you will have to wait but the wait will be worth it, AMD cards potentially because of the design (multi-threaded) that they will get a bigger boost than Nvidia but cross-platform game is going to be here - Ironically it will be down the the most efficient OS which will give the higher FPS which might give Linux an advantage, I don't know but that could put the cat amongst the pigeons so to speak - maybe !

  5. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Upgrade ? Not really.

    The perception from the (small) sample of the public I deal with is that no one seems to have a good word to say about windows 10. Compared to windows 7 its a disorganised mess that spies on you and crashes a lot. Its not much of an 'upgrade' when helpful features like media centre, aero graphics and deciding which updates to run have been removed. The start menu is crap and bloated, control panel wrecked in favour of sticking the settings in two places rather than one, and the GUI designed by a colour blind member of Fisher Price's design team. It looks ugly and amateurish - which for an OS that seems to be the NSA's wet dream is surprising.

    1. Boothy

      Re: Upgrade ? Not really.

      The only thing I've found that seems to be a genuine 'upgrade' is DirectX 12. But that's only really relevant to gamer's.

      So far I've only met one person who actually likes Windows 10, but he also liked Windows 8.0 (yes .0 not even .1!), so it takes all sorts :-/

      I'm happy with my venerable Win 7 for now (and Mint on the 2nd SSD).

      1. fung0

        Re: Upgrade ? Not really.

        Boothy: The only thing I've found that seems to be a genuine 'upgrade' is DirectX 12. But that's only really relevant to gamer's.

        The excitement about DirectX 12 must surely be waning, given that, almost a full year after launch, there are still no significant, fully-commercial games that support it.

        In the olden days, Microsoft had games rolling out Day One to support and promote its latest DX platform. As I've pointed out previously, it just might be significant that the guy in charge of gaming at Microsoft calls himself the "Head of Xbox"...

        It also might be relevant that when Bethesda recently showed its new Doom running at 200fps on the latest GPU, they were using a version based on Vulkan, not DX12. Vulkan will allow developers to target every version of Windows, plus Linux, plus (eventually) the Mac. DX12 hits only that sliver of Windows 10 adopters. Which API makes the most sense at this point?

      2. Updraft102

        Re: Upgrade ? Not really.

        And even then only to gamers who use AMD GPUs. DX12 has not shown to be any better than DX11 on Nvidia cards so far, including the brand new GTX 1080.

  6. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Retail Therapy

    Visited a number of shopping centers recently, and in the well known high street seller of tvs/cameras/pc's etc, staff loafing around, made no attempt to ask me if I required assistance in parting with my money.

    PC product range, pathetic and dumbed down.

    Visited Apple stores, attentive and helpful staff, all occupied with taking money.

    Loads of stuff to buy.

    Now in the fruity store if I had been heralded by angels as I went in to collect my new shiny thing it would have been perfect, still 99.9% isn't bad.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Retail Therapy

      Funny you should say that… I find the staff trying to sell me something is the last thing I want… I'll look at the goods and make my own mind up, thanks!

      1. ColonelClaw

        Re: Retail Therapy

        Yes, but as a Reg reader you are in a very small minority of people who are clued up about all aspects of modern tech. Those stores are aimed at selling stuff to an average user, i.e. someone who doesn't know that much. That's why Apple are basically printing money with their stores, they make tech approachable, and market it as a desirable commodity, or luxury product.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: Retail Therapy

          Yes, but as a Reg reader you are in a very small minority of people who are clued up about all aspects of modern tech

          … and that has what to do with a clothing shop for example? The comment applies… regardless of whether I'm shopping for shoes or software. If I walk into a shop, one of three things will happen:

          * I either know exactly what I want, and will scan for that particular item, and in a well organised shop, I'll usually find it before I can be directed.

          * I'm in there just to look around and see what's on offer, in which case the assistant isn't going to be of much assistance.

          * I have some idea on what I'm after, but need assistance, in which case I'll seek out the assistant.

          In none of the above examples, are sales people required to find me. Staff should be around in the situation that someone wishes to get assistance, it should not be assumed by default that the assistance is required.

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Retail Therapy

        As do I know what it is I want, but in that particular emporium, nobody approached me, in another well known electronics store that sells bits and pieces, I always get asked.

        The point I believe the OP was trying to make is there is no apparent incentive to sell the products.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: Retail Therapy

          Apple Store pays the staff to sell Apple devices, computers being a large part of this, with a good margin/reward for them.

          Electronics/computer store pays it's staff to sell services. The PC? Makes 10%-5% margin, gives 50p reward to the seller, is confusing and rather stale.

          Yes it's the managements fault and a change in the market, less the staffs.

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Retail Therapy

      The 40% price premium you paid is what enables all that attentive shopping.

      It's like shopping in a posh London store, all image and no substance

  7. 1Rafayal

    This has nothing to do with Microsoft and everything to do with smartphones and tablets.

    People want their social media fix and these devices deliver it.

    1. bombastic bob Silver badge

      the vast majority of phones and slabs run 'Droid and iOS. Micro-shaft LOST that potential market, before they even tried to get into it. Funny, how Micro-shaft STILL wants to shove a phone OS down our throats (or into various OTHER orifices), on desktop and notebook machines.

  8. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    "This doesn't mean the nagware is working:"

    I'm sure the nagware contributes a bit, though. Also contributing to the W10 rise will be the malware part of gwx that suckers people into approving the downgrade or does it behind their backs, and the borkware that knackers working W7 installations with crap updates.

    All that aside - PC sales will continue to decline vs mobile sales, I guess. The only thing I can see that would help to make them rise would be for the OEMs to realise that selling Linux-based alternatives would be a crowd-pleaser (a small crowd initially, but it would grow).

    1. Flocke Kroes Silver badge

      Re: "This doesn't mean the nagware is working:"

      Desktop sales fall because there is no real need to replace anything under five years old and because people would rather replace with a laptop, phone or tablet. People who want Linux have been able to get a blank desktop or laptop for less than the cost of one with Windows for a few years.

      The traditional PC distribution channel has always had good reasons not to distribute Linux: discounts for selling 100% with Windows pre-installed. Lack of crapware for Linux. Linux running on cheap hardware. No commission on AV and Microsoft Office (except for Dell, who would sell you MS Office with your Windowsless Desktop).

      Pre-installed Linux sales come from outside the traditional channel, such as Raspberry Pi and phones. I do not see that changing until after the desktop market is thoroughly dead.

      1. VinceH

        Re: "This doesn't mean the nagware is working:"

        "The traditional PC distribution channel has always had good reasons not to distribute Linux"

        [snip reasons]

        Do you know what I think would be really, really nice? If, rather than a default OS - which in most cases, for all of those reasons, is Windows - a new PC came with a minimal OS that, with a network connection, would offer you a menu of different operating systems, and allowed you to choose which one to install. (Along the lines of the NOOBS cards for the Raspberry Pi).

        A lot would still choose Windows, of course, because it's what they're familiar with - but some would try the alternatives (especially if it was made easy to reset the machine and go back to that starting point if the user didn't like what they've tried).

        Even better still would be if some legal situation forced this to be the way of things - much like the case with Internet Explorer from a while back.

        1. DropBear

          Re: "This doesn't mean the nagware is working:"

          Believe it or not I can walk into most any PC-selling outfit around here (well, not that there are that many left but still) and in pretty much any of them I can get a Pc with... FreeDOS. I don't think I need to explain no sane person from either side of the counter expects that to remain the OS of that PC - it's just there so that there's some difference between that PC and a brick when the power button is pushed...

      2. bombastic bob Silver badge

        Re: "This doesn't mean the nagware is working:"

        "Desktop sales fall because there is no real need to replace anything under five years old "

        that's right.

        For over 10 years "Moore's Law" has stopped contributing to "next year's model" being 50% faster/better. This is the primary 'thing' driving the so-called decline of desktop and notebook computers [it's a 'sales decline' and *NOT* a 'usage decline'].

        Micro-shaft has made it clear that they're not interested in improving their own product's performance [not really], to contribute to any PERCEPTION of 'better' by installing a particular version of windows.

        So people stick with what they have. LOUSY economy, plus no perceived improvement in "new", means *NO* *SALE*. [I've been saying this for MONTHS].

        And we all know that Micro-shaft's version of "New, shiny" was Windows "Ape" (8.0). That got them an increase in windows 7 sales, maybe.

        1. a_yank_lurker

          Re: "This doesn't mean the nagware is working:"

          @bombastic bob - Many agree with your overall analysis. For most users, SOHO and enterprise, the 3 - 5 year kit they have is still perfectly adequate and runs the software they need. The only reason for them to buy anything is to replace dead kit. Throw in dodgy finances and the hardware improvements bring no real performance improvements and there will be softening demand.

          Also, the PC market is primarily a replacement market with the total installed based growing very slowly and almost all the sales being replacement kit. Software has reached a point for many that they do not need the latest version of whatever because 1 or 2 versions back is overkill.

        2. Updraft102

          Re: "This doesn't mean the nagware is working:"

          Microsoft could probably make a lot of money by making a product called Windows 7 SE (second edition), like they did with Win 98. People still want 7-- Win 7 DVDs with legitimate product keys sell for more than Windows 10 on eBay, and the almost-certainly-illegitimate sellers of Win 7 keys (which they claim are legit, of course) are making money by the fistful (just look at the number of previous sales each one lists). Microsoft could be making that money if they wanted to.

          No kidding that people are not falling over themselves to buy PCs with Win 10 on them; the name has become about as toxic as Vista or 8 were. Bringing out a slightly improved (but keeping the UI!) version of 7 (to be sold at full price) with a full 10 years of extended support would be much more of an incentive, and it might get a lot of people holding on to 7 (original) to upgrade at their own expense (rather than take a 10 upgrade for free). It would capture the sales of people buying used (possibly illegitimate) Win 7 keys, and would restore a lot of goodwill in MS after this horrible GWX experience.

          Since the entire reason for this silly "I'm a phone" UI on 8 and 10 was to spur app creation that would in turn sell Windows phones, and it's looking more and more like even MS is giving up on Windows phones, what reason is there to stick to a Windows version whose main feature is a half-phone, half-PC UI?

          I know they won't do that, of course. I'm just dreaming. I just know I'd pay for 6.5 more years of security updates on 7 (10 years minus the 3.5 years I will get with Win 7 as it is now) and an implicit promise to not try to destroy 7 before that, rather than get 5.5 more years for free with 10 (even though MS said it was the last Windows ever, in the extended support column of their support schedule, it shows that security support for 10 is only guaranteed through 2025).

      3. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: "This doesn't mean the nagware is working:"

        >> The traditional PC distribution channel has always had good reasons not to distribute Linux: discounts for selling 100% with Windows pre-installed. Lack of crapware for Linux. Linux running on cheap hardware. No commission on AV and Microsoft Office (except for Dell, who would sell you MS Office with your Windowsless Desktop).

        Yep, there is that. And the fact that almost no-one apart from the readers on this forum want Linux on their computer

  9. Pascal Monett Silver badge

    It's the leap before the deadline

    That Win 1 0 is getting a (small) boost in market share is understandable, the deadline for "not free" is fast approaching.

    Microsoft needs all the market share it can get now because it'll be the last jump forward it will get on this. After June, it will be incremental steps only. Companies cannot switch easily or quickly, and private people who want 1 0 will have already got it. Any "new" installations will be of the buying-a-new-PC type, or when a company finally gets around to cycling its PC pool again.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: It's the leap before the deadline

      Nooooo, the boost is because it isnt nagware any longer - too many people were saying "No". The latest version installs Win10 whether you like it or not.

      Even switching your PC off wont help, it schedules a wake up, then installs itself!! (happen to my mums PC while I was visiting her on Wednesday).

    2. Dan 55 Silver badge
      Meh

      Re: It's the leap before the deadline

      "Due to unprecedented customer demand, we're extending our FREE offer!"

    3. Peter X

      Re: It's the leap before the deadline

      "That Win 1 0 is getting a (small) boost in market share is understandable, the deadline for "not free" is fast approaching."

      If that is the case, and I'm not sure it is, but if it is.... would MS not be better just dropping the price of Windows to ~$20. Maybe different pricing for enterprise, but otherwise, just have a single version of Windows equivalent to Pro for use by home and small business users for basically a minimal price to cover media distribution?

      That would effectively mean giving it free to OEMs, but at least they might then increase the user base a bit more than now; cheaper PCs, slightly more upgrades... maybe?

      In other news, Microsoft might in effect be allowing upgrades to Win 10 after the cut off date, providing you pretend to be are a user who requires assistive technologies!

      1. Dan 55 Silver badge

        Re: It's the leap before the deadline

        Presumably this means that users of Windows with assistive technologies by necessity know more than most in stopping the nagger, as the permanent revolution that is Windows 10 still doesn't work well with them.

  10. Paul Shirley
    Mushroom

    still 700mil short

    Hence the switch to mugging your pc instead of conning it into Win10 downgrades. Won't be surprised if new ransomware strikes before the 1bil deadline and the unlock solution is Win10...

  11. fedor1

    Horrified

    Windows 10 installed itself on my computer while I was writing text and I was on a deadline. I couldn't do anything to stop it. Then we couldn't get the security number right for our facility, wasted a whole day. Now I've got this new, ugly program and a very sluggish computer. Looks like I'm going to have to get a new one, can't work with this nonsense. This time it will be a Mac, I've had it with PC's and Windows.

    1. Dan 55 Silver badge

      Re: Horrified

      How to rollback

      And when you've done that, install GWX Control Panel so it doesn't nag you again.

    2. BobChip
      Happy

      Re: Horrified - can be solved!

      Don't chuck out a perfectly good PC - Just ditch Microsoft, put Linux on it and enjoy the experience. (And think of the environment as well, to make you feel even better about it.)

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Horrified - can be solved!

        He didn't say he was chucking out the old one, only that he was getting a new one. If the old one is still working I imagine he'll give to a friend/relative or donate it.

        It is funny when someone says "I'm done with Microsoft" there is always someone who is telling them what they need to do to continue using Microsoft, and someone else telling them to use Linux. But obviously those pitches aren't working, as Microsoft's share continues to slowly drop - but the loss is to the Mac, not to Linux, despite the best efforts of the pro-Linux crowd.

        FWIW I am now and have been running Linux on my desktop since the late 90s, but I don't go around evangelizing it because people who might want to run Linux already know about it, and those who don't already know about it would not be happy with it if they installed it.

  12. Surur

    Some people here are just crazy. Firstly Microsoft is making Windows more friendly to users by moving them to a safe ecosystem for getting their apps. Windows 10 is also safer than Windows 10 for a number of other security reasons, not the least of which is that users can not refuse to install regular patches.

    If the desktop is so over why do people even care how Microsoft manages it? The fact is that Microsoft is resisting the trend to mobile devices by adding mobile features to Windows such as app sandboxes and a tightly managed experience. The newest versions of Windows will let you sync your notifications to the desktop, and let you unlock it using your fitbit, and offer the same voice search features as found on your phone (which is charging on the other table). It will offer the same Facebook and Instagram app as on your phone, except the photos will be bigger. Your apps will now install, update and uninstall seamlessly, and not leave garbage and wreckage around when they leave. These are all good things.

    Again if everyone is moving to mobile in any case, why should Microsoft not add some of the experience they value there to Windows itself, like an app store?

    If you hate MS and Windows then either you are happy MS is killing itself, or sad that they are doing the right thing. Either way I am sure there will just be complaints.

    Now imagine if Google said they are forcing an upgrade of all Android 4.0 handsets to Marshmallow, and from now on would centrally manage updates so the whole android ecosystem would stay in lock step. Somehow I think the story would be very different.

    And about that 1 billion goal? If they get to 800 million in two years are anyone going to be crying? Why obsess over that specific number just so you could say MS failed?

    1. Roland6 Silver badge

      Windows 10 is also safer than Windows 10 for a number of other security reasons.

      The trouble with Win10 is that due to the major release cycle, such as we saw in Nov-2015 and will see in July, also being labelled Win10, this statement actually makes sense... :)

      But to be accurate, patches don't necessarily make a system 'safer' they may make it more robust and secure but not safer. For safety, I use configurations and tools that prevent users from doing unsafe things, like group policy to lock stuff down and web security software that stops them visiting websites that are known to distribute malware...

    2. inmypjs Silver badge

      "Some people here are just crazy."

      Wish I could downvote more than once, what a dick.

      If I didn't need a platform to run Win32 and a few Win64 apps on my PC with a keyboard and mouse. I wouldn't give a rat's arse about Microsoft or what they are doing.

      That platform is currently Win7 and instead of offering me an improved platform to replace it they offer an expensive (in the future) ugly pile of spyware crap that thinks it is a fucking phone and tells me to tap on screen.

      That is why people are not very happy with Microsoft and what they have done - nothing crazy about it.

      1. DropBear

        ""Some people here are just crazy."

        Wish I could downvote more than once, what a dick."

        Oh, that's just how some people spell "there's exactly two ways to think, my way and the wrong way..."

    3. Wade Burchette

      "Firstly Microsoft is making Windows more friendly to users by moving them to a safe ecosystem for getting their apps."

      Ha ha ha ha ha. Oh wait, you're serious, let me laugh even harder. The app store is as much about safety as smart meters are about saving energy; we are told it is for our benefit but in reality it is for the benefit of the business's wallet. "Safety" is just the blind used to distract you from its real purpose. Just like people love to use "think of the children" to try and prevent any opposition to their idea. And who decides what is and is not safe? And what is to prevent Microsoft from deciding that a competing program is not "safe"? Since Win10 is not owned, they can do that.

      "Windows 10 is also safer than Windows 10 for a number of other security reasons, not the least of which is that users can not refuse to install regular patches."

      I have found 25 security updates for Windows 7 that cause an essential Microsoft program I use every day to crash. 25. And these 25 are messing up one of Microsoft's own programs. Strange as it might seem, businesses have essential programs. Strange as it might seem, these essential programs can be affected by Windows update. Control over which updates you install is critical. Furthermore, who is to say what Microsoft is pushing in their non-optional updates? What if a "security" update was pushed out that essentially disabled all your privacy choices. (Since Win10 is not owned, they can do that.) P.S. It is 'cannot', one word.

      "If the desktop is so over why do people even care how Microsoft manages it?"

      The desktop is only over because of Windows 8 and Windows 10. You should see how people's faces shine when I tell them how they can get a Windows 7 computer. If Microsoft released a Windows 7 clone with the performance enhancement of Windows 8, desktop sales would soar and people would have paid good money to buy it, guaranteed. Microsoft's buzzword-chasing book-smart-but-real-world-stupid incompetents ended the desktop, not tablets. There is a difference between knowledge and wisdom.

      "Now imagine if Google said they are forcing an upgrade of all Android 4.0 handsets to Marshmallow, and from now on would centrally manage updates so the whole android ecosystem would stay in lock step. Somehow I think the story would be very different."

      Sigh ... Comparing apples to oranges. Tablets/smartphones have not been mainstream except for a few years. There aren't programs 15 years old on them that we need to run. We are not used to having the freedom to install whatever we want whenever we want on them. They are a different use case anyway. Besides, it is not about the upgrade, it is about the upgrade to clearly inferior product whose sole purpose is to spy on you and to force you into an app store so that Microsoft can get a cut of all programs sold for the computer. I would be happy with an upgrade if the product was superior, but it is not. Windows 10 has a stink so bad around it that nobody wants it. Why do you think that is? If it is was such a superior product, then why do they have to resort to making people take it, like it or not? All we ever wanted was an improved version of Windows 7. All we got was the worst Windows ever.

      1. Surur

        You are so stuck in the old ways of doing things, and you want to hold back Microsoft while you refuse to change.

        There is more than 2 billion Android devices in use, and more than 1 billion iOS devices. 50% of web traffic is now from mobile devices. Windows 7 is 7 years old. Stop trying to hold MS back because you refuse to change. The whole world has moved on already, and Microsoft is trying to modernize Windows to keep pace.

        Take your 15 year old apps and 7 year old OS and run it in a virtual machine, and get with the times.

        1. bombastic bob Silver badge

          "You are so stuck in the old ways of doing things"

          "Stop trying to hold MS back because you refuse to change"

          "The whole world has moved on already"

          "get with the times."

          That's more arrogant shilling (the verb, not the currency) than I've seen in a long time, and all in a single post!

          1. Surur

            And yet it's all true. The iPhone was only introduced 9 years ago. Yet you want a 2016 operating system to work the same as a 2009 one? Get with the times grandpa.

            1. Stuart 22

              "Yet you want a 2016 operating system to work the same as a 2009 one? Get with the times grandpa."

              Well I am a grandpa and I've seen more progress and welcome change in the last 50 years then you have probably had hot dinners. And I've seen a whole load of once innovative companies hit the wall and die.

              If you can't spot that MS have hit the wall then you must be one of them because outside you meet very few people who hunger for the next MS release. They countered the problem of a stagnating sector ... by stagnating. At least Apple (for whom I have less affection) has succeeded from being a hobby company to a PC innovator to steal the Sony Walkman market and destroying Nokia. OK the Rolex thing hasn't quite worked out yet. Apple's next step is going to be difficult but at least they have a track record of moving on.

              All Microsoft seemed to have done is to translate their early monopoly of the PC market with adding lucrative margin through Office. But even that is getting mighty tired now and whether the cloudy version will keep its market share will be kinda interesting.

              No mate, its not me that hasn't moved on. I have - elsewhere which is precisely MS's problem. its your heroes thrashing around to almost complete indifference or derision you need to worry about.

              1. Surur

                Stagnating? Windows is Microsoft's 5th largest business. Maybe you have not been keeping track.

                Stagnating would be having Windows 7 version 10. Every modern OS needs app sandboxing, an app store, and guaranteed updates. Yet all we have is complaints.

                1. Roland6 Silver badge

                  Stagnating would be having Windows 7 version 10.

                  But stagnation is fundamental to Windows 10, which according to MS is the last version of Windows. From their release numbering, it would seem they are very keen for users to lose interest:

                  Windows 10 v1507 Build 10.0.10240 Codename "Threshold 1"

                  Windows 10 v1511 Build 10.0.10586 Codename "Threshold 2"

                  Windows 10 vTBA Build TBA Codename "Redstone 1"

                  ...

                2. Richard Plinston

                  > Every modern OS needs app sandboxing, an app store, and guaranteed updates.

                  Maybe, but the users don't.

                3. Ropewash
                  Paris Hilton

                  @Surur

                  I realize I'm feeding the trolls but...

                  Every modern OS needs;

                  App sandboxing - True. Preferably in a way that cuts it off from ratting you out to the mothership too.

                  An app store - Fuck off back to mobile you tosser.

                  Guaranteed updates - Yeah, but not forced updates. There's a big difference.

                  The more I see it the more the term App makes me think of VD. "That damned whore gave me the app."

                  Paris ...for some reason.

                  1. energystar
                    Holmes

                    Re: @Surur

                    Is my personal view that Inexperienced users have no idea how damaging this 'Store Model' is to the Computing Experience. Nothing more toxic has been previously done, and more user' alienating. Transforming an Empowering Tool into a 'Interactive Channel' Media.

                    Allow us to forget -for a moment- the question if you own your hardware today. Are you going to own your media tomorrow?

                    By the way, up-vote to Surur just because (having the courage). Now knowing new [twisted] ways of evaluating.

                4. Updraft102

                  If you're talking about phone operating systems, sure.

                  On a desktop, I don't run apps. I have no use for an app store, or an app anything.

              2. energystar
                Windows

                "...[than] you ... have had HOT dinners". Well done Stuart22!. [Reasons there are for you being grandpa!]. Now really starting to learn English. Please keep enlightening this heavy summer.

            2. Roland6 Silver badge

              Re: " Yet you want a 2016 operating system to work the same as a 2009 one?"

              From a user perspective, my 2016 car works in exactly the same way as my first car - built in 1972 did: I still use a steering wheel, I have a speedo, a fuel gauge, three pedals (in the same order) and a gear stick. Yes on my current car the steering wheel is covered in fax leather and it has power steering and the brakes have ABS and there is a sh*t load of electronics and emissions control gear under the bonnet. So the expectation isn't unreasonable...

              1. energystar
                Headmaster

                Re: " Yet you want a 2016 operating system to work the same as a 2009 one?"

                "It's a pretty good one axe, you know..."

                [Paraphrased, referenced some days ago at ElReg Blog].

        2. Richard Plinston

          > You are so stuck in the old ways of doing things, and you want to hold back Microsoft while you refuse to change.

          "Refusing to change" does not "hold back Microsoft" in any way, shape, or form. They can modify their system any way they want, just don't force me to be a part of it.

          > Microsoft is trying to modernize Windows to keep pace.

          I do not want _my_ computer 'modernized', I do not care what Microsoft does with their products.

          > Take your 15 year old apps and 7 year old OS and run it in a virtual machine, and get with the times.

          > That is just a complexification that is entirely unrequired.

        3. Destroy All Monsters Silver badge
          Headmaster

          A message to the MS astroturfist

          Stop trying to hold MS back because you refuse to change.

          Yes, it's a very 20/21-st century thing to pretend to know best for everyone out there. In the domain of politics, we have the mountains of bones to prove it.

          In the marketplace, even in the one in which Microsoft is the Gorilla, it's the customer who decides whether he wants to "change" and in which direction this not-coincidentally-left-unspecified "change" is supposed to go.

          If Microsoft brings out a compelling improvement, fine. I could imagine paying for it and using it from time to time.

          If Microsoft brings out a whoring OS laden with rank ideas that gene-combined in various "customer-orientation" committees with too much antithetical directions about the "next big ting", not fine.

          Go back to basics, make clear what is going on, give options, don't threaten the customer or handle him like you own his arse.

          More here: The 'new' Microsoft? I still wouldn't touch them with a barge pole

        4. Updraft102

          We're the customers. We're supposed to be the ones calling the shots. Customers don't hold MS back-- it's Microsoft's job to give us what we want. By definition, we can't hold them back. Your arrogant attitude fits right in at Microsoft!

          There's nothing modern about Windows 10. The UI is the worst MS has ever offered; I'd rather use the Windows 3.0 UI than the "I'm a phone... no, wait, I'm a PC" monstrosity of 10. If that's what you're calling "modern," I think it's fair to say the market has spoken-- we don't want it.

          If I have to agree to a EULA that gives MS everything but the kitchen sink to be modern, I want no part of it. If I have to agree to let MS do whatever they want with my PC's operating system, without exception, in advance, and in perpetuity, in order to be modern, then you know what you can do with that.

          Universal things suck. Go to the auto parts store and get a universal part... it's never going to work as well, fit as well, or be as easy to install as a custom fit part. It's always like that-- something designed specifically for the task at hand is going to outperform something that is a jack of all trades. Windows 10, with its "universal" Windows platform, is a shining example.

          Windows 8 was a disaster on the desktop, but on tablets and phones, it was nearly universally praised. In an attempt to placate the desktop users that shunned 8, MS made 10 more desktop-friendly. Now the consensus is that Windows 10 pales in comparison to Windows 8 on mobiles; a major step backwards.

          Does this mean that at least MS has finally made an OS as good on the desktop as Windows 7? Not even close. Windows 10 is still too mobile-oriented when used on the PC... the unavoidable "app" bits of the UI have the massive amounts of wasted screen space, the comically oversized controls, and the menus that require excessive amounts of drilling down that are necessary evils on a mobile device, but are completely unnecessary on a PC with a real mouse and decent sized display.

          Windows 10 is a universal product that is supposed to run on anything, and apparently it does... poorly. It has the dubious distinction of being equally crappy and inferior to previous versions of Windows on both mobile and desktop. Congratulations, MS; you've created a masterpiece of suck.

      2. Roland6 Silver badge

        All we ever wanted was an improved version of Windows 7

        Actually, I suspect that the vast majority of non-techie users would of been happy with an improved version of XP...

        Putting aside TIFKAM I can't think of any desktop/laptop functionality in 7, 8 & 10 that couldn't of been implemented using the XP/W2K classic style UI.

    4. Anonymous Coward
      Thumb Down

      Have a down vote, as I am guessing you are the (only) person who down voted my earlier posting.

      Work for Microshit by any chance??

      1. Surur

        "Work for Microshit by any chance??"

        So I am supposed to take your opinions on Window$ $eriou$ly?

        1. Dan 55 Silver badge

          So I am supposed to take your opinions on Window$ $eriou$ly?

          A quick look through your posting history shows how seriously we should take your opinions on Windows.

      2. Updraft102

        Probably one of the PR companies that MS hired. Plausible deniability, you know.

    5. bombastic bob Silver badge

      "Some people here are just crazy."

      you say that like it's a BAD thing...

      "If the desktop is so over why do people even care how Microsoft manages it"

      loaded question. First, the desktop is *NOT* over. Looking at sales figures is not representative of the total number of people using desktop or notebook machines (it's like a derivative, not an integral, with more factors thrown in to make the maths impossible to derive). Second, many of us who PREFER non-windows computers STILL have to use them on occasion because the software we purchased was written FOR windows and won't work on anything else. Let's say accounting, certain games, multimedia production, and things like that. Pretty much everything ELSE I do, and that's a huge 'everything else', is done on Linux or FreeBSD (work-related specifically).

      And I don't own a smart phone. The dumb one is fine, and I don't use it very much. And I don't need a slab. The economy has limited my discretionary budget anyway and I have other things I'd rather spend cash on. New computers aren't "new, shiny" enough these days.

      And I think that sums it up for a LOT of us, and it also explains the market.

    6. Destroy All Monsters Silver badge

      Hmmm... I think the whole Excelsheet of corporospeak has been included there...

    7. Updraft102

      Microsoft is resisting the trend toward mobile devices by releasing two versions of Windows in a row that throw the desktop user under the bus in an attempt to capture the mobile market? Mobile first, cloud first... The only reason we're getting such an absurd thing as apps on the desktop is to spur development of mobile apps that will also be usable on the desktop.

      For years, MS has had no coherent schema for installation of programs. They throw bits of themselves wherever they want and put their greasy hands all over the registry, and Windows just allows it, in part because the Windows installer is weak. MS could have fixed this at any time going forward; it simply would not be compatible with older programs (just as the app installer isn't).

      Phone apps on a desktop are not an appropriate fix for the problem. It's a side effect of Microsoft's push for the phone market that is being played up as a feature.

      You seem to think that the people complaining are "MS haters." We're MS _customers_, who had every intention of continuing to use Windows into the foreseeable future, until this whole GWX thing came along. We hate what MS is doing, and we hate especially what MS is doing _to us_. We hate that eventually we will either be using insecure, unsupported versions of Windows we like, or else we will be stuck with Windows 10.

      If we're MS haters, maybe MS should stop and think why their actions are turning their own customers into MS haters.

  13. nkuk

    Low marketshare

    I'm actually really surprised that the marketshare for Windows 10 is so low after almost a year. Its free, practically forced onto peoples PCs, yet ~80% of systems aren't running it. Microsoft are only just past a quarter of their "1 billion devices" pipe dream with only a couple of months until the free upgrade / forced install blitzkrieg ends, it seems Win 10 is failing.

    1. Mark M.

      Re: Low marketshare

      Given that soon, you won't be able to buy/download/install Win7 anywhere for new desktops/laptops/tablets unless you know someone who has a DVD with a valid, unused Win7 product key with it, you have Hobsons choice of using Win10 or Linux. Places like eBay will probably flood with pirates offering Win7 OEM DVDs with a product key that may (or most likely) may not work when you install it.

      The small group of Win7 fanbois who are pissed off at MS will drift to Linux, or just stop receiving MS updates in fear of MS forcing them to upgrade to Win10, Most users will shrug and accept that Win10 is the future of the PC.

      It wouldn't surprise me if MS haven't already installed a timebomb in Win7 in that if it doesn't install any updates from them in xx months, Part or all of Win7 will just stop working though being considered a "vulnerable threat" if connected to the internet.

      1. DropBear

        Re: Low marketshare

        "Places like eBay will probably flood with pirates offering Win7 OEM DVDs with a product key that may (or most likely) may not work when you install it."

        FYI, any pirate Win7 DVD worth its salt installs without ever needing to verify or validate anything online. There's nothing "most likely" about it.

        1. This post has been deleted by its author

          1. Destroy All Monsters Silver badge

            Re: Low marketshare

            "Pirates" may well be more consumer-firendly than the original outfits and actually have FEWER backdoors...

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Paris Hilton

        Re: Low marketshare

        Yeah, they have broken Win Update for Win7, it just doesnt work (unless you want to download the Win10 crapware).

        In my mind, Win7 is now "Abandonware"; if (on the off-chance), I need a new machine loaded with it, I will use one of my existing DVDs, a certain program for activating it, and not bother with the Update website.

        After all, I still have one machine running XP, and despite all the pronouncements of doom, it hasnt been hacked or infected at all since support ended; and in reference to a post about dodgy intercepts in Chinese hotels, it has been used REPEATEDLY in various Chinese hotels, and STILL my bank account remains untouched!!!

        Now if only PARIS would turn up in one of those hotel rooms (or a reasonable facsimile of her).

        1. Mage Silver badge

          Re: Low marketshare

          XP ...

          Good user practices & turn off all services not needed.

          Use a separate firewall

          Use safe browser with NoScript, no Java and no Flash

          No media player or PDF plugins in browser

          No remote HTML etc in a safe email client

          use a VPN away from home.

          Don't use Adobe for PDF, Apple quicktime etc

          dual boot to Mint + Mate + WINE + Redmond theme :D

  14. Carl D

    Does the Windows 10 market share include all those who have (voluntarily or more often not) gone from W7 or 8.1 to 10 and then rolled back within 30 days or clean installed 7 or 8.1 if they've gone beyond the 30 day rollback?

    I bet it does. And, from what I've been reading, there's a lot of rollbacks going on. Especially lately with MS's shenanigans trying to trick people into installing W10.

    1. Boothy

      From what I understand, these figures are generated from active Internet browser use. i.e. page access data etc.

      So this 'should' be active systems, if a user has rolled back, their stats would be back under whatever OS they were previously on (7 or 8.1 presumably).

      1. Richard Plinston

        > these figures are generated from active Internet browser use. i.e. page access data etc.

        It is often done by Javascript running in the browser reporting directly to the stats sites.

        Anyone with two clues will be running NoScript and Ghostery or similar and will not be in the stats at all*.

        * Which explains the huge preponderance of Windows user in the stats.

    2. bombastic bob Silver badge
      Trollface

      "Does the Windows 10 market share include..." (etc.

      I have suggested in the past that Microsoft may, in fact, be inflating their own web statistics on weekends by running their office computers in "pound the network" mode. It's been observed by more than one person and at least one 'El Reg' article that during the week, windows 7 gets a bigger "net share" than on the weekends and holidays. That would be ONE way to explain it.

      And the 'gummint' stats COULD be explained by welfare recipients pounding their servers using "free" windows 10 to find out how to get more "free" gummint benefits... (they've got plenty of time after all)

      OK I admit there's nothing to back this up except my personal cynicism.

  15. Dave 15

    Every up (sorry down) grade of Windows is a total disaster

    Fatter, slower, more bug ridden and far more annoying.

    Office 360.... what a pile of manure

    How long does it take to start a version of windows these days... hours and hours.

    The only reason I still have it on my laptop is that I have an older version and continue to find linux is even worse. One day that will change, or maybe someone will get enough finance together to build something decent. (I discount iOS as a serious contender as I am neither an artist nor loaded)

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Every up (sorry down) grade of Windows is a total disaster

      >How long does it take to start a version of windows these days<

      Cold-boot of Windows 10 on my elderly HP Elitebook 8440p takes 15 seconds tops (off SSD, of course)

      1. Mage Silver badge

        Re: Every up (sorry down) grade of Windows is a total disaster

        You can "cold boot" XP on a four year old laptop using a 5400 RPM HDD, in under 15 seconds, if all the junk is removed, eye candy off and all services not needed are disabled.

        About 1s to load Win 3.1 in a VM! ^_^

    2. TVU Silver badge

      Re: Every up (sorry down) grade of Windows is a total disaster

      "The only reason I still have it on my laptop is that I have an older version and continue to find linux is even worse. One day that will change, or maybe someone will get enough finance together to build something decent. (I discount iOS as a serious contender as I am neither an artist nor loaded)"

      Linux operating systems have significantly moved on in the last decade and so I'd suggest trying out any one of Linux Mint Cinnamon, Linux Mint Mate or Zorin to see how you get on. Indeed, I know of some small businesses that have switched over to those operating systems because they just can't afford the ever increasing fees for enterprise versions of Windows. Since many business orientated software, e.g. Sage products, now works online, it's pretty much immaterial what the desktop operating system is these days.

    3. energystar
      Pint

      Re: Every up (sorry down) grade of Windows is a total disaster

      "Fatter, slower, more bug ridden and far more annoying."

      Take the slower out now. [Fatter also, probably right now (or 'really soon now', if AI optionality enhanced)]. As for the rest... Well, here We are, asking for a little amount of good will.

      Maybe they could offer a 'free' upload of rarely used libraries to their servers. That famous 'containers' thing. Also a portable, spinning HD backup option, just in case.

      1. energystar
        Holmes

        Re: Every up (sorry down) grade of Windows is a total disaster

        Any services or programs unable to fully work after that uncluttering by upload should be marked by, say a diferent menu color, and a more detailed system log notification.

  16. Anonymous Coward
    Windows

    Get with the times, grandpa!

    Windows 10 gets you the enhanced and new services and a refreshed UI for £0 plus it runs faster on the box you're using for Windows 7/8.x

    What's not to like?

    1. Dan 55 Silver badge

      Re: Get with the times, grandpa!

      Shit UI, telemetry/lack of privacy, pushing MS account, adverts on lock screen and in start menu...

    2. inmypjs Silver badge

      Re: Get with the times, grandpa!

      Get back under your bridge.

    3. a_yank_lurker

      Re: Get with the times, grandpa!

      I did, I run Linux only on my kit.

    4. Destroy All Monsters Silver badge
      Paris Hilton

      Re: Get with the times, grandpa!

      What's not to like?

      Please post yoof yodeling orgasmically in Microsoft stores or I won't believe you.

    5. energystar
      Windows

      Re: Get with the times, grandpa!

      "Get back under your bridge."

      [Maybe] you know... I like Sun, and the green.

  17. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    MS shill

    Windows 10 is ace!

    It fixed my truck, got my lady back and even washed my dog!

    1. ADRM

      Re: MS shill

      Since this usually (girl, dog and truck back) happens when you play the Country song backwards I assume you must have uninstalled Windows 10 and gone back to Sensible Seven......

    2. David 132 Silver badge
      Happy

      Re: MS shill

      Windows 10 is ace!

      It fixed my truck, got my lady back and even washed my dog!

      ..admittedly, my truck now won't let me open the hood "for my own security" and the dash layout changes randomly every Tuesday (for some reason the gear shifter is now a sub-menu from the infotainment screen??) and I have to buy fuel for it from Microsoft at a 30% markup;

      ...my lady reports every single thing I do to Microsoft;

      ...and my dog appears to have a large LED screen surgically embedded into his side, that shows me rotating adverts for Candy Crush, Winalot Prime and Office 365....

      ...but still, THANKS, WINDOWS 10!!

    3. Mark 85
      Happy

      Re: MS shill

      It fixed my truck, got my lady back and even washed my dog!

      For a complete Country Song, you need to add in something about trains, prison, rain, and mom. But I'll upvote you anyway.

    4. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: MS shill

      > got my lady back

      But then she heard about my affair with Cortana...

    5. energystar
      Windows

      Re: MS shill

      Every first World d!(k wishing for slavery to come back. [Patience, soon... Don't forget to vote].

      [I'll got your lady back].

  18. Col_Panek
    Pint

    Still holdouts to W10 upgrade?? Imagine

    Maybe MS will pay you to install it, or send their goons around to wise youse up.

    Won't work on me, all-Linux now. Well, Android too, that almost counts.

  19. Mark 85

    Office Politics and MS.

    From some folks I know (former and current MS types), it appears that the Windows division either runs MS or is autonomous. They're doing what they want, when they want, without much say so from the C-Suite. It could be that they are feeling threatened and losing power within the company unless Win10 is a success.

    A lot of mixed signals being sent, a lot of feedback from users is being ignored. It's very possible that MS will survive but Windows won't.

    The current MS types that I know are looking for new jobs as they are a bit scared with all the politics, etc. going on behind the scenes. Makes me wonder what the real story is...

  20. A Ghost
    Coat

    I finally got rid of Win X malware

    Touch wood, walk backwards, reciting the lord's prayer (also backwards) - eh, don't laugh, it's worked for me so far. Cargo Cult Programming? It's not voodoo if it works!

    Just about to do a full system image now that I've finally got rid of this crap after having to turn off windows updates nearly a year ago now. Microsoft left me no choice. I know it's bad. But it was not my decision. I was coerced and did it under duress. Microsoft did this willingly and knowingly, and of sound mind, rendering my machine unfit for purpose through their illegal hi-jacking of my system.

    I found a script that I think one of our very own commentards wrote - it is this:

    net stop wuauserv

    net stop bits

    rd /s /q %windir%\softwaredistribution

    net start bits

    net start wuauserv

    wuauclt.exe /detectnow

    (you might want to copy/paste that to a text file, and rename it with a .bat extension to run)

    I call mine "Fuck_you_Microsoft_you_fucking_Cunts.bat" - ymmv.

    The problem I found with this script at least on my machine was that it started the update again a few hours later after the machine being turned on. So I 'hacked' it (i.e. changed some things only having a very vague idea of what I was doing), to this:

    net stop wuauserv

    net stop bits

    rd /s /q %windir%\softwaredistribution

    And that was enough to stop all updating till at least the machine was rebooted. It also frees up the GB that it has raped down your pipes and on to your hard disk. Without fail, it would suck down a whole 1.5GB every fucking day before stopping and doing nothing. The best bit was, and this is the only reason I realised something was wrong, it would thieve a whole core on my machine - flatlining it in Process Explorer when I looked.

    My machine was generally sluggish and weird things eating up other cores too - I had no idea what was going on, as the processes spawned would hide themselves when I tried to trace them. My disk was being thrashed like someone hitting it with a hammer. My disk, with my work on there, that I fucking paid for.

    I've mentioned before that I actually spent over a whole working week trying to get rid of this malware, but alas, to no avail, until I got my hands on Never10. The first time I tried it, it told me I had to download some updates from Microsoft for it to work. This was a big risk, but I did it, after fully imaging my system of course. Being ill, I kind of forgot about things, but then the other day I ran Never10 just for the crack and out of desperation really, to see if I could finally get rid of this malware that Microsoft have planted on my machine breaking the computer misuse act, willfully and knowingly and of sound mind.

    Hooray! It worked. I had to reboot, and all was well. I opened up Process Explorer - no full core being munched, no 1.5GB of data being thieved down my pipes that I pay for. And the best part is, it's like a whole new machine. Not only is that core free again, but the whole machine is just super fast, and an absolute joy to use again. I've spent years building the software architecture on this machine. I work with audio and graphics and have programs that will run in no other OS apart from Windows.

    This is the last blood-curdling cry from a dying man, hanging on to your coat jacket as he tries to drag you down with him as he goes. Yes, that fella tugging at your lapels, that's Microsoft that is - a dead man walking.

  21. ben_myers

    Extend the free Windows 10 upgrade

    Microsoft would do well to extend the free Windows 10 upgrade after its current deadline and relax the nagging a bit. What they never tell you is what software and hardware will not work with Windows 10, forcing people either to roll back to Windows 7/8/8.1 or to replace hardware and software newer versions that run with Windows 10. That ain't free, Satya!!!

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Stop

      Re: Extend the free Windows 10 upgrade

      Good god no! That'd just give them an excuse to wind the nagging up to 11!

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