back to article GDS to handle Govt payments? What could possibly go wrong?

Be afraid. The previous government’s “elite digital team” which so brilliantly borked most of Whitehall’s websites, and that failed to meet its own targets, may be put in charge of handling real money: your money. New Cabinet Office Minister Matthew Hancock hinted at the opportunity at a gentle public grilling today. Although …

  1. Kubla Cant

    Paying people money

    The Government has a multitude of platforms for paying people money.

    Unfortunately, none of them seem to belong in this century. It used to be that when you sold a car the VED went with the vehicle, so it was all a neat cashless transaction. When they changed the process, they decided instead to refund the unexpired VED to the seller, and make the purchaser re-tax the car.

    I received my refund the other week. In the form of a cheque - an instrument of payment that I haven't seen for years. It sat on my desk for about a week while I tried to work out when I might be near a bank. In the end I found an old paying-in slip and posted it.

    Progress, eh?

    1. Trigonoceps occipitalis

      Re: Paying people money

      Its all about the money. Your refund started from the end of the month that you sold the car. The new owner paid VED from the day he acquired that car. Every car sale is (average) 2 weeks extra VED.

      Add to this the increase in fines and clamping fees for those who forgot to renew VED because the handy reminder was no longer stuck to the windscreen.

      Of course you also allowed them to collect that bit of extra interest by delaying banking their cheque.

      1. Destroy All Monsters Silver badge
        Facepalm

        Re: Paying people money

        > the epoch of historic money printing

        > that bit of extra interest

        Ahhh nnnuuu!!

  2. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Time to update the acronym dictionary

    We used to talk about an SPF (single point of failure) but in govt circles it's obviously now a GDS.

    1. Camilla Smythe

      Re: Time to update the acronym dictionary

      SPF (Single Point of Failure)

      GDS (Gross Distortion of Service)

  3. IHateWearingATie

    Being a former civil servant, I'm usually annoyed when people mention Yes Minister as real life in Government tends to be stupidly complex and has lots of very good people doing as good a job as can be done in difficult circumstances (certainly just as good or bad as in the private sector in my experience - you just don't see them being eviserated in the press very often).

    However, this has all the hallmarks of the minister in question being throughly Sir Humpreyed.

    "Welcome to your new office Minister. Just read this brief on how wonderful we are. Oh by the way, you have a select committee meeting in 3 days where you'll have no choice but to regurgiate our briefing as you don't know any better yet, and then you'll be stuck defending us forever more lest you be accused of a U-Turn".

  4. Frederic Bloggs

    Surely...

    Whomsever one gets to do the "single payment system" (or whatever else one might require), will have to maintain the "bespoke" system for ever (and ever)? Or is there some kind of magic "fix-it" sauce available to the idiot that said that?

    It doesn't matter whom one gets to write or sells the software. Companies go bust, key developers move on or (sometimes) die. If the supplier (in house or commercial) doesn't have an independently verifiable and robust system for dealing with entirely predictable problems, then when it breaks - you still get to keep all the pieces.

    I hope that sets everybody's mind at rest.

  5. frank ly

    “Government as a platform”

    I'm sorry; your payment fell into the GaaP.

    1. Graham Marsden
      Thumb Up

      Re: “Government as a platform”

      Mind the GaaP...

  6. Wolfclaw

    Fail Waiting To Happen

    Wonder if any brown envelopes were passed around with party donations ??

  7. All names Taken
    Paris Hilton

    GDS getting "the treatment"

    Incumbents in the civil service are well experienced at dealing with threats from the unwelcomed (be they MPs or awkward sods?), potential competitors and those invited against the civil service wishes.

    Expect lots of cold shoulders, trips (what was the movie that showed the established at a public school fouling a newcomer to the same - something to do with running?), press releases by the hour, ... , ?

  8. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Department of Wheel Reinvention

    “The Government has a multitude of platforms for paying people money. And receiving money. What we don’t have is a platform all across government for receiving and paying money.” Well, GDS already tried and failed with the Rural Payments Agency so don’t gibe this to them.

    The Government giveth money to people and organisations and it taketh it away. Debits and credits. Some would say that sounds rather like a bank account. Maybe it would be a good idea to make a single government agency responsible for all that. Perhaps one that already has responsibility for managing millions of accounts and doing it at less than half the cost of private sector banks. An agency that has already successfully outsourced payments for several other government agencies. One that has just handled the biggest retail financial services sales since war bonds during WWII. One with a modern UNIX core baking engine and that is finally starting to get to grips with online and apps. OK, the one I’m thinking of still has a way to go to get rid of a legacy paper-based culture but it’s happening.

    I’m talking about National Savings and Investments. There’s really no need to reinvent it. But that won’t stop GDS from trying and failing.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Department of Wheel Reinvention

      Or even a banking engine. I confused them with Greggs for a second there.

    2. x 7

      Re: Department of Wheel Reinvention

      we had that once didn't we? National Girobank & Post Office Savings Bank........

  9. cmannett85

    “Digital is the biggest revolution of our time,” he said

    Have you noticed how it's only people who know nothing about computers or electronics refer to things as "digital"?

    1. 0laf

      Digital

      They just use 'Digital' because the 'Cyber' bandwagon is already pretty full.

      I believe those at the cutting edge of buzzwords are already looking for something to replace 'Digital' so they can continue to suck up all that shiny money by selling the same old stuff yet again.

  10. JohnMurray

    Just let crapita do it.

  11. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    This should be good

    I design payment systems for a living (3 national ones so far), and it is very very easy to screw up.

    More interestingly I was recently rejected from consideration by DWP/GDS as an interim chief technical architect for not being sufficiently "heavy" i.e. not politically shiny enough.

    I feel a gigantic dose of Schadenfreude coming on.

    1. x 7

      Re: This should be good

      I think you dodged a bullet there. Be grateful they turned you down

    2. 0laf

      Re: This should be good

      You did dodge a bullet.

      Remember the old toilet paper adverts where the board of director was made up of smiling toddlers? Well that's GDS except they're all spoiled little brats screaming for their 'bitty'. Or probably more accurately an 'iBitty' .

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: This should be good

        I worked with an ex GDS architect who was very proud of his prowess in some Indian martial art that "actually kills people". I'm not sure what his body count was, but it had to be a preferable outcome to listening to the arrogant bloviator talk!

        His qualifications included a degree in Pharmacy. Understandable. After only one of his presentations I wanted drugs.

  12. Adrian Tawse

    The Busines Case?

    And just what is the business case for there being just one payment agency? This just introduces one more stage in the process of paying, one more stage to go wrong, one more stage to introduce delay, and for exactly what benefit?

    1. D Moss Esq

      Re: The Busines Case?

      You will find the business case set out with admirable clarity by Mark Thompson, a public services consultant, in What is government as a platform and how do we achieve it?.

      It all depends on the location of the digital profile of Payments on the Certainty-Ubiquity surface.

      Providing a single pan-government Payments platform will unleash "unprecedented innovation, efficiency, and savings":

      There are lots of discussion going on at the moment about digital “platforms”, and the impact they might have on UK public services. A rough and ready calculation suggests such an approach could save the UK £35bn each year – but the jury is still out on how best to go about making it happen.

  13. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    If you look at who is involved, this story looks set to come true

    I just had lunch with a Cabinet Office contact who has been close to this platforms work for a while and this Reg story is true! Whenever I look inside the civil service what I see is terrifying...

    The payments bit of the government platform work is now led by the same project manager, Til Wirth, who was responsible for the chaos with GOV.UK and the UK border agency website that was covered by the Reg here: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/02/18/the_inside_story_of_govuk/

    He has already got the nickname "Teflon Til" - failure just doesn't stick to this guy. Check out his Twitter account and you can see the history.

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