back to article Super-heavy element 117 DOES exist – albeit briefly. Got any berkelium handy?

Scientists at Germany's GSI Helmholtz Centre for Heavy Ion Research have successfully recreated a new type of element, paving the way for its admission into the periodic table. "This is an important scientific result and a compelling example of international cooperation in science, advancing superheavy element research by …

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  1. asdf
    Trollface

    rut roh Shaggy

    >decays into element 115

    Where are the zombies? Stupid yes but its Friday and I really don't want to do code reviews right now.

    1. JeffyPoooh
      Pint

      "... pretty much no practical use..."

      No practical use?

      But "element 117 has a half-life measured in milliseconds", so it be used in appropriate quantities within the latest Durable Goods (especially dishwashers, washing machines) to precisely time their failure just outside the one year warranty.

      In fact, the manufacturers may claim Prior Art.

  2. John Tserkezis

    What? Renaming atoms?

    I have about three dozen Periodic Tables of [something] in electronic form.

    Two of those are actual of tables of real-life elements. Well, even if they are short-lived elements...

    Both list 117 Ununseptium, and 118 Ununoctium.

    Sure, everything from 104 onwards are mostly theoretical and of academic value only, and elements from 112 onwards are ununimaginitively named, (no, I spelled that right), but renaming it? What am I going to do with my posters and shower curtain periodic tables? Don't these scientists have any consideration for people with printed charts when they create their atoms willy-nilly?

    1. Steve Knox

      Re: What? Renaming atoms?

      1. Those names are provisional names which are just Latin forms of their atomic numbers (quod ullus morus scit.)

      2. Provisional names are reserved for elements which have not been discovered and verified.

      3. Giving discovered elements non-provisional names provides a quick way to identify what has actually been proven to exist and what is only theoretical. Your electronic periodic tables are incorrect if they're marking 113,115, 117 or 118 as actually verified.

      4.It also provides job security in the economically influential periodic table printing industry. Keep refreshing those posters and shower curtains every time a new element is created: you're supporting tens of jobs.

      1. lambda_beta
        Linux

        Re: What? Renaming atoms?

        Ununoctium: Uuo 118

        Series: Noble gases

        Group:18

        Period:7

        p-block

        Discovered: 2006 (Russia/United States)

        Joint Inst. for Nuclear Research / Lawrence Livermore Lab.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: What? Renaming atoms?

          From Wiki:

          In 2011, IUPAC evaluated the 2006 results of the Dubna-Livermore collaboration and concluded: "The three events reported for the Z = 118 isotope have very good internal redundancy but with no anchor to known nuclei do not satisfy the criteria for discovery"

          So technically Ununoctium still hasn't been discovered which is why it still has a provisional name.

      2. joeldillon

        Re: What? Renaming atoms?

        'What any black mulberry tree knows'?

        1. Steve Knox
          Happy

          Re: 'What any black mulberry tree knows'?

          Morus can also mean fool. But your translation is acceptable.

      3. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: What? Renaming atoms?

        "These are the only ones of which the news has come to Harvard:

        There may be many others but they haven't been Discarvard."

    2. Don Jefe
      Joke

      Re: What? Renaming atoms?

      How can they possibly be accused of not showing due consideration for others? They named the damn thing the Periodic Table for Christ's sake. Like 'periodic updates', 'periodic email offers from our partners', 'periodic moments of instability'.

      It's right there in the name. I really don't know what more they can do.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: What? Renaming atoms?

        As any chemist knows, "periodic" is any molecule with the highest oxidation state of the iodine atom.

        Periodic acid and sodium periodate are the best-known examples, and periodic acid + Schiff's reagent are used in a test for glycogen.

        The periodic table started off as a list of all the known periodic compounds but Mendeleev got bored, started doodling other elements in the margins, and suddenly realised that with the wind in the right direction he could fit all the elements in there in some sort of logical order. It just left only one box for iodine, so all the periodates he'd started off with had to be left out.

        I hope this clarifies the matter,as you seem to think that "periodic" has some other significance. You'll be telling me next that "unionised" has a meaning other than the state of salts dissolved in non-polar solvents.

        1. Syx

          Re: What? Renaming atoms?

          You must have missed the "joke alert".

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: What? Renaming atoms?

            Assuming Syx is replying to me, sadly and obviously erroneously I thought the joke alert for my post would have been superfluous.

            I haven't actually written a factual account of how Mendeleev created the periodic table, you know.

            Sodium periodate is an interesting chemical, though.

    3. JeffyPoooh
      Pint

      Re: What? Renaming atoms?

      118 Ununoctium.

      Named after our Great Leader (Kim Jong-un), who happens to be the discoverer.

      LOL.

  3. Graham Marsden
    Coat

    How about...

    ... Unobtainium?

    1. Ole Juul

      Re: How about...

      Currently, that would be 118 and above.

    2. Irony Deficient

      Re: How about …

      Graham, given its brief half-life, I’d suggest Abivium (symbol Ab), from the Latin verb abeo.

    3. richardcox13

      Re: How about...

      > Unobtainium

      It has been obtained, so that does not seem appropriate.

      How about "hardtogetium"?

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: How about...

        wherethefuckhasitgoneium?

        1. Amazon Wageslave

          Re: How about...

          I think my keys are made of that.

  4. gregthecanuck

    I particularly enjoyed the "whooshing" sound of the Calcium ions in the video.

  5. Gene Cash Silver badge
    Coat

    U of Nevada, Las Vegas

    Did they run the Monte Carlo simulations...?

  6. channel extended

    Island of stability?

    This is currently an island like Gilligan's. Fanciful,entertaining to watch,and as real. Still not proven but nice to look for.

    The biggest is the element Skipper.

    The prettiest is Mary Ann or Ginger!

    1. frank ly
      Happy

      Re: Island of stability?

      "Unobtainium - and the rest - here on Gilligan's Island."

      At least that's how I remember it, now.

      1. Mpeler
        Mushroom

        Re: Island of stability?

        "Berkelium has a half-life of 330 days and after that time 50 per cent of your sample will have decayed into californium-249"

        Stable? Berkelium and Californium? Considering the extremely short half life,

        "Whycannooneelsebutcalcium"? or (with apologies to Douglas Adams)

        "Almostbutnotcompletelyunobtanium"....

        (gets lead coat, heads s l o w l y to the door....)

  7. Bartek

    Hundredseventeenium

    Howgh

  8. Mike Bell

    'new ways that atoms can be ... potentially made to decay more slowly'

    Huh? Come again?

    AFAIK the only thing that can change the half-life of an atom is to add a pinch of relativity, e.g. move it very quickly or put it in an intense gravitational field. What other new ways do you have in mind?

    1. Tromos
      Joke

      Re: 'new ways that atoms can be ... potentially made to decay more slowly'

      Sulphur dioxide. At least it seems to do the trick for bread atoms.

    2. Paul Crawford Silver badge

      Re: 'new ways that atoms can be ... potentially made to decay more slowly'

      The atomic number, like 117 is the count of protons in the nucleus, but the stability depends strongly on the number of neutrons. E.g. in the simplest hydrogen has none, the Deuterium isotope has one and both are stable, while Tritium has two and decays to half over 12.3 years.

      So with the "island of stability" (which is a relative measure, none will be *that* stable) there is a great uncertainty about what the effect of differing isotopes will be. Unfortunately it is damn hard to make any of them, let along high neutron count versions.

  9. Grikath

    I suggest

    Narrativium. In honour of Sir Terry, and because making stuff like this makes a good story.

  10. PM.

    Isn't it Elerium ?

    1. Charles 9

      That's supposed to be 115. That element is currently undergoing confirmation and is expected to be officially added (and named) pretty soon.

    2. jonathan keith

      Hats off

      ... to a fellow X-Com fan.

  11. Toothpick

    Greatscottium

  12. TitterYeNot
    Coat

    She don't lie, she don't lie...

    Ununseptium. Why is that making me think of Danniella Westbrook?

  13. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Berkelium

    I'm mostly impressed by them synthesising a whole 13mg of Bk, especially as it seems a whole gramme of the stuff has been made in total, with the result that it has been properly characterised. By transuranic standards, it's a low cost, plentiful building material. Perhaps Tim Worsthall could give some attention to how you might set up a commodities market in berkelium; high speed trading would surely be needed.

    1. Chris G

      Re: Berkelium

      Berkelium sounds like something for floating berks.

      For 117 how about Kinrapidium

  14. Zog_but_not_the_first
    Boffin

    Start of the new chemistry?

    I remember reading an article that speculated on the very heavy elements becoming stable again (I've forgotten the logic behind it), thus opening up an entirely new "heavy metal chemistry".

    Now where's my axe and Black Sabbath T-shirt?

    1. Charles 9

      Re: Start of the new chemistry?

      It goes to the atomic arrangements. Noble gases are supposed to be the most stable because their proton and electron arrangements form complete patterns, but it kinda breaks down with Radon (it's supposed to be a noble gas, but it's radioactive).

      Looking at the current periodic table, one hot goal right now seems to be confirming element 118. This is because it's supposed to be a noble gas, but because it occurs after Radon which is radioactive, it's hard to say just how it will behave. Any data on the matter will help to explain further whether or not atomic stability can still be maintained at such a high weight. Could also help to explain the Strong Force better.

      1. jonathanb Silver badge

        Re: Start of the new chemistry?

        Noble gases are chemically unreactive, but it says nothing about their nuclear properties.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Boffin

          Re: Start of the new chemistry? - @jonathanb

          Also the problem is that if there is an island of stability, the most stable isotopes are likely to have even numbers of protons and neutrons. It's not just enough to find two rocks to bang together, they have to be ones for which the arithmetic adds up properly, thus making things even more difficult.

          Banging together two big nuclei is likely to make them very wobbly, and thus very likely to fall apart before settling down to stability. Adding one neutron or proton at a time, like Lego, isn't possible because of all the unstable steps in between the starting and finishing point.

          Thus the island of stability could exist, be very large, and yet we could have no way at all of reaching it.

  15. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Re. Island of Stability

    Does "El Reg" count as peer review, because I had an idea a few months ago about hyperdeformed nuclei being metastable due to resonant Cooper pair decoupling at very low temperatures.

    Of course, try getting something like this published and any fule kno that it will get rejected out of hand amid laughs and catcalls.

    1. Destroy All Monsters Silver badge

      Re: Re. Island of Stability

      What is arxiv

  16. RegGuy1 Silver badge

    particularly clueless politicians

    'There are some – particularly clueless politicians.' I'm not quite sure what this is supposed to mean. I know politicians are not highly regarded. But what is the alternative? They after all reflect the society in which we live. Get rid of them and replace them with what? A new group of people to represent us (remember, we live in a democracy).

    If you have new people what would they be like? Well look at the loonies in UKIP to see what self-selecting people you get. So get rid of democracy -- but then you get an authoritarian society where the views of one person, or a committee, dominate.

    So be careful what you wish for: 'particularly clueless politicians' may be the best thing we can wish for.

    It would have been good to have something on the 'island of stability' -- rather than just mentioning it; and especially as that seems to be the motivation for the entire project.

    1. Rich 11

      Re: particularly clueless politicians

      > 'There are some – particularly clueless politicians.' I'm not quite sure what this is supposed to mean.

      a) Clueless politicians in particular

      b) Politicians who are especially clueless

      > But what is the alternative?

      Encourage them to educate themselves a little before speaking, rather than to simply pontificate.

      Part of the problem is the effect of 24-hour rolling news and social media over the last few decades, which encourages people to spout off without knowing the facts. When did you last hear a politician respond to a journalist's unexpected question with something like "I don't know. Call and ask me tomorrow, once I've had a chance to research the facts and give them due consideration."?

      1. Michael Wojcik Silver badge

        Re: particularly clueless politicians

        Part of the problem is the effect of 24-hour rolling news and social media over the last few decades, which encourages people to spout off without knowing the facts. When did you last hear a politician respond to a journalist's unexpected question with something like "I don't know. Call and ask me tomorrow, once I've had a chance to research the facts and give them due consideration."?

        True, but there are politicians who make some effort to provide more thorough, nuanced responses. I'm not a particular fan of Justin Amash (US House, R Michigan), for example, but I believe he's posted an explanation for every one of his votes to his Facebook page; so at least his constituents have some idea of what he supports and why.

        Similarly, I've heard my own rep in extended radio interviews more than once, where the interviewer asked some hardball questions. Again, I may not agree with him, but I know he's making some effort to supplement vapid sound-bite reporting with something of substance.

  17. Allan George Dyer
    Childcatcher

    Obviously a strong textbook-publisher lobby...

    though there might be practical disadvantages to a textbook that falls apart before the teacher has said, "Good morning class".

  18. Charles Manning
    Pint

    Obvious wheeze

    From the photo is is obvious these guys are onto a good wheeze.

    They have the German government paying for their moonshine experiments.

    Should have called is Schnappium.

    1. jjk
      Headmaster

      Re: Obvious wheeze

      ITYM "Schnapsium".

      As a former student at TU Darmstadt, I'll hold out for Datterichium or Niebergallium.

  19. Stevie

    Bah!

    I did this very same experiment with the very same results some 45 years ago. I cannot prove it because most of the proof decayed almost immediately and my mum threw out the rest with my comic books.

  20. Tex Arcana

    What we NEED is an element that would be called "killallpoliticiansium"...

  21. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Wouldn't that be called

    Nukeitfromorbitium?

    :-)

  22. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Re. element decay time

    The possibility exists though remote that in very (ie gigaTesla) strong magnetic fields the really heavy elements could be metastable by the mechanism mentioned earlier.

    In fact a neutron star is essentially a ball of neutrons held together by gravity and does have a strong magnetic field (insert sound of iron being ripped out of red blood cells strong)

    So the odds of some of the crust of a neutron star being composed of superheavy elements are quite likely and the existence of gold and other heavy elements supports the hypothesis that they were created by colliding neutron stars.

    No worries guys, you would be parboiled by the radiation and minced by the tidal forces well before being spread like very fine jam over the surface of said neutron star :-P

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Re. element decay time

      Isn't a neutron star in effect a single atom of a superheavy element? If you define a nucleus as a collection of protons and neutrons held together only by the strong force, then no because gravity is needed, but if we allow an element of gravitational binding in a nucleus, neutron decay means that at any given moment a neutron star contains a lot of protons.

  23. Herby
    Joke

    Of course you could go to an automotive theme,,,

    And call it Stigium.

    In any event, I like Vulturanium. It does have a good ring to it.

  24. Someone Else Silver badge
    Coat

    There are some – particularly clueless politicians – who decry such research as pie-in-the-sky thinking that's a waste of both time and money.

    Hmmm..."clueless politicians"...right from the Dept. of Redundancy Dept.

  25. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Dibs on

    A variant of this being useful for generating hyperspace windows.

    I still say they should call Element 122 Marinovium after its true discoverer.

    See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unbihexium seems that some radiation damage in certain minerals could be explainable by isotopes of Elements 128 to 120 decaying.

  26. D@v3

    Element 117 ?

    John.

  27. PassiveSmoking

    What to call element 117?

    Spartianium? Halonium?

  28. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    I say we should call it

    Youcantbeserium

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