back to article UK IT supplier placed on ASA naughty step over 'misleading' HDD ad

Aria Technology has received a telling-off from the Advertising Standards Agency for failing to respond to a complaint about a hard drive promotion which the toothless watchdog deemed to be "misleading". The Manchester-based reseller was put on the ASA naughty step over a "500 GB Seagate Barracuda SATA III Hard Drive - Clean …

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  1. Semtex451
    Holmes

    We had 500GB drives 5 years ago, surely then 41,000 hrs is quite possible.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Yup, I've got some here from a personal home server that runs 24-7. They're kept as spare disks as they still work (mostly) but have been removed from the server because of their runtime. The oldest disk in that server at the moment has 32,000 hours of power on time so just over a year behind.

      I would be extremely unhappy receiving a disk with that amount of usage, especially advertised with "driven to the show room" mileage.

    2. LarsG

      If they do it with these hard drives, what else do they do?

      Best to avoid buying from them.

    3. MancVandaL

      SATA 3 though? They were only ratified in May 2009. So it would have to be a one of the first ever SATA 3 drives out to be in with a chance of having 410000 hours of use. In fact, I would go as far as calling BS too.

  2. b166er

    I find myself agreeing with the boss of Aria, UNLESS the claims are true (and if true, the guy needs to apologise profusely as his response is bordering on arrogant).

    Either way, one should always know better than to buy a refurnished or 'clean pull' hard drive.

    Best not to scrimp on these things.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Oh his claims are true alright

      Got one of these just for use as a temp dump drive. Did a SMART examination of it on first use, it had 42,000 hours on it and had only been powered up 5 times. These babies were from a server room or data centre. I got my money back after pointing out exactly what they were in a very loud voice at the Aria counter with a shop full of customers :)

      They knew they had a problem alright. I noticed later on that loads of these were turning up all over the internet, especially on ebay. I suspect someone container shipped a load of old data centre drives to the UK and then flogged them around various vendors.

      1. Anonymous C0ward

        Re: Oh his claims are true alright

        Were they clean of the previous owner's data?

    2. Yet Another Anonymous coward Silver badge

      We sell special ultra-test versions which we guarantee to have run for 42,000 hours continuously.

      They cost a lot more but what are the chances of it failing in the next year if it worked for the last 5?

      1. Destroy All Monsters Silver badge
        Paris Hilton

        "These drives have seen the galaxy, m'lord! Cheap, for the price!"

        So what was the manufacturing date on the 40'000+ hour drives?

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: "These drives have seen the galaxy, m'lord! Cheap, for the price!" @DAM

          After I'd checked the SMART and realised that these were well old drives, there are places where you could check the manufacturing date code to give you a real date.

          The drive was 5 years old.

          If the drive was advertised as 5 years old and 40k+ on the clock as opposed to clean pull do you think I'd have gone anywhere near it ? It's like trying to sell someone an old banger but advertising it as nearly new with just delivery miles. In my eyes that's fraud or misrepresentation.

    3. Patrick R

      one should always know better than to buy a refurnished or 'clean pull' hard drive

      Studies show that a used hard drive is not more prone to fail than a new hard drive. Of course one can always try to sell you a known bad drive.

  3. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Blowhard

    "Aria Technology did not respond to the ASA's enquiries," the watchdog stated

    :

    He said he was unaware of the case

    Perhaps he should have made himself aware of the case, and dealt with the complaint, before sounding off and accusing his customer of telling porkies. As it is from this article he doesn't come across as someone it would be a pleasure to do business with.

    1. Anonymous Coward 101

      Re: Blowhard

      He said he was unaware of the case, >after< demonstrating knowledge of the details of the case, and having suggested the customer was telling lies.

      I smell shite...

      1. Matt 21

        Re: Blowhard

        Perhaps he was unaware of the case until he was questioned about it. The questioner then said "there's this bloke saying...." thus giving him the info he could use in the response.

        It might not be that way but it could be........

    2. Anonymous Coward 101

      Re: Blowhard

      In fairness, The Register could have misreported his words, which is not outwith the boundaries of possibility...

    3. leeph

      Re: Blowhard

      I would go further and say that he sounds like a right twat.

  4. Axe

    Aria

    Shame about this company, they used to be one of the biggest and best in the Northwest of England.

    I've had a trade account with them for over 15 years but over the last 3 or 4 years they have really let the business slip.

    The lack of care in the company is evident even in the retail shop.

    They have always been a bit iffy on customer service as they traditionally employed tech people rather than sales people, but now they just seem to employ people who will work for the lowest pay.

    Aria have been on the slippery slope for a while and it looks like nothing can save them now that Ari has got too big for his boots.

    :(

  5. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    I have always found aria to be great value

    I've been using Aria for years and, not only do they usually have the best pricing, they have always been very quick and with good support. The comments section on the products is very useful.

    In years of buying stuff I only had to send 1 thing back and it was handled pretty efficiently and quickly.

    Either the customer is full of b.s. or aria mixed up a drive with an old one - in which case it would have been a really old model???

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: I have always found aria to be great value

      Sounds like you work for them?

      1. 142
        Black Helicopters

        Re: sounds like you work for them?

        I suspect you're right. There sure are some very bizarre votes being given to this article's comments, yours being a case in point!

        1. Rol

          Re: sounds like you work for them?

          I'd like to take this opportunity to welcome the new subscribers to our sordid coven.

          I hope you stick around to discuss other topics than just bleat on about how brilliant your paymaster's business is.

          I guess grumble mining is far more lucrative than bit mining, but please, show us some respect and do it in a less than obvious fashion, I don't know, a bit of flair or creativity wouldn't go amiss.

          eg While out shopping for anything under £1 I bumped into my old pal Queen Elizabeth the second, "Hey girl" She loves it when I address her like that, "What are you doing?"

          "One is doing the shopping. I am looking for a nearly dead hard drive"

          "Look no further my girl, I know a firm that specialises in these things"...

          ...and so on, however you might want to word it differently and mention your company several times.

          We love a good story, even if it is total bollocks.

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: I have always found aria to be great value

        No I don't.

        Been a customer for years though.

        Expecting another DPD delivery this morning - 3 powercolor card for my scrypt miners.

  6. Longrod_von_Hugendong
    Coat

    A Clean pull...

    Sounds more like a Dirty Sanchez to me!!

    I will just get my coat.

  7. bigtimehustler

    It is quite possible he may know the customer is telling lies. It wouldn't be too difficult to tell, check its serial number and see if they even had possession of it or started using it longer than 4.5 years ago, any less than 4.5 and the customer is lying as there are literally not enough hours available to have done it. 5 years is a long time to keep stock in the IT world.

  8. Psyx

    Duh

    "I can't understand why this is an ASA issue"

    Because you didn't reply to them!

    It states really clearly in ASA guidelines that not bothering to reply is a black mark. Five minutes effort could have saved them this embarrassment. If it was an empty complaint, then it could have been sorted. This is basic common sense, surely?

    "He said he was unaware of the case"

    Does he not read his email and post? From personal experience, the ASA are pretty reasonable and if you reply to them and say "sorry, it was a screw up in proofing the advert" then they don't put you on the naughty step.

    1. The Axe

      Re: Duh

      Your personal experience of the ASA clashes with mine. They come across as a wasteful useless organisation more interested in pushing a progressive liberal campaign than actually responding to complainants.

      1. Anonymous Coward 101

        Re: Duh

        Oh, they didn't let you sell your penis growth pills without clear evidence of efficacy, then?

      2. Destroy All Monsters Silver badge

        Re: Duh

        > progressive liberal campaign

        Choose one.

        Unless this is the across-the-pond "liberal" (the dictatorship of the taxing neurotics)

        1. willi0000000

          Re: Duh

          hi, "across-the-pond liberal" here.

          dictatorship - not on my watch, although not a few "conservatives" have tried.

          taxing - why yes, we have to tax before we can spend, unlike the cons who spend without taxing. we also have to tax every time we change from an 'R' administration to a 'D' because of the massive debt we've been left. [two wars on the credit card last time]

          neurotic - possibly, but as Barney Frank once said "We're not perfect, but they're nuts."

      3. Jocoblover

        Re: Duh

        I second that! ASA is becoming wasteful.....

      4. Psyx

        Re: Duh

        "Your personal experience of the ASA clashes with mine. They come across as a wasteful useless organisation"

        I don't think it's wasteful to curb advertising fictions. The problem is that they are essentially toothless. They need more power to punish, rather than curbing.

        "more interested in pushing a progressive liberal campaign "

        Woah... tinfoil hat much?

        Serious... WTF?

        Not everyone you don't like is a commie

  9. AJ MacLeod

    Increasingly common fraud

    It's all very well saying one shouldn't buy "refurbished" drives, but I've had several sold through Amazon as brand new which had many thousands of hours on them. They usually come packaged correctly in a sealed anti-static bag but handling a fair number of new drives each month I can usually tell there's something slightly off, and check the SMART stats before using (or rejecting) the drive.

    I'm sure lots of people with a bit less experience would never even think about it - after all some manufacturers are keen on "hiding" the production date in a less than obvious code, and the drives are clean enough on the outside.

  10. SteveCarr
    FAIL

    4.67 years...

    ...and 500GB drives have been around for at least that long. Calling "porkies" is disingenuous at best.

  11. The Axe

    2nd hand

    So someone buys a 2nd hand hard drive and then complains when the drive is more 2nd hand than he first thought. Well boo-hoo, its a used hard drive. It could have been hammered for a few days or just spinning for 5 years. Which is better?

    1. MR J

      Re: 2nd hand

      Probably hammered for a few days.

      5 years of bearing wear is a lot, even in a HDD.

      By the way, would you like to buy a nearly-new 2000 Honda Civic?... Bluebook is probably £400, but as It was £11k new I'll sell it to you for £5k.

      1. Jocoblover

        Re: 2nd hand

        Comparing a hard drive with a car? Very clever!

    2. Paw Bokenfohr

      Re: 2nd hand

      Totally not the point.

      The equivalent, as pointed out already, would be buying a car which is advertised as having 5-10 miles on the clock (delivery miles; it's reasonable to assume a clean-pull drive would only have been imaged), and finding out it's actually got 48,000 (12,000 miles a year for 4 years; this drive had been in use for over 4 years).

      Whether or not the customer (or anyone) *should* be buying second hand drives, if a company advertises *any* product, then they have a duty to advertise it accurately.

      If they don't, and refuse to correct, and refuse to refund/replace, they should get their arse kicked, or we're all going to end up being screwed by resellers.

      1. Phil W

        Re: 2nd hand

        Actually you're a bit off in your comparison there.

        Mileage on the car is not the same as time the engine has run. A car could have 50 miles on the clock but spent 6 months on but idling or on the drive stuck at 6000 revs. SMART power on time is just that, the time it's been powered on not necessarily active or doing anything. Perhaps the drives have been heavily used or perhaps they've been powered on but idle with the heads parked 99% of the time due to being sat in an unused server. There's no way to know for sure just from powered on time.

        Regardless Aria (the company) are clearly in the wrong here and should offer refunds, but they may well have bought these drives in good faith having been told they were unused and simply not checked the SMART stats to confirm it.

        Innocent until proven guilty and all that.

        Aria (the man not the company) needs to learn to think before speaking though.

        1. leeph

          Re: 2nd hand

          "Innocent until proven guilty" - yes, but also "ignorance is no defence".

        2. leeph

          Re: 2nd hand

          I may be wrong here, but I'm fairly sure hard drives don't have an 'idle' mode themselves - isn't it that the controller turns the drive off itself under an idle condition - in which case the powered on hours counter wouldn't be ticking, thus 40,000 hours is actually 40,000 hours of spinning and wear on the motor bearings.

  12. Anonymous Coward
    1. Anonymous C0ward

      That would be an ecumenical matter.

  13. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    sata 111

    five year old sata3 drive?

    Time machine inveted in Manchester ?

  14. Jocoblover

    Clean Pull is not a refurb!

    Got a clean pull drive from them a few months back and it is working a treat. Have used Aria for while and wouldn't go anywhere else! Difference between a clean pull and refurbished is that clean pull has never become faulty and therefore has never been repaired.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Clean Pull is not a refurb!

      The difference between a clean pull and refurb is often what the etailer says. The number of clean pulls in the market is amazing all those thousands of sky boxes or pc's broken down just about to be shipped.

      Most are 2nd user drives from asset management that are data wiped and rebagged as new or clean pulls for the few £ you save its not worth it.

  15. Anonymous Coward
    FAIL

    Lots of places cheaper than Aria.

    I used to use Aria, but about four years ago one of their forum "Mods" (and suspected employee), referred to my wife as a whore.

    My complaint was answered by...

    the same mod!!!

    Not bought anything from them since.

    BTW, heard a lot of stories about "Mr Arias" head swelling after his TV show appearances, and customer service falling through the floor on a semi-regular basis.

  16. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    previous;y

    Hardly surprising news based on previous personal experience or in fact this article...

    http://www.channelregister.co.uk/2012/05/30/wd_fake_drives/

  17. tradewiser

    Clean Pull

    I bought a 500GB clean pull from Aria a while ago and it only had 250hrs on it

    1. Rol

      Re: Clean Pull

      I bought sod all from Aria and have only one complaint.

      On the other hand, while I was out shopping I bumped into an old friend who needed a nearly dead hard drive. She is still setting the corgis on me when I pop round for afternoon tea and buttered crumpet.

  18. andreas koch

    Misinterprtation of SMART data

    Not necessarily in defence of Aria, who handled the situation badly, but there's also the possibility of misinterpretation of SMART data. All it takes is a bit of dodgy reporting of the firmware like here. And no penpusher or advertising knight will understand that a program that states something isn't necessarily gospel.

    The drive in the lappy I'm using to type this (Seagate Momentus XT 500) reports over 110 million read errors and status OK. It did that from the day I updated it's firmware and never failed. Before the update the count was 0, which indicates that Seagate's SMART reporting is, at least sometimes, pants.

    Maybe this applies here, too?

    Also, Who guarantees that a clean pull is not a refurb? It could well be that a company pops returned drives into budget PCs and it was pulled from those?

    There's more to it than black or white.

    1. Anonymous Coward 101

      Re: Misinterprtation of SMART data

      If it's advertised as a clean pull, it should be a fucking clean pull. If you don't know it's a clean pull, it shouldn't be advertised as such.

  19. MancVandaL

    I bought a 'clean pull' 1TB Hitachi drive from Aria last week. I'm looking at the SMART info as I type this and it's on 135 hours of use. Most of that is deffo me. All I can think is they must've had a bad batch, this one is fine and I would buy another tomorrow with no hesitation.

  20. Rebelyell

    Should have bought more!

    I have bought two of these drives for my CCTV recording unit as they are special drives. I chose these as the MTBF (Average life span of the drive) is 1.2 Million hours.

    http://www.seagate.com/staticfiles/support/disc/manuals/enterprise/Barracuda%20ES/SATA/100424667b.pdf

    Normal Seagate drives have only 750,000 hours average life. See here:

    http://www.seagate.com/docs/pdf/datasheet/disc/ds_barracuda_7200_11.pdf

    Meaning the drives that Aria sold have an extra 50 years life span compared to normal drives. I don't mean to blow my own trumpet, but I always seem to amaze friends with my well researched purchases. These drives were gold dust and they have a 5 year warranty direct with Seagate. I can take them directly to Seagate in case they fail. Pity they don't have them anymore!

    Incredible what a bit of research can turn up!!

  21. Rol

    Worst hardware vender, ever!

    I got 25 SATA 3 HDD two months ago from Aria and none of them worked.

    So frustrated I threw one against the wall and guess what...the case broke and I could see the platters had been removed and replaced with tiny bricks, utter bastards!

    I contacted their customer service department and was told my mother was a whore and my dad was a donkey.

    I'll never steal any more of my neighbours parcels again, especially if they have Aria plastered all over them.

    God, what a crap company, how are they still in business?

    Forty, love, Aria employee to serve.

    Could the spectators refrain from shouting during play, thank you.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Worst hardware vender, ever!

      Aria is a brilliant company and you are being totally disingenuous.

      FOOT FAULT

      Second serve.

      What? You cannot be serious!

      By posting AC you stepped over the line of credibility.

      Second serve

  22. Smoking Gun

    I would love to know if the disk drives have been correctly wiped of any previous data. Perhaps someone with far greater knowledge than I could get hold of one and see what comes up?

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      They can't have been correctly wiped off. I found 152 bitcoins on mine. I am a rich man!!

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