back to article Valve aiming to take the joy(sticks) out of gaming with Steam Controller

Gaming house Valve has completed its trio of announcements for the week with news of a planned wireless game controller that replaces the traditional thumb-controlled mini joysticks with two force-feedback touchpads and a programmable screen. Steam Controller The touchy-feely future of gaming? The two touchpads will give …

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  1. returnmyjedi

    Wall•E's evil brother.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      I'd buy it just because it looks as though it has come from the Dark Side.

      Competitors beware......

  2. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Sorry...

    "Gordon Freeman needs to come out of stasis one more time"

    Sorry but he died. So forget about it.

    1. Duffy Moon

      Re: Sorry...

      Strange, he seemed very much alive the last time I saw him.

      1. Sorry that handle is already taken. Silver badge

        Re: Sorry...

        It was a pretty long time ago though...

    2. Not That Andrew

      Re: Sorry...

      I think you will find it was Dr. Breen's voice actor who died.

      1. Not That Andrew

        Re: Sorry...

        There should be an icon for missing the joke

  3. Vociferous

    Bad. Very bad.

    Keyboard + mouse is superior to controls in every way.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Bad. Very bad.

      For some games - But you miss the point in that a Keyboard + mouse + lounge don't make a comfortable combination. Since this is intended for a lounge gaming and entertainment center, this is the superior option.

      1. DrXym

        Re: Bad. Very bad.

        "Since this is intended for a lounge gaming and entertainment center, this is the superior option."

        That depends. After all, I can run ZX Spectrum games on an android tablet. But it turns out that most of them are unplayable even with virtual keyboard / kempston emulation. I expect the same will hold true for lots of legacy PC games played through this controller.

      2. Gerardo McFitzpatrick-O'Toole

        Re: Bad. Very bad.

        Hopefully Valves's Levitating Mouse will be ready for Big Picture v2.0

    2. Tom Samplonius

      Re: Bad. Very bad.

      "Keyboard + mouse is superior to controls in every way."

      So your existing keyboard and mouse is superior to all new input methods now and forever? How do you know that? It wasn't that long ago, when the mouse was new, and joystick users looked at the mouse and said there is no way a mouse could be used for serious gaming.

    3. Chris 3

      Re: Bad. Very bad.

      Do you roll the mouse around on your knee and have the keyboard perched on the arm of the sofa?

      1. Atonnis

        Re: Bad. Very bad.

        Actually, when I want to use the projector display for my PC I have the keyboard on my knees, or on a cushion on my knees, and my steelseries mouse mat on a cushion (or two) next to me, which raises the mouse to a perfect height AND gives my arm a comfortable resting point. I've played solidly for days like that...

        It really isn't all that hard to use a keyboard/mouse on a sofa, not if you have a teeny-tiny bit of inventiveness and £10 for a hard mouse mat.

    4. Levente Szileszky

      Re: Bad. Very bad.

      "Keyboard + mouse is superior to controls in every way."

      Most likely true... for all the FPS/third-person view/etc action games it is definitely the case, especially if you play it the original way (Doom or Duke3D), Forward being on the RMB, Primary Fire on the LMB (switch weapon is being on the scroll) so you can go, turn and even shoot (+switch weapon) with one hand, leaving all the tricks to be performed with the second hand (with Back being on the Space)...

      ...however here I'm stil hoping Valve finally hit the nail on the head - we're definitely seeing something innovative, something we haven't seen since Nintendo introduced Wii with its motion-controllers (no, Kinect was not much of an innovation and MSFT just acquired it anyway, they didn't have anything to do with any innovation.)

      For us older (age 40-50) people the lack of time defines what we play when we manage to set aside some free time - in my case they are mostly FPS (usually NOT the super-dumb twitch-shooter junk like CoD-series or BF3/4 etc.) For FPS I think KB+M is a must so the key in any new controller is the placement of the RMB as Forward - it has to be just as transparent to use otherwise KB+M will reign supreme for another 20-30 years for me (well, I'm hoping to live long enough to see my kids as adults.)

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Bad. Very bad.

        I was wondering when the Microsoft bashing would start in this thread.

        For your information, Microsoft acquired the infra-red depth sensing camera in Kinect, but all the body tracking, voice recognition and other capabilities were developed by Jamie Shotton and colleagues at Microsoft Research.

        1. Levente Szileszky

          Re: Bad. Very bad.

          Just as expected, Anonymous Coward MSFT-troll has arrived, only to spew more false propaganda - FYI they definitely didn't do jack about motion tracking as entire body tracking & translation feature comes built-in with its camera system, supplied by PrimeSense, an Israeli company: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PrimeSense

          Another day, another failed propaganda attemp by another anonymous MSFT-troll, too bad.

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: Bad. Very bad.

            ust as expected, Anonymous Coward MSFT-troll has arrived, only to spew more false propaganda - FYI they definitely didn't do jack about motion tracking as entire body tracking & translation feature comes built-in with its camera system, supplied by PrimeSense, an Israeli company: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PrimeSense>

            (incidentally, this is a different anonymous microsoft shill)

            The body tracking absolutely does not come built into the Kinect/PrimeSense device. This can be trivially deminstrated by looking at the output of the various 3rd party drivers and hacks which can grab depth/ir/rgb image streams from the camera... there's no skeleton data there at all. Why do you think that there was no skeleton tracking available on 3rd party devices once drivers were available? Hint: because the hardware didn't do the skeleton tracking.

            Microsoft's Kinect software, and PrimeSense's OpenNite code process the depth images to fit a skeleton to the video stream on a host PC (or XBox). The original XBox kinect, newer Kinect for Windows and OpenNite skeleton trackers are all slightly different even on identical source video streams, because they each do their own slightly different skeleton fitting.

            The camera is just a camera. The next gen Kinect camera for the XBone is also just a camera, it uses quite different technology from the original and wasn't made by Primesense. You can still get skeletons, because the depth video stream from the new camera can be used with the old software.

            The core work for Kinect was done by MIcrosoft Research Cambridge, and PrimeSense had to wait some time under the terms of their non-compete agreement with MS before they could independently develop their own skeleton tracking code (which, notably, tracks rather fewer joint positions. Because the software is different. Get the message yet?)/

    5. DeVino

      Re: Bad. Very bad.

      What might be would be cute for PC FPS are support for two mice.

      One for moving&selecting and one for looking&shooting.

      No extra hardware needed and doable as a patch to existing games.

  4. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    I'll stick with my Keyboard and Mouse thanks, Joypads are for targets.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      re: Joypads are for targets.

      Joypads are for gamers who've grown up and don't think first person shooters are the only games. They're not, in fact they're probably the least interesting of all the genre games.....

      1. Atonnis

        Re: re: Joypads are for targets.

        BWAH?! Ever tried playing a proper strategy or RTS with a gamepad? You'd get toasted by a K+M user.

        The two thing joypads excel at - FPS games and action-adventure (usually 3rd person). Once you need fine motor control and fast, truly precise movement you need a mouse, and if you want to be any good at games like RTS's learning the keyboard shortcuts beats everything else hands-down - especially when coupled with that fine mouse control.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: re: Joypads are for targets.

          Mouse beat touch screen for RTS? Don't think so.....

          Joypads don't excel at FPS games silly, mouse and keyboard is better for that. In fact you've listed 2 genres, FPS and RTS. (You know the S in RTS stands for strategy right?), games are redefining these little boxes you like to put things in all the time.

          For example, a lot of games these days don't involve "toasting" anyone.

      2. Greg D

        Re: re: Joypads are for targets.

        Hah!

        Joypads are shit in most respects. Handy for console/TV gaming, but being a *true* gamer, you cannot rival a keyboard and mouse. The exact opposite of what you said is true. The more I've grown up, the more I've come to understand this is so.

        As for the FPS thing, they are far from the least interesting. You appear to be thinking on terms of CoD.

        This pad looks pretty interesting though! Would love to get my hands on one to have a feel - looks like it could at least give mice a run for their money with the touch-sens thumbpads.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: re: Joypads are for targets.

          "...but being a *true* gamer..."

          "The more I've grown up..."

          Ha ha

        2. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re:being a *true* gamer

          Ah, good old reliable "true scotsman" argument!

          I'm not a *true* gamer, I'm just someone who plays games pretty much every day.... And none of that activity involves using a mouse and keyboard because gaming on PC is just too much hassle for me to be bothered with, so I use the PS3 or my 3DS (I know, *false* platforms for *false* games).

          This article is about a controller for a console, and as you say "Handy for console/TV gaming", exactly what Valve are aiming for.

          The start of this conversation was some blinkered AC saying that this new controller could never beat mouse and keyboard, and probably for a small set of FPS games they're right. However anyone with a bit of common sense knows we won't know what it's like until we're gaming with it!!! And surely any *true* gamer welcomes a new control method and the potential for new experiences it brings....

  5. poopypants

    Good. Very good.

    Allows something close to the precision of a mouse for those who prefer to play games in the living room.

    (Not that I'll be using it, but I have heard that some people use "consoles" with "controllers", so I can only assume that this is an act of charity by Valve to try to improve their lives.)

    1. Vociferous

      Re: Good. Very good.

      It's not close to the precision of mouse. Games must be specifically designed for hand controls, to compensate for the inaccuracy, that's why console games have autoaim and the character goes through complex maneuvres at the push of a single button. Hand controls are also much slower than mouse+keyboard, which is why game tempo is so much lower today than it was before consoles became the dominant game platform.

      1. Charles 9

        Re: Good. Very good.

        Except we're not exactly talking joypads here. These are touchpads, actually, and while they CAN be geared to simulate joypads, they don't HAVE to. They can be more like the touchpads on laptops, which can act more like trackballs than joypads, and if set sensitive enough can allow very rapid motions with just a flick.

        1. Spoonsinger

          Re: more like trackballs than joypads

          So why not just use hi-res trackballs. Personally I hate touchpads, but having a trackball on the right would be awesome. (Obviously left handed peeps would not like this, so also a track ball on the left as well). Go spinny balls of doom, go. (erm it's a mechanical thing).

          1. MrDamage Silver badge

            Re: more like trackballs than joypads

            Because trackballs can get stuck due to a buildup of dust, dog/cat fur, biscuit and popcorn crumbs, not to mention the various oily residues from said snacks and even fingers.

            While I do prefer using a trackball for shooters, nothing pissed me off more than having to pause or seek cover in the middle of an intense battle because either I had forgotten to clean it out before I started, or because I had been playing for so long the gunk had built up during play.

            1. Kubla Cant
              Coat

              Re: more like trackballs than joypads

              MrDamage trackballs can get stuck due to a buildup of dust, dog/cat fur

              You really should make the dog use the keyboard. The cat, of course, will prefer to use the mouse.

      2. P. Lee

        Re: Good. Very good.

        >It's not close to the precision of mouse.

        Sometimes precision isn't what's wanted. Its probably more fun to play a driving game with a steering wheel, even if a mouse is more accurate.

        You might also have a game which utilises rate of change as an input, rather than end placement. In that case, neither keyboard nor mouse are superior.

        I'd still like to see an analogue joystick as your fingers can stick to them without impeding movement, but top marks to Valve for bringing back controllers to the PC. I look forward to a resurgence in 80's and 90's-style games on the big screen. Monkey Island and King's Quest anyone? I'd like to see Wii's Cow Race on the PC. Worms would be good, as would Scorched Earth. The big screen is for simple games with popcorn as an excuse to get together and chat on the sofa instead of sitting silently gawping at the latest unlikely escapades from Hollywood or interminable recaps of who said what to whom on some idiotic unreality show.

  6. decoherence

    While I am also perfectly happy with wsad and mouse look (which valve was good enough to acknowledge -- but why they getting up in my grammar?) I'm very interested in trying this controller. I think its great that they're trying something new with a form factor that hasn't changed significantly since its inception. And no, I don't consider these 'analogue' joysticks to be something new. Just a bad implementation of a design that predates controllers by a couple of decades. Also, I guess you haven't heard but hl3 will be a launch title for when this thing is finally released. Honest!!

    1. Vince Lewis 1

      While it may be written in jest, HL3 would be a good crowbar to get people buying Steamboxes.

      1. Vociferous

        HL3 steambox exclusive

        Could well be the plan. At the very least it'll be Steam exclusive.

        1. Spoonsinger

          Re: HL3 steambox exclusive

          Probably the only person on the planet, but I actually thought that the story, (and execution), in HL2(*), was actually rubbish. (The engine, however, has given me hours, days, months of pleasure on other games which use it).

          (*) CS/Source and DOD/Source are, gameplay wise, not as good as the originals) - will probably have to live in a cave after this statement.

  7. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Looks like the dog's danglies in more ways than one.

  8. Jim84

    Wrong solution to the right problem

    So Valve are trying to replace a mouse and keyboard with trackpads so that you can play RTSs and Diablo and other PC games in the living room?

    And they've taken inspiration from Smartphones, just like the Wii U did.

    But... a mouse and keyboard aren't just superior for 'clicking' games because they are more precise than trackpads. The position of the users body sitting at a desk with the screen 30cm away and his elbows and forearms rested on the table is a big part of the useability. This is the reason why people don't just use a wireless keyboard and mouse in their living room.

    The problem is that we currrently have one computer (a laptop/desktop) on a desk in our study/bedroom/kitchen table for work and PC style clicking games, and another (a console) sat under our TV for games not involving precise clicking that benefit from the larger screen.

    I thought Valve got this, and were going to come up with some solution to use the steam box to power both screens from the one processor. Maybe some special lag free wifi (if such a thing is possible?) or some extended HDMI cable that is easy (without a professional install) to plumb through from your bedroom/study wall to the living room wall behind your TV(again if this is actually possible?).

    That way when you want to play Diablo/Rome Total War/World of Warcaft you just use the screen, mouse, and keyboard sat on the desk in your bedroom hooked up lag free to the steam box under your TV, and when you want to play a console style game on your bigger TV screen you do that on the couch in your living room with a Xbox One controller.

    1. h3

      Re: Wrong solution to the right problem

      Still not going to solve the problem of needing so many controllers for different types of games. (And the fact that there is so little Linux big picture supported games that are not god awful Humble Indie Bundle mandated ports - Football Manager 2014 is going to support it natively which may be a sign things will change).

      A windows embedded steam box with 2 fightsticks (King of Fighters XIII only good version - other than the arcade version which is warez / a fightpad (Super Meatboy or any 2D games that only really support a 360 pad / 2 xbox one controllers (Any other shoddy console port) would be what I would need but I cannot imagine it would be anything but hassle with detection.

      Have to see what happens a known hardware config might help optimization.

      1. Tom Samplonius

        Re: Wrong solution to the right problem

        "A windows embedded steam box with 2 fightsticks (King of Fighters XIII only good version ..."

        Of course, because embedded Windows is the *obvious* choice for a fighter. MS lost the embedded market years ago, so put down the koolaid as it is starting to come out of your ears.

        1. Charles 9

          Re: Wrong solution to the right problem

          "Of course, because embedded Windows is the *obvious* choice for a fighter. MS lost the embedded market years ago, so put down the koolaid as it is starting to come out of your ears."

          Oh? You should see what runs Taito's Type X line of arcade machines. They're all PC based and ALL run a form of Windows (Either XP Embedded or Embedded Standard 7, X3 can use the 64-bit version), and there's a pretty long list of games that use the architecture, including current games running on Type X, including the Street Fighter IV series and King of Fighters since 2012.

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: Wrong solution to the right problem

            Not just Taito, seen quite bit of Arcade kit that uses it. Just go into an arcade when they are powering it all up. I was quite surprised myself.

  9. Fibbles

    9 years...

    9 / 3 = 3

    3...

    HALF-LIFE 3 CONFIRMED!

  10. silent_count

    The chicken and the egg

    For a long time game support on linux has sucked because there's no market, since the majority of PC gamers run window, 'cause that's where most of the games are. Here's hoping the steambox is popular so it does for linux what the xbox does for windows - gives devs a platform/market to aim their games at. That you'll be able to run games on linux is happy side-effect. It would be funny if Valve managed, in one foul swoop, to gain more mainstream popularity for linux than all of the pious open source advocates have in years of haranguing.

    As for these controllers, I imagine their main problem is the same as touch-screens - there's no tactile feedback to tell where your fingers are without looking away from the game you're playing. The controllers won't be as bad because their curved shape give you some idea (unlike the flat rectangle of most phones). It'll be interesting to see how it works out.

    1. John H Woods Silver badge
      Headmaster

      Re: The chicken and the egg

      I think that might be one fell swoop

      1. Super Fast Jellyfish

        Re: The chicken and the egg

        or fowl coup?

      2. silent_count
        Pint

        Re: The chicken and the egg

        Right you are, Mr Woods. For some reason I had this vision of a swooping chicken in my head at the time. How exactly that came to be, well, I'm not even so sure myself.

        1. silent_count

          Re: The chicken and the egg

          And now it occurs to me a chicken would be 'fowl'. Yeah, I think I'll just quit while I'm... err, something.

    2. Robredz

      Re: The chicken and the egg

      Touch screen controllers on phones and tablets are mainly pants, no tactility means no real control.

      1. Steven Raith

        Re: The chicken and the egg

        You mean no tactility except the positional banding (which is up for change depending on what beta testers say - may gets some nubs/depressions to compensate for lack of a d-pad) and the ultra high resolution haptic feedback (the highest bandwidth, and as such, variance of feedback, available on any consumer device as far as Valve are aware) which those who have used it have said works quite well, depending on the sort of game you are playing.

        You know, like Tommy Refenes, designer of Super Meat Boy:

        http://tommyrefenes.tumblr.com/post/62476523677/my-time-with-the-steam-controller

        Generally positive for what (at the time) would be alpha hardware, and is now moving into beta, with lots more testing to come - and feedback. Lots of feedback.

        I'd expect more on this next month when (presumably) the beta units start rolling out.

        And for reference, you can use your keyboard and mouse, your XBox wired controller, or anything else that works on your PC with SteamOS as far as Steam are concerned - but they need joypad testers for the beta - hence the requirement of beta testers to have a joypad installed and configured under their Steam config.

        They need to test the primary market - the rest of us, should we go for SteamOS, can do what we want.

        I'll happily stick with a keyboard and mouse for FPS, but these controllers do look very interesting indeed....

        Steven R

    3. Ragarath

      Re: The chicken and the egg

      Here's hoping the steambox is popular so it does for linux what the xbox does for windows - gives devs a platform/market to aim their games at. That you'll be able to run games on linux is happy side-effect.

      You want to limit Linux games to poor ports? Jeeze, you really have it in for Linux gaming.

  11. Oninoshiko

    I've decided to reserve judgement until I can see one. I'm not expecting it to replace the control setup I've got setup from the one game I'm really waiting on.

    (HOTAS and Star Citizen)

  12. PaulR79

    The real reason Ballmer was in tears?

    I read that he cried during some unimportant thing. Is it because he saw that Valve were doing more than blowing smoke when they mentioned looking at alternatives Windows 8 like Linux? Ballmer has done more to kill Windows and push people to other platforms than I ever thought possible and Valve look to be saying "thanks, we'll take it from here". I'm undecided on SteamOS but I figure at least that way if games developers build for one version of Linux you know it will work without needing to hunt through forums for solutions.

  13. Mikel

    Half Life? What is this?

    Not a gamer, but this sounds interesting. I see that Steam on Linux has the whole series, so I may give it a try. If so many people are eager for the next installment maybe the kids will like it. Maybe the Valve Complete pack would be a better deal.

    This week has been awesome for Valve announcements. I can't wait to give SteamOS a try, am in the market for a Steambox when they come out, and the controllers of course. I'm hoping to get the kids into game modding and stuff while they're young enough to leverage it. Maybe I can sneak a little programming training in too, while they're impressionable enough to sway into Open. I understand the SteamOS is going to be a development kit as well as a console, and they can start with simple resource modifications. It will be a fun thing we can do together when it rains, which hereabouts is all the time almost.

    1. Fibbles

      Re: Half Life? What is this?

      Half-Life and Half-Life 2 are FPS games that are often regarded as having redefined the genre. There are many reviews out there that could tell you about them in-depth so I'll not bother here. I will say however that if you played them when they were released they probably still hold a place in you heart as 'one of the best games of all time'. If you play them now they're still good games but it'll be hard to see the innovation since world + dog have copied them (not that that's a bad thing).

      I wouldn't recommend them for your kids unless they're in their teens. There's some violence, as with any shooter, but the games rely more on their tense and often frightening atmosphere more than they do gunning down hordes of mooks. There's also the added bonus that the main protagonist is an experimental physicist rather than some dimwitted, muscle-bound, misogynistic mercenary.

      The Valve complete pack contains everything Half-Life related as well as some other great games (Portal1&2 and L4D1&2). The portal games are are based around physics puzzles set to the background of the player being a human guinea pig in a test chamber run by an AI that has completely lost the plot. The L4D series are zombie survival horror games. They offer some great co-op gameplay but I'd vet them first before giving them to your kids. They're certainly not intended for a younger audience.

      It's worth bearing in mind that Steam often has sales offering large discounts. You've just missed the giant summer sale where they slash prices on everything but they do still pick random games or series of games each week and reduce their prices. You might be able to pick up the individual games in the complete pack for a much lower cost. There are also third-party sites like GoG, GreenManGaming and GameFly Digital which sell keys to activate games on Steam but have their own sales at different times to Steam itself.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Half Life? What is this?

        "Half-Life and Half-Life 2 are FPS games that are often regarded as having redefined the genre."

        FPS? Whazzat? Fine Piece o'sh***?

        (sorry, I tend to play adventure games for the most part, like the ZORK and Myst series... but please enlighten me: what does FPS mean? Honestly!)

        Anyway, I have tried playing games with various controllers, and have found that nothing controls a game quite as smoothly as a keyboard does.

        1. Fibbles

          Re: Half Life? What is this?

          "FPS? Whazzat? Fine Piece o'sh***?

          (sorry, I tend to play adventure games for the most part, like the ZORK and Myst series... but please enlighten me: what does FPS mean? Honestly!)"

          First-Person Shooter. Though to add to your confusion FPS can also stand for frames per second which is an acronym used fairly often in the FPS community.

        2. Tom 38
          Trollface

          Re: Half Life? What is this?

          FPS? Whazzat? Fine Piece o'sh***?

          (sorry, I tend to play adventure games for the most part, like the ZORK and Myst series... but please enlighten me: what does FPS mean? Honestly!)

          Troll.

          Well, troll, or someone dense enough to a) post to a thread on a tech site about gaming and not know what a FPS is, and b) is incapable of googling for a definition

    2. Tom 38

      Re: Half Life? What is this?

      Half-Life was game of the year for 5 years in a row (or should have been). If you've never played Half-Life, stop what you are doing right now, spend a few hours getting in touch with Gordon.

  14. DrXym

    This looks like a bad idea

    Controllers have sticks for a reason - it gives a player precise control over position and feedback through the pressure and position of the stick.

    Touch sensitivity would be a very poor substitute regardless of it having ridges or haptic feedback especially since a finger's friction can change depending on whether it is greasy or dry.

    A lot of games already have 360 controller support. I have to wonder why they didn't produce something more akin to that. They could still stick a screen or touch pad in the middle.

    1. MJI Silver badge

      Re: This looks like a bad idea

      Touch pad = DS4

      One a PC I think I will stick to KBM and in the living room to a console

  15. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    The announcement was never going to be Half-life related, they were Steam-related announcements and a game announcement would've been out of place.

    Personally I was hoping for the last announcement to be 'Steam games now available on Android' (Where applicable, an ever increasing number of indie games are coming out for android on top of Windows/Mac/Linux and as Amazon have demonstrated, third party app stores on Android can work) which would have been nice.

    As for the controller well we'll have to see how much it costs (will there be a separate adapter that must be purchased like the Xbox wireless controllers or will it be bluetooth) and more importantly how it handles. Personally I'm not overly convinced by the idea of keyboard emulation when you have trackpads but it might work. Will they emulate analogue control through their emulated keyboard using PWM, and so on.

  16. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    I wonder how long before they release an 'app' for the Xbone and PS4 so that the owners of those consoles would stream the games running on their PCs.

    Any way, I still haven't seen anything from Valve that will let me feel that this would be different from the other consoles in the market. Why would I want to buy a console running SteamOS when I have a nice PC running my games? And I can play the consoles exclusives on each respective console*. Just because it has the name 'Steam' doesn't mean it will be more than the other consoles.

    * Some PC gamers refuse to use consoles, which I find to be strange, there are some really good exclusives on the PS3, why would I not want to play them? Graphics? Never let that get in the way of a good game.

    Obligatory: English isn't my native language, for please forgive my EngRish.

    1. Arthur 1

      one thing...

      One thing that springs to mind immediately on how this is different: the hardware is open, designed to be hackable, and designed for third parties to produce them. This is fundamentally different from any other console. It means that it may not function as a loss leader, a massive change in business model for the industry. It also means you can upgrade it over time like your PC, which is a big deal for the implications that has for graphics, physics and other bling. Consoles usually look great on launch day, but after two or three years they can get a little hard to look at if you split gaming time between console and PC. Steam games would presumably be designed to scale up quality on beefed up hardware like PC games.

  17. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Arrogance

    The arrogance of people who judge this without trying it is amazing. I'm a PC gamer and I know that some games don't work very well with my Xbox 360 controller when speed of movement or accuracy come into play but that's exactly the problem that Valve are trying to address. How about you wait and see what it's like before declaring that keyboard and mouse is the only thing that's good enough?

  18. Matt Bryant Silver badge
    WTF?

    Hmmmmm.....

    Ok, so I have a meaty and pretty noisy Windoze rig I use for games in the man cave, and a titchy and discrete Linux box (and the old Wii console the kids used to play on) in the lounge for media stuff because the lounge has the biggest and best TV in the house. But the media box is not going to be good enough to play real games on, and SWMBO will throw a fit if I drag my games rig into the lounge. And I don't see the point of putting another big TV in the man cave, it's simply not big enough a room (especially with the piles of junk and books I have in there!). The old Wii doesn't get enough usage that I'd consider wanting a replacement console, and I don't want a console in the man cave where I already have too many proper systems. So I'd rather just stick with Steam on a PC and use the old keyboard and mouse, thanks. I don't think even HL3 on console only would be enough to tempt me to buy one - after all, I withstood the urge with HALO all these years.

    1. Peter Gathercole Silver badge

      Re: Hmmmmm..... @Matt

      I would have thought that a SteamBox running in streaming mode from your gaming rig would be exactly what you needed to play games in your living room. Best of all worlds.

      1. Matt Bryant Silver badge

        Re: Peter Gathercole Re: Hmmmmm..... @Matt

        "....a SteamBox running in streaming mode...." Yeah, but no. Streaming = lagging like crazy, so pants for a lot of games. And my house has real internal walls so wireless is also pretty hit'n'miss, and I really don't want to start running cabling everywhere (did that in the last house, thanks). And then I have to keep a wireless keyboard and mouse in the lounge for when I'm not playing. Thanks, but no thanks.

        1. Atonnis

          Re: Peter Gathercole Hmmmmm..... @Matt

          Have you considered the more up-to-date powerline adapters? You can get some damn good speeds with them and they can make it so much easier to get data around the house....

          ....and streaming technology has come a VERY long way in recent years. Even nVidia are streaming PC games to their new SHIELD product (which I would seriously consider if it wasn't loaded to the gills with Google's shiteware).

        2. Tom 38

          Re: Peter Gathercole Hmmmmm..... @Matt

          Did you even read the article Matt? What would you need a keyboard and mouse in the lounge for? There is no PC there, just your Steam Box console. You control this with your Steam Controller to stream games from your PC to your TV. No keyboard/mouse involved. Streaming from inside your house should result in sub 1ms lag, about a quarter of the time for your monitor to transition grey-to-grey - imperceptible, in other words.

          What it sounds like to me is that you don't want to play games on your TV in the front room, and therefore there is no console that you would be interested in, but thanks for coming on and having a good moan.

  19. Clive Galway
    FAIL

    Gonna have to call a FAIL on this one.

    What controllers need is a TRACKBALL, not a touchpad.

    You cannot properly play an FPS with a touchpad, but you can with a trackball.

    This is why there is so much complaining in the console market about players with custom controllers whooping the ass of everyone else - IT WORKS!

    1. MJI Silver badge

      Re: Gonna have to call a FAIL on this one. - custom controllers

      The amount of times you hear people moan, I play a PS3 FPS regularly

      "They have rapid fire" - actually I know that the gun they accused will not work with rapid fire controllers. The real cause is lag, and running peer to peer.

      This game is bad enough with 2 official controllers supported, one lot moan about the other, as a fan of the better controller I said just learn it.

  20. ElectricFox
    Thumb Up

    Display

    This is where I think the Wii U got it wrong: a massive screen on one controller only. By putting a small cheap(ish) screen on each controller, you can have a private window for sociable strategy games played competitively around one big screen. I can see this being a real plus for bringing many popular board games to the television where you don't spend forever faffing about with little pieces.

    Regarding the trackpads, I suspect Valve has put a lot of testing, polish and thought into this, and dismissed many other possibilities that they were researching in favour of them. Finally, regarding cost, because this is all open source hardware, you can bring your own controller round to a mate's for a gaming session on a PC, or any number of steam consoles that will be released next year.

  21. Mark McC

    Not convinced.

    Touch-based controls for gaming have never worked well for me, based on my limited experience of trying to control various Android games (and one terrible Amiga gamepad many moons ago). To paraphrase Charlie Brooker, it's about as responsive as prodding your fingers against the wall of a fish tank and hoping the fish move in the direction you want.

    But... Valve are a company who seem to be remarkably good at killing bullshit ideas before they ever get off the ground. If the project has gotten to this stage without being shot down, then I'm prepared to believe that the hardware implementation is something better than it seems and I'll reserve judgement until I get a chance to fondle one of the things.

  22. TheFiddler

    "The Steam Controller also uses a central high-resolution touch-enabled screen that can display maps, allow users to scroll through menus, or just add extra buttons as needed for individual games. "

    Sounds like they are taking the concept of the old Jag Pads and updating them from a button-grid and game based overlay to something more modern. Still won't have me surrendering my keyboard and mouse though.

  23. Grogan Silver badge

    I may be commenting from a different perspective here. I've only recently (in the last few years) gotten the hang of console controllers (Xbox360 and Playstation 3 at friend's houses), being used to PC gaming with a keyboard and mouse.

    Console controllers were purposely designed to be similar. They have similar buttons, triggers, sticks etc. so that game developers can use similar mappings for all the games, that users are familiar with.

    I don't want to have to learn to use a new type of controller all over again. It took me so long to even be able to move/aim/shoot in Call of Duty games with the XBox360 controller.

    So probably, I won't be getting one of those. It doesn't really make a lot of sense for me (in my opinion) to get a Steam Box anyway, because it's going to be PC hardware and you can build your own box for it and install your own OS. (either SteamOS or regular Linux distro with Steam client). So since it's essentially just PC gaming to me, there's little incentive for me to move away from the keyboard and mouse.

    I only PREFER a controller (e.g. I have an XBox 360 controller for my PC) for games where driving is significant. A controller is much better than a keyboard for driving (accelerating and steering), because the controls are incremental, not just on/off.

  24. sabroni Silver badge
    Facepalm

    I can tell exactly how this will handle...

    ...just from looking at a picture. It'll NEVER be as good as a keyboard and mouse!

  25. Crisp

    Damn you muscle memory!

    I can see my thumbs being all over the place on this device. How is it for accuracy?

    With the exception of a few flight sims, I've never been able to find anything more accurate for shooting stuff than WSAD and a mouse.

  26. Benchops

    What's wrong with

    Q-LEFT

    W-RIGHT

    SPACE BAR-JUMP

    ?

    1. Atonnis

      Re: What's wrong with

      You forgot..

      .......PROFIT!

  27. Darkflame007

    The cost of games on the big screen

    So when doing a stupidly early to compare against my pre-ordered PS4 I get a system that all those indie companies who gave us fun games like Limbo & SPAZ can program towards! I can't wait for the Steam sale for the big screen, it's going to be epic. The price war has started and when it comes to the console its either going to be cheaper or better than the new PS4/Xbox one. Also you can problery make one yourself or a ton of PC builders will make you great option on an ever improving platform... I say we will soon see support for 4K TV gaming in full res!

  28. JDX Gold badge

    Meh

    It looks ugly and why would I expect a company who's entire focus has been on PC (i.e. not joypad based) games to know anything about what makes a good joypad?

    Reads more like they just bundled tech into it to look cool. Ps3 controller is far better.

    1. Greg D

      Re: Meh

      And you got all this from a picture of a concept drawing.

      Yeah. Ok.

      1. JDX Gold badge

        Re: Meh

        They don't have any background in console gaming, and most of their games are not geared towards joypads; I don't need to see the hardware to know these things.

  29. NomNomNom

    Console gaming is casual gaming. For more focused gaming you need a mouse and keyboard. Many games just don't work on console and unfortunately many games made today are being dumbed down so they work on both.

    1. JDX Gold badge

      Tell that to a parent whose kid spends 12 hours a day on FIFA.

      1. Ragarath

        FIFA?

        You bring up a game that controls most of the moves for you when someone mentions focused gaming? Colour me confused.

  30. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Keep going VALVe. As soon as you get my current Steam catalog of games (Currently 93) onto a Steam box that I can play on my TV, I'll be swapping to Linux full time.

    My Win 7 install is still there only because of my Steam games. I do everything else on Linux.

  31. imanidiot Silver badge

    Am I the only one hoping

    they won't make a massive announcement for Halflife 3? Just a "ohh, btw guys, we're releasing HL3 in November. Just FYI"

This topic is closed for new posts.