back to article Texan schoolgirl expelled for refusing to wear RFID tag

A plan by a San Antonio school district to continuously monitor its students using RFID has run into legal problems after one of them took a stand against being forced to use the tracking technology. Northside Independent School District (NISD) in San Antonio, Texas has spent over $500,000 on its "Student Locator Project," a …

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  1. Martin 47

    $500 000 just to track where a lanyard is? Wonder if they will be interested in these magic beans I have for sale?

    1. This post has been deleted by its author

    2. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Magic Beans you say

      How much mate?

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Magic Beans you say

        Magic Beans are the work of Satan - all who trade in them must be stoned!

        1. Shrimpling

          Re: Magic Beans you say

          "all who trade in them must be stoned!"

          It certainly helps

        2. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: Magic Beans you say

          Not surprised they are dragging religion into it, my Sis spent "years" on Sumatra in a big ole' compound in the middle of jungly nowhere with her man on a placement, they move with their kids to a Texas city for the next placement, and the only thing the Texan schoolkids wanted to know from the travelling UK kids after their adventures was "what religion are you?" ;)

          Proper answer-"Same as you, who do you think you got Independence "from"!

          Or possibly "Don''t you want to know about the scary wild animals with the big sharp teeth?" :P

        3. Stumpy
          Holmes

          Re: Magic Beans you say

          Yep ... definitely am. Why, do you want a toke?

        4. Alan Brown Silver badge
          Devil

          Re: Magic Beans you say

          yes, they are.

    3. Ian Michael Gumby
      Boffin

      @Martin 47

      You should really price what it would take to implement the solution.

      God I know I'm just going to get down voted for pointing out the obvious.

      Its not just the RFID tags, but the software, the additional hardware, etc ...

      It adds up quickly.

      I am not saying that I agree with the system, or that its a violation of privacy.

      Just that 500K isn't outrageous.

      1. The Axe

        Re: @Martin 47

        Etc. includes consultancy fees and prices marked up well above normal levels.

        1. Danny 14

          Re: @Martin 47

          500k sounds like a bargain for a complete school district - according to wiki it has 110 campus locations (100k pupils 6k teachers and 12k staff).

          50c lanyard and rfid tag would set you back 60k in costs alone.

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: @Martin 47

            Could be wrong but I don't think Martin47 was talking about the sheer cost, but rather that it's 500k to track not a child, but a lanyard.

            If they all leave them in their locker / at home / in the bin then that's 500k to track sweet f.a.

            Nd skoolkidz being skoolkidz n dat, dey gonna be swappin dem wiv der m8s from diff skoolz for de lulz.

            1. Anonymous Coward
              Anonymous Coward

              Re: Tracking

              >> "I don't think Martin47 was talking about the sheer cost, but rather that it's 500k to track not a child, but a lanyard".

              It wonder how long it will be before someone figures this out and, in order to solve this problem, suggests that RFID chips should be implanted into the students instead (purely for the child's own good, of course).

              http://www.in-pharmatechnologist.com/Regulatory-Safety/FDA-clears-RFID-chip-for-humans

              1. Fatman
                FAIL

                Re: Tracking ... implanted into the students instead

                Now, that is a GREAT idea!!!!

                But, in order to test it properly, a trial must be conducted. For the members of the trial, I suggest this test group:

                1) all state governors,

                2) all state legislators,

                3) all Congress members (House AND Senate),

                4) all members of School Boards that want to utilize such a system for tracking students.

                Each test group member shall have the RFID tag firmly jammed up their ass, and a law shall be passed to make it a "imprisonment for life" sentence if the tag gets removed.

                Any takers????

                Seeing none, then I shall conclude that the trial was a failure.

            2. Martin 47

              Re: @Martin 47

              That's the point I was making, same as speed cameras, they don't catch speeders, they record the number plate of a speeding vehicle.

              Anyway onto more important topics, best offer for my magic beans seems to be a tenner for three, anyone want to better that?

            3. Ian Michael Gumby
              Boffin

              @AC ...Re: @Martin 47

              The thing I think most are forgetting that its not just to track the student, but also tie in to their cafeteria billing system and other back end systems.

              So the cost could include some additional software too.

              We don't know.

              As to leaving them in their lockers, I would imagine that they track the student entering and leaving the school.

              This would suggest NFC not just a contact against a plate. (Think IPASS that your car uses on the toll roads.)

          2. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: @Martin 47

            "...it has 110 campus locations (100k pupils 6K teachers..."

            Being the USA, I presume these kilopupils and kiloteachers are extra large examples of the breed?

            ...or did you mean 'thousand'? in which case why not just put 100 000 and 6000, as writng [or saying] 'K' when you mean 'thousand' makes you sound like a 'kok'

            1. Danny 14
              Mushroom

              Re: @Martin 47

              I was merely typing quickly. I tend to make a few typos in my posts and I do abbreviate; I imagine I wouldnt get very far submitted to the broadsheets. Plus, being a site with a technical bent even your pedantry got the mean of 100k. Looking at my own post sure, teachers being cooled to 6 kelvin would be a bit extreme (and a magnificent feat of engineering on such as large scale for the cost) but im sure you got the meaning.

              Just a point of interest: If you are going to be putting someone down at least make sure your own house is in order. That is (unless) you can explain the meaning of "writng". Oh and apparantly although unorthodox (assuming wiki is correct) using SI standard prefixes is ok for abbreviations. Oddly enough they are usually capitalised. I appologise to all for incorrectly stating 100k when it should have been 100K. I am unsure how many megajubs this would be or if calculating such a figure on students would put you on list 99.

              So fuck off.

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: @Martin 47

        Ian,

        I actually designed just such a system some years ago. It was meant to track the movements of about (IIRC) 1000 people at various locations across a whole country. Its aim was that we would not leave anyone behind in the event of an evacuation following an armed attack against us.

        I cannot remember the actual numbers, but I assure you it was nowhere near half a mill. And back then the necessary technology was a lot more expensive than it is nowadays.

        Plus, I like to think at least we had a tolerable purpose.

      3. Robert E A Harvey

        @Ian Michael Gumby. I reckon half a mill is still outrageous.

        I worked on a ship where we implimented a personell locator/lone worker system using the motorola UHFs and some badge responders. about 120 compartments wired up to a dedicated machine which displayed where everyone was, and linked into the Man Overboard and General alarms too - most devices had a panic button.

        Whole package, hardware, transponders, cabling, and a terminal running some embedded software (OS9, I thihk) - around 20K UKP in the 1990s. We already had the UHFs with lone worker buttons, that was another 12K but was part of the comms package - I could make half-duplex phone calls home from mine.

        1980s, I worked in a laboratory where we wore 'lone worker' pendants that called for help if we stopped moving or went horizontal, or pulled the lanyard off.. Around 1.5K total price, for 5 people in 6 spaces.

      4. Charles Manning

        Re: @Martin 47

        These are USAians we're talking about. At least 50k will be soaked up by legal insurance.

    4. mgumn

      Magic Beans

      aren't they 3 for a tenner still?

    5. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      "The school offered to give her a special lanyard with the RFID tag removed"

      Sort out your headline.

  2. Andus McCoatover
    Windows

    Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

    If anyone's bothered to read The Book of Revelations, I don't think magic mushrooms are far off the mark.

    Could've been written by L.Ron.Hubbard, or Joseph Smith. We Christians believe Revelation to be Gospel (oops, did it again) but Rom and Joe's books are regarded as a complete joke in Christian circles. Go on, I dare you. Read, but make sure the toilet is free - you'll need it to relieve the jets of laughter that'll come from your bladder.

    I have, and I can't believe millions are fooled by these.

    Go on, read it. Mop the bathroom floor when you've finished.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

      I read the "Book of Mormon" when I was in High School (I won't go into why I embarked on this fool's errand).

      A pile of parrot droppings IMHO.

      Someone famous claimed to have read the Koran from cover to cover. Apparently a mind-numbing experience of the first order. One is apparently stupider for having read it. YMMV.

      However, the King James version of the OT is cracking stuff - a literary cornucopia. Content free of course, but the prose absolutely rocks!

      Dweeb

      1. veti Silver badge
        Boffin

        Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

        Most non-Muslims who think they've "read the Koran" are wrong. Unless they happen to read Arabic, then what they've read is a translation of the Koran. And once translated, it's no longer "the Koran".

        This is because (Muslims believe) the text was dictated verbatim to the Prophet, who took it all down in proto-shorthand. Therefore the words of the Koran are God's own words, i.e. perfect. Once translated, it loses that property and becomes mere human words.

        There are myths from the early days of the faith, of heathens hearing the divine Words and being converted merely by the sound of them.

        1. Psyx
          Thumb Up

          Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

          "Most non-Muslims who think they've "read the Koran" are wrong."

          Love the way that you are factually correct, but got down-voted anyway, just because someone doesn't like religion!

          1. Ian Johnston Silver badge
            Thumb Down

            Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

            He's only factually correct if you accept his basic assumption that the Arabic Koran is the divinely dictated word of God. If you don't accept that then is statement moves beyond "factually wrong" and into "meaningless twaddle".

            1. Psyx

              Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

              "He's only factually correct if you accept his basic assumption that the Arabic Koran is the divinely dictated word of God."

              Not really, to my mind. I wouldn't call a Chinese-translated version of Shakespeare or Mort D'Arthur Shakespeare or Mallory. I'd call it 'a translated version of the Shakespeare/Mort D'Arthur/Koran [or however you care to spell it! Hell: If we can't even get the title in an agreeable English form, it just illustrates my point].

              I'm willing to accept that enough nuance can be lost in translation to make the translation 'unworthy' of maintaining the original title and 'authority' on linguistic grounds, without needing to drag mysticism into it.

          2. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

            > Love the way that you are factually correct, but got down-voted anyway

            Veti is only factually correct if you believe that the koran is god's own words and becomes mere human words once translated.

            According to Veti's logic I have never read War and Peace because I never read it in its original Russian language.

            1. Psyx
              Pint

              Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

              "According to Veti's logic I have never read War and Peace because I never read it in its original Russian language."

              So you got all the puns, allusions to Russian sayings, cultural references, word play, etc?

              You've read it, but you haven't fully comprehended 100% of the subtleties. So you've missed part of the message. Only a small part, but to my mind - when conveying matters of philosophy and religion - that small, subtle part could be argued as being crucial.

              Just sayin'!

              1. Mephistro

                Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again??? (@ Psyx, 22nd November 2012 17:31 GMT )

                "You've read it, but you haven't fully comprehended 100% of the subtleties. So you've missed part of the message"

                So, following that reasoning, 99.99% of Christians haven't read the Bible. That explains lots of things! ;)

            2. veti Silver badge
              Boffin

              Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

              @AC 15:43

              Thing is, no-one cares enough about the precise wording of 'War & Peace' to make that claim. You're not about to take a (translated) quotation from it as evidence that all Russians are savages, and a Russian isn't about to take a quote from it as their reason for stoning an adulteress. It just doesn't matter that much.

              The Koran does. The precise wording of it is incredibly important. To get a feel for just how important, consider that the Gospel of St John refers to Christ himself as "the Word" of God.

              To Muslims, the Koran isn't "their equivalent of the Bible", it's "their equivalent of Jesus Christ". That's part of the reason why they get so upset when people burn it.

          3. david 12 Silver badge

            Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

            >Love the way that you are factually correct, but got down-voted anyway, just because someone doesn't like religion!

            Love the way that someone can get their 'factually correct' facts wrong and get upvoted just because people have studied neither Islam nor comparative religion.

        2. Chris 3

          Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

          I've always thought this is an interesting argument. Clearly it is a way to keep control over the 'truth' of the scripture, but it has always struck me that following this logic you should never trust the interpretation of any imam or mullah since those interpretations must necessarily be as flawed as any translation.

      2. Dodgy Geezer Silver badge
        Boffin

        Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

        I'll second that. One of the few impressive pieces of prose to have come out of a committee.

        And, you know, Shakespeare was around at that time, and they didn't co-opt him. Didn't need to. THAT'S how good they were at writing English prose in the first decade of the 1600s...

        1. Richard 81

          Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

          "Most non-Muslims who think they've "read the Koran" are wrong."

          You mean, most non-Muslims who think they've "read the Koran" are considered to be wrong by those who believe it to be more than just a book.

          1. Ken Hagan Gold badge
            IT Angle

            Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

            "You mean, most non-Muslims who think they've "read the Koran" are considered to be wrong by those who believe it to be more than just a book."

            Actually, I think that's exactly what he means. As far as I can tell, the believers use the term "Koran" for the word of God. If you happen to read and write Arabic, it is possible to reproduce those words in book form as a mnemonic, but that book isn't the real Koran and (quite possibly) unless you are a true believer merely reading the mnemonic won't count. I assume you have to be moved by the spirit to hear the actual words whilst reading before it actually counts.

            IT angle: It's a bit like the difference between an EXE file and a running program.

            1. TRT Silver badge

              Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

              "that book isn't the real Koran"

              Try setting light to one, and you'll quickly see just how "real" it is perceived to be!

              I do agree with you though. Until it is read, understood, believed etc. it's merely ink and paper.

              Analogy - colour. What exactly is it?

          2. Osmosis Jones
            Big Brother

            Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

            Long time reader, first time contributer so excuse the AC.

            Ive read the Quran in both Arabic and English and trust me they are different enough to be significant. Far be it for me to comment on the spiritual consequences of the changes in content but my own analogy would be how northerners have many different words for bread (bap, barn cake, butty, teacake etc) classical Arabic tends to have this for a variety of concepts, which i found difficult to get my head round.

            Personally the biggest difference is in terms of form, the Arabic version reads like poetry and can be lovely just to hear or read aloud (despite not having a clue whats going on).

            So, I would deff give credence to those who make the claim, that to have read the Quran is to have read it in its original form (whilst to understand it requires a fair amount of contextual knowledge)

            On topic: i wouldn't say 500k is too much, i suspect there was significant software dev. Also most work places tend to have RFID type systems for entry and exit to various spaces. And I am one of those "baddies" that has exploited such data for a variety of ends. So although i can sympathies with the Rutherford people's claim that this is the sharp end of the wedge, i hate to break it to 'em the thick end is already reality later on in life.

          3. Peter Gathercole Silver badge

            Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again??? @Richard 81

            I'm not sure that you understand how much is lost in translation. I tried reading a translation of the Quran myself (I'm pretty much agnostic and was doing it to try to understand the background to the religious conflicts, in the same way that I've read the Bible and the Book of Mormon), and the mess that was the translation I was reading must be poor, because it was difficult to read, and contradicted itself within a few pages. I got about a third of the way through before losing interest.

            I've been told by someone who can read Arabic that it is a very difficult language to translate without losing some of the meaning, because the structure of the language differs in several fundamental ways from European languages. I cannot confirm this from first hand knowledge, but I am prepared to believe it.

            Thus, I believe that to get the maximum benefit of the Quran, it is necessary to learn and understand (grok?) Arabic, such that you don't need to translate to comprehend.

      3. Ian Michael Gumby
        Devil

        @AC... Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

        You know you could have skipped the torture of reading the 'Book of Mormon' and instead waited for the Broadway show...

        Yeah I know its not the same thing... but you get the idea...

        The Spawn of Satan Icon, because I know I am going to hell for promoting the guys behind South Park... :-P

        1. John Smith 19 Gold badge
          Happy

          Re: @AC... Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

          And they killed Kenny. The b***ards!

        2. Andus McCoatover
          Windows

          Re: @AC... Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

          "You know you could have skipped the torture of reading the 'Book of Mormon' and instead waited for the Broadway show..."

          Bet it's nowhere near as funny as the original book. Or, indeed the South Park episode (Dum, Dum,Dum,Dum,Dum,) which was Smart,Smart,Smart,Smart,Smart.

      4. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

        In fact the Book of Ecclesiasticus is not content free - it has some good stuff on dinner party etiquette and some excellent one liners. I imagine it being written by an urban, and urbane, rabbi with a sophisticated flock, kind of like a 3rd century BC Sidney Smith.

        There's also some stuff in there explaining the origins of the present conflicts at the back end of the Med, though it is the Fox News version.

      5. James O'Brien
        Mushroom

        @AC Who read the Book of Mormon....

        I'm with you on this one. I read it for a laugh to see what was in it. Quite frankly I was laughing my ass off and more than a little surprised that these people couldn't smell bullshit. I mean would you or anyone here believe someone if they were told what had happened to them but that they couldn't see the "plates" with the text on them? I mean REALLY?!!??!? Yeah sure Joe Ill believe you on this one. I mean whats the worst that could happen.

        As for this girl taking a stand I applaud her. It takes a brass set to stand up to these idiots who think doing something like this is a good idea. I mean making it so you HAVE TO HAVE these tags on for some of the bathrooms? I really find it hard to believe whoever thought that part was a GOOD idea shouldn't be in jail for invasion of privacy and or child endangerment because if someone was to be a kiddie fiddler working there they could have a perfect idea when someone was doing something so they could get pics/videos/etc of said person/act. REALLY!??!!???

        I hope she wins and this kind of shit is stopped before it gets to be too big.

    2. Sorry that handle is already taken. Silver badge

      Dammit

      On reading the RSS blurb I thought "yeah, stick it to the system". And then I saw it was about religion.

      She really could have left out the superstitious BS. It adds nothing to the argument whatsoever.

      1. skeptical i
        Pirate

        Agree, but U.S. courts take that religion stuff seriously. [was: Dammit]

        One hopes this is a [cynical] way to bring more attention to the issue -- the more spaghetti* one throws at the wall, the more likely something will stick.

        * No offense to FSM, may we be touched by his Noodly Appendage.

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Dammit

        "She really could have left out the superstitious BS"

        ... on the contrary she played it like a pro. If you want to fight back against the next loony govt scheme in Texas you can't do better than suggesting you're doing it for Jesus (whether you are or whether you aren't) cuts the ground right out from underneath those in power.

        In passing really good to hear that things have improved so much in the Texas school system that they've nothing better to spend USD0.5M on than a people-control system - the last I heard their public schools would have shamed a third-world country

        1. James Micallef Silver badge
          Devil

          Re: Dammit

          "nothing better to spend USD0.5M on than a people-control system"

          and

          "their public schools would have shamed a third-world country"

          I think that shows ongoing causality rather than improvement

          1. TRT Silver badge

            Re: Dammit

            "And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon."

            Sounds like my WiFi box and a modem...

        2. saikungbob

          Re: Dammit

          Luckily, Louisiana and Mississippi are there to make Texas look almost civilized – oh yeah, and Guatemala!

        3. Sorry that handle is already taken. Silver badge

          Re: Dammit

          AC @ 04:04: Fair call that.

          AC @ 15:35: Claiming your religious freedom is being infringed when it isn't still adds nothing to the debate.

      3. Matt Bryant Silver badge
        Facepalm

        Re: Dammit

        ".....She really could have left out the superstitious BS. It adds nothing to the argument whatsoever." But it adds plenty to the lawsuits. Septic civil rights laws and all that. It's always fun when those preaching on about civil liberties switch the religion argument in or out depending on the need to drive up the settlement payout.

      4. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Dammit

        Actually, freedom of taught and freedom of speech are closely related to freedom of religion.

        You may call it BS, but it for sure adds a lot to the argumentation. Just look at US court-cases related to freedom of speech.

      5. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Dammit

        it's also possible that the religion angle was just that. the religion angle is the only way parents are able to avoid a disageeable vaccine, for instance, even though it doesn't have any practical relation other than as a loophole in the law/rules.

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

      In the classic words of Half Man Half Biscuit

      There's no s: it's The Book of Revelation.

      See also: Mary Hopkin, she must despair.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

        sadly as silly as the religious slant is, you're more the fool for rebuking her right to privacy because you think one of her reasons is stupid.

        Ignore the irrelevant and focus on the issue.

      2. Zane
        Thumb Up

        Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

        Thanks - must admit I always thought her name was Hopkins.

        So I learned something today.

        Do do do do do do Waiting for the gift of sound and vision

        1. Sam Therapy
          Happy

          Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

          Or Mary Visconti, as she was at the time.

      3. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

        Well you prob should go to Certain Baltic States for hilarity, they "officially" at any rate, localise "all" foreign gents' names with an "S" or "IS" at the end both forename and surname, and all ladies names with "E' or possibly "A".This is so that they kinda match the local ones. And that's just the start, sometimes they need new double vowels or "Dž" because there is no "J".

        So, for example, for film stars, they have "Šons Bīns" , for pronunciation, the Š is a "sh" and the Ī is an "ee". That's right- yer man from "Game Of Thrones"..... a missed film product placement opportunity if ever there was one! ;)

    4. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

      If you read the start of the book, it says, "to the seven churches..." It was meant for those familiar with the scriptures already.

      Its written using OT imagery. If you aren't familiar with it, you won't understand what's going on. For example, the number "seven" has meaning associated with it beyond just being a counter; the "mark of the beast" is not really going to make sense if you haven't read Exodus where it talks about the "mark of God" being the sign that you have accepted a substitute to die for your sin instead of you. Lots of the book refers back to the book of Daniel where there are some explanations. God's people living in a cubic city makes little sense unless you know that the part of the OT temple where god "resided" was a cubic - i.e. the image is that god's people live without a barrier between them and god. If you haven't read the rest of the OT where God's uses prostitution as an image of how his people have behaved, the hooker of revelation won't mean much to you.

      If you want to read revelation, go ahead, but if you haven't read the lexicon which goes before it, don't expect to get much out of it.

      Sadly, I suspect the girl at the centre of the row is misinformed. Its nice that she's championing privacy and perhaps "freedom of religion" is the last bastion against being tracked, but its really the wrong argument. Its so wrong and so pop-culture-focused that I suspect its a sham argument being deployed for a good cause.

      1. t.est
        Megaphone

        Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

        Nice one then you also know she's called "Babylon the Great", and perhaps understand what that represents?

        And then you have probably also identified the beast she's riding, the very beast that will devour her.

        Basically that means, if it is as you say that religion is the last bastion against being tracked, say goodbye to a life where you'r not being tracked. At least for an hour.

    5. bond Bond

      Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

      laugh all you want, but if you think again, the book of revelation was written 2000yrs ago and if you follow technology, you know such tech is readily available and is widely used in the animal world. See how popular pet owners are tagging their pets? just look at oyster card, your movement can be easily tracked and located.

      So how hard is it to implant one into the forehead or right arm of a human being? as far as i know, there is prison already tagging their dwellers.

      after 911 and continous terrorism, don't you think governments are keen in tracking human movement, with the mainstream media and finances institutions hence, (a street with a bull mascot) controlled by a certain group of people. dont you think they want to enslave us in a more distreet way? it's not a question whether is it going to happen? But it's a question of when is it going to happen?

      foot note: in the book of Revelation, it also mentioned that at end times, the whole world will be able to witness the same incidents simultaneously. you have to ask yourself, in a world that had no electricity, no satelites, no tv, no telephone, who an earth would think in 2000years time, everyone can be able to watch the same news coverage, I wonder where else do you find another book that could provide such revolutionary view??

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

        "I wonder where else do you find another book that could provide such revolutionary view??"

        On my bookcase. Take out any old, rambling text and you can read prophesy into it.

        "after 911 and continous terrorism"

        I hate to break it to America, but 'Continuous' terrorism didn't start at 9/11. You guys were nicely financing the PIRA to bomb this country for a long while before that, for example.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

          wasn't all PIRA, you know. some of those bombers were british intel or funded by them. england could have just decided not to invade and occupy their own relatives, the whole time miustakenly believing them to be of different blood.

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

        Presumably speed (or the lack therefore) of communication in those days was a major pain in the proverbial, so I would imagine that much like science fiction authors everywhere do, the author was imagining that the future would solve issues that they had in the present day, i.e. by having instant communication between far away places.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

          Its the first time I've heard of an actual use for the religion that was forced on me at school.

          Using it to stop them forcing an RFID tag on me.

          Nice one.

      3. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

        Well if you actually read the revelation about the mark, you find it in Rev 13:18. Then read the next verse Rev 14:1 and you see an other mark of different origin. And that one is for sure not physical.

        The reason why some Christians think it could be an ID or especially an RFID is due to what's stated in 13:17 that nobody might be able to buy or sell except a person having the mark.

      4. Imsimil Berati-Lahn
        Facepalm

        Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

        Okay, so according to the (translated, transliterated, probably largely MUNGed) legend,

        "The Mark of the Beast" (*tm) is applied to:

        A) The right hand.

        B) The forehead.

        Taking into account the difficulty in translating Sanskrit / Arameic into English, this plausibly implicates mobile phones, wristwatches, baseball caps, gloves, jewellery, hair, inoculation scars, lobotomies etc... etc... as "The Mark of the Beast" (*tm).

        Given the way a lanyard is worn, it's a weak argument at best, to deny that all these other contrivances could be "The Mark of the Beast" (*tm) and cry foul over this one thing which (quite rightly) makes you feel uneasy.

        Don't know where I'm going with this, but, yeah, anyway.

        Down with this sort of thing!

        Both the unneccesary surveillance and the mumbo-jumbo.

    6. John Smith 19 Gold badge
      Unhappy

      @Andus McCoatover

      "If anyone's bothered to read The Book of Revelations, I don't think magic mushrooms are far off the mark."

      The advisors and members of the Cabinet of *several* American presidents have read & believed it as *literal* truth.

      Not really someone you'd want near any sort of nuclear release system. It could end in tears.

    7. James Micallef Silver badge
      Facepalm

      Re: Christ (oops!) bloody religion again???

      I think it's actually outrageous that this single student protested against the lanyard on religious + privacy grounds. The article doesn't say, but there seems to be the implication that not a single other student (or parent) was ready to contest this abomination on privacy issues alone. I find that quite incredible.

      The other thing that surprised me is that teh school didn't back down but effectively threw the kid out. It means that there are hundreds of parents who either don't have the nearest clue of what's going on at their children's school, or they are all happy that their children's location is being tracked

  3. Rolf Howarth

    RFID?

    Good for her, but why do they need RFIDs? All they need to do is install a bit of equipment to track the mobile phones that all the kids at school have these days, and they'll be able to track them outside school as well :-)

    1. bazza Silver badge

      Re: RFID?

      To track a phone it would have to be in use for a phone call, sending/receiving data, etc. Otherwise it's location would only be generally known as being 'somewhere near the base station' when it does a Location Area Update (or whatever the 3G equivalent of that is these days). And that'd be no better than knowing that it's somewhere in the school...

      Mind you, I reckon that kids' phones are probably permanently on Facebook, etc. so no problems there...

      Back in the old days when I were a lad every school had a much more effective way of finding kids that were bunking off. In my school he was called Mr Simmonds, and he could find anyone, anywhere, either in the school or in town. Don't they have people like that in schools these days?

      1. hold2ransom
        Holmes

        Re: RFID?

        So how is it possible to find the location of a mobile within a few feet without making a call to it. With sufficiently sensitive equipment it is possible to interrogate a SIM card without the phone being switched on.

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        @bazza, your wrong, mobiles to not need to be in use, just on

        That is all.....

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: @bazza, your wrong, mobiles to not need to be in use, just on

          @AC Posted Thursday 22nd November 2012 09:22 GMT

          "@bazza, your wrong, mobiles to not need to be in use, just on"

          Well if you know of a way for a school to pinpoint a non-radiating mobile phone whilst staying on the right side of the laws concerning spectrum abuse, privacy, investigatory powers, illegal intercept and physics I suggest you patent it or, more likely, go back to telecoms, physics and engineering school to learn why your idea doesn't work.

          And even if the phone is doing background email polling (so not a Blackberry then, their push is 'receive only' so far as the phone is concerned which is why their battery life is good) you can't lawfully detect, geolocate and identify it without a warrant. Good luck on getting one of those!

      3. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: RFID?

        So true about Mr. Simmonds!

      4. James Micallef Silver badge

        Re: RFID?

        If the aim of the system is just to take attendance and make sure kids are at school and not truanting (and also for valid fire-safety reasons eg make sure that everybody s out if there is an evacuation), then Oyster-like scanners that just show the kids checking in and out of school should be enough. No need to track their movement inch by inch and keep track of when they're going to the john.

    2. AlexH
      Devil

      Re: RFID?

      That's actually not a terrible idea!

      Use WiFi and associate the phones' MACs with the students - give phone-less students a free smartphone (should also help the scheme be more popular), then use existing (or new, if they can't be used) access points to triangulate students' locations.

      Cost: if (big if) existing APs can be used and they don't need to buy tons of new phones, then pretty cheap - loading the software and a few days on-site calibrating the triangulation.

      Bonus: You're able to detect people wandering around who shouldn't be there. Legit visitors can have their phones registered onto the system at reception.

      I did consider that the kids would just switch them off, but if it's the 'official' method of registration for classes, then phone off = truancy, regardless of whether you're off site or not.

      NOTE: just a thought exercise, I actually really disagree with tracking and monitoring kids like this!

      1. xj25vm

        Re: RFID?

        Yeah - that will work wonders with smartphones nowadays having a battery life just a touch longer than an ant's attention span. Dead battery = truancy.

  4. Richard IV
    Boffin

    Quite right too!

    She's at a science academy and didn't use science (like a lead shield), or engineering (like a hammer) to maintain her privacy? Disgraceful!

    1. Thorne

      Re: Quite right too!

      Science and religion don't mix. Her religious beliefs should send her to Christian school

    2. Steve Evans

      Re: Quite right too!

      I thought the simple, student style method of rejecting this system would be to anonymize it.. Just swap tags with each other every couple of days.

      That way the powers that be would know where students go, just not which ones.

      1. Eddy Ito
        Thumb Up

        @Steve Evans

        If this is also about truancy I don't see why the kids couldn't rotate carrying several tags at once. It would work a treat until the teachers realized that something was amiss when RFID attendance was 100% even though only 10% of the children were actually present.

        The kids could go a step further and wear several fake lanyards to have the school checking them all the time or better yet a daily ritual of "gee, I don't know why it stopped working? Yes, I do still have the Tesla coil and Jacob's Ladder from my science fair project, why do you ask?" Once the school replaced each a few hundred times they might realize it wasn't such a bright idea. Kids these days, they really should learn a little about passive (well covert-aggressive) resistance.

        1. PT

          Re: @Steve Evans

          For those without a Tesla coil, one second in the microwave is equally effective on RFID chips.

          1. Disintegrationnotallowed

            Re: @Steve Evans

            Passive resistance by students to anything at school always seemed to get the desired effect. Just shows we are bringing up a society where kids now accept being tracked. In 20 years time we will all be tracked and maybe it will be down to our generation to rebel?

            1. Danny 14

              Re: @Steve Evans

              indeed. RFIDs dont work very well once you have drilled through the antenna.

  5. DN4
    Thumb Up

    Excellent

    I like where this leads. Please, please track everyone using mobile phones and make it the ultimate tracking technology. Then I will become invisible to tracking for free.

    1. DN4

      Re: Excellent

      Should have been a reply to http://forums.theregister.co.uk/forum/1/2012/11/21/schoolgirl_expelled_rfid_chip/#c_1632382

      Not sure how I managed to start a new thread....

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Excellent

        snip/ free.... without a cellphone /snip

        except, someone (French) was arrested for allegedly being suspiciously WITHOUT a cellphone

        that was a couple of years ago mind, related news surfaced this week that the UK secret cops with long-hair were very much (allegedly) involved in this French bust of an anarchist cell, triggered by not having a cell

  6. Richard Cartledge
    Terminator

    "We've got one here who can see." - They live. 1988.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Nice one.

      Good film.

  7. David 45

    OTT

    From my UK viewpoint, this scheme seems very invasive and will probably be a white elephant. I'm sure students could work out ways of fooling the system. After all, they're meant to be bright young things!

    1. Eguro

      Re: OTT

      Indeed...

      If it's essentially a necklace thing, what's to stop me from... say... taking it off? Unless it's more of a collar design.

      1. Charles 9

        Re: OTT

        Considering it's needed to open the library (to check out books you need for homework), the cafeteria (so you can have lunch), or the toilet (every so often you can't hold it in), I think those would stop you from taking it off. As for shielding, as they're meant to be shown out in the open, any kind of shielding would likely be visible, too.

    2. Demosthenese

      Re: OTT

      Just get your friend to carry your lanyard/rfid to all those lessons when you have better things to do.

    3. bazza Silver badge

      Re: OTT

      It'd take the average kid mere moments to workout the likely efficacy of 30sec in a microwave.... Get it right and it's just a "failed card" with no external sign that it's been zapped. It would then be very difficult to pin the blame on the kid.

      1. Sorry that handle is already taken. Silver badge

        You've got the right idea...

        ...but I've a feeling 30 seconds in a microwave might just result in plenty of external signs that it's been zapped.

        I'll just go and put my office access card in the microwave to test this... Be right back!

        1. TRT Silver badge

          Re: You've got the right idea...

          "Be right back!"

          If it works, no you won't!

          *tapping on entry door for 10 minutes*

      2. Nathar Leichoz

        Re: OTT

        How would you get into the toilet or checkout a library book with a zapped card?

        1. Danny 14

          Re: OTT

          I read the article and system as being RFID for tracking, barcode for library cafe etc. A quick run on a large library degausser and im sure the RFID wont be IDing any more.

        2. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: OTT

          I don't even think Book of Revelation talks of needing the mark of beast before you can use the toilet.

          Far too much recording of movements.

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: OTT

            "I don't even think Book of Revelation talks of needing the mark of beast before you can use the toilet."

            Even satan wouldn't go that far.

    4. h4rm0ny

      Re: OTT

      All these technical solutions are starting down the wrong path. The girl has chosen the right one - take it to the people and the courts. What would be wonderful is if all the children in that school microwaved their cards as a sign of solidarity with her. If all the pupils did that, then the school could do nothing to them.

  8. gkroog
    Black Helicopters

    Well, the US government IS...

    ...planning to unleash those predator drones to keep an Eagle Eye (dun dun dun) on their own people. And I'm sure there will be ones armed with "less-lethal" crowd control measures in case the people of the "land of the free and home of the brave" get a little too free and brave.

    Heck, officials in the Pentagon have already ordered...I mean...obtained restraining orders against protesters unhappy at being monitored as if they live in a police state. I'm a foreign observer to all this, and it worries me. America is supposed to be a democracy. Every one on the street makes up the "DEMO" in "DEMOCRACY" and yet the government wants to use technology honed by the armed forces to...make sure they're safe.

    I'm not going to try paint the current government there with TOO much of a sinister shade, but once the technology is in place...and more technology on top of that...what then? It'll be an awful lot of power to just deliver into the hands of the next bunch of politicians and bureaucrats. When all they have to do to enforce legislation will be to click a mouse a few times...what laws will they pass? And who will protest when that is deemed to be against the interests of "the people" by...those who are less and less "of the people".

    Does this sound a little too paranoid? I know, but I've watched things come to pass that I thought would never happen. So will I see the people of America, and Europe, for that matter, having to take drastic measures to remind their democratically elected leaders who put them in the seat of power?

    1. Cubical Drone

      Re: Well, the US government IS...

      This is not the US government however, it is a school district and school districts are controlled at the local and state level.

      That is one reason that I find this so fascinating, this is Texas, a state that is usually obsessed with individualism and very much against government intrusion.

      Looks like for a little money, those beliefs can be modified.

      Hypocrisy...yeah, they've heard of it.

  9. Ross K Silver badge
    Black Helicopters

    I predict...

    ...some numpty will come along and say "if you're not doing anything wrong, you've got nothing to hide" in 5,4,3,2...

    BTW, 5 or 10 seconds in a microwave will kill an RFID tag.

    1. Nigel 11
      Coat

      Re: I predict...

      If you read the article, you'll see that you need a working RFID tag at that school, in order to be able to use the toilets. So you'll most certainly have something to hide by the end of the day.

      1. Ross K Silver badge

        Re: I predict...

        Ok, I'll entertain your pedantic comment: what's to say a student doesn't receive a bunch of "faulty" tags, one after the other?

        RFID tags or not, a school that prevents a student from using a toilet while acting in loco parentis would want to ensure they have good legal representation for when they get sued.

      2. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: I predict...

        I give it a week before they realise that putting any barrier between a student in need and a toilet is resulting in a lot more need for cleaning.

    2. Ian Michael Gumby
      Boffin

      Re: I predict...

      Its kind of ironic that while everyone is be-itching about a kid having to wear an RFID tag, I'll wager that their parents routinely wear an RFID tag on a daily basis.

      Seriously. You work for Company X. In order to enter the building you need to wear your employee badge. Embedded is an RFID tag. If you work in a secured location within the building, every time you enter that location you have to badge in. If there are no rest rooms, then you have to leave and re-badge in.

      The sad thing is that for the child attending the school there is probably no expectation of privacy in that the school is responsible for knowing the child's location. Can you imagine the lawsuit of the child is at school, walks off campus and gets hurt or injured in an accident? You can bet your bottom dollar that there is going to be some lawyer ready to sue the school district over letting the kid leave campus.

      Yeah, I didn't use your line, I gave you a better example of why this is a done deal.

      All the parents hope to do is to get their daughter back in to the school because its offers a better education than her alternatives.

      So do you have a work badge? Did you pop it in to the microwave? Did you protest for having to wear the mark of Satan? (Cue the Church Lady)

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: I predict...

        I have no idea how it works in the US of A, but in the UK secondary schools, the teachers are not allowed to physically prevent a student from leaving the premises.

      2. Ross K Silver badge
        Facepalm

        Re: I predict...

        Can you imagine the lawsuit of the child is at school, walks off campus and gets hurt or injured in an accident? You can bet your bottom dollar that there is going to be some lawyer ready to sue the school district over letting the kid leave campus.

        Rubbish. I don't think kids bunking off school is a problem of such magnitude that tracking needs to be implemented. I don't think I've ever read about a school being sued for an non-academic off-campus accident involving a student.

        The bottom line is that this scheme is all about the $2million.

        And yes, I swipe in and out at work using a simple mag stripe card. I'm sure my boss would love to have me RFID tracked every time I go for a piss, but the day that happens is the day I look for another job.

      3. Nogbad1958
        Headmaster

        Re: I predict...

        Hey, at least at work you get paid to wear the damn things at work, and I have never needed one to go to the toilet. That is extreem IMNSHO unless of course they are monitoring who is in there digging the escape tunnel.

        1. Ian Michael Gumby
          WTF?

          Re: I predict...

          First I wasn't commenting on the toilet issue.

          I think that's a bit over the top.

          The point I was trying to make is that we as adults do this all the time.

          Even as parents there are some who use their kids cells to track them.

          Put GPS monitoring devices on their cars.

          Granted its their parents and not the schools.

          But as I've pointed out, that there is some legal responsibility that the schools have towards the children.

          All you need is one hungry and creative lawyer to make an argument that persuades a jury that its the school district's fault and voila everyone has one of these things embedded under their skin.

          Again another piece of irony. If a company does this we don't bitch while if its a government, we bitch and don't trust them.

  10. Captain DaFt

    Typical student:

    "Can you keep my card in your pocket today at school? I'm going shopping, and I don't wanna get caught skippin'."

    1. Nigel 11
      Black Helicopters

      Which is of course why "their" next step will be to implant the chip in our foreheads at birth once the infrastructure is omnipresent. Are we quite certain that those religious people are complete fruitcakes?

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Yes they are, but that doesn't mean they are not right. Infinite monkeys occasionally output something that is spot-on.

      2. Thorne

        "Are we quite certain that those religious people are complete fruitcakes"

        Someone can be right plus a complete fruitcake at the same time

        1. A J Stiles
          Holmes

          Yes indeed

          Sound reasoning applied to false premises always produces a false conclusion.

          Faulty reasoning applied to false premises can sometimes, accidentally produce a true conclusion.

  11. Graham Marsden
    Black Helicopters

    WTF???

    Ok, I may not agree with her religious beliefs, but I sure as hell agree with this being a gross invasion of privacy verging on Official Stalking!

    If I had a kid at that school I'd be standing right alongside them objecting to this and probably outside the gates handing out leaflets too.

    PS And what's to stop students swapping ID tags either through mischief or malice??

    PPS " in some cases for toilet breaks, and it allows the school to track their every movement throughout the day" - I'm sure there's a pun there somewhere...!!

    1. Fred Flintstone Gold badge

      Re: WTF???

      I'd play this slightly different. I would just plant a few stories that some pedos were seen hanging around the school with RFID scanners. I am willing to bet that nobody would ask the question of how you could recognise a pedo - the political CYA alone would soon put a stop to this RFID tracking malarky..

      What I want to know: did anyone bother to consult students and parent before blowing so much money on a system?

      1. Bush_rat
        Happy

        Re: WTF???

        Isn't it funny though that we have to fabricate shady activities to remove an invasive security system, designed to stop said activities.

        I find it even more funny, cause my local high school (the one I attended) currently has no more than 40 cameras to manage 800+ students. And even those cameras are only checked when there's a complaint or a crime. Then again I'm an Aussie, so (and apologies for my generalisation) school shootings and other horrendous crimes aren't common.

  12. gkroog
    Mushroom

    And regarding the "Revelation" rant...

    ...as a Christian, I don't quite see how that can be applied to these lanyards. They are not trying to make them wear them on their right hands or foreheads, nor are they trying to make them worship anything that could be construed to be "the beast" (there are actually two beasts, one out of the land and one out of the sea; and the word "antichrist" does not appear in the book of revelation, it appears on the letters of John, referring to people who deliberately distort the Gospel, which would describe someone/something trying to become an object of worship).

    1. Eguro

      Re: And regarding the "Revelation" rant...

      While I agree with you on most points, I wouldn't put it past some people to deem the US as the Beast, and what the school is doing as an attempt to force the children into worshipping said beast. (of course that'd be a strange mix of Christianity and non-patriotism, which from what I can tell is quite rare.

    2. andy 45

      Re: And regarding the "Revelation" rant...

      ...as a christian you should know not to take the words of the bible/book of revelation etc too literally, especially from a book that has been translated many times. I would recommend just trying to get a feel for what the writer is getting at.

      As an aside, it amazes me how many people dismiss god/the bible etc but are quite willing to believe in evil/the devil. Like, I don't know many people that would be willing to do a ouija board in their house or attempt to perform some kind black magic.

      If you believe in ultimate evil you must believe in ultimate good.

      1. crowley

        Re: And regarding the "Revelation" rant...

        "If you believe in ultimate evil you must believe in ultimate good."

        I believe in brain damage which deprives people of empathy.

        That -resembles- ultimate evil, but doesn't require a spooky father figure to balance it out.

        1. andy 45

          Re: And regarding the "Revelation" rant...

          You can look at it purely scientifically if you like, but science can't explain 'the soul'.

          1. Anonymous Coward
            Anonymous Coward

            Re: And regarding the "Revelation" rant...

            It wouldn't be very scientific to try explaining 'the soul' as there is no evidence that there is anything to explain.

          2. A J Stiles

            Re: And regarding the "Revelation" rant...

            That is because the "soul" is imaginary, and therefore some way beyond the domain of science (which only attempts to document and catalogue reality)

      2. A J Stiles
        FAIL

        Re: And regarding the "Revelation" rant...

        Ultimate evil == lack of empathy.

        Ultimate good == human potential fulfilled.

        Nothing supernatural involved. Ting! Next, please.

      3. This post has been deleted by its author

    3. historymaker118
      Pint

      Re: And regarding the "Revelation" rant...

      As a Christian* girl myself, I am proud to say I would have done exactly what this girl did, and for exactly the same reasons. While I admit that these lanyards are not the mark of the beast, they aren't far off it, and I certainly would not wear one.

      Beer, because I want to buy her a pint.

      *Bring on the down votes you bunch of Atheistic Liberals.

      1. Andus McCoatover
        Windows

        Re: And regarding the "Revelation" rant...

        So, don't wear your keys on your right wrist. There. Sorted.

  13. Old Handle
    Big Brother

    You know that saying about Facebook?

    "If you're not paying for the product, you are the product."? Well it applies to public (state) schools too.

    1. 2much2young

      Re: You know that saying about Facebook?

      The last time I checked the govt budget I *was* paying for that particular product - maybe you've worked out how not to ?

  14. Charybdis
    FAIL

    If the system was Opt-in, there should be no issue

    People are SIGNING UP to be RFID tracked (just look at the http://www.epicmix.com/ ski-ticket system from Vail resorts, or for public transport there are the UK Oyster Cards or the Oz Myway cards etc).

    However for them to be introduced at a public school, with no choice but to comply smacks of the police state.

    We all already have barcode/swipe cards used to "Buy and Sell goods" (I wonder if the student in question likewise avoids credit cards and ATMS under religious beliefs), so it's only a small leap to get to RFID tracking of same.

    Of course, we all protested something back in high school, and for the student to refuse to comply with an RFID-less lanyard (which appears to mean that she is refusing to carry school ID) it seems that the school is quote within rights to expel her, religious beliefs or not.

    Note: If your religious beliefs mean you refuse to be photographed, for example, you can't get a license or photo ID to buy liquor. It's not religious persecution, it's legal bloody sense....

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: If the system was Opt-in, there should be no issue

      Police state? Hardly. It looks very much like the RFID is just used as an automatic register and possibly door activation technology. In the UK at least, it's a legal requirement to record who attends school, there are some schools which have swipe in systems. There are also some schools which have electronic door locks to allow students and teachers in/out as appropriate. My place of work has electronic doors, which I pass through with - yes - an RFID tag, hardly police state, just a common sense use of modern technology.

      1. James Micallef Silver badge
        Facepalm

        Re: If the system was Opt-in, there should be no issue

        (Recording attendance) is an appropriate use.

        Swipe in/out to access the toilet (Recording bowel movements) is not an appropriate use.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: If the system was Opt-in, there should be no issue

          The article is hazy, I suspect because the author knows this sort of thing pushes the buttons of the commentators, the five pages of comments would suggest that this is the case. It doesn't say if the tracking is on a who goes through a door basis and it doesn't say that the RFIDs aren't used as a classroom door lock opener. I don't think it's unreasonable to believe that the "need it to go to the toilet" is actually because you need the card to leave a classroom, during a lesson.

          I need my RFID card at work to go to the toilet, this is because the door to the toilet is in the same area as the lift lobby and these are potentially areas that the public could get admittance to, should they get past the guy on the entrance lobby. It's all in how you spin it.

    2. andy 45

      Re: If the system was Opt-in, there should be no issue

      Please dont bother using the Oyster card analogy. When oyster cards were brought in they doubled non-oyster fairs to make sure people used them. People didnt particularly want to sign up for them.

      And your point is also moot as with Oyster cards one can remain anonymous by not registering the card and paying with cash. I also have a handy RFID-blocking wallet to keep my Oyster in.

  15. Coen Dijkgraaf
    Devil

    She might also have been objecting to the barcode containing a hidden number of 666.

    Don't believe me? Do a search in your favorite search engine for "number of the beast barcode"

    1. quarky
      FAIL

      Barcodes

      Only 666 if you don't understand them though right?

    2. BorkedAgain
      Thumb Up

      Wow. Thanks, Coen.

      Some previously untapped resources of crazy there. That's wonderful.

      If only there were some way to convert internet-sourced lunacy into power, we'd be all set...

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Wow. Thanks, Coen.

        Well, if the beast's number was actually 666 maybe (popular belief and Iron Maiden at their best notwithstanding, it is 616 if you go back before the mis-print).

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Urban myth

      The barcode containing 666 is an urban myth which arises from the three pairs of lines which are used to detect velocity/acceleration looking like the number 6. The problem is that (IIRC) they're actually the number 0, most people don't realise that a barcode encodes data in the mark as well as the space.

    4. SteveK
      Devil

      "Unexpected demon in the bagging area"

  16. McBeese
    Devil

    How is it possible that people still 'believe'?

    Is it not 2012? Did we not land a Volkswagon-sized remote explorer on Mars this year? HOW, in this day and age, can supposedly intelligent and educated people still believe in primitive superstition a.k.a religious doctrine? I totally get why the leaders are into it... it's a good business. I'm lost as to why the followers buy into all the nonsense and GIVE MONEY to support it.

    Why is your god more credible than Zeus, Apollo, Thor, Santa Claus, etc., etc.? Do you worry that you'll break your mother's back if you step on a sidewalk crack? Why not?

    More bad than good comes from religion.

    We live among superstitious fools.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: How is it possible that people still 'believe'?

      Human beings - in aggregate - are not a particularly intelligent species. Clever, yes. Smart not so much.

      1. Danny 14
        Alien

        Re: How is it possible that people still 'believe'?

        never under estimate the power of lunacy. There is a flat earth society with true believers.

        Oh my.

  17. Herby

    I wonder...

    What would happen if a bunch (50 or more) students got together and jointly zapped their RFID tags. Then when replaced, did it again. Sounds like a good thing to organize a student protest about.

    Kinda like Von Ryan's express: "Parade strip" (when they burned the rags they had for clothes).

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: I wonder...

      You could add "swapping barcodes with each other" - barcodes are very easy to make and read, so I'd invest some time in figuring out what's in them and then generating some more, at random. Oh, and RFIDs can be reprogrammed from a distance, so wouldn't it be a very cool school project to do just that?

      With a decent antenna and transceiver you can do it from a good 10 meter or so.

      1. TRT Silver badge

        Re: I wonder...

        Oh God, they do that swapping rings and jumpers thing with their boyfriend, girlfriend thing, don't they? This could be, like, the new 'pledge', swapping RFID tags. Except when he goes to the loo and finds it only opens the girl's bogs.

        1. Fred Flintstone Gold badge

          Re: I wonder...

          Except when he goes to the loo and finds it only opens the girl's bogs.

          You say that as if that's a bad thing :). Personally, I think you've stumbled upon the most certain argument that swapsies will take place, unless teenagers have stopped being teenagers.

      2. David Pollard

        Re: I wonder...

        "Swapping barcodes with each other"

        Would this be classed as a variety of cyber-sex?

    2. Ian Michael Gumby
      Boffin

      Re: I wonder...

      Can you say "destruction of school property?"

  18. bitten

    "If you can start early in life getting people accustomed to living in surveillance society ..."

    Why not orange jumpsuits, 3% will wear them and 33% should have worn them on the same grounds but where favored by 'chance'.

  19. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    I wouldn't necessarily agree with her reasons

    But the principles are fine. We risk raising a generation of human sheep who find this kind of monitoring perfectly normal. It doesn't have to stop at school! History teaches us that human sheep are a fundamentally bad thing*.

    * Because human sheep tend to think "Gosh, what a lovely moustache; I'll do as his party says," and that kind of thing rarely ends well.

  20. Steven Roper
    Big Brother

    John Whitehead gets it

    "If you can start early in life getting people accustomed to living in surveillance society then in future it'll be a lot easier to roll these things out to the larger populace."

    THIS, a thousand times this. THIS is what it's really all about. Training the kids to get used to living under constant police-state surveillance so it can be pushed on the public later on. This is why this insidious trend needs to be stopped now, by any means necessary. And people like John Whitehead are absolutely essential to this goal.

    A $20 donation is on its way to The Rutherford Institute as soon as this comment is posted. And I don't even live in America, but people like Mr. Whitehead need to be encouraged in their endeavours.

  21. Combat Wombat
    Facepalm

    I was all for this protest..

    Until I saw her rationale behind it.

    Oh for the love of DOG !

    There are a shit load of reasons to protest this, but "because the voices in my head say so" Is the worst reason.

    Please have that girl tested for schizophrenia ASAP.

    1. Alan W. Rateliff, II
      Paris Hilton

      Re: I was all for this protest..

      So you'd be happy just letting this slip because the loudest voice against it is someone who's religious? By this logic, even if you believe abortion is murder you would not speak out against it because the loudest voices against abortion are religious.

      Pretty damned sad, IMNSHO. The religious and privacy angles notwithstanding, as I feel these get addressed fairly well, let's look at some numbers. The school system is spending $500,000 ($.5 million) to wrangle students in order to win a $2 million grant, a net gain of $1.5 million. I posit that the $.5 million could be spent on mechanisms which work to entice students to desire participation in an educational environment like, oh, better teachers, better trained teachers (good and dedicated teachers, you know I'm not talking about you,) better curriculum, better extra-curricular activities which can only be enjoyed if the student is fully attendant, and so on. $500,000 goes a long way to encourage and entice rather than coerce, bully, and buy-off.

      Net gains in this scenario are a better school, happier and more capable students, students who retain dignity and privacy and develop a sense of doing right for its own merit rather than because they have to, less stressed teachers and administrators, more productive individuals going out into the job market, and $1.5 million. Hell, for that matter, the school might not need $1.5 million in pocket-padding if the $500,000 was put to better use.

      Paris, could be put to better use.

  22. westlake
    Pint

    Northside.

    The numbers tell the story.

    The Northside district in San Antonio has 112 schools and 100,000 students.

    The middle school and high school in the RFID badge pilot program have 4,200 students.

    In the adult world, where will you find a campus that size ---- whatever its purpose --- which doesn't restrict physical access and access to services through the use of keycards, badges, and so on?

    John Jay is a STEM magnet school.

    Parents are encouraged to enroll their kids with promises of small class sizes, a safe and secure environment, academic rigor and strong discipline.

    It's been a winning formula for the Catholic School to generations.

    1. Dave 15

      Re: Northside.

      A few years ago every shopping centre was open (still is in the free world, just not in the west).

      Indeed most factories used to be open .... but now in the UK they are all closed (but not by turnstiles). The only other reason to have the turnstiles was to extract money ... not to spy on you.

  23. Mike Flex

    "Students need the lanyard ... for toilet breaks, and it allows the school to track their every movement throughout the day."

    Yup, that does sound rather over-detailed.

  24. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    CCTV

    "The school has already installed over 200 CCTV cameras in an attempt to curb truancy"

    Installed them where?

    If its in the school they're a waste of money - they need to be in the local shopping centre if they're after truants.

  25. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    File this one under...

    right fight for the wrong reasons.

    1. Nigel 11

      Re: File this one under...

      You might come to think "right reasons" if you consider that she doesn't want to be forced to wear a tag because it's against her principles, and you don't want to be forced to wear a tag because ...

      The opposition being the people who say fuck your principles, do what we tell you or we'll hit you with something.

  26. FrankAlphaXII

    Hell, Im a believer and I think John of Patmos was on mushrooms, ate just a little too much Nutmeg, or wrote down one hellacious fever dream as a thinly veiled attack on Roman Imperial authority.

    Regardless, isn't the tracking concern why people like RMS refuse to wear RFID key badges? I can't describe him as religious at all unless you count the Cult of GNU, yet he still refuses it on very similar grounds.

    "When a place gets crowded enough to require ID's, social collapse is not far away. It is time to go elsewhere"

    1. DJO Silver badge
      Happy

      John of Patmos (allegedly) wandered the desert for 40 day and nights before writing his revelation, there are not many mushrooms to be found in the desert, however there are a lot of very interesting cacti and succulents.

      A minor point but peyote is a lot more psychoactive than psilocybin and is far more likely to generate visions etc, just ask Carlos Castaneda to confirm that one.

      Icon – effect of peyote & psilocybin.

  27. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    When I wer' a lad....

    When I was at secondary school, the general ethos was one of not talking down to pupils but treating us with respect unless we did wrong, in the hope that we would develop into responsible young adults and cause less trouble overall.

    This idea is like a reversion to the Victorian era with presumed guilt from the outset, ne'er trusting the little blighters. With cameras monitoring the whole place it must feel like a prison camp, offering new vistas to paedo-headmaster types.

  28. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Mushrooms???

    If I read some of the comments on the Reg, it sure looks like they have something to do with pine trees.

  29. Mutl3y

    It's the book of revelation

    Revelation, singular.

    1. A J Stiles
      Flame

      Re: It's the book of revelation

      Hey, I know that. But believing in God and having read the Bible right through tend to be mutually-exclusive. Most people who have read the Bible right through realise what dangerous nonsense it all is.

      <-- Best use for the Bible.

    2. bep

      Re: It's the book of revelation

      Yeah, but don't they say 'Revelations' like they say 'Spurs' and 'Hearts' for Tottenham Hotspur and Heart of Midlothian?

  30. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Good for us!

    This is a good move on behalf of privacy in general. This sort of tracking should be optional, not required.

    BTW, I'm not too sure who else has noticed, but this is NOT a PUBLIC school, it is an INDEPENDENT school. I had the welcomed experience of attending public, christian private, and independent high schools. Independent schools are not magically funded by the state like a public school. Nor do they have charitable donations from one of many fund raisers on behalf of a religious organization. For instance there will almost never be the instance of a independent school participating in a nation wide government funded study program, and you will almost never have your honor programs held in a church funded by the community, and you many not even have typical leaves accepted as excused (FMLA like leaves may not apply to minors attending independent schools).

    If this independent school takes the fall for this, it may never recover. Which, if what I'm reading is true, that would be a good thing on behalf of the word privacy alone.

    1. pixl97

      Re: Good for us!

      WRONG. Everything you just posted is incorrect.

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independent_school

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independent_school_district

      An independent school and independent school district are two totally different things. Don't bring confusion to the issue.

  31. Dave 32
    FAIL

    Tattoo

    Maybe they ought to just do away with the RFID tag, and tattoo numbers, perhaps on the inside of her left forearm. :-( :-( :-(

    Dave

    P.S. I shall remember.

    1. Thorne

      Re: Tattoo

      "Maybe they ought to just do away with the RFID tag, and tattoo numbers, perhaps on the inside of her left forearm. :-( :-( :-("

      Maybe they should do away with RFID and go facial recognition and biometrics. Exactly the same effect without the barcodes.

      You're not going to stop tracking by getting rid of RFID

      1. bep

        Re: Tattoo

        Don't think you comparison holds water, old bean. With facial recognition, you don't carry the transponder around with you anywhere you go.

        I remember when these RFIDs first came out there was this debate on television and this hip Gen Yer said she wouldn't mind having a chip inserted so she could borrow library books at Uni etc. I thought at the time "That's not how it's going to happen". Like Focault knew, it was going to start with all the people and creatures who had the least control over what happened to their bodies, so

        1) Domestic pets: check

        2) Prison inmates: check

        3) Old people with (and no doubt soon, without) dementia): check

        4) School kids; check

        5) Workers in security environments: check

        6) Workers not in security environments: soon.

        Lot's of people around here love wearing their identity tags around their necks all the time. I'm not one of them.

        1. Thorne

          Re: Tattoo

          "Don't think you comparison holds water, old bean. With facial recognition, you don't carry the transponder around with you anywhere you go."

          Ummm last time I check, your face was attached.

          They installed hundreds of camera. Facial recog would be fairly easy to install and use

          RFID makes tracking easy but not having RFID doesn't make tracking impossible.

  32. Dave 32
    Devil

    RFID Swapping

    Maybe the kids ought to swap RFID tags every morning, thus totally and effectively randomizing the RFID tags.

    How long before a hacker hacks this system? ;-) Where are the gray hats?

    Dave

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: RFID Swapping

      "Maybe the kids ought to swap RFID tags every morning, thus totally and effectively randomizing the RFID tags."

      You mean the Army's night-in-town technique?

  33. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Obligatory...

    Coming soon to the UK!

  34. JaitcH
    WTF?

    Don't let ACPO know, they wll be next - RFID readers all over the UK next on their WANT list

    There is just too much being forced on to students. I am Herandez' side, technology looking for a problem.

    The RDIF system can be easily defeated by simply leaving the tag behind secreted somewhere, or covering it with alumin(i)um foil. For more permanent cures, placing the RFID-equipped device in a microwave, together with a mug of cold water, and giving it 15 second bursts of 100% power. Works well on UK Passports and larger denomination US dollar bills, too.

    GAP clothing are sold with several RFID chips in each garment.

    ACPO would have a field day with this stuff, with Plod carrying portable readers around so they can scan people and bring up their information and criminal records eliminating the familiar expression: "What's all this then?". Besides Plod now have a handbook for guidance such as the Warwickshire Police handbook Policing Our Communities.

    1. Dave 15

      Re: Don't let ACPO know, they wll be next - RFID readers all over the UK next on their WANT list

      It is already here. Various schools here have spy cameras watching the kids, databases all over the place, and so on. Really the west is being taken to a frightening place because of the apathy and stupidity of the majority. They are too wrapped up in 'big brother' (or whatever it is this week) to care and too stupid to realise the effects of having the police/government/whoever takes over next in control of every possible piece of data about you.

  35. Dave 15

    Free and democratic

    Thats what the west claims... but it seems to be a total lie. We have spy cameras everywhere in the UK, they appear to be everywhere in the USA, chips and tracking all over.... It appears we have been lulled into a police state and the muppets who claim 'nothing to hide... nothing to fear' have clearly forgotten the lessons of history - not least the Jews who didn't need to hide their religion in 1930 but didn't live to regret it. There are other similar examples but that one is the most striking because it happened in a democratic country.

  36. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Well, I suppose it's better...

    ... than having a BarCode or similar tattoed on you, like the Nazis used to do.

    Wait! Don't give Mr Gove and the Nasty Party such good ideas.

    1. Ross K Silver badge
      WTF?

      Re: Well, I suppose it's better...

      I'm pretty sure the Nazis didn't have barcode technology in the 1940's - I could be wrong though...

  37. Nolveys
    Thumb Up

    I'd think this was a wonderful system...

    ...if I were a pedophile.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: I'd think this was a wonderful system...

      Isn't this about high school?

      so a paedophile wouldn't be interested....

      paedophile = someone over 16 who's sexual interest is mainly or only in prepubescent children...

      in other words a paedophile is someone who needs to be castrated or culled, but teenagers are safe..

  38. MachDiamond Silver badge

    Waste of money and tech

    Just because you can, doesn't mean you should. If this program were to be analyzed after a year or two they would probably discover that it didn't do a damn thing. They won't do any follow up, of course. It would be embarrassing for them to show that all of the money they took from the classrooms was wasted. It's better for the powers that be to just point to this modern high-tech system and claim it keeps the students safer and in class. I wonder how much time they are going to have to chase students around that are out of class for legitimate reasons. Every time a teacher sends a student to the media center to pick up lessons that weren't printed in time for the teacher to get them in the morning is going to have to be "investigated" by somebody. That somebody is going to be another school employee that has nothing to do with teaching.

    It seemed pretty simple when I was in school for the teacher to take roll at the beginning of class. If you were skiving off, you would get a summons slip to appear before the vice principal to have a chat about why you weren't in class at some point in the next couple of days. A few no-shows would trigger a conference that included your parents. The library was the last place you would go if you wanted a bit of free time, so there was no use in having some sort of pass to get in. If you wanted to check out a book, you handed over your student ID card and the book was signed out to you. Bathrooms?! If you really just had to it was at a point where you didn't want to be held up by anything. I never saw the restrooms were I attended school as any place that needed a bunch of security. If a student qualified for a free lunch, it was verified by a check box or mark on their student ID card. I went to the snack bar at the college across the street. The food was marginally better and they had sodas.

  39. Anonymous Coward
    Coat

    Different universe...

    ... here on planet 'me', I'm somewhat disturbed by this entire fiasco.

    Civil liberties - I get that, definitely worth fighting for. but...

    "Mark of the Beast?" - lost me there. Argument dead in the water.

    I have to remind myself that out there in that 'other universe' there's still plenty of people who believe this utter bullshit. Any credibility they may have had by citing privacy and liberty is thrown down the shitter the moment they bring religion into the argument.

    Onto the wider question, as to why a school has to implement this type of scheme in the first place - I'm frankly saddened as to what a *massive* FAIL it is. Worse still, only *one* student protested?

    Are the rest of these kids a bunch of sheep? Do they enjoy being treated like criminals?

    It's that old chestnut that schools have fucked us over with for centuries. If one or two kids do something bad, well, damn it all, punish everyone! Yeah! That'll learn um! ... or it'll just make the entire lot of them do bad stuff.

    I'll get my coat, it's getting cold around here ...

  40. MachDiamond Silver badge

    Random Swapping

    I love the swapping idea. It sounds like something out of Cory Doctorow's book Little Brother. Everyday as you enter campus, you swap badges with the first person you see. Totally random mixing. Whoever is bound to be the next valedictorian and the whole herd of teacher's pets should nuke their badges so it appears they have dropped out.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Random Swapping

      Every time I got a new badge, I'd nuke it... and assuming their not too complex, clone a few.. Make it look like people were in 10 places at once...

    2. TRT Silver badge

      Re: Random Swapping

      The cyber-equivalent of bullying someone for their lunch money, because this is BOUND to be linked to the cashless payment systems.

    3. Thorne

      Re: Random Swapping

      "and the whole herd of teacher's pets should nuke their badges so it appears they have dropped out."

      They laugh about nuking their tags but later when they REALLY need to go to the toilet.....

      1. Dave 32
        Coat

        Re: Random Swapping

        After a few brown piles mysteriously appeared in the hallways, the bathrooms would be quickly unprotected!

        Dave

        P.S. Mine's the one with the toilet paper in the pocket (It pays to be prepared!).

  41. MrXavia
    Big Brother

    I thought the UK was big brother, but this? this is mental!

    Total invasion of privacy.. OK I might wear an RFID tag a work, but that is a security issue, NOT for the sole purpose of tracking.

    Sure I can track MY sons movements on his mobile IF I need to, but that is for emergency use and mainly for tracking down his phone if he looses it or if he wonders off somewhere, he did that last year, so now I make sure he has a mobile phone on him whenever we go out, sure many parents might find a 5 year old with a smart phone odd, but I'd rather be able to call him and him call me if we get separated.. and worse case scenario, I can track him down to a few meters usually (not that I have needed to )

  42. Silverburn
    Happy

    Simples!

    Just install the same DO_NOT_TRACK code that MS uses in IE...

    ...oh wait. I spot a flaw.

  43. foo_bar_baz

    Truancy

    Cameras and RFID tags, technical solutions to a social problem. Doomed to fail.

  44. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    a barcode and an RFID

    LOL THATS JUST CRUEL.

    AND round the neck as well, haha.

    good luck with your shitty school system you dumb as texans

    1. Dave 32
      Coat

      Re: a barcode and an RFID

      Wonder how many students will have to be strangled by those round-the-neck cords before they realize this is a Real Dumb idea?

      Dave

      P.S. Mine's the one with the strap cutter in the pocket.

  45. deadlockvictim
    Unhappy

    Giggedy Giggedy Giggedy Goo

    Article» Students need the lanyard ... in some cases for toilet breaks, and it allows the school to track their every movement throughout the day.

    No chance that it will be abused by perverts then.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Giggedy Giggedy Giggedy Goo

      schools already fuck kids up by making value judgments about them base don their toilet breaks.

      in the real world nobody ever tells you your a bad person for taking a piss but in school where psychopath teachers get off on their power trips over 8 year olds, that shit happens all the time.

  46. john 19

    She could just wrap it with aluminum foil..

  47. Tom 7

    Think of the sheep!

    Sheep now have to have an RFID tag in them in the UK for 'welfare reasons'. My sheep have successfully torn their ears really badly cos these tags are basically inhumane.

    I just hope everyone else at the school puts a bit of silver paper round them - this isnt a science thing - its 1984 with backhanders.

    And no you don’t send Christians to christian schools - everyone has a right to learn.

    1. Thorne

      Re: Think of the sheep!

      "And no you don’t send Christians to christian schools - everyone has a right to learn."

      But what if they don't want to learn?

  48. Andus McCoatover
    Windows

    ..and the LORD spoke, and sayeth unto Flob "I will give You a sign, by which others may enter your house, and feast in your canteen and look at Scriptures in your library"

    And Flob said "I give grateful thanks, O LORD" and fell to his knees in supplication.

    The LORD, being so moved by Flob's contrite nature, He gaveth Flob thousands of these signs.

    The lord sayeth to Flob, "Carry them always with thee, as the cost of replacing them will cost thee many sheckels!"

    "Thank You, LORD, I shall stuff them onto my ring, and I shall call them...keys!"

  49. Crisp

    Any chance of having this added as a comment icon?

    http://regmedia.co.uk/2012/05/25/she_devil.png

  50. JaitcH
    Happy

    Injuntion Issued Restraining School - Hearing Next Week

    A district court judge for Bexar County, Texas, has granted The Rutherford Institute’s request for a temporary restraining order to prevent Northside Independent School District from removing a San Antonio high school student from John Jay High School’s Science and Engineering Academy because she objected to wearing a name badge signifying participation in the school district’s new “Student Locator Project.”

    Source: < www.rutherford.org/publications_resources/on_the_front_lines/victory_court_grants_rutherford_institute_request_to_stop_texas_school_from >

  51. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Like Yikes Scoobs!

    To heck with the religious angle..

    "What’s happening now is going to spread across the country," Whitehead said. "If you can start early in life getting people accustomed to living in surveillance society then in future it'll be a lot easier to roll these things out to the larger populace."

    Good luck to your children and their children...doesn't bode well..systems linked to police systems/state...

    I'll be getting off at the next stop..thanks...

    1. Charles 9

      Re: Like Yikes Scoobs!

      Forget that. What if a private enterprise does the same thing, turns it into something everyone wants and becomes the de facto standard. Now you have it even worse because the private enterprise isn't really answerable to anyone (not even the law since they'll probably be an international conglomerate with an HQ no one can approach). Forget Big Brother. Have you considered Big Owner?

  52. mfritz0
    Stop

    Maybe I'm old fashioned

    It used to be that the students showed up at school in the morning and reported to their home room, where roll call was performed and the student was marked absent or present. This seems to be a much simpler process than all this other techno-babble. What's wrong with the teachers actually doing their jobs and creating a classroom environment that keeps the students interested in their own education and inspiring them to want to come to class. If the teachers today would just do their jobs correctly this "tag" would not be necessary. In my opinion, the necessity of this RFID tag not only violates the individual's personal civil right to anonymity but it also represents a massive failure or flaw in the design of the educational system. What kind of an example is the educational system setting when they treat everyone as if they are all prisoners? What kind of example are they setting when they show everyone that they don't trust any of them and FORCE them to wear such a device? I hope the people involved win this lawsuit and win big. This will set a prime example for other institutions contemplating this "easy way out" for student control.

    Stop sign, because this idea has to stop.

  53. Simon B
    WTF?

    followers of the Beast receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads. Then the silly bint should have used her left hand instead if she was THAT bothered, of blaming religious beliefs.

  54. nijam Silver badge

    Of course the teachers were the first to sign up to wearing these gadgets, not.

    For some reason teachers seem to think they're exempt from all the sh:t they foist on students.

    By the same token, I'd suggest all new legislation be tested for a couple of years on MPs and the police, before it could be enforced on the rest of us.

  55. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Barcodes

    What No mention that the barcode start, centre and end anchor lines are the number 6.

  56. Gordon861

    I expect the next evolution of this tech will be to monitor who is getting with who around the school.

    So student A is found out breaking the rules and they then look back and student B has been spending a lot of time with them outside normal lessons and use that to start questioning them too.

    Or they bring in a rule regarding how close members of the opposite sex can be whilst at school.

    They could even add in the shock collars/bracelets they want to pass out to air passengers and use remote discipline too.

  57. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    At my school…

    They checked for truancy by taking a register with a pen on a piece of paper! Primitive, I know, but it worked and wasn't such a massive violation of privacy.

  58. johnck
    Joke

    With apologies to Dara O’Brian

    Come on people it’s only the Bible it’s not Gospel

  59. A J Stiles
    Facepalm

    Right conclusion, for the wrong reasons

    I believe that Hernandez is going about this entirely the wrong way.

    Nobody has an automatic "right" for their religious beliefs to go unchallenged. What if your religion demands you to sacrifice thirteen virgins every full moon? What about blowing up unbelievers by the busload with exploding rucksacks? No religious belief is any more or less riduculous than any other.

    If she really, seriously believes, even for one moment, that as much as one word of any of this stuff about the "mark of the beast" is anything but far-fetched fiction, she needs a spell in a mental home.

    Tracking a person's movements all the time is wrong because people have a right to privacy, not because of any mythology dreamed up by iron-age tribes of nomadic goatherds.

    Obiter Dictum: Has anyone conducted any studies of the long-term effects on an individual's mental health of this kind of intrusive monitoring?

  60. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Good for her, really, if such a device would have been invented and implemented during my school years, I would have fought it too. I would also have pointed out that with the US Education system facing so many money problems, that money could have been spent to better improve education, not distrust students. Also, based on my experience from my High School years, thy would have expelled me and anyone else for opposing such a system. I know, because I did oppose something in high school based on principle and was suspended. When I ask about my rights, I was told, and I quote "I don't have any rights as a student".

    Oh well, enough with blood pressure trip down memory lane, on the other side of the coin, wait until this young lady get's into the real world of "work". She is in for a real shock as far as her religious believes and rights are concerned.

  61. SlaveNewWorld
    Big Brother

    Mark of the beast prediction...

    A pretty good guess for someone who used silver shekels... Maybe he anticipated a solution to what politicians and bankers were already dreaming about back then.

    Physical cash is anonymous, it allows the bearer to trade relatively freely without interference from an omniscient and omnipotent government/ dictatorship, and with few restrictions, other than the physical limitations of using a physical medium.

    Electronic money, with your ID associated with every transaction, information readily accessible to the State (who take from Peter to give to Paul), ...is a recipe for absolute tyranny in corrupt and greedy hands.

    Well done to the student for standing up for herself.

    1. Andus McCoatover
      Windows

      Re: Mark of the beast prediction...

      Well - kinda.

      "Well done to the student for standing up for herself."

      Did she, on her own? Or was her pastor/preacher/whatever pushing for this? Not belittling the young lady, I'm guessing the decision was - well, maybe - a bit 'pressganged' on her.

  62. Hoe
    Thumb Up

    LOLs

    "Other non-believers think John was a bit too fond of funny mushrooms and shouldn't be taken too seriously."

    - Classic.

  63. Anonymous Coward
    Black Helicopters

    Bloody good mushrooms if that's what it was

    So John wrote about a system which uses a mark (the Greek means an etching in the skin) to facilitate purchasing and sale of goods, and this was written when!? Of course, we all know that nothing like that will never happen.

    Pretty good guess, mushrooms or source.

    Back to the plot, since the 'Mark of the Beast' is described as a mark on the hand or forehead, and not a lanyard, then I don't see why she made such a fuss. Does she refuse to have her hand stamped when she goes into a theme park?

  64. Johan Bastiaansen
    WTF?

    Land of the brave and the free

    They tag their students and sell guns to lunatics.

  65. nerdfiles
    Trollface

    "It is an implemenation of the Mark of the Beast" can go many ways. Is she mentioning or using "Mark of the Beast"? If she were an atheist, she might argue that the school is promulgating religion through a technological dressing. I recall coming across a grant proposal here, living in Houston, written by a notable land owner. A kind of template or something. One of my colleagues, an English grad from UH criticized it chiefly on the grounds of its heavily religious language, coloring, and imagery. --

    And so, seriously. -- No, seriously. She could actually argue this. Atheists argue this all the time. The trouble is, would the consequence be any different from where we have here this "religious privacy" interpretation?

  66. Haku

    "mark of the beast"

    I'm reminded of a comment to some video I read recently:

    "When I was in high school a friend's mother told me that one day we would all have bar codes tattooed on our foreheads (mark of the beast) and that is how we would pay for everything. She got mad when i asked her if she thought it would hurt to slide your head over the bar code scanner."

  67. Brett the Brat
    Facepalm

    To hell with this thing. Cameras are fine. Being tracked by some Nazi's is not fine. I do not agree on tracking their every movement. You try to track me with one and I will give you a kick in the goolies.

  68. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    She has options

    While I believe her objections are purely B.S., she has options. She can be home schooled, she can wear the RFID lanyard like everyone else, she can move and go to a different school, she can launch a meritless court case she can't win, etc.

    This girl isn't be persecuted. She has chosen to violate a school requirement designed to protect her and secure the school, which is not only reasonable, most parents expect and often demand that schools provide these protections. If she's that opposed to these security measures then she'll need to explore her options but I doubt she will will a lawsuit on the matter and I hope she doesn't as it has nothing to do with free speech or personal rights. Anyone who's read the Bill of Rights would know this but many folks falsely believe that all speech is protected and it is not nor are all so called "rights".

    1. The Alphabet

      Re: She has options

      Our school simply maintained "security" by locking us in via 15 foot high anti-climb-paint-covered fences with CCTV pointed at all exits.

      If you know someone cannot leave then they are, by implication, secure. If anyone inside was to come to harm or danger, it wouldn't go unnoticed for long because of all the people locked inside.

      But then prison can be defined exactly the same way.

    2. JEDIDIAH
      Linux

      Re: She has options

      ...yes her choices are "anal probing" or "being cast out".

      Great list of so-called "choices" there.

      According to you it's all good. Doesn't matter if it's someone like Stalin or Hitler in charge. They always have the choice to go live in the ghetto or get themselves a nice farm in Lancaster county.

  69. NomNomNom

    what the fuck is a lanyard

    1. Charles 9
      Facepalm

      A cord loop that normally wraps around some part of your body to keep it from getting lost. Now, most people call them necklaces when placed around the neck and straps when on the limbs, but the idea is the same.

  70. my farts clear the room
    Boffin

    I am a well practiced regarder of beans .....

    3 for a tenner suggests that the beans are small. I am not a small bean regarder, although I have been known to flick beans and have found they sometimes get bigger.

    What do your magic beans do when flicked?

  71. sylviechen
    Unhappy

    RFID hacking

    You think that kids can't figure out a workaround to stay hidden?

    Think again.

    RFID "chips" are easy to disable. And you can cover them with a nice copper mesh(invisible) in a plastic sleeve when you want to disappear for a while.

    Its distressing to see the lack of technological knowledge that educators exhibit and are willing to spend monies on solutions such as these.

    As for privacy and constitutional issues, educators are now treating students as sources of funding for their programs and if you can "prove" that a student was at the school, this audit trail assures that they receive their per diem payment from the government.

    Sounds no different than a prison system administrator keeping track of inmates. Sad.

  72. eddieVroom

    I expect the upshot of VoterID is that it creates a "problem" with the ID itself, and the "solution" to fill this newly created market will be RFID implants for all. The evangelical conservatrons will have made "the mark of the beast" come true all by themselves. The irony is delicious.

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