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The Royal Society has backed the discussion of creationism in school science classes, kicking off what promises to be a spectacular row amongst the country’s top boffins. The boffinry talking-shop’s director of education told the British Association’s festival of science in Liverpool that creationism should be examined in school …

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So if I "get your point"

the statement "Faith is evidence of god" is true if you have a definition of "evidence" that means "faith".

Would that be correct?

So you're telling us "Faith is Faith of God". But using the word "evidence" to pull in the standard meaning of "evidence" as "that which is shown".

There is no evidence of God.

Either deliberately, in which case, you live your life, I live mine (and leave religion out of science, we've got a perfectly fine RE class for it). Or because there is no God. In which case, by not investigating whether there is no God, you're creating a poor life for yourself in your delusion.

PS learn how to think, then learn how to put an argument on the table. your post was almost 100% gibberish.

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@writebaby & Others...

@WriteBaby -

Ah, thank you! Your breakdown of probability and possibility is exactly what I was trying to frame before writing. You saved me the effort with your excellent and succinct post!

@Soozy -

Have you seen the film 'idiocracy' - I think you'd find it amusing given your post! I also reccomend it to anyone else interested in the comical side of social evolution.

@Mark -

I'm sure you have heard the phrase before; "Respect is earned and not demanded" - Religion (not faith per se) has yet to earn respect on any reasonable or logical basis. Instead, as a rule, it demands respect from a stance of fear and ignorance. It is taught, by it's leaders, that faith is a virtue and that faith does not question. Since when, I ask, is unquestioning obedience considered a virtue? Surely only religion and patriotism (my country, right or wrong) demand such things. Respect will come for Religion when religion learns to respect my beliefs and rights too.

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Faith?

"the statement "Faith is evidence of god" is true if you have a definition of "evidence" that means "faith"."

Anyone please tell me that you you can answer ALL questions without considering something other than science as it is obvious that science does not answer all the questions pertaining to our world. I will say that when I was talking about faith in my previous post (as questioner) I dare to say that science limits our knowledge to a degree - perhaps a massive amount as it does not take the place of an INFINITE mind (GOD). I realize that I am speaking from within a theological sphere as science is inadequate (to the best of my knowledge) at proving some of my theological statements. The biblical view of 'evidence' through the passage in the book of Hebrews pertains to the spiritual view of the world that surpasses the scientific view as Christians because our faith in Jesus Christ is central to anything pertaining to our lives and therefore we cannot trust science alone as it is always in the state of changing unlike our infinite God who we believe to be unchanging and immovable when it comes to his Word (bible). I will state what I believe to be true and that is this, God can answer all the questions of life through the bible within our human reasoning as well as our spiritual understandings. It is our responsibility to 'seek' and we will 'find' as He (God) declares this clearly in His Word...

"There is no evidence of God."

I dare to say that there is so much evidence but you may fail to see it. Suggested website: http://www.godandscience.org. I personally know that God exists as I speak with Him on a regular basis. I realize that may seem crazy to some people but that is my experience or 'my science' that God exists. I have seen and experienced too much to dismiss His existence obviously and would commit intellectual suicide if I tried to dismiss His existence. I am a very curious person so I do ask a lot of questions but I've come to the conclusion that as fascinating as science may be, it will not answer all of my questions like this authorative Creator does. I am finding that science is a wonderful servant at confirming God's existence as it is confirming more and more about the bible.

Ron (Questioner)

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No.

"the statement "Faith is evidence of god" is true if you have a definition of "evidence" that means "faith".

Would that be correct?"

Not at all, sounds like a troll. How on earth would you get any of that from what i said, or most the other things you have said.

Context of faith I was implying was the circumstance and context of the faith producing something tangible. Such as work in a job as a position, and work as in the product of the job, two different contexts. So faith maybe viewed as faith itself, and also what it produces (the evidence). You really are actually helping everybody else understand and appreciate what I am saying, thanks.

"There is no evidence of God." see previouse posts on concrete logical proof. Calling me deluded is like the "pot calling the kettle black". All true trolls are deluded as they are depending on dishonesty to keep it going (apart from the ego), and this is definitely so dumb it has got to be a troll. Even as a troll you are not looking very smart, you are overplaying the dumb hand and making yourself look bad even to trolls. The low level of intelligence of your troll may mean you are a skeptic.

A few years back I anti-trolled a troll for 18 months, with him trying to get the last word in, not really realising that he was not the one in the control he craved for a good while, and was himself being anti-trolled. Eventually he spat the dummy and became a reformed member of the newsgroup he had been stalking. "If only you would use your powers for good instead of evil" ;) . I am not interested in wasting time on it, but how much time do you have..?

"PS learn how to think, then learn how to put an argument on the table. your post was almost 100% gibberish."

Yes, proof again, stop trolling.

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Ron and Steve

Ron

"I personally know that God exists as I speak with Him on a regular basis. I realize that may seem crazy to some people but that is my experience or 'my science' that God exists. I have seen and experienced too much to dismiss His existence obviously and would commit intellectual suicide if I tried to dismiss His existence. I am a very curious person so I do ask a lot of questions but I've come to the conclusion that as fascinating as science may be, it will not answer all of my questions like this authoritative Creator does. I am finding that science is a wonderful servant at confirming God's existence as it is confirming more and more about the bible."

I tend to avoid getting into discussions about everything, that get bogged down, but I can testify to what Ron is saying, my experiences give science a run, and that of others I know completely defy science and less objective cynical/skeptical thinking. In certain circles, with various people, at certain times, these things tend to be more common. But why get into something that bias people do dismiss out of hand, instead of sticking to evidence that can be dealt with here, like the concrete evidence for the existence of God as I posted earlier. As I said, it is not if there is an intelligent God there can't "not be" by logic and science, but what nature that God is?

If any of the people here consider themselves honest, undeluded and true, then examine my statements in the previouse posts on the existence of God and prove them true or false!

Steve, God could demand unquestioned obedience (funny, he gives people chance and choice apparently though) and we say why, and eventually we find out. Religious leaders demanding unquestioned obedience is not the same thing, as people fail. While your interpretation of religion is such, mine is not that. But, if you want to see demand for unquestioned obedience, the communists, and other dictatorships, are a good example (look at the film "Enemy at the gates" for an example, do and die, or die), that it is power mongering you might really be talking about, not necessarily religion.

In the same way our egos power monger and ironically 'demand' that people earn respect, and we demand respect. What is wrong with respecting others because they are human beings, respecting the truth and seeking it because it is the truth, respecting fairness, respecting any other righteous thing. Respecting police officers because they are police officers, government because they are government etc etc etc. However, some people expect to be blatantly wrong and respected, while disrespecting others they hold as wrong. crazy world isn't it. Anyway, back on course, respect is not only earned, but it is also by position. If we disrespect somebody who proves themselves right, because we want to please our egos and are wrong, then we disrespect their position of being right and also the fact they just earned it, and we just lost it.

A lot is spoken about respect by those that neither respect the truth or other's belief in it, or understand very much.

Wayne.

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Faith - Tangibility

"Context of faith I was implying was the circumstance and context of the faith producing something tangible. Such as work in a job as a position, and work as in the product of the job, two different contexts. So faith maybe viewed as faith itself, and also what it produces (the evidence). You really are actually helping everybody else understand and appreciate what I am saying, thanks."

In regards to tangibility I will state my personal experience (science) and those of millions (perhaps billions) of people worldwide who have experienced supernatural (divine) encounters in regards to unquestionable miraculous, unexplainable, medically impossible healings and genuine resurrections; prophetic knowledge and wisdom to the benefit of one and (or) others lives and guidance beyond anything science could ever predict. Also I have had the privilege of seeing multitudes 'transform' from dysfunctional, unfortunate, poverty stricken human beings into whole, healthy, very functional ones through the awesome power of the gospel of Jesus Christ. I personally experienced the 'evidence' and an intelligent person would know that these things are indismissable. If you are after clinical, unquestionable facts do a search for the things mentioned earlier and you will find the documented proofs and testimonies. I would say that God is very much in the business of caring, nurturing, healing and restoring imperfect, finite and fragile beings like ourselves.

Ron (Questioner)

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God's Anon.Cowards

I have seen someone survive a fall which should have killed them.

They were an atheist and they didn't see God.

Wayne, you understand nothing about science nor who is allowed to persue their proofs. I.e. EVERYONE. Science doesn't have heretics, unbelievers and people that need to be converted by the sword. Unlike your religion.

And as to "stop trolling", shit man! Look at the dog-collar trolling going on here!

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