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back to article Nokia's Elopocalypse two years on: Has Microsoft kept its side of the bargain?

It's two years since the "Elopocalypse". This week in 2011 Nokia's new CEO Stephen Elop set Europe's biggest technology company off in a radical new direction. Nokia would license its flagship phone software from Microsoft, rather than develop its own, set fire to three of its own mobile platforms, and eventually shed thousands …

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Stop

Oi!

"Did you dream that at one point, Nokia decided to give all its phones the same name, such as C3,"

Don't knock my C1-01, it makes phone calls very well.

If I get mugged they can have it, I'm not putting up a fight that.

I won't be buying a WinPhone, I will maybe just wait a another year to get my first smartphone. I might even go for an Ubuntu phone, at least I will have more trust that my data is not be sucked up somewhere.

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JDX
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Re: Oi!

And of course nobody will want to nick that either.

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Facepalm

Dream vs. Reality.

Did you dream that at one point, Nokia decided to give all its phones the same name, such as C3, differentiated only by an extension number?

You mean like "Lumia nnn"?

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Boffin

Give it another year...

While I can't verify accuracy, this is worth looking at.

Yes, I've linked this before. Just as I've made this sort of point before.

It took Android the best part of three years to gain traction against the iPhone - of course, it has since exploded, but it is possible this has nothing to do with Android itself. And of course, this was in a still relatively new market field.

It's a shame that unit sales per month/year for the Windows Phone since launch seem to be available (and I'm talking "sold" here, not "shipped") - I haven't found them, and neither has anyone I challenged to (too busy spreading FUD, I guess). But not making them available does weaken Microsoft's position.

Competition, variety and choice are always good. Windows Phone has massive challenges ahead, especially with the new Blackberry launch being pushed as hard as it is, and some quite frankly crap decisions by Microsoft. But given the state of the market, I think writing off the Windows Phone completely at this stage is still a bit premature. This time next year I think will be the crunch point.

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Re: Give it another year...

> I think writing off the Windows Phone completely at this stage is still a bit premature.

In 2006 Microsoft had 42% of the US smartphone market. Since then it has steadily declined to now be less than 3% (it did get above 3% in 12Q2).

Some of the reasons for the decline include letting 6 outlive its usefulness, in spite of promising a wonderful renewed phone MS released 6.5, then killed it with an incompatible 7 which in turn was dead-ended by 8.

Comparisons with the first couple of years of Android are irrelevant. MS had the market share (after a slow start with versions up to 5) but failed to keep up with more agile developments.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Give it another year...

Comparisons are not irrelevant because Windows Phone is a completely new platform, and bears no resemblance to Windows Mobile.

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JDX
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Re: Give it another year...

MS have now got themselves to the point their phone OS is as good as the competitors, give or take... for the majority not techies who like tinkering.

So now it's basically just inertia. Can they pay their way through or is the market sewn up? It might seem 'obviously' the latter but Windows had the desktop sewn up and Apple is slowly eating out a respectable bite of this.

Maybe time for some brand awareness to grow and they can. Probably a long haul thing though... even Android started off slowly.

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Re: Give it another year...

> Windows Phone is a completely new platform, and bears no resemblance to Windows Mobile.

That, of course, was one of the problems. After waiting too long for a post-6 update the app developers got a disappointment with 6.5, and then were dumped with WP7. WP7 was then dumped too and with a history that included Zune and Kin why would anyone want to start again from fresh with WP8, yet another new platform*.

One major issue with WP is that the hardware, at least many aspects of it, were laid down at the start and are controlled by MS. For example the SoCs can only be from a limited range and for WP8 were controlled to the extent that OEMs could only deal with specific manufacturers for specific part numbers. These were set a year ago and in a year's time will be obsolete. This means that, like WP7, WP8 will not have 'bragging rights' for technical superiority.

* While there are some aspects of WP8 that are continuance from WP7 there are enough differences to make redevelopment necessary.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Give it another year...

> While I can't verify accuracy, this is worth looking at.

> Yes, I've linked this before. Just as I've made this sort of point before.

One of the links on the very same page will take you to another article on the same site by the same commentator in which he explains why Nokia must now embrace Android.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Give it another year...

> Comparisons are not irrelevant because Windows Phone is a completely new platform, and bears no resemblance to Windows Mobile.

Oops.

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I cant belive no one has mentioned the lack of a 'backup and restore phone' option in winpho8! yes your app list gets saved and you can re-download them, but any data will be lost and hardly any apps have an export option... yes, your contacts get synced, but if you add images to the contacts those don't get restored when you reset and restore your phone...

Migrating one win8 phone to the next should be as painless as an iPhone, back up backs up the whole phone, restore restores the whole phone... simple! people do loose phones, people do break phones and people might possibly want to upgrade one win8 phone to another...

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Go

Really?

Have you tried the Win8 phone? It links to SkyDrive and you can back everything up. You can even save pictures on the fly by default. I had switched jobs and phones - and my new Win7 phone picked up so much just with a few login inputs it was amazing. The same when I wife got her Win8 upgrade. It wasn't even a restore, it was more or less just done. Apps are a different story, but honestly I almost found that to be a blessing in disguise - when it comes down to it I found myself using maybe a dozen apps, but I had 100 or so. Now I just have the dozen, and feel a bit wiser and waste less time.

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Re: Really?

Yep, I have had a Lumia920 since launch day... and have had to do a hard reset to find that all my app data had gone down the pan, my homescreen needed setting back up and lots of the contacts were screwed.

The phone does backup to skydrive and I checked the settings before I restored... losing all my car fuel data was a sod! as was the only game I had played... neither app having the ability to export data...

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unknown details on Microsoft Nokia deal

Because Andrew Orlowski has no intimate knowledge of the terms and conditions of the Microsoft-Nokia deal, he should not speculate as to whether Microsoft or Nokia received the benefits "supposedly" promised or calculated, since the usual business practices may not apply.

Several long time experts in the field of business cooperatives of this nature speculated some time ago that it would make no difference to Stephen Elop if Nokia got shafted in the deal and remained unprofitable, as he was very well $$compensated by Microsoft directly to ensure that the Nokia Windows 8 smartphones got produced, irrespective of any worthwhile Nokia sales gains.

Under those circumstances Stephen Elop comes out smelling like roses financially, no matter Nokia's future. He can always quit and move elsewhere to another company that Microsoft wishes to exploit through his servitude to Redmond.

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Re: unknown details on Microsoft Nokia deal

Several long time experts in the field of business cooperatives of this nature

all of whom wear hats made from tinfoil, by any chance?

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This post has been deleted by a moderator

This would be a nice article....

... if it was for a company like HTC or a boutique shop...

However for a company at the size of Nokia??? No way.

I think there is one rule... dont put your faith in the hands of another. Nokia had internally whatever they wanted and also had the ability to license multiple other operating systems. Throwing away in virtually one night all the work that they had done with Symbian, Maemo/Meego and whatever else was something that one should put Elop to stand trial.

Even Samsung which now is the king of the mill with Android, is always looking for alternatives (they have internally Bada and are involved in the name-of-the-jour Linux flavor Meego, they use Android, Windows etc).

Nokia had massive R&D. What do they have now? How can they be at the forefront again? By simply putting together a nice package? Come on...

It is just a shame to see the demise of a company like that...

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Anonymous Coward

The Gadget Show

TV's Gadget Show anointing the £150 midget gem as the best budget smartphone and even the best Windows phone.

Follow the marketing money, via the sponsors.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: The Gadget Show

Currys and PC world are currently the sponsors of the Gadget show. How many phones do they sell? What is their interest in pushin MS' phone OS?

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Anonymous Coward

Re: The Gadget Show

Indeed! A show that is bookended by Windows Phone adverts - is it any surprise they gushed over the 620? The Gadget Show is purely for entertainment, it long ago stopped being a worthwhile or credible show that reviewed gadgets.

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Meh

N9

"all the while the long-slated successor Meego failed to arrive"

Either this sentence misses 'to' somewhere in the middle (preferably right before 'Meego'), or the author never heard of the N9. It got very good reviews and was promptly killed by restricting the countries where it was available.

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(Written by Reg staff) Silver badge

Re: N9

"the author never heard of the N9"

Rest assured, we have.

C.

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Happy

My WP7

I have to laugh at all the people who don't like the Windows Phone. Even my "old" 7.5 HTC Titan is pretty awesome. I have used Blackberry and Droid phones, and would never again. I refuse to pay Apple to join the Cult, so I have to be honest and admit I cannot compare user experiences. The whole App comparisson is a bit over blown though, and I can sum it up this way: search the Apple and Google app ecosystem for "weather" and see how many hundreds, if not thousands, of apps come up. I believe Apple and Google could easily have 10 times as many weather apps as Microsoft - but all 3 platforms can get Weather.com's app and a bunch of others, and all 3 can get the weather information needed.

I have also noted Microsoft's Phone OS includes a bunch of features that other OS platforms have Apps for. I was at dinner a couple of friends, one with an iPhone, one with a Droid, and my with my Windows Phone, when a song started playing. We could not remember the name of the familiar tune, so they started talking about their cools apps for that - I just hit my search button and tapped the microphone and it was found. No app, built-in. Similarly I have a UPC/Picture/Book title type function, hit seach, and the camera icon and it finds it. No app needed, again, built-in.

Best of all? So far my phone is rock-solid stable, and no update has broken a single thing. My phone doesn't crash/spontaneously reboot (Droid?!) and my last updates didn't break my phone or enterprise mail systems (Apple?!). You keep you million apps and market share, I will keep the best phone I have ever used.

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Facepalm

Poweruser?

The reason why the new BBs will sell like hot cakes is that they bothered to come out with a product that "powerusers" crave: One with a physical keyboard.

A touch-only device can never keep up with that. I use Swype on my N9 (still the best touch phone in existence and possibly also one of the worst "political" fuckups ever) which makes for a very good crutch but it is still not the same and it makes for a completely different writing experince. Touch keyboards without Swype? No. Just no. You can still pick up the E6 and E72 for a reason. Running Symbian. Ha.

BB will likely also let people do all sorts of stuff they expect from a "powerusers" device such as proper BT file transfer and all the other nasty worky stuff. You know, the stuff you used to take for granted on Symbian and MeeGo devices and that nobody at MS botherted to implement since "hey, Apple doesn't do that".

Let's all hope for Jolla not to screw up.

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Oh yes, real keyboards are nice. Even the small ones are a lot better than pure touch.

OTOH pure touch ist (thankfully) dying again with the new Atom-based penables. And if having to choose between a 7'' mail client (as nice as QNX is - used in the early 1990s) or a 10'' tablet pc - I lug around the tablet pc. With 3G (or external router) it can replace smartphone and notebook.

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WTF?

Welcome to the Muppet Show

Does anyone else think that Eadon & Dogged are the Waldorf & Stadler of Vulture Central?

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Meh

Re: Welcome to the Muppet Show

Upvoted.

I should really just let him spew his bile everywhere and either never read comments or find a different site, I guess. The sad part is once upon a time, I would probably have agreed with him (although not with his rampant obsession). At age 43 with less idealism and more realism, I can admit that I was wrong about MS. They're just a company that makes and sells software and Bill Gates is not the devil; he's a man doing his best for people. The older I get and the more I learn, the more I think that even Steve Ballmer is just a guy who loves Microsoft (I don't think this can be argued, actually) and just wants it to make the best stuff.

Oddly, I prefer that to a company that collects and sells data about people so although I can't see that I'll ever replace linux/debian as OS/distro of choice, the whole new "ANDROID IS THE WAY AND THE TRUTH" thing disturbs me. For a start, it's the least "open" linux distro ever created.

Second, its job is to be spyware. I'll take MS over that any day of the week. At least they don't pretend their code is open source.

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Re: Welcome to the Muppet Show

At the end of the day the question is: Did the gear what I wanted for a resonable price and with good stability. If yes - everything is fine. iOS can not deliver, Android can not deliver. Maybe WP8 can.

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Re: Welcome to the Muppet Show

you are not as technical

Jesus, son. Get over yourself. You have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. You don't know me and you don't what I do. And I never see anything technical from you. Just product evangelism. You're like the Barry Scott of linux, if Barry Scott kept busting in on everyone else's ads too.

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Lumia 820 rocks even easy to fix.

Just last week my wife broke the screen on her Lumia 820, thought it was the end of the world, she had to suffer an olde button handset for 3 days while it was fixed.

On the plus side it was an easy, relatively cheap fix, dropped it off at a local Nokia repair center they ordered the outer layer touch part of the screen fixed it up all for 70euros. The service guy said the phone is lovely to repair and really serviceable.

She is now happy, just raves about the phone, even droid and iphone users really like the package.

Their is a lot of old button phone users and this is where the Lumia 620 comes in, Nokia just needs to believe in the product and flood the worldwide market at the right price with the device and it will sell, Windows phone 8 is the best OS when upgrading from an olde push button phone.

Apple have nothing at the 150euro price point, all almost all the Android devices are cheap and nasty; the horrible Samsung Ace comes to mind.

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Mushroom

Nokia 2008 annual earnings €74bn???

Nokia, the most profitable company ever!! €74bn earnings on a €50.7bn turnover in 2008. Now, that's impressive! It would yield a 146% Return on Sales... No wonder Apple wanted to get in on this market. In fact the US government would prefer to start selling mobile phones than printing money.

Where did you find these numbers?? In fact Nokia's turnover was down by 1% and profit down by 38% compared to 2007.

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"During what I call the "years of madness" - sweeping from Nokia's peak in 2007* to the Elopocalypse - good reviews were rare. "

What does rare mean? What is a good review? The Nokia N900 received with very, very favorable reviews. Complaints were about it not being launched by Nokia in the UK, US etc. There were even a gray imports for the N900. It's swipe interface received a lot of positive attention, as did it's one piece, machined shell.

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Thumb Down

You've got to be joking!

Wake me up when Windows Phone 8 can do everything that Windows Mobile 6 could do, like USB cable sync with Outlook Notes, Tasks, Calendar and Contacts. What moron decided that users didn't want ActiveSync/Windows Mobile Device Center functionality any more?

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Mushroom

Re: You've got to be joking!

Welcome to the 21st Century. No need for cables anymore, or syncing via your email client. It's over the air and direct to the email server these days....

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