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back to article People just not that into Blu-ray

Winning the next-gen DVD format war turns out to be a bit like getting crowned "most popular stench." Blu-Ray may have overwhelmed the competition, but that doesn't mean folks plan to invite it into their home. Although nearly half of Americans now own a high definition television, the overwhelming majority show little interest …

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Flame

Ah the memories.....

Is it just me or are these pretty much the same arguments we heard when dvds where introduced 20 quid for a disc wtf i can buy the vhs for a fiver etc. Anyone who has a decent HD tv in my book should be getting new releases on bluray the difference in picture and sound is more than worth it, rereleases meh for the most part they're dissappointing but Blade Runner looks amazing on br. I do seem to remember reading that bluray pickup rates where around 50% higher than that of dvd but thats most likely the ps3's fault.

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Bronze badge
Alert

I don't get all this HD stuff!

Everyone is jumping on the HD bandwagon, HD this and that, but 90% of the HD offerings I have seen are just ports from earlier releases! What's the point in having HD is the content was shot in normal quality?!

I recently bought Xbox 360 and HD gaming is a great step up, I never realised what I was missing until I upgraded my old original Xbox 3 months ago, but HD TV and DVD, give me a break, it ain't worth it!!!

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Paris Hilton

Why bother?

I haven't bought a film on DVD in years, purely because while all the films coming out these days are big special-fx laden blockbusters, they're not exactly up to repeat viewing. They're one off escapist movies, which they do well, but I need something a bit more than amazingly expensive fx to make a movie worthy of repeat viewings.

Add to that the fact that I am perfectly happy with standard DVD quality, and the fact that I can get HD or near-HD quality videos off the net at any time I want, why would I want to shell out for an expensive player which takes expensive discs?

Paris, because her movie is worthy of repeat viewings.

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£30 or £3?

When buying a film, I buy Blu-ray where possible. But at £30 per movie, it's friggin expensive. The DVD upscaling on my PS3 is good enough for a lot of movies anyway (at least the ones that I don't warrant as 'good enough' to bother with full HD).

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@Ben Norris

"Thanks to the miracles of digital as long as the signal gets there it will be perfect so those £80+ HDMI cables that the likes of Currys and Comet try to sell you are absolutely pointless."

Not so fast there. For short cable runs between devices with decent quality transmit and receive hardware, an el-cheapo cable will work just fine. Start trying to send digital data across longer lengths, from a device which isn't quite as good at generating a clean signal, or to a device which isn't quite as good at pulling a valid data stream out of the received signal, as they could be, and you start to learn that even in the digital world, there are still times when you need to pay more for the bits of wet string linking your devices together.

It's not just a question of getting the signal to the other end of the cable, it's a question of getting it there without distorting it so much that the receiver can't pull anything intelligible from it - when it comes to sending signals down a bit of copper wire, especially at high bit rates, the analogue world has a nasty habit of gatecrashing the supposedly perfect digital party. So whilst I'd be happy to predict that in the majority of cases, people buying expensive HDMI cables *are* being ripped off by dodgy salesdroids, there are some situations where higher quality cables are absolutely essential.

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I'm just an average Joe

I bought a portable CD player in 1986 because the quality was awesome compared to my portable tape player.

I bought a DVD player because the quality was far superior to VHS

But blueray? Yeah the quality is a bit better but nowhere near the extent to justify ditching my collection of DVD's for BR.

I need to have the same massive leap to even think for a second about replacing my film collection. My DVD has a sharp picture, lovely sound and that will do ta.

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Paris Hilton

...Width

While I agree there is a perfectly acceptable HD experience to be had online by streaming ,and even that this may well be the last physical format. There is something nice about having a physical product in your hand that you feel you own outright as opposed to data on a storage device. Digitally delivered content is a great concept especially for HDD manufacturers as people will shift to buying Hard drives for storage rather than the discs the media used to come on.

I can see a future of people carrying large suitcases full of HDD' around rather than their selection of discs.

Apart from all of the above ,this whole concept is at the mercy of the ISP's in reality.

Anyone in the UK and unfortunate enough to on Virgin Media knows all to well about their evil throttling rules, even thinking about downloading a Blu-Ray worth of Data on Virgin is just madness. ISP's simply arent ready to provide the bandwidth needed for reliable effective mass data delivery.

Paris because even she would like more ...width

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Withnewspaper and I

The "buy all your favourite films... again" bandwagon has arrived at platform 2.0, Absurdville station.

I bought a newspaper a week ago for a free copy of Withnail and I. What was on the back of the DVD sleeve? "Buy this film on Bluray from the whateverth of June/July".

Yes, they actually gave away the *entire film* on DVD as an advert for the Bluray disc.

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@Lex 2 Re Pricey

I don't think 'old' movies are cheap, they are only cheap if the media maffia have produced too many of them and now they are trying to shift them.

I picked up the 1958 (1959?) version of the war of the worlds in a "major high street retailer" for 4.99 some time ago, the Tom Cruise version come out and the "major high street retailer" bumps the price of the '58 version up to 17.99.... WTF.... Greedy Bastards

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Paris Hilton

Hmm

@ Thecowking "I don't know where you guys are shopping but I've not paid anything close to that for any of my BDs yet, I think the most expensive one was £12."

Agreed mate. I haven't bought any BR film for more than 14.99 (aside from Planet Earth, but that was a Chrimbo present!)

I certainly wouldn't expect anyone to rebuy their entire collection! It's not for that, unless you have money to burn. No, it's more for us film-fans that want to see it in pristine condition. I have a couple of films that have been cleaned up to the point it looks like it was filmed yetserday rather than 30-60 years ago. True, they could release a compressed version on DVD, but that is a step back. The more compression technology improves (as it does), the less likely BR will survive. But come on! A downloaded film from any corporate entity versus a BR (or even DVD!) is still not reasonable! A quick look places a downloadable film at between 8-13 pounds.. 13 pounds?! (ref: iTunes). I think I would prefer to either pay for a DVD instead of a pint, or pay the extra (the cost of a pint, remembering that the mythical £25 is ..er.. mythical) ..

Me, I have a hybrid of streamed movies, DVD, and BR. The streamed ones being ripped off a DVD for ease of use. This model also is how I do Music; never download as it's still cheaper to buy a CD (generally)

Peace

Paris, because she's cheap

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@Citizen Kaned

"@"BD movies insist I watch all the crap the studios/publishers/whatever shove on the front of every movie - so I have no control" - you mean like DVDs do? or do you watch too many copies to remember this?"

Umm, rather than assume anyone who doesn't enjoy sitting through enforced trailers, FBI/FACT warnings etc. must be watching dodgy DVDs, how about considering that they are probably using a DVD player which simply ignores all the restrictions baked into the disc, and allows the user to skip these annoyances... How many Blu-ray players offer a similar level of control to their users, hmm?

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Flame

@The Fuzzy Wotnot

And this is where your lack of understanding of modern technology fails you.

1/ You bought an Xbox. Bad move, as it's only slightly more "HD" than a Wii (despite what Microsoft want you to believe). It never started as even a HD console, with HD being added it as a afterthought, and even now only has a handful of proper (not upscaled) titles. 8 titles at last count (PS3 has 38).

2/ Old movie content on 35mm film still has 4x more resolution than even Blu-Ray, so you are still getting more resolution for your money than the SD release,. And for the idiots that think the difference is between £3 and £30, do you buy your Blu-Ray from Harrods and your DVD from jumble sales?

http://www.avforums.com/forums/high-definition-tv-hardware/185820-what-resolution-movies-recorded.html

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Life span

So, the DVD in the same point in it's development was suffering the exact same problems. the discs were over-prices, blah blah blah.

Dvd has been in my household for the last 10 years... in those ten years, we've seen prices of DVD discs drop from £20 to circa £7.99 for alot of new releases, Bluray will go exactly the same.

As for loading times - Theres almost no difference between the last dvd I bought and the last Bluray I bought - I'm playing both through my PS3.

I must be in the minority that enjoy the Bluray experience.

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@the fuzzy wotnot

"What's the point in having HD is the content was shot in normal quality?!"

Anything originally shot on 35mm film, is in HD already. The problem is poor quality film that has either degraded over time, or was pretty bad quality to start with. These need a lot of restoration work before being released, to clean them up. Ironically, they are in much higher definition than films, like the newer star wars, that were shot digitally.

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HD-DVD

Having just bought an XBOX 360 Elite in preference to a PS3 I'll soon be investing on a HD-DVD drive for the XBOX. The way I see it is I'll be able to pick up a whole load of cheap movies which I can enjoy in 720p (only got a 720p telly) and then when the price of Bluray comes down to near DVD prices (I mean the players and the discs) then I'll get either a Bluray player or PS3.

I'm not convinced that download are going to take off just yet (even with 20 Meg broadband on Virgin it still takes a while to download 4GB of data) but maybe in a couple of years when the speeds go up a bit (say to 50/75/100 Meg) then I can see it happening.

Rob

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Very little worth watching

I bought a big HDTV a couple of weeks ago, and feeling that I ought to experience some proper HD on it I started researching bluray players. But then I had a look through all the blu-ray discs currently on sale on Play and Amazon, and there are probably no more that 10 that I would take even if offered to me for free! So many recent shit hollywood c-list films, so few classics that a film enthusiast who might be tempted to invest in a premium format would care to watch - whoever is in charge of deciding what gets released needs firing, into a brick wall.

So I've concluded i will not waste money on a bluray player, but might get a PS3 for use as a media pc which will handle discs and stream all my downloaded content, and may even get me back into playing games.

As for what i've actually been watching on my new TV, mostly low and standard quality downloads, and freeview. I've not even bothered to put a dvd, the best quality source available to me, on yet.

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Coat

It's people like you wot cause unrest

I've not seen any "adult features" in Blu-Ray, I want my money shots without flicker and so clear I can see it sticking to eye lashes.

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hmm part II (REDUX)

@"I have a PS3, I had it with a bog standard CRT for a good year. I finally decided I wanted to free up the 2ft by 5ft space my jumbo CRT took in the living room and bought a flat screen. Obviously I bought a HD Samsung. The only difference between playing GTA with and without a HD connection is that I can read the text clearer going through HDMI." -man! your eyes MUST be BAD!

ps3 SD = 30HZ

ps3 HD = 60Hz.

that ie enough to make me want to move. the ps3 on SD is terrible. i guess its due to the samsung TV (they are all crap, the ones i have seen anyway - we have 5 here at work :() their monitors suck too. and to be honest GTA is a crappy looking blurry game. try some of the 1080p games, they will blow you away! or even something like tomb raider (new one) looks better than 90% of CGI films lol!

@"Your eyes cannot tell the difference between a DVD and a Blu-Ray disc, anyone who says they can is lying to save face because they think they're stupid for not being able to tell the difference." - as before. get rid of that crappy samsung and get a decent 1080p 24fps dropdown TV. the quality increase is massive.

people are also missing the much better quality sound aspect, althouigh i guess many people still use the TV speakers?

@"1) I have yet to see any HD/BluRay movie show a better picture quality than my current, standard TV.

2) Sound is way, WAY more important than picture

3) Too bloody expensive (players and discs)

4) Too much DRM

5) Why waste money on BluRay when 3D is 'round the corner?

I'll probably buy an HD telly once my current one dies, but only because that'll be what I can get; not because HD is any better."

come round to one of our houses who have a decent rig then. and read my above point about sound quality, much sharper, althouigh i have a decent set of speakers all round my lounge.

everyone here moans abouy DRM, yet the next piratebay article we will see all your names coming up with downloading crappy qualiuty movies and music. remember its the pirates than necessitate DRM. you cause it yourself. and btw - BR on PS3 - if i stick the disk in, then turn on the tv the movie is ready by the time i sit down. wow, what a major inconvenience. to be honest its better than the crappy piracy bullshit you see at the start of all legit DVDs (that you cant skip either)

@""My best friend has gone back to watching VHS and I don't blame him! He can watch a film or a tv show and stop it come back to it a few days later and pick up exactly where he left off! How many people can do that with their DVD's or Blu-Ray? Not many."" - erm. any decent dvd player for the last 10 years will do this. the ps3 can remember too.

@"I recently bought Xbox 360 and HD gaming is a great step up, I never realised what I was missing until I upgraded my old original Xbox 3 months ago, but HD TV and DVD, give me a break, it ain't worth it!!!" so, gaming in 720i or whatever is amazing by the same movie in 1080p is no difference? way to contradict yourself there!

@"Umm, rather than assume anyone who doesn't enjoy sitting through enforced trailers, FBI/FACT warnings etc. must be watching dodgy DVDs, how about considering that they are probably using a DVD player which simply ignores all the restrictions baked into the disc, and allows the user to skip these annoyances... How many Blu-ray players offer a similar level of control to their users, hmm?" - fair point. i have never seen one that can skip PUO stuff. i cant even FF some on DVDs! in fact is PUO a directive from the DVD authors? what dvd player does this? or is it a PC one (i can skip as i use anydvd on my home machine... but have never found a bit of dvd s/w on a pc that comes close to a standalone dvd player/ps3 etc.

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Jobs Horns

Blu-Pay

I think there would be a higher margin of sucess if it wasn't for the recession, consumers are keeping there wallets closed because they believe the media who have told people 'money is scarce' and 'wait it will get cheaper'. If the media had told people to 'spend spend spend while it's cheap' then we may have moved a lot further on than we have done.

Ideally Blu-Ray needs to drop in price to DVD costs and DVD's need to drop in price to bargain bin prices. This might encourage people to take the plunge and buy a blu-ray player. This is unlikely to happen as DVD and Blu-Ray are still competing markets, DVD prices will continue to tail Blu-Ray prices while greed still drives their premium cost. Now, is this because the HD battle has been won and our corporate owners think we need to now pay for our support, or is it simply just driven by greed so that they can get whatever they can?

Oh well, I'm sure this could get talked about all day.

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Unhappy

economic

its the economy too. Who is willing to splurge on new tech when old is good enough?

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Bod

China threat

"If the Chinese invade with a lesser-DRM'ed über-HD format of their own choosing"

They're pushing CBHD now. China Blue High Definition.

Guess what CBHD is?

Yes, it's HD DVD, rebranded! And Warner are signed up already.

Even the players look identical to the Tosh line up, right down to the menus!

(however the codecs are a little different, but that's down to China not wanting to pay for expensive codec licenses so they developed their own /ripped-off new codecs. Blu-Ray was a non-starter due to the massive licence costs and restrictions).

Really I see it as whatever China can pump out cheap vs Downloads/Streaming. 5 to 10 years from now that is. At the moment HD is a non-starter for most.

Even Sky HD is failing big time with very buggy boxes and still a £10 a month additional sub.

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Blu-ray

Blu-ray is an amazing technology. Peope are probably not initially purchasing players as they are waiting for them to come down in price further, and the price of purchasing movies to lower too.

I have had a player for nearly a year now, and most of my movie purchases are in Blu-ray format also, because there simply is no comparison in picture quality.

I don't download movies. I just couldn't be bothered. I prefer the aesthetic quality of putting a disc into a player, and hitting the play button, same as I prefer to buy audio CDs also. The quality just isn't there when you download a movie, and especially the audio quality. Couple that with the fact of having to buy bigger hard drives, and then keep buying them to store all of the movies you download. Then you have the issue of streaming them to your HD TV. No thanks!

Blu-ray is the king!

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Blu-ray changed my viewing habits

I used to buy about 50% of the DVDs I watched. Now, I don't see the reason to buy an old format and since I don't have a Blu-ray player yet there is no sense in buying the new discs. Instead, my AppleTV collection is growing. Same DRM crap but at least I can watch the movies on any computer in the house as well, instead of having to buy yet another drive. If I need to see a movie as soon as it's released on DVD (iTunes is usually a month behind) I go to TPB.

Thanks, Blu-ray. If it wasn't for your expensive players and discs I'd still be buying DVDs.

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pointless

There is such a thing as on-demand. And it is avaialble in hd. And for a tenth of the price of a blu ray disc you watch the movie you want when you want.... Most movies you will watch only once anyway ... no point in having the disc.

physical storage is dead. streaming is the new thing.

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Silver badge

RE: hmm part II (REDUX)

"remember its the pirates than necessitate DRM. you cause it yourself."

Wow, you live on what exactly planet?

FYI, DRMs are not meant to fight piracy - piracy is an annoying but acceptable side-effect. The DRMs are there to control how and when you use the content. If you control that, you can charge the user for any new way he could find to watch your movie, you can restrict the number of times the content is watched, you can withdraw your permission to watch the content completely, forcing the user to pay for it again.

Unless your idea of piracy includes such things as watching a movie while skipping the ads, watching at home a movie you bought in another country, watching a movie you bought on any other device of your choice, piracy has really, absolutely nothing to do with DRMs.

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Anonymous Coward

Am I noticing a trend here?

No one wants to upgrade from XP to Vista / Windows 7, most common reason given - "XP works just fine for me, don't need to upgrade and don't want your pointless bloat and DRM"

People don't want to change from DVD to BD, most common reason given - "DVDs work just fine for me, don't need to upgrade and don't want your pointless bloat and DRM"

OK, its only two things, hardly a trend, but is it the way things are at the moment? There has been no huge improvement in the products on offer.

People expect better, not more of the same but with chains attached.

The last thing I bought that actually made things better than they were before was a Thompson DVR / Freeview Box that I bought in 2004.

Since then everything on offer has been a new version of a previous product with no real improvement on the last.

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Silver badge

If..

Bluray players were a price where someone who needs a new DVD player would think ' thats not so much more and its future proof' then they would sell more. Even if the end user doesn't intend to buy Bluray disks just yet.

I would - if they made a wall mounted one that would attach to the wall next to my wall mounted TV.

BTW, what media player do people here use? Want to dump all my DVD so can stream from a PC on to TV's around the house. (Wireless if possible)

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LOL, the Toshiba loonies are out.

The 100 people still hurt by HD DVD and havn't moved on, clearly all got emailed and have arrived here to pretend Blu-Ray sucks...

The funny thing, the HD DVD loonies claimed they cared about HD and were videophiles, clearly they aren't, or they would have embraced Blu-Ray by now.

PS, clearly many people havn't heard of managed copy...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advanced_Access_Content_System#Managed_Copy

Many discs already have this, allowing you to make SD copies of the HD movie you own, and copying them to portable devices like the PSP and iPod. I have about 4 disc that have it so far, I expect more to arrive, as companies want to justify the small price increase over DVD.

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Got both - still prefer HD-DVD

No region coding and all players came with a network port as standard in case a firmware update was needed.

A good number of the budget (hah!) Blu-Ray players out there are old models with the older profile and no network port to update the software. They're also glacially slow to use. Apart from the PS3, even the latest Blu-Ray players are pains to use. One or two minutes to get as far as the first screen seem to be standard. Then that screen is the unskippable 'You thieving bastard' copyright warning. After that, I think Disney hold the record in requiring a further TWELVE button presses to get to the main menu.

As for the movies - yes some of them look amazing in Blu-Ray - especially animation; but for the average brain-dead kickboxing cyborg timetraveller movie that's about the limit of my intellectual capacity these days, DVD will do nicely thank you very much.

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Just say NO to BluPay

@Efros - Paris cos she knows when she's been rogered... repeatedly!

Dang, and she told me I was the first....

@Version 1.0 - Whores aren't always welcome at the dinner table.

Interesting that you didn't say they are NEVER welcome. That must mean that they ARE welcome sometimes. Erm....

@goggyturk - even the missus can see the difference, and she's a total luddite.

Not sure how you ended up with my missus, but send 'er home mate.

@geejayoh - People were forced / coerced into moving their movie collections to DVD and now that's only just about finished.

Don't I wish, but I haven't won the lottery yet. Still have about 100 VHS tapes at home and doubt that all of them are even available on DVD. I'll give up my VHS and DVD when they pry it out of my cold, dead hands....

As far as I'm concerned, the additional DRM on BluPay and the machines is a deal-breaker from now until forever.

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I guess I'm in the minority.

I'll add my voice to the "few" number of people in this thread who've posted that they actually like Blu-ray.

@The Avangelist: "Your eyes cannot tell the difference between a DVD and a Blu-Ray disc, anyone who says they can is lying to save face because they think they're stupid for not being able to tell the difference."

That is a deliberatively provocative statement, and quite false. I can quite easily tell the difference on my TV. From DVD to Blu-ray is as different as VHS to DVD. Especially if you have a Blu-ray movie that's actually been produced correctly - as opposed to many that are just whipped off in the format but without any particular attention to doing a good job with it. This is not me just being "stupid" but an objective and empirical statement. There are movies that I've watched in both DVD and Blu-ray. With the Blu-ray I've been able to read text on signs in the background that cannot be read on the DVD version.

I only buy Blu-ray at this point, and the movies I currently own on DVD that I consider to be the best I am slowly converting over. (Others I will just keep on DVD.)

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FAIL

Reasons tp be cheerful

"With the Blu-ray I've been able to read text on signs in the background that cannot be read on the DVD version."

Sorry mate but if that's the best reason you can think of for justifying the existence of Bluray then the industry has definitely ost the plot.

(yes I have seen Planet Earth in HD on a decent setup, right next to the same setup playing it on DVD. Yes it was impressive. No I didn't think it worth spending money on).

Ooh look, new improved icons. Let's see, this one seems appropriate

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@The Avangelist

"My best friend has gone back to watching VHS and I don't blame him! He can watch a film or a tv show and stop it come back to it a few days later and pick up exactly where he left off! How many people can do that with their DVD's or Blu-Ray? Not many."

I bought one of the first DVD players released, a sony, and it had the ability to store the position in up to 9 films I believe. That's around 1997.

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Anonymous Coward

Heh

I never had the money to get into laserdisc, so DVD was a godsend to me. Movies in their OAR at a decent price, with lots of great extra features that I could watch on my computer. I spent all my money on them, and have a nice little collection now.

There is no reason for me to upgrade. If I ever get a TV and want to buy a player, I might then, and just buy newer films on Bluray, but I can't even remember the last time I bought a newer movie... maybe about a year ago?

Also, I hate the cases they come in, go figure.

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Boffin

Being an audiophile...

...I swapped to Bluray as soon as it was released.

The mere $15,000 for a top-line player was definitely worth it, and the $9,750 cables were an absolute must - conventional interconencts just can't handle the data-rate of Bluray, and introduce unwanted quantum bit-shift.

The iridium-osmium disc storage cabinet also helps keep my collection pristine - of course I took all my old DVDs straight down to the local high-temperate incinerator and had them vaporised; even tiny particles of remaining DVD could permanently un-balance my delicate viewing room setup.

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WTF?

hmmm....

for the idiots who compare bluray to upscaled dvd:

http://fwd.five.tv/videos/news-bluray-vs-dvd-upscale

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too pricey for what it gives

also take into accoutn the recession. Also, you can get sky hd box free. VirginMedia box half price plus loads of channels, plus FreeSat. All of them are better value for money than buying a blu-ray player and discs. I'll hold back until i can buy a plyer for 50 quid or less and must be elegant :-), or hti 2 birds wiht oen stoen and get a PS3 or Xbox. Both better value than current Blue-ray players

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Anonymous Coward

Fool me once...

Problem for BD is twofold, first, the normal marketing curve (innovators>early adopters>mass market>laggards) for digital media has been broken; all those innovators and early adopters have already made the jump to downloads (illegally or otherwise) or streaming, rendering their BD device redundant (I use my PS3 almost exclusively for playing back downloaded content - I probably own 10 BD discs max), even if the quality isn't as good as BD (a lesson the film and TV industries should have learned from music; for the majority of people, availability trumps quality). Without these ealry adopters telling friends and family to get BD, all the marketing in the world won't help BD succeed.

The second problem is that the adoption curve for HD TVs has hit the mass market, but the mass market wouldn't know HD content if it bit them on the arse - most people assume if their TV says "HD enabled" that's what they're getting. The most salutary lesson for me was showing my (Luddite) brother the difference between SD and HD by flicking between a ITV SD and HD football broadcast using the red button on my Freesat box; the direct comparison was what it took for him to get the point of HD.

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FAIL

re: China threat

Is this guy for real? Still clinging onto the HD DVD dream....

even IF CHDVD makes it outside China, it will be Chinese movies. I suspect you will be wanting hollywood movies however.

Sometimes I am saddened by the clueless idiots that post here.

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Welcome

@Being an audiophile

You forgot to mention your collection of original P W Belt accessories: silver rainbow foil, one drop liquid, CD pens, etc.

http://www.belt.demon.co.uk/index.html

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re: too pricey for what it gives

You realise the Xbox doesn't do Blu-Ray? Infact it barely does HD, which was tacked on as a afterthought,

Many Xboxes don't even have HDMI, and the ones that do, use a old obsolete version that does not do audio.

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Bod
FAIL

Re: LOL, the Toshiba loonies are out.

And someone gave blu-ray.com the nod to send their rabid fanatical evangelists over here ;)

But anyway, as for Managed Copy. You realise that Managed Copy was a Mandatory part of the HD DVD spec (just the technology wasn't realised to enable it) and it was actually Blu-Ray that included an additional feature which allowed studios to optionally disable, time limit or restrict it in their own way? Blu-Ray of course also ties the copies to selected Blu-Ray licenced portable devices, namely those made by Sony and Apple. HD DVD was all set to be part of Vista, Media Center and Home Media Server, allowing streaming around the house and storage on NAS systems on the most popular (by far) home operating system in the world. Still. Made your bed, etc ;)

@Mark 9 -Who is the more foolish if you can't see just how important China is to the western world when it comes to electronics? Where do you think all the £20 DVD players are made? In fact, even the named branded hardware and even Japanese kit including Sony. All made in China, or source from Chinese components and rebranded.

Which ones live the longest? Yep, the ones that the Chinese can knock out by the millions for peanut prices. Blu-Ray that aint.

Not saying though that CBHD will get anywhere outside of China, but it's likely to be more successful however than Blu-Ray (remember just how many people live there!).

It is relevant because if Chinese manufacturers don't see the point in Blu-Ray manufacture, then it's game over for Blu-Ray. No one else can produce the stuff in the quantity required, especially if you want cheap enough prices to make it a success.

Long term though, it's downloads baby :-)

You can argue who'd wait for a download, but frankly even the slow P2P illegal downloads of decently watchable quality HD movies can come down the wire on a 2mb connection overnight faster than it takes Royal Mail to deliver a shiny disc. If you've experienced the speed of iPlayer's offline downloads when served up by ISPs that provide the infrastructure, you can see how it can be faster still for legit downloads.

Enjoy shiny discs while they last :-)

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FAIL

2 things

Have kept me from getting a blu-ray player. Firstly: far too expensive on the media. It annoyed me when DVDs came out that they cost so much more than VHS tapes, despite being cheaper to manufacture. I only upgraded because VHS was such bad quality. Even then I didn't replace my old collection. The same was true for Vinyl to CDs (I remember Vinyl costing £6 an album, and CD started at over £10 an album. Yes, Blu-Ray looks better than upscaled DVDs, but not double the price better.

Secondly: I will never ever buy a region encoded device again as long as I live. I recently moved to the US from the UK and brought over my entire DVD collection. When I went to buy a new Hi-Fi setup, I spent hours choosing a receiver, hours more listening to speakers, just as long selecting a big HD TV. Then I went to the DVD section of the store and asked for all the upscaling multi-region capable DVDs. I had a choice of 1. Which cost $40. I would have happily paid $500 for a really good device, but my one must-have requirement was multi-region, so they didn't get the expensive sale they could have done. Now I have a collection of DVDs that is mixed between region 1 and 2, so I will never again buy a region encoded device.

And interestingly, I'm not convinced that download will destroy physical media completely. Whilst you can download a movie faster than Royal Mail can deliver, it becomes harder when you want the whole of Buffy the Vampire Slayer. It is harder still when you want something to watch on a plane. Or something to watch when your internet connection is down. And I wonder how many people are going to end up rebuying digital collections on a regular basis because of hard-drive crashes, and then decide to switch back to CDs or DVDs.

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FAIL

Mehhhhh Who cares?

I'd only buy a death ray recorder, if the burner was $50 or less and the disks were under a dollar; and only for backing up stuff into hard copy.

Beyond that - I have too much important stuff to do besides wasting my life watching crap from mostly greedy multinationals.

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