back to article I KNOW how to SAVE Microsoft. Give Windows 8 away for FREE – analyst

With the PC market sputtering and users still sour on Windows 8, Microsoft should consider giving its latest OS out for free, say analysts. According to IHS analyst Clifford Leimbach, a free update from Microsoft would help to win back the hearts and minds of consumers at a time when Microsoft finds itself in need of some …

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  1. Peter Gathercole Silver badge
    Joke

    Be better...

    ...offering a Win7 update at low cost to existing XP customers. Oh no, they're hoping that those customers will fork out for new machines, and count as new Windows 8 sales!

    Unfortunately, unless MS do this, many XP users will keep it until they can no longer log onto their on-line banking, and then there may be scope for persuading some of them to use something like Linux Mint (note, I'm in the process of defecting from Ubuntu to Mint Debian edition at the moment - trying to resist whims of Canonical [Unity and Mir] has finally persuaded me to jump).

    1. mmeier

      Re: Be better...

      Any hardware that runs XP and is powerful enough to run Win7 - will run Win8 even better since the system is faster/smaller

      Any user that requires new hardware to run W8 - will need that even more for W7.

      There is a very small group of cards and external hardware that rely on hardware components that only have XP drivers AND can not be replaced by more modern stuff. Those are about the only ones stuck with Win7 since that still supports the XP driver model.

  2. ElReg!comments!Pierre

    Of course it will change everything... oh wait

    So, let's say Windows 8 is available for free. We have a bunch of machines here that run reasonnably well under XP, it would be nice to upgrade them... what do you mean, "they won't run Windows 8"?

    Oh well, we'll buy new machines then, with Windows 8 for free they're gonna be cheap as chips, surely. What do you mean, "it only shaves $80 from the price"?

    Frankly I don't see a free Windows 8 giveaway making the slightest change in PC purchase decisions; it won't make a difference in "customer goodwill" as most customers have litterally no clue about the price of the OS; most don't even know that hardware and software are two different things. It could theoretically curb Linux and other Alt-OS adoption on the desktop, however I reckon most people who end up using a free OS instead of Windows do it for the free-as-in-freedom aspect, not for the free-as-in-beer one. Plus the numbers aren't exactly threatening for MS right now (as much as I regret it).

    You can't spell "analyst" without spelling "yst", it would seem. Oh look what Apple did now, surely I can sell an article saying MS are doomed if they don't do the same. After all these Apple chaps are pretty smart aren't they.

  3. Ian K
    Windows

    Got to admit...

    ...given the choice between continuing to use Windows 7 and upgrading to 8 (or 8.1) for free, I'd rather stay where I am.

    Offer to pay me to upgrade, *then* I might just consider it.

  4. Getriebe

    Win RT, maybe

    There are a rumours which I have heard from a couple of west coast sources that RT might become free.

  5. Anonymous Coward
    FAIL

    Uhm, no?

    The only way they'll manage to convince me to upgrade my Windows 7 environment to Windows 8 is by paying me for it. And I'm not talking about a free Windows 8 license with a nice complimentary gift of $120 or so, I'm talking annual payments for a duration of 6 months or so.

    Why? Because to me Windows 8 is a huge set back when it comes to work flow. Because I'm using Windows 7 both professionally and private the work flow has become a huge issue for me. I heavily use (and favour) the recent programs list for example; whenever I'm switching my activities from documenting to bookkeeping (both activities usually last a few days) it doesn't take longer than one working day for Word to get replaced by Excel in my start menu. Which means so much that from that point on I can simply click start, hover, and either start Excel (or Word) directly or use the jump list to open one of the previous (or pinned) documents.

    Windows 8? Click start, open the desktop application and then select from either Word or Excel because both would need to be pinned onto the taskbar.

    No, this isn't only about "beancounter work", it also concerns IT related tasks.

    I've mentioned this many times already, but I don't use Windows 7 as administrator, my user account has regular privileges. So in the event I need to check up my log files (event logs) or other system related tasks I more than often need to raise my privileges. It's easy: start -> hover -> system administration -> right click event logs and then "run as administrator".

    Windows 8? I know you can right click the start button (or start location) which gets you a context menu allowing you to select some administrative tasks, but because you're already in a context menu it does not allow you to use the "run as..." option.

    Sure; there are ways around this, I'm well aware. But the point here is that those workarounds are a whole lot more tedious than the way I use in my current environment of Windows 7.

    Can it get worse? Of course it can. PowerShell anyone? Awesome piece of work in my opinion, this is no sneer. To me PowerShell is the ultimate proof that if Microsoft sets its mind to it they really can come up with something good and awesome. I often use PowerShell to quickly check up on several servers which I maintain for work, but the thing is; because I'm accessing privileged sections I can only do so when starting this as administrator.

    On my Windows 7 PowerShell is pinned to the taskbar and I can right click on it any time I need. On Windows 8 there is no way to perform that task straight from the start screen; you need to go to the desktop before starting PowerShell. In all honesty it makes some sense considering that PowerShell is a "desktop application". But wasn't the start screen the ultimate and full replacement for the start menu? So why can't it cope with such trivial tasks?

    Alas; enough ranting.

    My point should be obvious: When using Windows 8 it takes me more time to complete several routines than it does on Windows 7. Now, I am willing to take the possibility into consideration that in time you might find other ways to achieve the same results (that is something I can't say for sure right now) as such I'd settle for an annual payment which only lasts 6 months.

    But just providing Windows 8 for free is not enough to make me switch.

    In fact; should I need a new computer right now I'd easily cough up the extra cash to get my hands on another Windows 7 license and would be more than willing to invest some time to replace the POS which is Windows 8 (in my opinion of course) with my trusty Windows 7.

    Just my 2 cents on the matter.

    1. TRT Silver badge

      Re: Uhm, no?

      Right click an executable in Windows 8... notice the "Add to start menu..." option?

      1. TRT Silver badge

        Re: Uhm, no?

        ""Add to start menu..." "

        My point being that this is a very crap piece of coding which hasn't really been tested very thoroughly at all. The start menu was probably removed last minute or something.

    2. Shagbag

      2 cents?

      ...more like a full dollar there.

      1. Getriebe

        Re: 2 cents?

        Mailer, Steinbeck, Foster-Wallace, Joseph McElroy (OK, cheap shot), Hemmingway, ShellLooser – all the great American novelists needed a good editor.

    3. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Uhm, no?

      Word, Excel and PowerShell pinned to your taskbar with jump lists in Windows 8 as with Windows 7. Why do you want to go to the start screen if like me you predominantly work with desktop apps?

      1. Roland6 Silver badge

        Re: Uhm, no?

        >Word, Excel and PowerShell pinned to your taskbar with jump lists

        I really dislike the confusion and clutter caused by pinning applications to the taskbar. To me the taskbar is my cache of active applications, the start menu my cache of frequently used applications and the "all programs" menu for those rarely used but organised so that I can find them. Also by pinning stuff to the taskbar, I find that the taskbar 'overflows' and hence goes into scroll mode with no real user control over which section of the menu any particular application is placed.

        The jump lists display of an miniature screen is of little real help and is quite slow to display, what is more helpful (and quicker) is the text popup's XP displays when you roll the cursor over items in the taskbar (being perverse I like my taskbar to run down the left-hand side of the screen, which then causes even more problems with the daft implementation of slide out menu's in win8).

        Yes for someone who uses there computer mainly for email, browsing and Skyping, pinning app's to the taskbar makes sense.

    4. Bill Gould

      Re: Uhm, no?

      Desktop icons? Arrange the start screen so the apps you allegedly use all the time are in the first column, first row? Better still, pin to taskbar and boot to desktop (Win8.1).

      There are no "productivity" issues using Windows 8 (or 8.1) except that people don't like change, and of course poorly written legacy software that you shouldn't be using anymore anyway. Even then, WinXP VM right in your desktop.

    5. Ken Hagan Gold badge

      Re: Uhm, no?

      "I'm talking annual payments for a duration of 6 months or so."

      I think that's the point where I lost the thread of your argument.

    6. Sandtitz Silver badge
      Boffin

      Re: Uhm, no?

      "On my Windows 7 PowerShell is pinned to the taskbar and I can right click on it any time I need. On Windows 8 there is no way to perform that task straight from the start screen; you need to go to the desktop before starting PowerShell."

      Wrong. Select the down arrow on the TIFKAM screen, right-click on Powershell and select Run As Administrator.

      Also, you can pin Powershell to the start screen on the same context menu.

      If you're a keyboard warrior like me, just start typing 'powershell' in the TIFKAM screen and you can launch programs much faster (IMHO) that way. Just like you could in 7/Vista.

  6. arctic_haze

    I have better idea

    Could we have a free downgrade to Windows 7?

    This could create some actual goodwill.

    1. Stoke the atom furnaces

      Re: I have better idea

      My wife has been driven mad by Windows 8 and 8.1 on her new laptop.

      A free copy of Windows 7 would be a good way for Microsoft to say "sorry" for the dogs breakfast that they made with the Windows 8 UI.

      1. Tachikoma

        Re: I have better idea

        [i]My wife has been driven mad by Windows 8 and 8.1 on her new laptop.[/i]

        Just install Classic Shell on her machine, takes two minutes, same applies for the epic wall of rant above.

        1. miket82

          Re: I have better idea (Classic Shell)

          And it's free.

        2. Stoke the atom furnaces

          Re: I have better idea

          Thank you for the tip - I will try it.

          Now if there were a "Classic Shell" to replace the ribbon on MS Office....

          1. Uncle Slacky Silver badge

            Re: I have better idea

            The only free method is to create a "ribbon" that looks exactly like the old menu - this company has done just that: http://www.ubit.ch/software/ubitmenu-languages/

      2. CLD

        Re: I have better idea

        Have a look at your OEM license... i'm pretty sure you have downgrade rights. If you really feel the need to install Win7, grab a win7 disk and run the install. When it gets to the licensing section of the install, you make have to call Microsoft to explain the situation and get a valid key, but I never had any issues with this in the past.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          downgrade rights on Pro

          As the title says, downgrade rights only come with Pro and Ultimate licenses.

          The £15 Win8 upgrade is a special case, it is not accompanied by downgrade rights.

          BTW the upgrade has another catch - the EULA says that you aren't permitted to revert to the OS that you are upgrading from (so I tried it on a Vista machine...)

      3. Roland6 Silver badge

        Re: I have better idea

        >A free copy of Windows 7 would be a good way for Microsoft to say "sorry"

        And make that an upgrade of Win8.n to Win7 (!) that doesn't require the user to do a full clean install...

  7. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    ... and stop trying to make one size fit all

    As well as the proposed strategy for the consumer market, MS could also, BUT QUITE SEPARATELY, offer the corporate market an evolutionary product line that does NOT entail ever more frequent revolutions which forces changes in User Interfaces (and associated traing and productivity), genuine backwards compatibility (so that a forced upgrade of the OS does not trigger a domino effect of changes to applications, utilities, etc.), and in-place feature upgrades (so that it is not necessary to throw numerous fully functional babies out with the bathwater when upgrading to a new (and deliberately different) version of the OS.

    There would be HUGE cost savings, both in corporate IT departments, and for corporate users who have to put up with successive disorienting and productivity slashing changes just because MS wants to seem innovative for other, quite different markets. The value to corporates would be considerable.

  8. McVirtual

    Pah!

    Unfortunately they CANNOT give away Windows 8.x due to all the people who have purchased it already and the refunds involved would cripple their EBITDA / share price.

    Maybe they should consider it for Windows 9

    1. John Tserkezis
      Coat

      Re: Pah!

      "Unfortunately they CANNOT give away Windows 8.x due to all the people who have purchased it already and the refunds involved would cripple their EBITDA / share price. Maybe they should consider it for Windows 9"

      Or perhaps they should consider continuing the free upgrade policy to 8.2, which finally fixes the abomination "formerly known as metro"?

      Oh, OK, I'll go now.

      1. Tony Paulazzo

        Re: Pah!

        Or perhaps they should consider continuing the free upgrade policy to 8.2

        This!

        In fact, if they don't do this then MS deserve everything they get. They should have done it for Vista to 7, generated a lot of good will and probably gotten a better response to the abomination that is 8, knowing we could trust 'em to fix it... eventually.

        DISCLAIMER I'm running a touchscreen netbook / tablet with Win8.1 full and don't hate it - spend most of my time on the desktop.

  9. Thomas Whipp

    The big issue for business is generally the effort involved in the migration - why do it if you aren't getting any benefit?

    Getting off XP due to end of life might be an argument, but if that also requires a new Exchange, Office, etc... then the direct cash cost for the desktop OS licence becomes a relatively small part of the overall bill. Its worse for companies with bespoke internal apps who have dev, testing costs and issues.

    Also as others have said, I'd have thought any move by MS to offer products for free would get a lot of regulatory scrutiny.

  10. Gene Cash Silver badge
    Stop

    I wonder what the Pirate Bay stats are

    I wonder if anyone is actually making the effort to pirate it. I have a feeling they aren't. Nobody I know would take Win8 for free.

    Anyway, Microsoft need to stop stepping on people's balls. I bought two copies of Windows 7... one with a new laptop and one I bought from NewEgg to run in a VM on Linux for work.

    Yes, I made the effort to buy it and be legal.

    So I had to reinstall the laptop because the SSD died, and instantly it said it was pirated, despite using the key straight from the sticker. Ditto for the VM install.

    I finally had to find and use a crack to use copies of Windows I bought.

    This is why I don't use Windows 8. Not because it's a shit OS (which it probably is, but I no longer care enough to even try it) but because Microsoft treats you like shit.

    1. Suricou Raven

      Re: I wonder what the Pirate Bay stats are

      To be shunned by pirates is the ultimate insult. A sign of a product so rubbish, it isn't even worth stealing.

      1. Peter Simpson 1
        Thumb Up

        Re: I wonder what the Pirate Bay stats are

        Damn Pirate Bay!

        Hated by all media producers, who nevertheless religiously watch the download numbers to see how their product stacks up against the competition.

        If they manage to put it out of business, the stats go away as well...so what to do?

        The media companies should form an association to *buy* and run Pirate Bay. It has everything anyone would ever want to download, all in one place. Charge a $10/month access fee. Profit! Of course, this would never happen, but it is fun to dream, especially when Netflix doesn't have the movie I want to watch.

      2. John Tserkezis

        Re: I wonder what the Pirate Bay stats are

        "To be shunned by pirates is the ultimate insult. A sign of a product so rubbish, it isn't even worth stealing."

        Just checked (a not very extensive check mind you), it's not that bad, Win8.1 sits at about 70% of the seeds available for Win7. Win8 is marginally better at about 77% of the seeds of Win7.

        I haven't factored in available time in the market, Win7 *has* had a good amount of time in the market, but then again, its uptake had been favourable after Vista, which isn't hard to understand considering...

        It's still very telling - not that bad - but still telling.

        (*) Disclaimer: All statistics are made up on the spot, I have no idea what pirate sites are, where I might find one (or many), I have no idea what the term "seed" means, especially in the context of torrents, of which I also have no idea what a torrent is, what it's used for, or what abomination will grow if you were to grow a seed in a torrent. What I *do* know, is whatever brand of horror that grows into, it can't be as bad as metro. I'm sorry, the "interface formerly known as metro", that's better.

    2. Bill Gould

      Re: I wonder what the Pirate Bay stats are

      "So I had to reinstall the laptop because the SSD died, and instantly it said it was pirated, despite using the key straight from the sticker. Ditto for the VM install.

      I finally had to find and use a crack to use copies of Windows I bought."

      No, you call the automated line and get a new key based on the digit string your PC gives you.

      1. John Tserkezis

        Re: I wonder what the Pirate Bay stats are

        "No, you call the automated line and get a new key based on the digit string your PC gives you."

        I did that once with an early version of office for a family friend.

        After punching in dozens of digits on the touch phone, and it insisting my string of digits were wrong, I installed a pirated copy. It worked, and it didn't piss me off.

        Nuff said.

  11. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Giving windows 8 away for free won't change anything.

    It is already free to all intents and purposes. Nobody willingly buys Windows. They just get it bundled when they buy a new PC.

    Windows 8 is so toxic that people have stopped buying PC's in order to avoid getting it. Many people who need a new PC are paying extra to have Windows 7 instead, so the cost is clearly not the issue.

    The best thing Microsoft could do is stop making radical changes to Windows. Most people's "ideal" operating system is fairly close to what they are already comfortable with. Consistency is the key. Making small incremental improvements results in a much better user experience than making wholesale changes that disrupt people's productivity by making them re-learn how to do the most basic simple operations on a computer.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Windows 8 is so toxic that people have stopped buying PC's in order to avoid getting it.

      Yeah, they've even decided they'd rather not even have a keyboard and instead use a "tablet" for their browsing needs. They'll happily pay over the odds for an iPad, all because they hate windows 8!!

    2. Richard Plinston

      > It is already free to all intents and purposes. Nobody willingly buys Windows. They just get it bundled when they buy a new PC.

      No, it is _not_ free. It happens that the price that is paid for Windows is included in the price of the computer. Just because you don't see that does not mean it doesn't exist.

      You may as well say "the CPU is free".

      1. This post has been deleted by its author

      2. John Tserkezis

        "No, it is _not_ free. It happens that the price that is paid for Windows is included in the price of the computer. Just because you don't see that does not mean it doesn't exist."

        Correct, it's not free, but it's not called the "Microsoft Tax" for nothing.

    3. Michael Habel
      Thumb Up

      THIS THIS THIS

      Giving windows 8 away for free won't change anything.

      It is already free to all intents and purposes. Nobody willingly buys Windows. They just get it bundled when they buy a new PC.

      Windows 8 is so toxic that people have stopped buying PC's in order to avoid getting it. Many people who need a new PC are paying extra to have Windows 7 instead, so the cost is clearly not the issue.

      The best thing Microsoft could do is stop making radical changes to Windows. Most people's "ideal" operating system is fairly close to what they are already comfortable with. Consistency is the key. Making small incremental improvements results in a much better user experience than making wholesale changes that disrupt people's productivity by making them re-learn how to do the most basic simple operations on a computer.

      LISTON TO THIS GUY HE SPEAKS TRUTH!

      1. Michael Habel

        Re: THIS THIS THIS

        And on that note... This could well apply to Mozilla too...

        Why they went and broke the "browser.download.use.ToolkutUI" in the latest Firefox 26 buggers belief!

        Why did they have to kill this?

  12. Rallicat

    We already got the 8.1 update for free - something that affected far more PC users than Mac users (yes, there are already more PC users out there running Windows 8 than the entire Mac install base).

    Should it be free for Windows 7 users too? Maybe, but I don't think it would make sense, at least not now. Most Windows 7 users have regular desktop PCs or laptops, and don't want Windows 8. It will only be when Windows 8.2 comes along that desktop users might finally be tempted.

    Windows 8.2 is being slated to potentially bring back the start menu, and to allow the use of Metro apps in a window - exactly as it always should have been from the start! I guess Microsoft must finally have taken notice how many Windows 8 users had bought copies of Stardock 'Start8' and 'ModernMix' :p

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      There is more to WinRT apps on the desktop than 'ModernMix'. The point (presumably) is APIs to allow WinRT apps to offer desktop compatible behaviour when running on a desktop so features like drag/drop, copy/paste etc. work as expected. This lets us distribute most desktop apps through the Windows store or corporate centre with no more traditional complicated Win32 setup scenarios. Totally crazy this was not a option from the word go.

      I don't miss the start menu but if something returns, please let it be better than that annoying Win7 version.

  13. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    and the Microsofth saw it was good

    and they gaveth away

    WAKEY-WAKEY!!!

    but hey, here's a cynical angle: there's nothing like good old FREE publicity. Ryanair knows this. Amazon knows this. Ebay knows this. Shit, even politicians, who seem to know nothing about anything - know this And now - analysts know this.

    1. Roland6 Silver badge

      Re: and the Microsofth saw it was good

      The trouble, which the IHS analyst Clifford Leimbach missed, is that MS have been destroying their brand ie. the trust in their products, for many years probably since Vista and Office 2007. Giving away a product that has had poor customer reception isn't going to make it good, and as others have pointed out it could simply generate even more grief.

      No MS don't need to flood the market, they need to regain the trust of their customers, something that won't happen overnight. I suspect that biting the bullet and releasing XP-SP4 and giving XP another few years of life - just like they did with Win98 maybe a good first step and given them the marketing breathing space to deliver Windows 9.

  14. jason 7

    Well they do sell it cheaply to start with.

    I bought a load of upgrades of Windows 8 Pro for about £20 each this time last year.

    I still buy up copies for around £40 if you hunt places that haven't updated their stock records.

    I think I paid about £20 for my copy of Snow Leopard from the Apple Store (for a Hackintosh), so that wasn't free.

  15. David Webb

    Eh?

    If memory serves, didn't Apple, you know, charge for service packs? So Apple follow the MS method of making SP's free (for once, probably a once only ever offer) and someone demands MS do the same? Eh?

  16. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    UEFI BIOS vs Legacy BIOS vs NSA

    My computer doesn't have a UEFI BIOS, so a free copy of Win 8 would be no good for me. Unless they made it work with a legacy BIOS. And I have a feeling NSA would not be happy with that...

    1. jason 7
      Facepalm

      Where did you get that idea?

      I've installed Windows 8 on machines going back to 2006 just fine. Very few have had UEFI BIOS.

      The FUD people give into......

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