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back to article This week's BBC MELTDOWN: Savile puppet haunts kids' TV

The BBC has apologised for airing an episode of kiddies show The Tweenies featuring a puppet "impersonating Jimmy Savile". Outraged parents choked on their cornflakes on Sunday morning as the offending programme, filmed back in 2001, exposed wide-eyed nippers to "Max" - a character "in a blonde wig, wearing Savile's trademark …

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Headmaster

Re: What a lot of fuss

The process by which Savile was deemed to be 'Britain's worst sex offender' was not reasonable. He suffered firstly a trial by media, then Operation Yewtree simply collected all the accusations against him and assumed they were all true. The vast majority of the accusations were only made after the initial publicity against him.

This is certainly not to say he was innocent of everything, and indeed he could even have been guilty of everything. It's just that the process by which we have decided he was 'Britain's worst sex offender' left much to be desired.

There, got it off my chest.

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Re: What a lot of fuss

Except I saw a program about Country&Western on BBC4 at the weekend which had several clips where DLT introduced the act.

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Bod
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Re: What a lot of fuss

"He suffered firstly a trial by media, then Operation Yewtree simply collected all the accusations against him and assumed they were all true. The vast majority of the accusations were only made after the initial publicity against him."

Seems odd that no one in the media or even police seem to remotely consider there is an ulterior motive in at least some of the cases, such as the money they'll get from the Daily Mail et al.

How many of the accusations are of the like you'd see in Carry On films? Should they be banned and the memory of Sid James be erased too?

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Headmaster

Doing the maths

Say there is a 1 in 100 chance that a serious sexual assault on a child will be brought to justice - a depressingly low proportion but probaly not far from the mark IF you take within family offences into account.

The probability that 200 independent serious sexual offences will be committed with none being brought to justice is 99/100 to the power of 200 or about 0.13

So how lucky was Jimmy Savile feeling - or are a fair proportion of the allegations poppycock?

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Childcatcher

this story is too stupid...

...for words.

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TRT
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Facepalm

F*** me!

I've just seen an episode of Pipkins where Pig knocks over Hartley Hare's tower of building bricks with a paper aeroplane, which is a clear parody of the 9/11 attacks on New York, which I then had to explain to my four year old.

Get a grip, people!

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Bronze badge

Re: F*** me!

Or, was two children playing with toys as normal.

And why did you "have" to explain this to your four-year-old? One of them knocked over the other's toys... what's to explain exactly other than one of them is a little git interrupting the other's quiet playtime?

Get a grip, indeed.

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FAIL

Re: F*** me!

@Lee Dowling... I think your irony detectors are malfunctioning.

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Facepalm

Re: F*** me!

"@Lee Dowling... I think your irony detectors are malfunctioning."

I'd say they had done a Fukishima

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Re: F*** me!

This sort of behaviour has be nipped in the bud in children. Lego boxes should carry a warning to parents about the dangers of certain types play encouraging terrorist attacks

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WTF?

get a grip

a fictional character dressed up as someone now deceased...

do we really care? apart from the folks who think complaining and 'feeling offended' top-trumps other people on their estate?

the kids this program is aimed at have never even heard of JS let alone can comprehend the issues

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WTF?

I wonder...

Exactly how many of today's children were offended, or felt violated by this? Presumably none, since the vast majority have no idea who the fuck Jimmy Saville is.

Some people must sit by the telephone, with the Telegraph's number on speed dial (just behind the button for the Daily Mail) waiting with baited breath for an opportunity to be outraged. I feel sorry for "concerned father", who must spend his days rocking back and forth in a dark room worrying about the filth that exists outside his sanitised walls, trying to determine the best way of erasing any memory his children may have of Jimmy Saville from the last 18 months (because before then it Wasn't His Fault (tm) that he exposed his children to Jimmy Saville).

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Anonymous Coward

Re: I wonder...

Actually, the Telegraph today presented the story in two small paragraphs on an even-numbered page, 6 or 8, IIRC... obviously the first few pages were all about terrorists. They did have a front page feature trailer about how Boris Johnson feels it is the start of another ice age, though.

Just a few months to go before we get photos of teenage girls in vest tops jumping for joy at their exam results! Until then, will have to make do with critiques of dresses worn at the Oscar ceremony.

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Mushroom

I've also seen Wile E. Coyote setting up a roadside IED to try and "take out" Road Runner. Do these 1950s cartoon makers and modern-day DVD pimps have no sense of decency towards our brave boys in Helmand province?

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You're right. I'm going to start a petition and get fame for a cmapaign against this.

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Devil

Ahem...

The Tweenies featuring a puppet "impersonating Jimmy Savile".

So this cigar smoking puppet was luring starry eyed teen girls to parties, then to hotel rooms?

It must have pulled some strings to get all that right...

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Childcatcher

As if..

..the Tweenies aren't creepy enough...

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Alert

Re: As if..

Just don't mention the Harold Shipman episode of the Roley Mo Show.....

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TRT
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Re: As if..

And that Cliff Richards Jnr song in Thunderbirds Are Go (the first Thunderbirds movie)?

"Baby, I got friends, so baby listen to me. A shooting star will shoot you, and Mars will go to war. The man in the moon will jump on you, if you don't love me no more."

Now if ever there was a song glorifying violence and domestic abuse towards women, then this is it! A bl**dy good job that when I went to see it as a kid, all I was paying attention to was Thunderbird 2 taking off.

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WTF?

Innocent until proving guilty?

Has our Jimmy been tried and found guilty then?

They guy is dead and the government is probably spending a children's hospital per year to do exactly what about him?

It was an indirect reference to the guy, so bloody what, who cares? Obviously do gooders with nothing better to do.

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Silver badge

Re: Innocent until proving guilty?

Dead people can't be tried and convicted. However the police believe there to be so much evidence and so many complainants that they are calling them victims.

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Childcatcher

Re: Innocent until proving guilty?

Oh for the good old days when you could convict them, dig them up and hang them (Google Oliver Cromwell).

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Silver badge

Re: Innocent until proving guilty?

Or indeed dig them up, then try them, convict them, etc etc. (Google Pope Formosus.)

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Re: Innocent until proving guilty?

Considering he was buried for a year before all this broke I think you'd have to hang him in a net.

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g e
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Alert

MEDIIIC!

I had to go to hospital and have intensive psychological therapy due to my reliance on the media to tell me how to think and react to the world around me as I am utterly incapable of forming an independent thought for myself.

The very kind private doctor took one look at me and warned me I would need a prolonged course of very expensive treatment though he did refer me to his brother who happens to run a no-win-no-fee company who will be able to sue the BBC on my behalf for the cost of it.

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Anonymous Coward

those choking parents

and all others, who bothered to complain, should have been (...)

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Joke

Was pretty funny that the song sung

was "One Finger, One Thumb" :-D

There is nothing that the British like more than an outrage over nothing though!

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Trollface

Choking on cornflakes...

at least it was nothing nutritious.... ;-)

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jai
Silver badge

setting a worrying precedent?

yes, it is perhaps poor taste, in light of the recent findings, but it's an episode made over 10 years ago. it's a tv show, aimed a small kids who, even 10 years ago, wouldn't have known who Jimmy Savile was, so at the time it could have only have been intended for the benefit of the parents watching the show.

what's next? do we need a Records of Department to eradicate any mention of Jimmy Savile from any tv show ever? should we have a Black List maintained to ensure Gary Glitter is never ever mentioned? or shall we be content which just giving such items an Emotional Content rating and leave it at that?

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Windows

Re: setting a worrying precedent?

To be honest, I've never ever seen a swimming pool in an episode of Coronation Street since 1983...

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Thumb Up

To be honest, I've never ever seen a swimming pool in an episode of Coronation Street since 1983...

Would it be in bad taste for me to give that post a 'thumbs up'?

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Thumb Down

Re: setting a worrying precedent?

Sounds a bit like Winston's job in that George Orwell novel. Maybe the "Ministry of Truth" isn't a work of fiction after all.

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Childcatcher

Re: setting a worrying precedent?

I didn't get the reference, so I googled "swimming pool coronation street" and now I am offended.

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MJI
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Re: setting a worrying precedent?

I searched it and got your post!

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The song he introduced just makes everything worse

So what was the song?

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Facepalm

Re: The song he introduced just makes everything worse

One finger, one thumb, keep moving. :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=89IdetbRyu0

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Anonymous Coward

Re: The song he introduced just makes everything worse

>do we need a Records of Department to eradicate any mention of Jimmy Savile from any tv show ever? should we have a Black List maintained to ensure Gary Glitter is never ever mentioned?

Well, they stopped doing TOTP some time back... though they've started showing re-runs again.

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FAIL

Grow up

It's an 11 year old reference to a dead weirdo that no modern 4 year old would understand; but it gives the Telegraph and the like another opportunity to be outraged by the Beeb. Beeb management should grow some nuts,tell them to get knotted and the Telegraph should go back to being a newspaper.

Oh and I should probably get back to finishing the report due this afternoon :0)

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Silver badge

In fairness

Who would even think to check some 11 year old kids TV series to see if something in hindsight could cause someone offence? I doubt the kids noticed it and aside from some faux outrage from some newspapers and amusement on Twitter I doubt anyone seriously cared.

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MJI
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Facepalm

Definately facepalm moment

I remember this from the first time, just a parody of a TOTP show.

The Tweenies were a very good preschool programme.

What is worrying is that I can remember Max, Milo, Fizz, Jake, Bella, and of course Doodles. My boys called their sister Bossy Bella after her.

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MJI
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aghhhhhhhhhhhhhh

Now got the theme stuck on my head.

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Coat

Re: aghhhhhhhhhhhhhh

You know you've spent far too much time watching The Tweenies when you start to find Judy an attractive proposition. Thankfully I was able to leave this lot behind a long time ago...

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MJI
Silver badge

Re: aghhhhhhhhhhhhhh

And it is worrying I know what you mean!

As to complaints, I think the average child doesn't care and the average parent is having a laugh

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Childcatcher

"Think of the children! Won't someone think of the children?!"

"Now then, now then, now then..."

"Stop thinking about children!!!"

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Trollface

Is it really that hard to chew cornflakes?

It was so disgusting that he forgot to chew? I don't understand, is this a new scale to measure disgusted-ness?

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Stop

... described by police as a "prolific, predatory sex offender"

The police are supposed to be investigators who offer their results of inquiries (if they can be believed) to a member of the judiciary, or an official inquiry/commission, and THEY make a finding and issue a decision.

With Saville it seems that all the normal procedures have been swept aside and the Plod have become investigators, judge and jury.

Whether the claims against Saville have been proven, or not, since the police have adopted a position against Saville, who has absolutely no one acting for him, their actions are to be questioned.

And why has it taken so long, by so many people, to find their voices? Surely one or two, or their parents, would have acted. It should also be born in mind that way back when Saville allegedly committed these assaults, "putting out" for favours was common.

Doesn't make it right but it surely changes the circumstances.

Chances are that the intended viewers, children, wouldn't even know who the character was supposed to represent, only these faux angry parents who love bitching about anything.

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Unhappy

Re: ... described by police as a "prolific, predatory sex offender"

"With Saville it seems that all the normal procedures have been swept aside and the Plod have become investigators, judge and jury."

No, this is how the police have always operated when faced with a public baying for blood, rather than justice. Leak any damning material to the press, along with some hearsay and conjecture, while sitting on any evidence that might cast doubt on the accused's guilt. When the case comes to trial, the average potential juror has already had their mind made up for them. Plod gets a conviction and a promotion, the public get a new hate figure and all it costs is some poor sod his life. By the time the miscarriage of justice is corrected, the perpatrators have resigned/retired/passed away and can't be held to account.

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I've just read the Wikipedia article to refresh my memory of one a sublime piece of satire on this topic. In fact, the outraged reaction was even funnier than the broadcast itself. Well worth reading for the IT angle:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brass_Eye#Paedophilia_special_.282001.29

Highlights:

-Labour MP Syd Rapson related that paedophiles were using "an area of internet the size of Ireland".

-Richard Blackwood stated that internet paedophiles could make computer keyboards emit noxious fumes to subdue children, subsequently sniffing a keyboard and claiming that he could smell the fumes, which made him feel "suggestible". Blackwood also warned watching parents that exposure to the fumes would make their children "smell like hammers".

The reaction:

-MP Beverley Hughes described the show as "unspeakably sick" but later admitted she had not seen it, and David Blunkett said he was "dismayed" by it. It later emerged that he also had not seen the episode, because he is blind.

-The Daily Star decried Morris and the show, placing the story next to a separate article about the 15-year-old singer Charlotte Church's breasts under the headline "She's a big girl now" and using the words "looking chest swell". The Daily Mail pictured Princesses Beatrice and Eugenie, who were 13 and 11, in their bikinis next to a headline describing Brass Eye as "Unspeakably Sick".

You couldn't make it up.

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h3
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People should stick with their opinions. (And worry about people alive not dead)

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Mushroom

Outraged

I'm completely outraged at their decision to show this! As I am every time the Tweenies is on cos it's total crap.

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