Windows Media Center EPG has SWITCHED OFF, wail Euro users
Europeans using Windows Media Center to watch TV have been upset to find that all TV programme guide data has disappeared from the service as of 1 January. For affected users, live and playback TV still works, but all programme guide information has been wiped as of 11am on 1 January, leaving users unable to plan recordings or …
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MediaPortal
Does the job, much nicer and much more configurable than WMC.. oh and it's free.
Re: MediaPortal
The new Titan skin in 1.3 Beta is really nice actually. If I can solve my HD problems it'll be happy days.
Another MythTV user
We have been using MythTv on Linux now for a few months - the PC sits on the landing with a quad tuner card plugged in. And the recordings are available to be streamed through the network (wirelessly, and wired through homeplugs).
I won't pretend Myth was easy to setup, and that we haven't had problems (it still occasionally records shows with zero length and requires a reboot to fix). But it is working well now - and solves the problem of needing multiple PVRs in a house with a number of people with different TV tastes.
Selecting the right front-end is still a work in progress given I don't want a large machine for a front-end or a hard disk. WDTV is ok - but fastforwarding through the stream is a pain. And XMBC on Raspberry Pi might be good - but isn't there yet (FF problems as well, and frequent crashes).
Re: Another MythTV user
Old HP D530 slim desktops are OK (eBay £30+ a decent Nvidia card) for MythTV - bit noisy though. Better to buy second hand Zotac ION boards w 1-2GB RAM + Akasa Cryto case - can be done for under £100. Work well as frontends (my server is D530 CMT +3GB RAM + 3 tuners and in the basement...) and can happily cope with three / four frontends round the house. Don't forget - SSDs are your frontend friends
Re: Another MythTV user
> SSDs are your frontend friends
Nice. However if you're feeling poor, a normal flash drive can be used. If your frontends are wired and not rebooted often, PXE is your friend - just point it at a mythbuntu DVD image.
Any old office PC is generally fine - its the home built ones with noisy power supplies you need to avoid. Also, Mac G5's are rather inefficient, though with the temperature hitting 40C today, those fans are going to come in useful! :D
If you're looking for clients I suggest having a look at Plex
Plex as a client?
So you can install the Plex Server component on the PC running Myth and it plays nicely?
Re: Plex as a client?
I have a Plex server running on my master backend (MythTV).
It runs as well there as it does anywhere. Same challenges and quirks as running on a Mac or a Windows PC.
MSFT Call Centers appeared unaware over Xmas - BDS had done their job though
Just to comment - could see this coming over Xmas break...as I see it the OTA EPG is now/next or 7 days only - WMC was (hopefully still is once fixed!) good in that it would cover 2 weeks (great for longer vacation and series scheduled recording! :-) ) Only real problem I found is lack of response to real time programme updates/over-runs...that life I guess.
I spent time (hours :-( ) talking to various (mostly Indian?) call centers trying to flag the problem over the break but they appeared ignorent of issue - I guessed it was a UK only problem and they seemed to have US view of life.
OTA option only avalable n W7 if I understand correctly - I use old XPMCE05 as main TV and have a number of other desk top and laptop m/c's running MCE04 (as an old testbed), WMCE05 and W7.....problem is obviously with all platforms.
I wouldn't blame BDS (Bee) on this - I was in touch with them prior to New Year (and data end) and they confirmed a data package was sent to MSFT (just that morning) so its down to MSFT I'm afraid......
Sadly the wife & kids are now P1$$ed as loads of recordings are "Manual Recording" labels - which get lost in the mist of time......(e.g. try to fing UP! from NY Day will be fun....though record data of 01/01 may help ;-)
......is anyone from MSFT listening/tracking I wonder.......? (If so can they enlighten please!)
DVBViewer
XP Media and Vista Media centre are rubbish for European DTT or Satellite. The Windows 7 Media centre (built in MHEG5 too) was quite decent.
But still not as a good as DVBviewer and MHEG5 plugin. Evidenced by fact than it's still bought by Windows7 users.
DVBviewer or MS Media Centre on Win7 is though easier to set up than MythTV.
A Freesat+ HD PVR set box is best, but quad tuner (2 x DVB-S2 and 2 x DVB-T) set boxes with real Freesat and/or MHEG5 don't seem to exist. Important for people not actually in UK wanting Local DTT and the Freesat channels. Then a PC based PVR is best.
You can run HDMI over 2 x shielded CAT5e for quite a good distance by cutting a £1.50 HDMI cable in two and splicing.
However I expect the missing EPG is a mistake!
Xbox?
"many people use a sitting-room Xbox to connect to a PC located elsewhere."
I tried this. As much as I tried, running up and down stairs to input various codes, I just *could not* get my Xbox 360 to see the Windows 7 machine upstairs!!
The machine later died a death (HDD - specifically the Windows partition, went) and I gave up on the whole idea.
"I have the PC installed as my main TV,"
More fool you.
Muppet.
Re: "I have the PC installed as my main TV,"
@Boltar: Constructive comment & contribution I see :-) NOT
Guess I should clarify as "...'connected to' main (Freeview/DTV) TV and acting as local PVR + longer term EPG" ! Fact is have been considering other options for some time and the rest of the posts here are useful inputs/guidance (thanks folks!) - this latest episode may tip me across.....possibly also going whole hog and heading to Linux (as running on several other machines).....main issue is family familiarity with MC ;-)
TVHeadend
If you just want TV Streaming and Recording, I've found TVHeadend an excellent little (free) install.
It streams to XBMC and if you install the transcoding branch, you can stream to Android devices over the Internet.
Of course, you need Linux installed with a compatible TV tuner, but its not insurmountable.
And it will fetch TV listings from the Radio Times too.
Live TV Subtitling is actually done by voice recognition: http://www.redbeemedia.com/blog/day-life-subtitler which explains the phonetic spelling that occurs at times....
Anybody who is described
as "distraught" because of this is badly in need of a reality check....
Slightly miffed, yes, distraught, no....
Re: Anybody who is described
"slightly miffed" doesn't justify hitting the torrents.
'Cos that's what happens when the EPG fails.
"I was out of my mind with grief, m'lud."
So glad I'd already given up on MS and Media Centre
Having used Media Center as my freeview PVR for many years I gave up on it when I moved to using satellite. The codecs in Media centre 7 are so out of date and slow they simply can't cope with satellite HD and after much pulling of hair I gave up installed XBMC for my media and got a slingbox for TV/PVR. I feel lucky not to be in the same mess those still using Media Centre are now in.
Re: So glad I'd already given up on MS and Media Centre
I use it for quad tuner DVB-S2 HD + quad tuner DVB-T reception without any problems. I also use DVBLink to share it around the house, and EPGCollector to get the FreeSat epg. The only time I ever have to fiddle with it is when the transponders change (thanks Olympics!!). My friends are amazed whenever the come over for parties, what with the big screen music/video playback with photo slideshows and visualisations. Ripping cds to my network is as simple as putting them into dvd drive and clicking ok, then they are automatically synced to my families phones via google music. I am currently putting all my dvds on the network. But the most amazing thing is that even my wife can use it!
Re: So glad I'd already given up on MS and Media Centre
Really? Sky HD (movies, sports etc.) worked superb on mine when I lived in the UK, as did everything I downloaded (Shark007 btw).
Now I live in middle east and sadly OSN use betacrypt which afaik hasn't been cracked :(
Re: So glad I'd already given up on MS and Media Centre
Yeah exactly Stu, Tim couldn't have pulled much hair as it's pretty easy to get DVB-S2 hd in wmc.
Re: So glad I'd already given up on MS and Media Centre
Stu. you must be running it on a high powered box the codecs you can use in WMC don't support offloading to the GPU so if you're trying to play HD on a nice quite little small form factor PC such as the Acer REVO you'll only get unacceptable jerky performance. The big gripe with WMC and MS in general is very poor performance browsing large folders once you start to get a lot of media files in them. As others have mentions there are far far better products to use now than anything from Redmond and a lot of them now are cross platform too.
Re: So glad I'd already given up on MS and Media Centre
"Stu. you must be running it on a high powered box the codecs you can use in WMC don't support offloading to the GPU so if you're trying to play HD on a nice quite little small form factor PC such as the Acer REVO you'll only get unacceptable jerky performance."
This just isn't true. The onboard h.264 codec uses DXVA to offload to the GPU. I had HD tv on an Atom Ion Revo. That played video fine but struggled a bit recording two streams whilst playing back a 3rd so I upgraded to an AMD APU based machine.
If your computer wasn't offloading to GPU then most likely you had installed some awful codec pack that was using ffdshow for everything or you just needed to update your graphics drivers.
I use the media browser plugin for accessing my media files I find it looks and behaves much better than the built in browser.
Does anyone use Windows Media Center any more?
I'm surprising anyone's using WMC when there are better alternatives if you really must use Windows for TV recording e.g. Mediaportal for one.
The best setup is surely a Linux nettop (e.g. Acer Revo) or even a Raspberry Pi plus tvheadend (the best media centre Web configuration interface bar none, IMHO) and XBMC as a front-end (possibly on the same device as the tvheadend server if you only have one box).
With XBMC available on far more platforms than WMC (including Android now), it's a no-brainer to ditch WMC completely.
Re: Does anyone use Windows Media Center any more?
TV tuner support in XMBC is still Beta - right?
I actually like J River a lot, but the TV support is nowhere close to WMC.
WMC 'Just Works' (or used to).
Re: Does anyone use Windows Media Center any more?
I can't see a Raspberry Pi driving three TVs as Media Center does in my home. XBMC is getting better but still has the feel that it's made by techies for techies. It didn't pass the "wife and kids test" last time I installed it.
I tried Media Portal on my laptop for the first time this morning and it does look very promising, although again the interface isn't as straightforward and slick as Media Center. When people design this stuff they really need to think what the typical gadget-shy person does and does not want to see pop up when they're using their TV. Still, Media Portal is going to be a strong contender for providing TV when Windows 9 approaches and the death of Windows Media Center becomes nearer.
Re: Does anyone use Windows Media Center any more?
There was and never will be Tuner support in XBMC.
There has however been a PVR Branch that WILL go mainstream in the next release (i.e. Frodo).
The PVR Branch requires that you have something like MythTV or some version of VDR installed.
Most likely at some point One would imaging that even WMC would also be available if only for the Windows version.
But, no XBMC is not likely to have in your World "native" support, anytime soon if ever.
Time to switch to DVBLink and its Digiguide EPG loader?
Those preferring to continue using MediaCenter not only for live TV, but also for its recording function can switch to DVBLink with either its EPG Collector integration or Digiguide EPG loader.
"Windows Media Center has never been a huge success for Microsoft: despite being available since XP and included in all but the lowest-end editions of Windows."
That's not quite true is it? Media Centre was a specific edition of XP, it didn't come with standard copies of Home or Professional.
The vast majority of PCs running XP came from Dell or HP or some other large OEM. And from 2006 on, most of those boxes shipped with XP Media Center Edition.
So you could argue that the boxed version of XP Home was a "lower end" version than XP Media center edition!
No matter what "you could argue" the fact is that the statement made in the article was untrue.
I particularly like your "from 2006", lets see now. Windows XP launched in 2001. Vista launched in early 2007. So for one year of a five year shelf life some PC manufacturers only shipped Media Centre Edition. Not really a convincing argument.
If we ignore Embedded IIRC there were only three editions of XP. Home, Professional and Media Centre. The latter was never available retail, BTW. Fair enough, excluding Embedded, Home Edition was the lowest spec version, but to describe Home and Professional together as "only the lowest spec versions" is hardly true is it?
Never was a huge success because it's crap
1. You have to wait ~4 seconds for it to start up because it's playing its ridiculous start-up animation and sound
2. You have to wait another 5-10 seconds to see a simple list of your recorded programs as your hard drive is apparently put through a stress test (WHAT IS IT DOING?!)
3. Your 1-dimensional list of programs is presented in a confounding 2-dimensional matrix that's confusing even to somebody who's been using the product for years (let's see, to get to the next program I press down, unless I have to press right and then up 3 times)
4. Many features are only accessible by clicking on faded out words that are often literally half-invisible and certainly don't look like anybody should be clicking on them
5. There's enough lag when fast forwarding and skipping backwards that the features might as well be worthless for skipping commercials
6. The keyboard shortcuts were chosen by somebody who apparently hates customers... you have to press Control-P to pause instead of just hit the spacebar, etc.
Anyway, I'd go on but I'm exhausted just thinking about it. It shouldn't be a mystery why this product failed. I still use it to watch ~2 programs per week because I already have it set up and it does work, but I hate every minute of it.
Re: Never was a huge success because it's crap
Which is why I and others who use it in anger run it on dedicated hardware with little else on it. It's still Windows after all.
I never experience any lag skipping back or forwards.
And if you use one of the dedicated remotes (and the original MS remote is a wonder) then you don't need to use the byzantine key combos.
Another "Plays for Sure"
Not making any money, can't be bothered, turned off the server.
System back as of this evening....
Looks like we are back in the game from tonight....though some systems have only dowloaded selected channels despite repeat attempts.....and looks like some listings incorrect (e.g. 10pm PICK TV showed Game of Thrones but actualy one of the Cop reality TV sessions!)
Would be good to get full MSFT explaination (excuse) - back toyou Anna!......though no doubt chances slim......what will they do to stop repeat of this episode (excuse the pun?!)
They're back! I have been fiddling with other options to get my WMC 7 listings back with not much luck so restored my ehome directory and run a bog standard WMC7 guide update and I now have listings up to 13/1/12. Let's hope that's an end to it...
That explains it...
...kinda. I'd have expected some announcement, and since Win8 offers MCE I presume this is a cock up rather than a switch-off.
I have said it before - in fact since about 2006 - and will say it again, Media Centre (Center!) has been the most reliable, useful, user-friendly MS product I have ever used.
If you go to the effort (yes, it's a slightly bigger if than just getting a Sky box) it rewards you time after time. My MCE box is home built (and that's the problem for the mass market) but being in an Antec case it's quiet, not too ugly, and fairly cheap to run.
This is a box that cost me about £300 to build in 2006 when I upgraded from XP MCE to Vista. It still runs fine with Win 7.
Having just got a 46" telly I can assure you the interface is the cleanest and most responsive I have ever experienced in a PVR. Even when I use friends' Sky boxes I think MCE still urinates from a great height.
It's speedy; the picture looks great; HD is perfect; SD upscales better than anything else; it worries about when to record things if it can't get the first transmission; plus it does the trick of being a PC if I need it to.
Best of all? It does the supposed-Apple trick of *just working*. If Apple ever build a TV presumably the TV interface will be very MCE. Indeed I wish the whole UI of my Samsung telly was similar to MCE rather than the Korean abomination which I otherwise try to avoid.
It is quite amazing that not only is it the same company behind MCE and Win 8 Metro - in many ways the origins of Win 8 can be seen in MCE, via the Xbox interface. They just lost the plot along the way.
If they ever did get rid of Media Centre I don't know what I'd use in its place. I'd cope, but IMHO it's such a genuinely refined product I'd be hard-pressed to find a decent alternative. It's amazing to think I began this journey with Showshifter more than 10 years ago. For once, credit to MS for coming up trumps.
It's back now
EPG is back now - for me at least.
Having used XBMC and MediaPortal, I find myself always going back to WMC. As Mark 47 suggests, it's actually one of the finest bits of software that MS have ever put out. Even better when combined with MediaBrowser...
As a side note, it would be nice if MS were capable of sending me a Product Key for Windows 8 Media Centre Pack 9 days after requesting one...
Myth TV
Another vote for Myth. It is a bugger to set up, you can't just install it and sit back, but everything you need to know is available on-line, and you will learn a lot doing so.
Mythbuntu is the way to go for a dedicated TV/PVR system.
I still use Windows MCE I just gave up on broadcast television, it's all repeated crap and advertising. My brain feels so much better leaving all the ads behind.
XBMC
I went to check out the XBMC PVR stuff in the new beta. I was always a big fan of XBMC right from the start out of XBMP so I'd love to use this. In short it looks like a nightmare. You have to install a backend and a frontend then manually load plugins and get the whole thing to talk to each other.
Contrast this with WMC where you simply click setup live TV then agree to a few terms and 10 minutes later everything is done for you.
It's a shame XBMC is so complicated I'd like to switch to a PVR that can record multiple shows from a single multiplex/transponder. It means that for freeview HD you only need 1 HD tuner and the rest can be cheap £5 jobs from ebay. With 6 tuners you'd be able to record everything that was on. I just don't want watching TV to be too much like real work.
Re: XBMC
I'm not sure how else XBMC could work to avoid this "nightmare" you mentioned. Remember, that's it's purely a client that doesn't do any recording or EPG downloads or TV tuner config itself. That way, it can work on many, many different platforms, including Android. Want Windows Media Center on your phone or tablet - sorry, no can do. XBMC 12 is due out shortly and it runs virtually identically on Android as it does on Windows, Mac and Linux. Oh yeah, want WMC on Mac or Linux too? Sorry, no can do.
The backend and client *can* be run on the same machine if you only have one computing device and only one TV in the house and WMC does score on initial configuration if that's you're tech-poor setup. For all other situations, XBMC plus your favourite backend (yes, you choose between half a dozen - amazing...you've got a *choice*) is far more flexible and convenient. Whilst Windows remains popular on desktops/laptops, media centre client-side it doesn't (think watching on phones and tablets that aren't running Windows), which is what lets WMC down.
For backends, I personally think a good Web interface to set up your TV tuners, auto-downloading your EPG data and schedule/check recordings is the way to go. That means *any* device can access it and you can even (carefully!) open it up to the outside world so you can view it whilst out of the house, again on any device.
This is why I prefer tvheadend on Linux - it really is a very easy to use (but still very configurable) Web interface that beats stuff like MythTV's equivalent. Yes, I tried MythTV as a backend and being a tech person, I still really did not like MythTV's interface at all. I also was surprised that MythTV's developers don't think you'd ever want to record more than 5 channels on a single TV tuner (yes, that's a hard-coded limit in their backend that I tried to get them to increase, but they refused).
Re: XBMC
Might I suggest to you to try YaVDR?
You will need an nVidia (VDPAU capable Video Card anything from a Gforce 8400 should be ok)
Other then that most common DVB-C / DVB-T / DVB-S(2) or even ATSC (for our 'Merikin cousins), should work OotB.
Just scan your Channels in and start the XBMC (Disc Version 11 Eden) and IIRC the PVR should be pre-activated with the XVDR Protocol. It'll take a moment to import your Channels & EPG Data. And that's that really. Might take you all of an Hour or Two to setup depending on how fast your PC is.
And updating to XBMC 12 Frodo RC3 is simple enough. But this was more to do with some encoded 10-Bit Anime that I have that doesn't run so well under Eden.
RE:...the fault lies with Microsoft and some hapless admin bod has forgotten...
$DEITY, I don't want to be that clueless (l)user!!!!
S/He might end up with a chair ride out a window, courtesy of one Steve Ballmer.
For those looking for an alternative on Windows I use ArgusTV as a backend with an XMBC front end. Works a treat! The TV programme scheduling options are the best I've come across
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