back to article Apple scrambled to hire iOS 6 maps engineers DAYS before launch

Apple posted job adverts for six iOS map engineers within the past ten days, perhaps preempting the storm of criticism over the controversial new map app in iOS 6. Any effort to boost the software's team could be seen as too little, too late after fanbois and fangrrls across the world branded the new satnav-like service as …

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      1. asdf

        Re: Tim Cook fail

        The Newton was developed and released long after Steve left and before he was rehired (one of the reasons he was rehired). In 1982, Steve Jobs was forced out of the Lisa project,[2] so he joined the Macintosh project instead. (sourced from wikipedia so buyer beware). The world wide web was invented on Next computers but I will grant you Steve overengineered them to the point they were very expensive workstations that didn't sell well but much of the technology developed did largely lay the foundation for his Mac OS X/IOS empire later (still f__k objective C, never should have made it out of the 80s). He definitely was not perfect but Tim who? He is all the bad qualities of Steve (arrogance, total douche) without any of the good.

  1. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    And so, it started...

    With Jobs gone the quality is slipping already. Frankly, I thought it would take longer...

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: And so, it started...

      I could have told you that last year with the iPhone 4S launch. The iPhone 5 could have been called the iPhone 4ST (speed, tall).

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: And so, it started...

        Don't care one way or another - never owned an Apple product; they are pretty, but as far as I'm concerned overpriced. Maybe this is why it seems for me to be the first seriously, and visibly public FAIL of Apple in recent years. They said that Jobs was a control freak, but that worked very well for him and the company; without him they start to do what most of the companies in US seems to do - they get overexcited (and/or over-greedy) and try to push for too many things too fast.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: And so, it started...

          Don't care one way or another

          ---------------------

          You obviously do since you are taking the time to read and comment on an Apple story....

    2. Ilgaz

      Re: And so, it started...

      It is the always forgiving cult like community who was holding them back and now it started slipping.

  2. Matt_payne666

    you could hire a million people into the maps team.... the maps app can be the most polished progam in existence, the maps application isnt the problem... the issue is the source of the map data - this is owned, managed and updated by TomTom.... They are the people that need to be investing in staff, cameras, licencing/updating imagery.

    1. asdf

      >They are the people that need to be investing in staff, cameras, licencing/updating imagery.

      No Apple is still to blame for not doing due diligence then (money shouldn't be an issue compared to quality for Apple's war chest). That said glad to hear that because Garmin is a big employer in my hometown and I have friends working over there.

    2. Paul E

      But...

      Tomtom maps do not have all problems that apple are having, e.g. tomtom satnav do know where stratford upon avon is. What it looks like to me is either problems importing the data or, more likely they are just using tomtom data for the roads and are getting the data on places from somewhere else.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: But...

        i thought this was down to OpenStreetMaps being used for the source data? Not TomTom.

        Im not going to join the bandwagon, but having seen Maps in use at work today i can only presume that they had no other option but to use the data and just hope they can ride the storm or that they could just get users to correct everything.

        One self confessed fanboi i work with is attempting to return his iphone 5 tonight based solely on the maps issue.

        Its a good day to be an android user!

        1. Andy Gates

          Re: But...

          It's not (all) OSM data. OSM knows that Luton isn't in Devon.

          Some of the problem looks like tagging issues (to use OSM jargon: landuse=industrial and landuse=park render differently, and there are cockups like that throughout). Some appears to be simply wrong data. Some smells to me that they've got a tag like "highway=imported" that is set not to render until it's been cleared by a checker, and that didn't happen before release.

          Beta in live, Steve would be sad. Or wiki, but there's already one of those... ;)

    3. Vince

      No it isn't a Tom Tom issue, or more accurately, Teleatlas issue.

      That data is good and serves sat navs bloody well.

      The issue is Apples responsibility. They released this.

      1. Ian Johnston Silver badge
        Thumb Down

        Having tried a borrowed TomTom in rural Scotland recently

        I can report that their mapping is not that good. In fact, it's bloody diabolical. Roads missing, staggered junctions in the wrong order, phantom roads (sometimes cart tracks, sometimes just fields) - you name it, they fucked it up.

  3. S2S

    Google has 7000 people working on maps, 1000 full time and

    6000 contractors and has had for many years now, Apple has had a hand full, for very little time.

    Game over, before it's started.

    1. asdf

      maybe

      Apple does have over a 100 billion in the bank though which can be used to fix showstoppers very quickly. They could buy any other geolocation company and database other than perhaps Google (lol they even have cash to do that I think) today if they wanted. The bad press for the next however long it takes to fix is what hurts. My guess is Google maps app will be on ios 6 within a week.

      1. Richard 45

        Re: maybe

        "My guess is Google maps app will be on ios 6 within a week."

        Seriously? If Google know what's good for them, they'll permanently shelve their iOS 6 maps app and just sit back with a box of popcorn and enjoy the fun of Apple suffer the shitstorm.

        1. Test Man
          FAIL

          Re: maybe

          Richard 45

          Meanwhile, in the real world, Google will try and get their app up and running as soon as possible, as they'll lose crucial data from people who are not using their mapping solution on Apple devices.

          Google can't afford to be smug.

      2. Dan 55 Silver badge

        Re: maybe

        Apple do like to bring in open source solutions then put their bling on top using relatively small teams, this time it bit them on the arse though. It doesn't matter how much money you've got, you need development time to fix something which is fundamentally broken.

        I wouldn't expect Google to willingly bail them out, maybe we'll see Apple sue them for anti-competitive behaviour (not supplying Google Maps for iOS 6).

  4. Jean-Luc
    Black Helicopters

    About those Google Maps apps

    Many seem to expect that Google will helpfully provide an app to plug the gap. They even expect that Apple may block that app.

    But... wouldn't it make sense for Google to delay that app, just a bit? Yes, they'd forgo some proximity-based business ad revenue.

    But think of all the people who may opt for an Android instead. Tasty! Why pull Apple's chestnuts out of the fire?

    Full disclosure: on iOS 5 for now and will cautiously dip my toes into iOS6 once I know my iPhone 4 isn't a second class citizen on it. Not a great fan of the Google App, mostly because it's non-caching/network only. Do appreciate public transport routing, which is available and works really well where I live.

    And, as far as no-network/caching map software goes, I nominate PocketEarth (paid app & not to confused with an older celestial app of the same name) which uses OpenStreetMap.

    Bit pants on the routing bit, but links to wikipedia for local POIs. And free maps, reasonably accurate in my neck of the woods.

    (Black helicopters, cuz starving Apple of a decent map app is a bit conspiracy-theorist)

    1. Test Man
      WTF?

      Re: About those Google Maps apps

      So how many people are going to switch from an iPhone 5 to Android? Hardly any. Let's be serious.

      1. Jean-Luc
        Thumb Down

        Re: About those Google Maps apps

        Think before you type. The risk is not iphone 5 just-bought-it folks. Duh!

        It's iPhone 4 /4s folks thinking of updating their phones & getting iOS6 w useless maps.

        But thats ok dude, you got the religion. I dont, Apple is just one possible vendor to me, and I suspect this cant be a good spot for Apple to be in. They have plenty of money to throw at it so I expect they'll get the egg off their face, eventually.

  5. Lars Silver badge
    Happy

    Nothing new really

    Apple wanted to get rid of Google fast as possible so the bosses asked other bosses if they could produce a superb system bye them selves fast as hell. They all said "Yes" as that is the only answer allowed. Then they asked the programmers and others if they can do it, and again the answer was "Yes" as that is the only answer programmers are allowed to use. I should know, I said "Yes" for 35 years. It is indeed very common, and probably one of the reasons why many good programmers do open source rather than work for companies run by idiots and so damned dependent on what ever Christmas or similar event is approaching. The rest is history.

    Makes me happy, in fact.

    As somebody pointed out without up to date maps you have absolutely nothing and I wont believe TomTom is the reason here as their navigators work fine. A map is not a map but a hell of a lot of code you have to make into a map.

    If you do not know how to work with that data you produce rubbish.

    He he.

    1. asdf

      Re: Nothing new really

      >, I said "Yes" for 35 years.

      Reminds me of the board scene at the beginning of the movie Brain Candy lol. Not easy for the tech geeks to say no.

  6. Jon B
    Holmes

    Long hours

    'Hard-working and proactive' sounds like a euphemism for 'working for 12 hours a day to fix this mess'

  7. Matt Piechota

    But... wouldn't it make sense for Google to delay that app, just a bit? Yes, they'd forgo some proximity-based business ad revenue. But think of all the people who may opt for an Android instead. Tasty! Why pull Apple's chestnuts out of the fire?

    Google doesn't really care if Android wins, they just need ad revenue. Although you do have a point for the most point, Apple can (and probably will) lock Google out at some point. For Google it's a calculation of whether they'll get more out of providing the app vs. the number of people that *may* switch. How many fanbois are realistically going to switch to Android?

    And, as far as no-network/caching map software goes, I nominate PocketEarth (paid app & not to confused with an older celestial app of the same name) which uses OpenStreetMap.

    Before this, I didn't realize Google Maps on iOS doesn't cache. That is crap.

    1. Comments are attributed to your handle
      Thumb Up

      If I were Google, I wouldn't even release a map app for iOS. Or, if i did I would charge $0.99 or maybe $1.99.

      1. NomNomNom

        id charge $99

        1. NomNomNom

          for an annual subscription

      2. Test Man
        Thumb Down

        Comments are attributed to your handle

        Fortunately, Google aren't as childish as you.

        1. Comments are attributed to your handle
          Facepalm

          You're right - how childish of me to suggest a business move for Google that might result in more users adopting Android. Tool.

  8. sueme2
    Meh

    mapgate

    Tom Tom supplies maps to the masses, and the masses manage to map quite well. This problem belongs to the iThing. All antennas have shitty maps, why!! you only have to look at the other maps to see iXXX is not alone. And other bullshit like that will be running soon. Apple might even tell it like it is in RDF:: You are simply holding the phone wrong.

  9. Chris 171
    WTF?

    Giving it to the competition on a gilded platter

    I see very little mention of Nokia / MS here...

    I'll resist the temptation to mention Symbian to heavily, with my main point being.. Lumia with Nokia maps blows even dedicated sat nav devices out of the water.

    WP8 launch should start with a video...

    A car with a Lumia on the dash directing the car to the venue, shift time a bit to get in all road types, nice places on the way, all shot of course with a Lumia... I dunno maybe show someone riding bike in, walking too yes, don't forget public transport either.

    I thought the icloud would be apples Achilles heel but hey, they couldnt have chosen worse fail considering the new competitions massive strength in the exact field.

    And they'll be made by Nokia and therefore drop tested.

    Who'd a thought it...

    This is the real popcorn moment.

  10. Anonymous Coward
    FAIL

    The wall biting Apple on the arse for a change

    Due to Apples walled garden policy it's unlikely that a Google Maps app will be allowed as it duplicates functionality. That along with other walled garden policies like all alternative browsers essentially being a re-skinned version of safari means that the consumer suffers at the end of the day.

    Apple should embrace allowing rival products to the likes of Apple Maps & safari, because without rivals Apple are free to just put out products and never improve them, but if they opened it up and they had competition from other developers making rival browsers that aren't a re-skinned safari or a rival maps app then they might pull their finger out and improve and innovate their products which is better for the iPhone users in the long run.

    I've got an iPhone 4S but as long as that POS maps app is on there I won't be upgrading and I'll probably get a Galaxy 4 as my next phone. Apple are standing still and the industry shows those who stand still are essentially going backwards. What have they added to safari for example? - Synchronising of tabs and a full screen browser. Hardly showstoppers and the limitations of safari are still present.

    1. This post has been deleted by its author

    2. Arfbarkwoof
      FAIL

      Re: The wall biting Apple on the arse for a change

      "Due to Apples walled garden policy it's unlikely that a Google Maps app will be allowed as it duplicates functionality."

      Well, given the state of functionality of the Apple effort, I'm not sure that exactly applies in this case.

  11. OrsonX
    Unhappy

    Naff Maps, Dirty Apple Stores, iPhone5

    When Steve died the magic died.

    1. Grazman

      Re: Naff Maps, Dirty Apple Stores, iPhone5

      Stevie J. was a dictator.

      Opinion denoted... neXt!

      When did Apple become the "We Shall Prevail" rather than " Think Different"?

      IBM Vs Little Ol' Apple for context

  12. John Fowler

    I applied for this job...

    ...but my iPhone got me lost on the way there.

  13. etabeta
    FAIL

    Beginning of the end.

    Shame on you Apple for dumping Google Maps and replacing it with a bunch of crap. So what happened to your hyper-testing of installed SW? No matter how many engineers you hire, there is no way you could have made a working map app in a few months. That takes a lot of time and patience; plus you can't possibly have all that Streetview data which permits the Google navigation to even tell you what is written on the road signs at intersections (unless you steal that from them!)

  14. Ilgaz

    What about google?

    We all knew for months that they will get rid of their maps. IT media predicted since first patent case.

    They sat on their asses for all this time? Where is google maps?

    Same goes for Microsoft& Nokia.

    1. MacroRodent
      WTF?

      Re: What about google?

      "Same goes for Microsoft& Nokia."

      Nokia has no problem. It bough the established Navteq map company in 2007, for their technology and map data,, for an outrageous sum ($8.1 billion), and everybody scratched their heads, it is seen as one of Nokia's more expensive blunders. But I wonder if it was prescient after all. Now Nokia has fully debugged mapping software and maps independent of Google's.

  15. Robot

    Collecting map data is a messy job...

    ... that does not fit Apple's culture of clean product development in a controlled campus environment. Google literally drove around on city streets.

  16. JaitcH
    FAIL

    COOK is a new word for Compromise

    Jobs might have treated his employees like a maniacal fanatic but rarely would he compromise on quality.

    The Don't squeeze phone obviously embarrassed him and a few heads were pushed.

    This COOK guy has screwed up serially: first with Siri and now with this joke called maps. It's not as if Apple hasn't been purloining user location data. The satellite maps are crappy old black and white, low resolution junk. Russia sat ops are selling better quality sat pictures.

    This fiasco shows just how good Google maps are.

  17. Will 28

    So the map is crap, what's that got to do with job adverts?

    You've already reported the map sucks, and by all accounts it does. The fact Apple are recruiting in no way implies that they believed this to be the case, that they were panicking, or that they believed that new developers would mean it would suddenly be fixed.

    In fact I'd fully expect that, regardless of the state of the application, you would see job adverts go up now. This is because they have completed (arguably) the first development iteration, and are now getting ready for the next release. This often involves increasing the team as you don't start a new application with 1000 devs on board - it would be chaos.

    I can't help but feel that this article is a thinly veiled excuse to continue bashing apple. I quite enjoy bashing apple, but would like some new material to do it with rather than another re-run of "the maps don't work".

  18. NomNomNom

    Had to give it a miss. I applied for an interview but I couldn't find the place on the map.

  19. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    There is absolutely nothing wrong with iOS6 maps.

    It's clearly the fault of users too stupid to be living in well mapped regions such as the Bay Area.

  20. Andalou

    "fanbois and fangrrls across the world "

    Boyish lesbians and punk feminists? Well, some of the women in the queue may have been of that persuasion but, at least where I am, they seemed to be outnumbered by the straight and the straights (not, of course, that this is something that can be categorised by such a superficial examination as a glance).

    I don't know, I'm getting old. I can't keep up with this new-fangled argot. When did bois start having to share their name? What was wrong with calling fans 'fans' and 'fanboys'?

  21. Franklin
    Happy

    So I have a rubbish sense of direction...

    ...and I am utterly, thoroughly lost without GPS, even in my own back yard.

    I upgraded my iPad to iOS 6, and discovered in Apple's Maps application a reason to hang on to my Android phone. There's quite a lot I really don't like about Android, but Google's maps app is undeniably the only thing that lets me find my way around.

    Now if only I could figure out why the voice synthesis in the turn-by-turn navigation keeps stuttering and glitching since I upgraded to Android 4.0...

  22. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    As well as hiring the map developers...

    ...Apple has also hired a global team of construction workers (the 'iTerraform Team') to stretch bridges, move buildings and roads and adjust the landscape so reality is better aligned with Apple maps.

    Apple's team is nearly done, but there are still a couple of troublesome cities that still insist on existing, despite flatly contradicting the one true map view.

  23. Ian Johnston Silver badge
    Thumb Down

    I'm surprised Apple isn't hiring geographers to correct the problems, which are clearly in the Real World and not in Apple's conception of it.

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