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back to article End in sight for IT jobs outsourcing massacre

The offshoring of IT work to developing countries has been very popular with accountants looking to cut costs, but the limits are being reached of what jobs can conceivably be sent overseas. Research by The Hackett Group estimates that of the 8.2 million business service jobs available in the US and Europe in 2002, only around 4 …

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Re: We're All DOOMED!

Free market capitalism does not exist like that. It is "restricted capitalism" carried out under a large system of rules. The issue is about what the rules should be and who should benefit from them. In the UK, the rules are usually couched so as to benefit those at the very very top - heads of big coorporations, government minsters and senior civil servants, at the expense of everyone else.

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Joke

There's far too much common-sense thinking, in this forum.

You people will get nowhere in either politics or business, with this approach.

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Coat

Re: There's far too much common-sense thinking, in this forum.

I have only one response to make to this accusation.

Wibble.

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Not all bad news

There are reasons for the recent boosts to Nissan in Sunderland and Glaxo Smithkline in Ulverston. As the need for agility increases, local supply chains start to make more sense. I read somewhere recently that manufacturing costs in the UK and India (think it was India) are on a par. I do know that small companies in the US are finding it more efficient to have the manufacturer just down the road rather than on the other side of the world. Vetoing the new item shape in person *before* the factory churns out 10,000 of them (and charges you for it) makes a difference.

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Anonymous Coward

No CIO is going to offshore his own job?

Management excels at leading from the rear.

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Anonymous Coward

Re-read the article

Re-read the article and replace the word "jobs" with the phrase "UK economy".

No you know why there is "Nothing left".

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Obama has the right idea

Give tax cuts to UK companies that bring jobs back and penalise those that offshore.

More jobs, better service and a better economy because people spend more.

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IT Angle

Pretty crap analysis from Hackett

Companies offshore for a number of reasons, it might be cost, reducing their overall cost of doing business, it maybe to take advantage of skills pools which they cannot obtain or afford in their home country, it might also be because they have global aspirations and need to support a global workforce and positioning in India makes sense as it overlaps the european and asian working days.

But the majority have gone for cost reasons, so what will happen in the next 10 years or so will be those very same offshored activities will move to the next low cost country, be that Africa, South America or even back to the UK if this recession continues for much longer.

But we should be focussing on our ability to attract high quality jobs to the UK in manufacturing, engineering, science and technology. Where real money is made. Apple does not manufacture much in the US but it sure does employ a lot of engineers and scientists and it sure does make a heck of a lot of money.

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Re: Pretty crap analysis from Hackett

"attract high quality jobs to the UK" - thats all right for me and you.

But what about all those guys with 2 CSEs I imagine there are more of them than you and me. We need jobs for those too. Simply paying more tax to subsidize their enforced idleness is unsustainable...

We need high, medium and loads of low level jobs in all sorts of industries. If we are lucky we will get world class at a few of them too...

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Flame

Our utilities owned by the French, Germans and Dutch. Our cars made by the Japanese. Our computers made in China and supported from India. Our food from all over the place. Our telly mostly from the US...

This state of affairs dates back to when Maggie Scratcher insisted that we do away with penalties for imports to "even up the playing field". The trouble was that the playing field didn't become even. There were still industries and services that go a lot of help in their home lands, and suddenly we opened our entire market to an influx of asset stripping companies, bolstered by their own home advantages that we no longer had.

This latest round, the so-called "offshoring", is tantamount to sweat shop politics, but it all works out the same way. We do NOTHING to save our own industries beyond paying the CEOs and shareholders fat bundles to screw us over.

Could the last person turn the light off before leaving?

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RE:maybe if they

"Instead to save a a few pence they move the jobs abroad. We lose out in tax revenue, jobs, with a Hugh knock on effect, we lose skills."

I guess that only really effects you though if you live in or care about the country you do business in. However if say you are the owner of a large corp who has shifted all the profits to a wife who lives in a tax haven and spent years avoiding paying tax in your country, why should you care? After all you're loaded enough that petty things like health cuts etc arent goin to bother you. The only time it will really bother you is if the country is so badly effected they can't afford your services*.

*I know that in this case actually having a strong economy should mean your company makes more profit, but businesses if they were farmers they would still be practicing slash and burn agriculture rather than looking after their fields.

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Meh

This is why BT and Talk Talk rank the highest for Poor customer service - lots of offshore call centre staff ( veer from the script at your peril!). Santander brought the off shore jobs back to the Uk due to poor service. There are many solutions :- when you call a call centre ask to be put through to your home country, Buy local services. Many textile businesses that were lost have started to come back as the costs of shipping stuff round the world - has increased due to the oil price, now makes more economic sense to bring it back - and good.

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Anonymous Coward

Offshore the bean counters...

...and let them get a taste of their own medicine.

Fyi I left a Big 4 Consultancy a few years ago due to this. It just became too much and I didn't want to be a part of the brain-/skills-/job-drain. On what will our chaps and chapesses cut their teeth, and what happens when the off-shore country gets too expensive (which they already were for the various reasons mentioned in others' posts)? We will be over a barrel. Yes, offshoring will become offshore-squared/-cubed as it rotates around the various countries (India, China, Russia, Poland...) but, at some stage, this chain will snap and we will have no one with those skills.

So, back to my initial point, off-shore the bean-counters and we might actually be able to put some value back into our businesses while they are occupied elsewhere. And it would also be fun to see CFOs etc deal with the crap quality return from offshore deliverables.

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Anonymous Coward

pikey plc

if you think pikeys ripping up cables and selling them for scrap are savages just remember thats what greedy bosses and accountants have been doing to thier companies and staffs for years.

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Offshoring the CEO

If India has so well educated people, why not suggesting to the shareholders the savings that can be made hiring a guy from there?

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FAIL

When I pick up the ringing phone...

...and I get the tell tale pause and then an Asian voice the other end the phone gets put down straight away.

I just don't have the time to waste.

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Coat

What happens when...

... the people in 'the West' receiving calls from 'the East' are those who are unemployed, or now have 'value added' jobs that pay less, that means that they can't no longer afford the products that are being offered to them by the people to whom they lost their jobs, by the people who have taken them....

With another few million jobs about to outsourced, this may not be that far away...

Oh and lending money to those who can't afford what's being offered, I don't think they do that any more, or do they?

In the mean time, those senior enough, or those who just have money, well no problem for them, as ever.

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Unhappy

Re: What happens when...

Well its all part of the plan of the 1% to extract all the money from the rest of the world so they can enslave us all to make their luxury goods for just scraps.

When we are all poor the world over, production costs balance out everywhere.

Capitalist nirvana!

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