The government is set to refuse refunds to people who have forked out good money for ID cards. There will be a bill to abolish the cards, along with electoral and parliamentary reform - a move to equally-populated constituencies and to the Alternative Vote system - in the Queen's Speech tomorrow. But thousands of people …
To be honest
we dont seem to have any money to give back, thanks to the people who created the daft scheme.
Serves the silly sods right. Both opposition parties made it pretty damn clear that the scheme would be killed if they got any say in it.
I don't know about anyone else, but if I had an ID card I probably wouldn't be in a great hurry to put it - all full of my personal information - up for sale on Ebay as a collector's item. You do know who would be the collectors, don't you?
@Ask Labour for a refund
Erm. OK. And have you also been asking Tory HQ for a cheque for the millions pissed away by their wilful and deliberately awful method of rail privatisation? Or the poll tax fiasco? I expect Lord Ashcroft might suddenly be less enthusiastic about coughing up.
Quit moaning -- the trophy now belongs to you!
No amount of whinging about "Tory years of misrule" will change the fact that the Brown government was the worst we've ever had. Yes, poll tax was bad; yes, privatisation was botched; and yes, the Tories at their worst were strident and heartless. But not once, ever, has a Tory government managed to combine incompetence, envy, puritanism, profligacy and stifling political correctness on the scale managed by Brown's lot!
The Trophy for Worst Ever Government now belongs to *you* - so laugh it up, fuzzball!
I think you're forgetting someone...
Yes, Brown's been pretty bad. But there's no way he takes the crown from Blair. For sheer evil, misery and waste, Iraq and Afghanistan trump absolutely everything Browns done.
No surprise you're anonymous
I'd be thoroughly ashamed as well.
credit where credit is due
Remember it was Bliar who decided everyone should be bar-coded for eternity. And he lied about that too.
For sheer evil
You have to flag up Brown whilst he was Chancellor as well as Brown whilst he was PM. Blair might have sent the boys to Iraq and Afghanistan, but Brown was the one who didn't pay for their equipment, whilst instead running up the biggest deficit ever (and the biggest debt in real terms since the second world war) during a period of boom; leaving nothing in the bank for when things went horribly wrong.
Iraq was a big mistake, but in terms of effect on the people of the United Kingdom, Brown has done more damage than any Prime Minister I can think of since Sir Robert Walpole.
Get it right Fuzzball.
You didn't see anything praising Brown/Blair in my post did you? Blair turned out to be a crazed loon and Brown has screwed us all with overuse of of PFI (which the Tories invented and were going to rely on if they hadn't been kicked out). Don't know why Labour did all the control freakery shit. Let's see an end to it.
Shame that the thoroughly evil bastards have got their hands back on the tiller though. Because they're, like, thoroughly evil and all.
(Ashamed of my post pointing out Tories pissed millions away on politically motivated nonsense? Nope. Got my own reasons for posting anonymously.)
And we get the last laugh, ching.
A lot of the ID card work was about biometric passports, mostly the relatively small amount of money required in the IT systems to cop with ID cards will probably be retained by the IT companies in penalties. The big bikkies left would be the roll out of enrolment services which may well still be needed, which would have been a lifeline to your local post office.
Any aspiring back bencher want to ask the question "How much did we actually save by canning ID cards" in about 12 months time, bet it won't be much once termination fees have been taken into account. I'll bet it's all covered up by Commercial in Confidence to save embarrassment.
Oh, and I hope that some of our negative commentators out there are in line to loose their jobs when the government cuts back on IT, because a lot of dead wood will be cut from SI IT staffing to accommodate the really good people who worked on ID cards and others, bet you hadn't thought that one through.
Local Post Offices
Are you really saying that we should have kept ID cards in order to keep Post Offices from closing? That sounds like one quango justifying itself by supplying services to another quango. Scrap 'em all, I say.
Won't somebody think of the IT staff?
"...the really good people who worked on ID cards and others, bet you hadn't thought that one through."
The really good people will be transferred to other projects or have to find jobs in the private sector doing something useful. The fact that people are making money out of a boondoggle is no reason to keep it.
Rather than asking how much we've saved 12 months from now, ask how much we've saved 10 years down the line. Ask how much it would have cost to install card readers in every hospital, police station, job centre and every other government building where the public might interact with the state. The cost of that was never included in the Home Office cost projections.
And the real winner will be......
I think it will be the great British public that has the last laugh here, as it happens.
It has been said that at least 29 million ID cards will have to be sold for the project to break even in financial terms. That's at least 29 million people who will now not have to stump up the cash to buy into Nu Labour's Stasi population control project. That's at least 29 million people who will not have to pay up to a £1000 pound fine should they forget to update their details with the all-surveying National Identity Register. That's at least 29 million people who will now not have to carry an ID card around with them in their wallets to show to every jobsworth and petty official on every street corner. That's at least 29 million people........ oh well, I think I could go on all day about the numerous disadvantages and problems that this socialist dystopia project would bring with it.
Whether cancelling this project saves the treasury 2 Billion pounds or 2 pence, it will be the man in the street who will be quids in once it has been passed out of law.
What a strange link-up
So, by the same token we should have SS-style police in order to keep more people in employment?
I am a supporter of local post offices, but that doesn't mean I believe a liberty-infringing expensive and ultimately useless system should be implemented to save them. Dolt.
Also I seem to recall that Cameron declared a while back that any new contracts between then and him becoming PM would not be honoured, because he was making it clear that he would cancel them. I hope he sticks to it, if a company was stupid enough to take on a project which they knew full well would be cancelled, then no right mind would believe they should receive any compensation.
I suppose the SoGA/DSR wouldn't help them no? Goods not fit for purpose blah blah blah
Certainly should help them. The product's not fit for the purpose promised, so the vendor's obliged to either repair/replace it so that it is at no cost to the customer, or to make a full refund.
What better warning?
I hope the early adopters fail to get any kind of refund. Not because of a told-you-so vindictiveness, but purely because it will make it much harder for any authoritarian busybodies to have another try in the future.
ok you do that
I'll do it out of vindictiveness then ...
No refunds ought to be given. That fee ought to be seen as fine for supporting a traitorous act by supporting principles of being British.
If I want an ID card then I will move abroad to where I have to have one.
I disagree with abolition. Existing holders should be held to their freely entered obligation to keep their details up to date or pay a massive fine and pay for renewals at cost (which will be massive for so few idi^H^H^H takers).
Where is justice when you need it?
I almost agree
I did wonder, when abolition was mooted, that the best way to punish the early adopters would be to insist that they (and they alone) fulfil the obligations required, forever, of having to notify their Change of Details ....
But like I said, in victory, magnaminity (sp?)
_NOW_ I want one !!!
Serves the fools right
Anyone dumb enough to sign over there identity to the government without them using force deserves to lose their money, after all they have already lost their dignity.
The new government has the best 'sucker list' ever created, I would be spamming them now.
I would suggest that selling an ID card is illegal, in the same way that selling your passport would be, even if it expires.
Do we actually own our passports? I thought that they remained the property of the state.
Yeah, very funny
So those early adopters will be well out of pocket?
Well, I've got news for you - so are the rest of us!
You don't think all the stuff they've done so far was free do you?
After all they did to try to make this a success by buying into it, then they ought to be charged double for card disposal. And no point trying to fly tip them, your id is on our records.
This govt keeps getting better and better
I'm hoping the next thing they do is slash the Olympic budget in half, starting with dumping the special accomodation for the IOC and moving them out to a youth hostel in Hackney.
/doesn't really care about IT budgets as left IT long ago.
don't stop with the IOC
dump the lot
every last stadium
every last track
every last training facility
every last 'hospitality' facility
nothing in all that Government spending that will benefit any child / athlete north of Milton Keynes
. . . and let's face it, would be worth doing to hear that whining fool Coe's reaction <evil grin>
South of Milton Keynes
Given that somewhere in the region of 25 million Britains live south of Milton Keynes, I would have thought that having lots of facilities in those areas made a lot of sense. Especially since Manchester, Birmingham, and other more northern cities have got a lot of spending from other games (like Commonwealth games etc.) and from national bodies. The North has more excellent stadia than the South already thanks to the more Northern football teams as well.
Re: Milton Keynes
If 25m people live south of MK, that leaves 35m who don't.
60m of us are paying for something that will benefit less than half of the population.
May I just say...
a warm sense of satisfaction sweeps over me as I recall all those numpties who lobbied that ID cards were the best thing since sliced bread.
Just desserts that the retards don't get a refund
Collector's item ?
just stash it away for a decade and then flog on eBay :)
No Refunds = Stupidity Tax
@Richard39: damn right.
In fact, I know personally one of the utter prats who bought one of these. It pleases me no end to think the silly div wasted his money. Oh yes....
Rory Bremner was right
They needed to know where we live.
Oh the tragedy
In the back streets of Manchester, where *dozens* of bold "entrepreneurs" had staked their financial future on reverse engineering/copying the card, now facing *ruin*.
Won't *someone* think of the forgers?
BTW IIRC most of the actual *data* is held on the virtual database that *was* the NIR (let's make sure *that* is dismantled along with the more loonier parts of the IPS) stitched together from the data from 3 existing databases.
No sympathy from me, I'm afraid. If you've been mug enough to fork out good money for something that wasn't compulsory at the time - tough! They were always a dead duck. Glad to see the back of the idea.
Ha ha ha ha
Let me give them this tiny violin. With a little camera inside it to track them.
Stupid? No, just conned.....
Have a bit of sympathy guys. Most people who bought ID cards on the basis of the information put before them by the media - that they were a more convenient, cheaper form of passport. Have a look at the publicity, and most newspaper articles outside of the likes of the Guardian, and that's all you'd see. Same for most of the IPS staff who were duped into buying one - nobody telling them about £1000 fines and lifeflong data retention. You can only make a judgement on the basis of the info presented to you (OK, you should have the gumption to look a bit deeper, but do we honestly all do that? All of the time?)
So spare some thoughts for the poor dupes.
No, the villains I want to see punished lie elsewhere. It would be a joy to see the smile wiped off the fat, smug, overfed face of James Hall (IPS Chief Exec) and his "leadership" team, by having to make a public apology for the misleading propaganda they've been pumping out.
My ex almost got one for my daughter this Summer, as a "cheap passport". It would have worked out cheaper than a full passport, so she was advised to get one.
The "idiots" shouldn't really be ripped off like this, but I agree the ID evangelists who signed up just to support the scheme, deserve to lose every last penny.
These traitors to the cause of opposing ridiculous pointless & ineffectual government schemes should have to pay extra for having got them.
Did she, or didn't she?
I found an old Bagpuss in the attic yesterday, and it made me wonder if Jakkie/Jaquie/Jacky/fuck it had brought one?
Identity card I mean, not Bagpuss!
Mine's the dusty one with the orange and white tell-tale signs.
I am so glad I took the advice of a Reg'er and applied for a 5-pack of ID card applications, then mailed them to the likes of my local Labour MP, Meg Hillier and the like.
I know I probably end up paying the bill for the 'free' postage ... but it was truly worth it.
Serves them bloody right
Frankly, this is simply a case of the dangers of early adoption of new technology.
Am I entitled to a refund from you, Dear Register Reader, because I bought Betamax or an Apple Newton? No, you say, underwrite your own stupidity. Quite right too.
These people were warned, certainly by El Reg, that the opposition parties were committed to scrapping the id card project. So let that be a lesson to them about where they get their news from in the future should they seek to argue blissful ignorance of what the Con-Dems were planning to do.
But worst of all, these people were happy to take a cheap passport, subsidised by the rest of us, and permit themselves to be used as propaganda in the war against our civil liberties and privacy.
These dimwits thought it was all about a card and appear to have been incapable of conceptualising the NIR behind the card.
So to anyone who lost 30 quid: tough! It might not have taught you to value my liberties, but hopefully it's taught you about the dangers of early adoption.
Anyone want to buy a Newton? It's hardly been used ...
So how many people from the last government had one?
Title says it all really - any one know?
Of course they might have stayed away from them, what with all the different addresses they might have been using. Could have got a tad expensive in the £1000 fine dept...
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