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Windows Vista gets a lot of grief both in tech circles and the general public — but one Texas lawmaker wants to make it a matter of public policy. Democrat Texas state Senator Juan Hinojosa recently added a rider to Texas' $182bn budget plan that would ban the state's agencies from purchasing Vista (and all Vista-related …

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@AC - Biz specs

Exactly the point re: Vista and Business. Licensing a shed load of desktops is expensive, so you get away with the bare minimum you can on the desktop, enough for O/S, Office, couple of apps, not much else. The odd exception you add another 512M for the screaming PA or manager to shut them up so they can browse and work, but in the main most of us get dumped with a bog standard single CPU 512M/80GB trash pile running XP. Not great., but it's the cheapest there is and it works, most of the time!

Vista comes along and instantly the CPU is not quite good enough and the memory has to be doubled. Fine of Mr/Mrs Home user with a bit of spare cash to make a £20 memory purchase, but not for a business with a minimum of 3000+ desktops to upgrade at lets say £10 a stick of 512M or worse a new £500 desktop machine.

Sorry, but XP works with what we have paid for and the budget will certainly not allow upgrades for the forseeable, especially with Gordo doing his nest to put us all on the dole!

Me I tried Vista, it was OK, nice and shiny. ran everything I tried, but I dumped Windows and now the Lord Jobs is my shepherd at home and the Penguin is my worktime desktop co-pilot!

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Vista may be sh1tty but...

I wonder what a senator is doing proposing laws on what OS to use or not to use.

I mean, does he want to regulate the size of donuts in state agencies, too?

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@09:15GMT AC

"5) Lacking decent support. The only support you get are a few crappy forums populated with elitist geeks whose only response is "Go read the manual. EDUCATE YOURSELF!" Very helpful to the new user without a degree in computer science and rather abusive (a bit like yourself)."

Mmm. Because all commercial products have wonderful support, don't they?

Like one fax server provider who won't even provide access to a service pack unless the support contract is renewed. From the time it expired. 18mo ago. No per-call option. So that'll be £2k for two years of support expiring in six months just to get a service pack, then.

Now, about active community support?

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@Psymon

When I switched to XP for the first time on my old computer, an AMD Duron 700 with 256mb of RAM, it started almost as fast as Windows 98, it ran as fast and in some cases then Windows 98 and it didn't crash any more.

When I installed Vista for the first time on my at that point still recent computer (AMD X2 6400+, Nvidia Geforce 7950 GT), it took about 30 seconds longer to start up (even though I hadn't installed any apps yet), it ran like a dog and it ate most of that machine's 2gb of RAM.

Yes, XP used a lot more resources then windows 98. Yes, a lot of old machines couldn't handle it. But the majority of fairly recent machines (I believe mine was about a year and a half old at that point) could run it fine, without issues, a small speed increase and a major boost in stability.

Vista, comparitively, slows everything but top of the line hardware down to a crawl, it starts up significantly slower, runs idle at much higher CPU utilisation and has no major increase in stability over XP.

Add to that the driver issues at the start and you can't conclude anything but it being crap.

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Gates Halo

Clearly a moron...

"I've had no experience with the operating system, but heard bad things". Hmm yeah, thats pretty much the reaction of a lot of stupid people. Used Vista for years, only had one problem with it in all the time I used it. No incompatabilites, not even a BSoD. Though naturally, I will update to Windows 7 =)

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Coat

FWIW

I've used Win95, then 98 and 98SE for approximately ten years. I have very little exposure to XP, zero with Vista.

I moved to OpenSUSE 10.1 two years ago, later 10.3. Now my computer I built myself: AMD XP 2200+ CPU (1.8GHz), 512MB DDR, FX5200 graphics card. Yesterday I was OGGing another of my music CDs from my collection while watching a movie online with no problems (well, until the streaming server got a case of the hiccups halfway through [#&@^$*!%#^$@&&&#!!!!!]).

That said, consider this: I cobbled a machine together from a bunch of parts I was given. The main parts I used were a mobo made in the late 90s from some off-the-wall company on the outskirts of Io (had a devil of time finding info on setting the jumpers), 256MB SDRAM, an S3 Trio3D GC, and...wait for it...an AMD K6-2-300 CPU (yes, 300 MHz).

On this snail of a machine was installed OpenSUSE 11.0, which at the time was the latest version of OpenSUSE Linux. It runs just fine, albeit rather slow compared to my 1.8GHz system, but it is completely usable, her kids fight over it, and she can do more than just surf the web with it (read: watch DVDs, use OO with no problems, basically the same things she was doing on her laptop in XP [until she decided she preferred Linux over XP that is]).

This turtle of a computer would just run Win 98. I seriously doubt XP would be in any way usable on it. OpenSUSE 11.0 as I stated is quite usable and extremely stable.

Microsofties, take note: it is this ability to run on old hardware (TMK even 386-class CPUs) that IMO gives Linux a major leg up on Windows and the like.

BTW, I switched to Linux simply because of economics: for US $65 I received a full-fledged OS and thousands of applications, tools, utilities, etc. No need to buy or search the Net for other software to do what I need. As for Windows...

Also, I absolutely LOVE the software repositories: update all software installed from them in one place (software update module in YAST) instead of downloading individual updates manually then installing one by one. Windows on the other hand...

Mine's the one with the "Linux Shell Scripting with bash" in the hip pocket.

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@Ash OS v. Program

I understand a program to be something loaded into memory, or resident in non-volatile memory in order to execute a series of instructions. This includes Operating Systems which provide a fundemental interface with the basic system hardware. An OS is obviously a program executed by commands issued by a BIOS of some sort (even if it is simply an interrupt to say that the POST has completed).

An OS has to be designed coded, tested, compiled etc before it can be executed by the hardware - just like any other program - it can be edited and updated just like any other program (given the source and the tools etc). I will agree that an OS has a special status as an executive deciding how when and where applications should be dealt with and it provides a basic foundation on which to run other applications.

So an OS is a just computer program or collection of executable code. Don't accord any special significance to it. I'll agree to the distinction between 'OS' and 'Application' but not much more.

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@FWIW

Oops. I inadvertently left out a piece of code in my prior post. The line

"That said, consider this: I cobbled a machine together from a bunch of parts I was given."

should have been

"That said, consider this: I cobbled a machine together for my soon-to-be bride from a bunch of parts I was given."

The updated RPM is available at www314159.toerrbepenguin.ogg.

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Happy

Keep the date in mind!

I hope that you all noticed that this was posted on April 1st. I think there might be a connection.

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Perhaps he has a point...

Since the issue at stake was the IT budget, perhaps he was trying avoid it all being blown on unnecessary Vista upgrades. Let's face it, from a corporate perspective, there are almost no advantages to an upgrade from XP, which is why so few corporations have actually done it.

Being bullied by M$ is not a good reason to upgrade; justifying an upgrade with a sound business case is the right way to go.

Go Senator!

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Happy

Common sence

If there is nothing to gain from swithing to Vista, then why do it.

Simple as that, and a problem only for Microsoft.

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Anonymous Coward

@Jason Togneri

Are you confusing "will never run linux" with advocating linux? I thought my post was fairly clear on that, but apparently I stand corrected. I posted to say how impressed I was with Vista's performance on a low-spec machine and to take linux zealots to task, and you respond my calling me a muppet for advocating linux and hating on vista?! Erhhh....

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Happy

for being a vista virgin

He would have been better off working to get the religious right radicals off the state board of education. His time and effort would have been much better spent.

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Gates Horns

@ the bunch of braindead Vista tr0llz here!

You lot seem to think that "Vista runs fine on my $2000 gaming rig -after 2 month of heavy tuning" means "Big structures with thousands of 10-yo low-end machines should migrate to Vista".

Though I am a vocal *NIX zealot, I wouldn't advocate a massive migration to Linux or BSD for state administration in money-scarse times, either: in spite of the savings on hardware and licenses, the cost of staff retraining (or lost work hours) would be huge. It's even worst with a very expensive *erm* OS *cough* needing expensive new hardware. Especially as said *erm* OS' obsolescence is planned for later this year..

The guy is tech-illiterate and has no Vista hands-on experience... but who cares? He read complaints from state workers and saw the costs of Vista, that's more than enough to make such a policy. If you really, really need the latest, most expensive, least efficient and soon-to-be obsolete OS*cough*, you should have to justify why. It shouldn't be Vista-specific, either.

I doubt any politician have any hands-on experience on any issue they discuss. Which politico lost their house in the credit crunch? Which one ever went to war in Iraq? Which one ever got to guide a space shuttle? Which one had to suffer from gambling, or from sex abuse? Which one ever went to jail? Which one has hands-on experience on stem cell research? They just read up. That's good enough most of the time -when they ask for the right people's opinion, that is.

To the person here who dissed Linux on laptops and netbooks: most low-ressource portable machines (AKA netbooks or whatever) run massively faster with linux than with windows, the only problem -sales-wise- is stupid lusers unable to cope with a slightly different GUI. Those are lost with Vista, too. As for regular laptops, I do own two, they both dual-boot, and my custom Debian installs run better (including hardware support) than the factory-installed Vistas.

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IT Angle

The truth shall set you free...From MS BS

I live in Austin...its no hoax.

And to all you stupid MS shrills complaing about why a senator is making a law on tech when he is clearly nontechnical...I'll fill you in.

Like most rational people (none of who I live around), I hate...no, despise most things about TX. But one thing is for certain is the extent of truth being pushed down here in the last few years. Some of the smarter politicians are seeing the real effects of FOSS. Go read the Helios Blog for one of the best examples of actual results of Linux in the hands of "average users".

And as far as the money crunched lawmaker is concerned...have you MS hacks thought that because Win7 is coming out soon, that this law isn't concerned with tech at all, and simply done because the "next POS" he can buy is coming in a matter of months anyway. Id personally like to believe he's done this with the RIGHT intentions of placing TX on a more interoperable tech roadmap to look out for the best interests of the public. But like everything else in TX....it's probably about getting more money and looking good.

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Gaz
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Cannot shake the feeling

he is simply another headline chasing politician without a clue. That he seems to have the right intentions appears to be entirely by accident. Despite the apparent merits of this piece of legislation I would oppose it just on the fact it has been poorly thought out with little research...

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JC

What's The Fuss?

Vista costs more, runs slower, brings nothing to the table they need. It'd be dense to switch and therefore makes perfect sense to rein in the puppets that feel compelled to switch over because the latest isn't necessarily the greatest. Less is more.

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@ Rich Turner. Sorry. I was out of order.

First things first.

I got in from work at 8PM, thanks to yet another Windows "problem". Cold dinner syndrome!

I then proceeded to get pissed, and a little stoned.

I then saw the words Windows and Vista. The cause of my late working. I then saw you defending Vista.

I saw red!

I was bang out of order by calling you a tosser. You may well be a thoroughly nice chap! Sorry for that. I was the tosser...

However, although your words about optimising your Vista setup are valid, they miss the point somewhat.

Most Linux installs are secure and fast, straight out of the box. No MSCONFIG, no deleting crud from your Start up folder, no REGEDIT crap. NO version of Ms Windows is, from my experience, either of those! And that experience started at IBM-DOS 3.3 and Windows 3.0. Trust me on this, I've been in "Computering" for quite a while...

To the various "AC" posters. Ubuntu Linux certainly is "Ready for the desktop". I have installed it on nearly 300 "Home" PCs in the last nine months, and I have only ever had support calls from TWO users, One is as thick as pig shit, the other is an M.O.D. Plod. Need I say more!!! Those users range in age from 7 (my niece), to 75 (my Mum). With all steps in between. And no, they are not all family members. Most of these ordinary (L)users were amazed at how fast their computers ran after I installed Linux, after the drudgery of booting, and running XP or Vista.

There should be NO NEED to re-install the OS every year, because it has slowed to a crawl.

Umbongo, currently at 8.04 on this lappy,was upgraded from 7.04 to 7.10. It's still Fast as Fuck!

@ Poster who quoted re-training costs.

And what about the re-training costs involved with MS Vista. Loads of stuff has moved, or had it's name changed!

My 3 year old Dell Laptop (dual boot, obviously), takes over six minutes to finish loading XP.

It boots Umbongo in about 1 and a half. I can power up, login, send a mail or two, and shut it down, in less time than XP takes to load. Gnome is so easy to use, you really don't need a brain. It's just obvious, after about 10 minutes of "training"!

So, after all is said and done, All versions of MS Windows are a steaming pile of dingo's kidneys, Linux, of virtually any flavour, is superior in "almost" every way!!!

@AC's. If you won't show your name,or at least a "Handle", when you pass comment on ANYTHING, you snivelling wankers, then just eat Tux shit, then FOAD!

G'night all! Tux WILL rule.......... One day! ;oD

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@Codge

Linux is a crock of shit!

Which is why I use FreeBSD for serious stuff, and wait for it, Windows for work!

Different tools for different jobs.

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Figures Bush's state would do something like that...

Microsoft should tell the the legislature if they pass that bill Microsoft will pick up and move all of their Texas operations out of state and take all those (much needed, in this economy) jobs with them.

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Gates Horns

Poor Vista

Everyone hates you.

I waited a year to install Vista. It runs just fine, but my computer wasn't made in the '70s like so many "government" machines or whining sub-power-users. Of course, the only reason I installed it was for DirectX 10. (sneaky MS bastids). I like to use my video cards.

I like the way this politician refers to XP as a "program". Can we have more people in power that don't think computers still run on punch cards?

Everyone loves Bill!

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Stop

Dont' Mess With Texas

>>> Reminded me of those silly "Don't Mess With Texas" road signs

Maybe you don't understand all three meanings of those signs?

1. Don't litter in Texas

2. Don't enter into a war against Texas

3. Don't go into or have anything to do with Texas

Between the three possible meanings they offer something that is valid for everyone.

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Happy

IT always cost$

and an OS is a program.

as for April 1st , it must be .

Since when do politicians make such an acute and accurate call on savings ?on IT costs , Equipment , and retraining . Not to mention the headaches of learning Vista to be retrained on WIN7 in 2 months [95,98,2000,2003,now2007[2years late?]me,nt,xp,vista,?]

As for M$ leaving Texas over this . hahahaha no way. M$ have other BIG clients there . M$ has newer software they can push . [w7] . And if M$ did leave , who's to say the BIG T would not only succeed with out M$ , but show the BIG clients can too. Don't messy with the Texans..... I'm surprised the Rangers have not lassoed this big bull[y] already .

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@ Charles King

check your facts bubba!! GwBjr is a former governor but TX never gave him to us... he is a blue blood yankee...

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