back to article London officials declare cabbie-bothering Uber is legal – for now

Transport for London (TfL) has said that it doesn’t think that the app used by Uber drivers is in breach of the law by allowing them to use GPS and navigation to calculate charges, but it wants to refer the issue to the UK High Court. The capital’s transport authority said it didn’t agree that smartphones used by private hire …

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  1. Arachnoid

    So a a punter

    I could actually use the app to tell if the driver is trying to go round the houses by the scenic route and agree a price before hand.

    1. Tel

      Re: So a a punter

      I have long since lost any trust in black cab drivers since the day when I had to get from the West End to my dying mother in Enfield. The cab driver took a route so circuitous I'm pretty sure it went via Mars and certainly it took at least twice as long as any time I had driven (roughly) the same journey when I had access to a car... On top of that, the driver had no 'knowledge' of the area much outside the North Circular, and when he finally crossed that particular Rubicon, I had to direct him!

      Oh, and I arrived 20 minutes late for my mother's death.

      Black cab drivers can go f*ck themselves.

  2. ADJB

    Congestion?

    "The Licensed Taxi Drivers Association (LTDA) is planning a demonstration against Uber on 11 June, which it expects to cause severe congestion and traffic chaos in central London"

    and we will be able to tell the difference how exactly?

  3. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Predictable outrage

    Poorly socialised, overpriced, rent-seeking monopolists whose business model is essentially unchanged since the days they used horses instead of diesel engines, are outraged by an element of competition preferred by customers. What a surprise.

    1. Yet Another Anonymous coward Silver badge

      Re: Predictable outrage

      Yes but it's the only High Court the UK has got

  4. Spindreams

    I was in Rome for a shopping trip and took a taxi from the shopping center to the airport to catch my plane home, we new the route was short and should only have cost about $5 but the taxi guy drove us clear around the city to ramp up the price. I didn't want make a fuss while in the cab in case we got stranded by the driver, final fare was close to €50.

    I confronted him at the end of the journey and asked him if he thought I was a stupid and explained that I knew exactly how much it should cost, he made the excuse that there were road works that meant he couldn't take the normal route. I gave him €5 and told him where to stick it.

    This is just one of many bad experienced I have had with metered taxi cabs both aboard and in London, any app or tool that gives me more choice, better control and helps me avoid being con'ed is good and I am afraid the traditionalist taxi drivers who have what I see as an unfair monopoly should start to move with the times and think of their customers first instead of themselves, maybe then they wouldn't have to be so scared of loosing them..

  5. Elmer Phud

    mini-cabs

    Considering the number of mini-cabs round our way who have followed sat nav and are hopelessly confused I do hope they won't now charge for the mystery tours.

    A little Knowledge goes a long way

    1. theModge

      Re: mini-cabs

      Some of the ones near me do just that, by accident - free mystery tour with every journey. I'd suggest they were taking the piss, but they lack the wit (normally).

  6. ACZ

    Does Uber use journey GPS data to determine fares?

    I suspect that this might all hang on whether or not Uber uses GPS data from the actual journey to determine the fare.

    So, for example, if you go onto the Uber website/app, provide your journey details, and get a fixed price for the journey then there's no taximeter issue since there's no metering in the vehicle and e.g. delays in the journey, detours etc. won't affect the price.

    However, if the fare is determined at the end of the journey based on GPS data logged by a device in the vehicle (and e.g. transmitted to an Uber server which calculates the fare) then there must be a strong argument that it brings a taximeter into effect in the vehicle. There's caselaw where having part of a device/system in a different location wasn't a get-out-of-jail-free card.

    So I think that it might depend on exactly what that GPS data is used for - logging journeys for live journey status info, passenger safety and optimising future fare calculations is one thing. Using it to meter the journey is another...

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Does Uber use journey GPS data to determine fares?

      This is from TfL:

      “Smartphones used by private hire drivers – which act as GPS tracking devices to measure journey distances and relay information so that fares can be calculated remotely from the vehicle – do not constitute the equipping of a vehicle with a taxi meter.”

      Sounds like a taximeter to me.

      1. Oli 1

        Re: Does Uber use journey GPS data to determine fares?

        The crux is that a taximeter is physically attached to the vehicle. A mobile phone, not so much.

        No doubt, they will decide its all legal and above board, and then change the law...

      2. Graham Dawson Silver badge

        Re: Does Uber use journey GPS data to determine fares?

        The wording of that is a little spongy. Are they calculating the fare based on the predicted distance at the start of the journey, or are they calculating it based on how far the car travels?

        The latter would be a taximeter. The former wouldn't.

        Based on what I've read, Uber drivers do the former.

        1. Anonymous Coward
          Anonymous Coward

          Re: Does Uber use journey GPS data to determine fares?

          Uber calculate on actuals not predicted, and use both time and distance.

  7. Arachnoid

    On that note

    If the drivers could actually be relied upon to offer a good,predictable and accurate fare price would the service not have an increase in customer base because of it

    If I have a parcel delivered by for instance Royal Mail from A to B I dont get charged extra for road works etc so why as a passenger in a taxi is this any different?

    1. Tom 13

      Re: On that note

      I can see an argument for the taxi and not the mail. For the mail, they have an established route that goes by the delivery location every day anyway. A change in the route resulting from road work doesn't change that the mail still has and constant delivery schedule. Taxis are definitely ad hoc, heading only to your destination at the specific time you hire them and only for that trip. So charging for the detour seems fair, so long as the detour is actually for road work and is the shortest/quickest (depending on your which minimum you are seeking given known congestion) route to the destination. The problem is too many people don't feel taxis deliver that service.

  8. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Interested in the logic

    I am not one to defend monopolists but I question the TfL decision. The crux seems to be that the app might be like a taximeter, which it obviously is.

    TfL say the app is not a taximeter because it is not physically connected, but so what? The intent and result of the device is the same. Unless the law says how the device actually should work this seems like a mistake and I would expect the cabbies to win in court. If TfL don't like it then ask for a law change rather than just ignoring it.

    1. TRT Silver badge

      Re: Interested in the logic

      I think if they opened up the charging algorithm, then a legal determination could be made.

      The principle feature of a taximeter, in my mind, is that it includes a component charged by time and another charged by distance travelled. If the Uber app simply calculates the distance travelled and then presents that as a pence per meter calculation, then no, it's not a taximeter. If it presents the distance travelled and the time taken then gives a combined cost, then yes it is a taximeter.

      I believe that the word 'taxi' actually derives from the taximeter device rather than the other way around.

      1. Anonymous Coward
        Anonymous Coward

        Re: Interested in the logic

        The cabbies say they time and distance, hence taximeter:

        http://lcdcorg.wordpress.com/2014/02/07/letter-to-tfl-re-uber-and-our-concerns-regarding-using-a-taxi-meter-to-calculate-fares/

    2. Velv
      Headmaster

      Re: Interested in the logic

      Most of the bye-laws under which "licensed taxis" operate define quite clearly what constitutes a "taximeter". A quick search with a famous search app provided this from Reigate & Banstead Borough Council:

      The taximeter

      The owner of a hackney carriage must ensure the vehicle has a taximeter which is constructed, attached and maintained to comply with the following requirements:-

      (a) the taximeter should be fitted with a key, flag or other device which starts the machine, bringing up the word AHIRED@ on the face of the taximeter;

      (b) the key, flag or other device should be capable of being locked in such a position that the machinery of the taximeter is not in action and that no fare is recorded on the face of the taximeter;

      (c) when the machinery of the taximeter is in action there should be recorded on the face of the taximeter in clearly legible figures a fare not exceeding the rate or fare which the proprietor or driver is entitled to demand and take for the hire of the carriage by distance and time in pursuance of the tariff fixed by the Council;

      (d) the word AFARE@ should be printed on the face of the taximeter in plain letters so as clearly to apply to the fare recorded thereon;

      (e) the taximeter must be situated so that passengers can see all letters and numbers on its face. The display must be capable of being illuminated during any period of hiring; and

      (f) the taximeter and fittings must be fixed to the carriage with seals or other appliances so no-one can tamper with them except by breaking, damaging or permanently displacing the seals or other appliances.

      1. Bigbird3141

        Re: Interested in the logic

        That doesn't define the taximeter - it defines a class of taximeter acceptable for use in Reigate & Banstead by hackney carriages. If such a definition was the crux of the case then non-hackney carriage drivers could use such a taximeter and simply cover up the word "AFARE@" and claim "it's not a taximeter".

    3. Yet Another Anonymous coward Silver badge

      Re: Interested in the logic

      > The intent and result of the device is the same

      Then the same could be said of anything that charged you a fare based on the distance between the endpoints - like a train ?

      1. bluepolo1971

        Re: Interested in the logic

        No... because the fare is set in advance

  9. ukgnome
    Coat

    I heard that the Luddite Black Cab drivers are also trying to ban A to Z guides and Google Maps also.

    *the one with, oh no hang on, I left it in a taxi, I will never get that back now - TAXI!

  10. DSGiTechGuy

    What about getting uber et al drivers done for hire and reward. I'm sure their insurance won't cover them if they are found to be running people about for profit...

    1. Velv
      Headmaster

      Clearly you haven't bothered to read the article or any of the background material.

      To be a driver under both apps you must already hold a private hire license from the council and be operating a vehicle that complies with all the relevant restrictions around private hire (i.e. insurance).

      These apps aren't just for picking up random people at the side of the street who might be going the same way you are!

  11. Eradicate all BB entrants

    Look, its quite simple ......

    ...... that it isn't a taxi meter at all. It's just a booking app with a calculator. It records the distance traveled then gives the price for that. It is merely the software version of the minicab driver looking at his trip odometer then lowering the sun visor and checking the distance against the charging table.

    The other way to prove it isn't a taxi meter is that there isn't a £3.50+ charge on it for putting the taxi in first gear.

    1. melswife

      Re: Look, its quite simple ......

      Look, its quite simple ......

      ...... that it isn't a taxi meter at all. It's just a booking app with a calculator. It records the distance traveled then gives the price for that. It is merely the software version of the minicab driver looking at his trip odometer then lowering the sun visor and checking the distance against the charging table.

      The other way to prove it isn't a taxi meter is that there isn't a £3.50+ charge on it for putting the taxi in first gear.

      actually that's not quite right. uber will give you a quote for a journey. then the uncalibrated and hidden from view meter monitors time and distance. only at the destination is the final price known. unlike taximeters in black cabs the fare structure is not set and regulated by the major's office. uber are free to set their own pence per minute/mile and via google maps the driver is shown the shortest route to take. not the cheapest route. they also charge £6.00 minimum for their cheapest car option so a flag fall of £3.50+ (it's actually £2.40 in a london black cab) would be very unpopular.

  12. Velv

    I've seen a lot made about the accusation about these apps being a "taximeter", but what is the license constraint on how a private hire vehicle actually charges for a journey.

    Is it a fixed price agreed in advance? (guess not)

    Is it based on time?

    Is it based on an old fashioned ruler measuring a distance on a map?

    Are there fixed fees between waypoints that gets added up?

    Is it just the driver suggesting a figure off the top of his head (feels like it sometimes).

    That is the crux of the problem. While the licence may say that "private hire cars cannot use taximeters", what does it say should be used instead? And an app on a phone is not a taximeter. A taximeter is a well defined calibrated physical entity that is hard connected to the vehicle, and that is covered by law.

    1. melswife

      Is it a fixed price agreed in advance? (guess not)

      Is it based on time?

      Is it based on an old fashioned ruler measuring a distance on a map?

      Are there fixed fees between waypoints that gets added up?

      Is it just the driver suggesting a figure off the top of his head (feels like it sometimes).

      That is the crux of the problem. While the licence may say that "private hire cars cannot use taximeters", what does it say should be used instead? And an app on a phone is not a taximeter. A taximeter is a well defined calibrated physical entity that is hard connected to the vehicle, and that is covered by law.

      yep it should be a fixed price agreed in advance.

      unlike uber it is not based on time.

      yes PH charge on distance only.

      not sure i understand the waypoints question.

      though illegal yes, sometimes a driver can be approached or vis versa and a price given off the top of the driver's head. it is called touting and is an arrestable offence.

      a device that combines both time and distance taken to calculate a fee is a taximeter. the fact it is not calibrated, not on view, not regulated by the london major and possibly open to software hacking makes it a very poor taximeter. it would also be illegal in both ph and taxis

  13. basil66

    What is the logic of only allowing licensed cabbies to have taximeters? What next - are they going to say that only licensed cabbies can play 1980s music … It seems an anachronism from decades ago that is well past its sell by date

    1. Tom Wood

      I'm lacking in context here, not knowing what Uber is. But round here (Leeds) and in fact in many non-London cities I've visited, private hire firms (minicabs) often have "meters" fitted and charge the fare based on the meter. Now these often have LCD screens and don't look exactly the same as meters in black cabs. Are they not classed as "taximeters" either, or is the whole thing about no taximeters in private hire cars some London-specific rule?

      1. DPWDC

        @Tom Wood

        Also in Leeds and was thinking the same thing... Usually prefer it when they have the meter running as they won't pluck a number out of the air when the journeys done.

      2. jonathanb Silver badge

        This has been answered below, probably after you posted this. The rules on private hire cars not being allowed meters apply only to London.

  14. MarkA
    Facepalm

    Really? This is so new to you guys in London? I would have thought London would lap this up, given the state of the minicabs sometimes. In Philadelphia we've been using this for ages. Want to hop from one bar to another? One of us opens the app, decide on whether to get a town car or an SUV (# friends, distance, feeling flush or not etc) gets the cost from source to destination from the app (It maps your current location off the phone to the address you enter as the destination). Vehicle arrives. Go from A to B by any damn route he wants because you've paid both fare and tip by credit card so it's in his interest to get you there asap and become available for the next trip. The fact that you've paid a sum based on the most efficient route on the map, why would the driver go round the houses!

    It's easy. It's safe. It's comfortable (although I'll confess that the Crown Victoria's used in Philly as taxi's would make Indian Railways look good.)

    I detect the whiff of Spanish Practices. They hate Uber in New York City amongst others and I'm stunned that the union-stuffed city of Philadelphia hasn't kicked up a fuss; they seem to have just taken it in their stride and they're expanding.

    1. DPWDC

      You pay the tip BEFORE you've had the service? Madness!

      1. Spindreams

        In the US a tip is just an expected part of the payment, it is not given as a reflection of the service provided. Which is why yanks tend to think foreigners are cheap as we tip as a tip should be for good service and if we don't get it we don't tip leading to foreigners never tipping when they go to the US. :)

  15. David Thorn

    Has anyone actually used them?

    There seems to be all sorts of speculation here about how it is charged for but surely the easiest way is to just use one and see what happens.

    Like this:

    Fare Breakdown

    CHARGES

    Base Fare £3.00

    Distance £1.92

    Time £1.30

    Charge subtotal £6.22

    DISCOUNTS

    Rounding Down -£0.22

    Discount subtotal -£0.22

    TOTALS

    Total Fare £6.00

    Amount Charged -£6.00

    Outstanding Balance £0.00

    Trip Statistics

    DISTANCE

    1.30 miles

    DURATION

    7 minutes, 15 seconds

    AVERAGE SPEED

    10.76 mph

    1. Tel

      Re: Has anyone actually used them?

      I can walk 1.3 miles in not much longer than that time and at less cost in shoe leather. Also I don't have to finance a monopolistic cartel.

  16. Anonymous Coward
    Anonymous Coward

    Road Traffic Act "Inconsiderate driving"

    Doesn't that apply?!

  17. Hollerith 1

    Market forces

    Uber's fares rise and fall according to demand. When its raining and cold and cabs are scarce, they can and will jack up the price. When I use a black cab, I have one daytime price, the same whether it's raining or not, and one night-time price, which is not hugely different. I am in a big comfortable vehicle that can accommodate my mobility-disabled partner. I don't have to get out my phone to get a cab, I just stick out my arm. I don't say I love black cabs -- some drivers are good, some are bad, etc, but they have the edge, for me, over having to do a lot of sorting and admin on a tiny little screen, by being hailable.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Market forces

      They'll also ignore you if they want to get to a more lucrative pick-up spot, refuse short trips, refuse to venture "sarf of the river" once the sun's past its zenith, and frequently display a level of "knowledge" that suggests they lend their cab to anyone in the family (having to get the A-Z out for a trip from Waterloo Station to Kennington Oval springs to mind).

  18. TopOnePercent
    Go

    I can't wait to see what the cabbies union makes of self driving google cars. Quite obviously someone will setup a business allowing you to hail a car using a smartphone and be driven where you want to go based on a fee.

    As the car is a capital expenditure rather than time based cost, with fuel being the only distance related item, a fixed price fare should be possible.

    The best part? No driver. So anyone that can afford the car and relevant licnecing can set up as their own cab firm running as many vehicles as they can afford.

    Think about the possibilities..... EasyCab budget market with plastic chairs and flooring, normally upholstered cars, luxury hire with more space and leather / wood... SleazyCab self driving stripper cabs that charge more per mile.... the opportunities will be endless.

    So I reckon instead of holding back progress, the cabbies should see which way the wind is blowing, start saving up, and then retire to Spain while their JohnnyCab earns their living for them.

    1. phil dude
      Thumb Up

      supply, demand, the need for humans...

      My 2 cents, after discussions with random truck drivers and cab drivers about googles efforts.

      I don't think that self-driving cars will eliminate taxis any more than cars did the Hansom cab (well, whatever Sherlock was using...).

      Ultimately, the driving part of the job is only a bit. Taxi drivers also shift luggage. And possibly wheel chairs.

      At least in my utopian view of the world.

      But just as with Hansom cabs, there will be fewer of them.

      Oh and of course, google will need to make their self-driving cars with room for 5 and a turning circle for a london street.....

      P.

      1. JC_

        Re: supply, demand, the need for humans...

        Ultimately, the driving part of the job is only a bit. Taxi drivers also shift luggage. And possibly wheel chairs.

        A driverless car could still be serviced, it'd just be another amenity to pay extra for, in the same way as a posh restaurant will have someone to take your coat while at Nando's you sort it out for yourself.

        More than likely it'd be easier to order a serviced cab via an app than walking along the taxi rank to find a driver willing to leave his cab.

  19. bluepolo1971

    http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1998/34/section/11

    Private Hire Vehicles (London) Act 1998

    11 Prohibition of taximeters.

    (1)No vehicle to which a London PHV licence relates shall be equipped with a taximeter.

    (2)If such a vehicle is equipped with a taximeter, the owner of that vehicle is guilty of an offence and liable on summary conviction to a fine not exceeding level 3 on the standard scale.

    (3)In this section “taximeter” means a device for calculating the fare to be charged in respect of any journey by reference to the distance travelled or time elapsed since the start of the journey (or a combination of both).

    1. MarkA

      Section (3) ought not to apply because the whole pricing and even payment part is done between your iPhone and the Uber service. All that gets passed to the driver is where who you are, how many there are, where to pick you up and where to drop you off. You are explicitly told that the driver will not take money from you in tip and he has no means of taking any card payment from you at all anyway. Maybe some do but I've never offered and never had a nasty glance after getting out of the car so clearly it's all working tickety-boo.

      Bottom line here? The market has spoken in many cities and in spite of all the union bullshit lobbying going on it's legal and people like it - A LOT.

  20. J.G.Harston Silver badge

    s//in London/

    ...in London ..in London ....in London ....in London. Almost NONE of this applies to civilisation, London has its own London-specific taxi licensing laws.

  21. Lars Silver badge
    Happy

    Taxi driver

    I have followed this discussion about traditional taxi versus Uber and similar in GB and the USA.

    But so far I haven't read even on comment written by a taxi driver. Having been one for some time I would like to tell you about it and you.

    You piss and shit and vomit, you cut and steal, you cheat and rob and even kill. Sometimes the only way to deal with you is to call the police or other drivers for help. Sometimes several persons are needed just to get your fat body out of the cab. Now, of course, that is not all of you, but even as there are less than one bastard in one hundred a taxi driver will regularly have to deal with it. I have of course used cabs too in different countries but most if not all have been decent helpful and honest. It differs in different countries and towns. The worst to date was a mini buss driver in Egypt.

    But let me continue with the “funny” guys among you. Taking customers at the airport will regularly reward a driver with the guy who tells you how far he came from and how very cheap it was. Next he wants to know how in the hell he has to pay so very much just to get into town. Stupidity hurts. So what do you say. All alone on a private plane, what a bargain. Or you should have gone with the crowd and take the public transportation, it's such a bargain too if you cannot afford a taxi.

    Then there is the occasional representative of God who wonders if you believe in him. You can of course ask him which one he refers to or try with - Oh yes but I also believe in Father Christmas. I also remember a nice looking American lady I took to the airport who asked me if I believe in the “climate change”. I told her I find it more like a fact than a belief, next I had to listen to the “no change facts” all the way to the airport. Stupidity hurts. This might sound as if I am both rude and talkative, the sharpest weapon a taxi driver has is in fact silence when needed but sometimes there simply is to much shit in such a small space.

    The reason for conflicts between a customer and the driver is more or less always the route and the fare.

    If the fare is set in advance the driver has no logical reason to take the “poetic” scenic route unless of course it's the only one he knows or if in fact that rout happens to be the best or then he is fed up with guys who get upset when he takes the good route along roads the customer never knew existed.

    I remember a guy who got aggressive because of the (good) route I took and told me he never never ever uses that route. I then asked him why he has an opinion about a route he never uses. Stupidity hurts. He was so upset that when we came to his home he demanded I would drive back to town and then back to his home along his route. If his route was cheaper then he would pay me nothing if not he would pay both and the trip back to town. He lost, and payed and his wife laughed and looked so damned happy I felt a bit sorry for him.

    If the fare depends on a taxi meter then the logic is the same. Time is money as they say, There is absolutely no mathematical reason to extend the trip from A to B. If you want to make some money as a taxi you want to get your customer out as fast as possible, and find the next as fast as possible.

    There are, I suppose, countries and towns where there simply is not enough customers for the cabs and that will increase the temptation for the scenic routes.

    However, as a taxi you find that most people use the same familiar routes, home, work and so forth knowing hardly anything else about their town. And then there are those who normally use the public transportation and feel that it's the only route no matter how stupid it is.

    I remember an old taxi driver who told me it's a rather funny profession because every customer is a better driver has a better car and knows all the routes better too.

    In a way you could compare a town to a graph paper. You want to go from bottom left to top right but because of the squares you have to take on right then one up and so on. Or you can go all the way to the right corner and the right up. Or right up from the left corner and then all the way to the right. The distance is always the same although there are many different routes.

    Theoretically the fastest routes are the ones along the edge of the paper. But the chicken brain sitting behind you will feel more uncomfortable because it feels like driving in the wrong direction for too long.

    Any way too much text already, but let me add. As a taxi I had lots of interesting wonderful and decent customers. Still I wonder if there is any other profession where you meet the same amount of bastards and where you have to listen to the same amount of shit in such a small space alone.

    Finally about Uber and similar. Driving a taxi was a profession once, a man and a cab, able to support him self and his family. Uber and similar are the McDonald's of the taxi profession, they will make a good profit, but they will have drivers as uninterested of having it as a profession as are people working at a Mac. It will be something you do for a while cheaply until you find something better.

    If the old system does not change with the time they will loose.

    And if you folks want to find out more about your town and its people do some time as a taxi.

    Also dear Reg reader now is your chance to think about how you behave in a cab. Use a mirror.

    Finally one of the positive surprises as a taxi was that young kids tend to behave better than adults.

    1. Anonymous Coward
      Anonymous Coward

      Re: Taxi driver

      "If the fare is set in advance the driver has no logical reason to take the “poetic” scenic route unless of course it's the only one he knows or if in fact that rout happens to be the best or then he is fed up with guys who get upset when he takes the good route along roads the customer never knew existed"

      Good, don't want the driver taking a poetic scenic route unless specifically asked to do so; I can't think of a single cab journey I've done in the last year or so where only a single route is available. The most abuse I've had from a cab driver recently was having collected some colleagues at Heathrow getting a cab to Stockley Park and having an black-cab driver complain very loudly about not getting a fare taking "fat stupid Americans" (he inserted an Anglo-Saxon f in there as well) from the airport to "some overpriced hotel" in the West End - and doing so in front of US visitors.

      The recent record for stupid journey has to be a cab driver who he actually thought a sensible route from Greenwich parish church to Creekside involved going all the way round the one way system, up to Blackheath Road, then along Deptford Broadway & down Church Street, when all he needed to do was turn right: due to dim-witted route he ended up with a fare of nearly £20 when a private hire car for the same start - end journey is £3. The fact it can be walked in five minutes is no reason for the cab driver taking the p*ss as he did: the fact that there were no speciai circumstances (roadworks, etc) and the fact that the cab driver chose to drive three sides of a square, ignoring the fourth, and just assuming the customers would have no idea which way to go should be a reason for him losing his cab as a consequence of deliberately ripping off his passengers. The fact that when asked why he thought three sides of the square represented a reasonable route he replied "it's the way the rules say i have to take fares to Creekside" was laughable.

      Based on those two journeys I could suggest that cab drivers are sometimes less than polite and do not, unhesitatingly, choose the best route for their customers. "Now, of course, that is not all of you,"

      1. This post has been deleted by its author

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