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back to article That's right, MICROSOFT is an ANDROID vendor after Nokia gobble

Nokia won't be changing its strategy now that it's been gobbled up by Microsoft, its former CEO Stephen Elop has said. Elop, who has returned to Redmond after almost a four-year absence to head up the software giant's new Devices Group, said in a blog post on Friday that we'll continue to see the same mix of Nokia-branded …

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Microsoft finally distributing the Linux Kernel, and obliged to abide by all that GPL goodness. That's got to hurt,

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Anonymous Coward

I knew they'd concede.

The Windows fanbois will be here in a bit, telling us how great Linux/Android is.

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they got the cancer

it metastasized... Well, I'd praise Microsoft if they have admitted the win of Google and and how Linux, GNU and the free software are good.

No, Microsoft have always been as hypocritical as Putin is right now. Bad for both Putin and Microsoft. Elop has been honest compared to those two...

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You've been able to purchase GNU/Linux from MS for ages as it's one of the options in Azure.

Microsoft have always wanted one thing and one thing only: your money. They're Old School like that.

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Happy

nothing new

Microsoft might not be a top 20 Linux contributor anymore but the story has changed, as have the economics.. for very surprising reasons. Microsoft's "beef" with Linux was about the desktop, which was set to be decided with the 64-bit migration, which Microsoft has won with Windows 7.

on the devices front Android has won because every SoC/component developer builds for Linux first: performance/cost advantages have been institutionalized, and that can only change if Linus Torvalds goes soft and Linux kernel gets big and flabby for cloud coverage.

the next big story with android is going to be the unexpected decision for Obama and the rest of the US government to get Windows phones

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Angel

I'm sure they are crying all the way to the bank.

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They are one of the bigger contributors to the Linux kernel, mainly for the stuff that makes it work on Hyper-V.

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Re: nothing new

'Microsoft has won with Windows 7' ??? that it no longer publicizes... win8 is all it *sells* now... you can get legal win7 discs from everyone else, though... unless they are stoopid/ being bribed by MS/ think HUGE blocky GUI is great... :/

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Microsoft distributing Android ..

@MrMur: "Microsoft finally distributing the Linux Kernel, and obliged to abide by all that GPL goodness. That's got to hurt"

Now that Microsoft is distributing Android, it would be a good time for Google to sue them for violating the Android terms of service, as in Microsoft is extorting revenue out of the other Android phone makers, under threats of litigation ..

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LDS
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Hurt what? They have to abide to the GPL only for the GPL related stuff. And probably the will abide far better than many "Linux developers" who ignore the GPL as much as they like.

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Re: nothing new

No, Microsoft's beef about Linux has always been about its GNU license, not about the software, and not about it being open source. That was the basis of Ballmer's famous comment that software distributed under the GNU license, like Linux, was a "cancer".

Of course, Linux or open software fanbois would have you believe otherwise.

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Joke

MS also have a history of buying non-windows tech - Xenix, Hotmail, CPM, VMS^H^H^H...

Of course, then they mess them up. ;)

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> They are one of the bigger contributors to the Linux kernel, mainly for the stuff that makes it work on Hyper-V.

They _were_ 'one of the bigger contributors' for _one_ month and only for Hyper-V stuff.

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Re: nothing new

> Of course, Linux or open software fanbois would have you believe otherwise.

I am not sure what the 'otherwise' would be, perhaps you could explain.

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Anonymous Coward

non other choice

Windows phones is selling badly what else could they do?

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h3
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Microsoft is a better contributor to Linux and Open Source than e.g certainly Amazon and maybe even Google. (At least all the stuff Microsoft contributed went into the main kernel). Amazon almost certainly has loads of stuff that could be in Xen. Google's Android kernel was a total mess I think they are trying to contribute a bit but its just dumped out there lots of their OSS stuff.

Android might as well be closed in lots of ways due to the fact that the Google Play Services malware is the bulk of the OS. (I have a Google experience device with a set of apps that works perfectly until the play services update is forced onto it which happens constantly). Battery lasts about 3/4 days with play services 3.2 with any 4 or above then it loses about 10% in a 15 min drive.

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@h3

Microsoft is a better contributor to Linux and Open Source contributor to Linux and Open Source than e.g certainly Amazon and maybe even Google

Not sure about the former, it is certainly not true about the latter. One can easily ascertain this fact by seeing what each of them use and develop. For Google it's mostly open platforms on the Linux kernel, for MS it's their own proprietary kernels and platforms.

As far as the Linux kernel contribution is concerned, look in the .config file for yourself and grep it with-i 'microsof\|hyper'

grep -i 'microsof\|hyper' /boot/config-$(uname -r)

CONFIG_HYPERVISOR_GUEST=y

# CONFIG_SYS_HYPERVISOR is not set

CONFIG_HID_MICROSOFT=m

# Microsoft Hyper-V guest support

# CONFIG_HYPERV is not set

Right, it's the hyper-v modules and some drivers for touch devices, like mice and keyboards. Nothing more.

Google's Android kernel was a total mess

It's not only the Google's development, you seem to be unaware, it's the OEMs and ARM system manufacturers'. The chip man's have been creating this despicable mess, rather than Google. BTW, originally, Microsoft had to clean up the mess of their own with HYPER-V, otherwise the modules would be ousted from the main Linux kernel tree.

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Microsoft's contribution to the Linux kernel

git grep -i 'cop.*microsoft' in my local git kernel build directory, MS' copyright is present in the following:

Documentation/usb/linux-cdc-acm.inf:; Copyright (c) 2000 Microsoft Corporati

Documentation/usb/linux.inf:; Copyright (c) Microsoft Corporation

drivers/hid/hid-hyperv.c: * Copyright (c) 2010, Microsoft Corporation.

drivers/hv/channel.c: * Copyright (c) 2009, Microsoft Corporation.

drivers/hv/channel_mgmt.c: * Copyright (c) 2009, Microsoft Corporation.

drivers/hv/connection.c: * Copyright (c) 2009, Microsoft Corporation.

drivers/hv/hv.c: * Copyright (c) 2009, Microsoft Corporation.

drivers/hv/hv_balloon.c: * Copyright (c) 2012, Microsoft Corporation.

drivers/hv/hv_snapshot.c: * Copyright (C) 2013, Microsoft, Inc.

drivers/hv/hv_util.c: * Copyright (c) 2010, Microsoft Corporation.

drivers/hv/hyperv_vmbus.h: * Copyright (c) 2011, Microsoft Corporation.

drivers/hv/ring_buffer.c: * Copyright (c) 2009, Microsoft Corporation.

drivers/hv/vmbus_drv.c: * Copyright (c) 2009, Microsoft Corporation.

drivers/net/hyperv/hyperv_net.h: * Copyright (c) 2011, Microsoft Corporation.

drivers/net/hyperv/netvsc.c: * Copyright (c) 2009, Microsoft Corporation.

drivers/net/hyperv/netvsc_drv.c: * Copyright (c) 2009, Microsoft Corporation.

drivers/net/hyperv/rndis_filter.c: * Copyright (c) 2009, Microsoft Corporation.

drivers/scsi/storvsc_drv.c: * Copyright (c) 2009, Microsoft Corporation.

drivers/video/hyperv_fb.c: * Copyright (c) 2012, Microsoft Corporation.

include/acpi/actbl2.h: * Copyright 2006 Microsoft Corporation.

include/linux/hyperv.h: * Copyright (c) 2011, Microsoft Corporation.

tools/hv/hv_vss_daemon.c: * Copyright (C) 2013, Microsoft, Inc.

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Anonymous Coward

"That's got to hurt"

Yep - all those Linux security patches and vulnerabilities must be a nightmare for them...

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Anonymous Coward

And Windows has 'Services for UNIX' that can be installed if you need to run legacy / OSS stuff.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: nothing new

You realise you can set Windows 8 to boot straight to the desktop? And it just becomes a better and faster Windows 7?

Faux News are the only corporate I know who are using Modern UI as the primary desktop mode.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Microsoft distributing Android ..

"Now that Microsoft is distributing Android, it would be a good time for Google to sue them for violating the Android terms of service"

Microsoft never signed up to the Android Terms of Service. They don't distribute any of the Google spyware with their build.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: non other choice

"Windows phones is selling badly"

Relative to other platforms (except Blackberry!) it is right now, but it is growing by more than any other OS year on year.

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Re: non other choice

> but it is growing by more than any other OS year on year.

In 2007 Microsoft had 40% of the market in what are now called smartphones. Currently they have less than 4%.

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Re: non other choice

> but it is growing by more than any other OS year on year.

According to Nokia itself their sales of Windows Phone for 2014Q1 was less than 2013Q1 and less than 2013Q4.

"""Nokia writes in the Q1 2014 results:

The year-on-year and sequential declines in discontinued operations net sales in the first quarter 2014 were primarily due to lower Mobile Phones net sales and, to a lesser extent, lower Smart Devices net sales. """

http://communities-dominate.blogs.com/

But _you_ certainly don't want facts to get in the way of your fanaticism.

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Re: non other choice

>> but it is growing by more than any other OS year on year.

>According to Nokia itself their sales of Windows Phone for 2014Q1 was less than 2013Q1 and less than 2013Q4.

They didn't say that the amount sold each quarter was growing. It's quite possible to sell ten million one quarter and nine million the next quarter and still be growing faster than others. What you provided doesn't invalidate the claim at all.

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Re: non other choice

>>> but it is growing by more than any other OS year on year.

>>According to Nokia itself their sales of Windows Phone for 2014Q1 was less than 2013Q1 and less than 2013Q4.

>They didn't say that the amount sold each quarter was growing. It's quite possible to sell ten million one quarter and nine million the next quarter and still be growing faster than others. What you provided doesn't invalidate the claim at all.

In what way is selling _less_ than the previous quarter (or year on year) represent _growing_ ? Even Nokia acknowledge it as a decline.

While 2013Q4 units may have been more than 2012Q4 and thus growth, that has not continued and there is decline (negative growth) in 2014Q1 compared to 2013Q1 (year on year) and also compared to 2013Q4.

Also FirefoxOS and Jolla's SailfishOS are showing _huge_ growth is sales since last year (when it was zero), far greater growth than WP, so the claim 'more than any other OS' is simply wrong.

In any case the sales of WP increased last year because most were sold at a loss - even taking into account the $billion dollar subsidy from MS. Some people just want a phone, don't care what the OS is, and buy the cheap one. That works for Android too.

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Trollface

Or maybe

They could swallow their ego, snuff out Windows 8 and Windows phone, sell android phones and a new hybrid NT-Linux with 100% Win API compatibility!

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Re: Or maybe

but still LOADS of people out there who have no clue, *only* go to facebook, have their nose firmly connected to MS... :)

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Re: Or maybe

They could swallow their ego, snuff out Windows 8 and Windows phone, sell android phones and a new hybrid NT-Linux with 100% Win API compatibility!

And Pigs will fly!!

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Coat

Re: Or maybe

"And pigs will fly"

Price of bacon is rising.

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Linux

Tee hee hee hee hee...

:-)

That is all.

...Cirdan...

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Windows

Re: Tee hee hee hee hee...

Just waiting for the first photo of a Microsoft branded Android phone to hit flickr, twitter or whatever. Will need to go outside and check that the sky is still up then.

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Re: Tee hee hee hee hee...

"Microsoft branded Android phone"

Not likely since they purchased the rights to the Nokia brand for mobile devices.

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Re: Tee hee hee hee hee...

"Not likely since they purchased the rights to the Nokia brand for mobile devices."

For two or three years only, if I recall correctly. By then though, they'll probably snuff out the Nokia X line.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Tee hee hee hee hee...

"Not likely since they purchased the rights to the Nokia brand for mobile devices"

No they didn't. They purchased rights to the Lumia name, not Nokia.

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Re: Tee hee hee hee hee...

> No they didn't. They purchased rights to the Lumia name, not Nokia.

No. You are quite wrong, again. Microsoft have purchased a license to the Nokia name but not Lumia.

"""Microsoft will license the Nokia brand for existing products, and will retain Nokia's Asha brand - used for low-cost devices in emerging markets – although the licensing deal doesn't include the Lumia brand."""

http://www.stuff.tv/microsoft/hello-micro-kia-microsoft-buys-nokias-device-arm/news

""" ... Microsoft announced that it had obtained a 10-year license to use the Nokia name in smartphones as part of its $7.2 billion purchase,"""

http://www.mobileburn.com/22785/news/microsoft-set-to-phase-out-nokia-brand-in-favor-of-yet-to-be-chosen-name

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history is always repeated.

Hotmail was UNIX only at the back-end before M$ bought it. Then they replaced each UNIX server with 10-20 windows servers to try and handle the load. They had to roll back a few times, the same thing will happen with Nokia's Android phones. Leave things as they are for now, but within 5 years time there will no no such thing as an Nokia Android phone, they will all be Microsoft windows phones sold under the M$ sub-brand name of Nokia for now. But in time that will migrate to Microsoft.

They want to be Apple, and they think that being in peoples pockets and being a brand that they see many times a day will help move them to this position.

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Not convinced

Elop ended Symbian, restricted Meego to small markets and made Nokia into a Microsoft Partner. The results were so devastating that it looked like Microsoft would not buy Nokia and Elop would not get his $25million bonus (with his specially reduced tax rate). I thought Nokia's Android phones were released to hit Microsoft on the head with until they bought Nokia. If Microsoft wanted to end the X family, Elop would have released another 'Burning Platforms' memo as it worked so fast the last time.

Microsoft Android remains in existence for a reason. My guess is that Microsoft know the carriers will not tolerate Windows Phone being successful on their networks. The carriers understand that being locked into Microsoft technology leads to becoming a Microsoft Partner (then it's bend over and trouser down while Microsoft empties your pockets).

Personal computers are now called smartphones, so to stay in the computer business, Microsoft needs a presence on smartphones. That is why we have Office for iPhone and Nokia X (Android without Google Play). Microsoft started Linux distribution when Novell became a Microsoft Partner (where are Novell's trousers now?). All that remains is Linux on Azure.

Microsoft Linux is here to stay - the OS for those who cannot afford the ever-rising Windows lock-in costs. The most obvious threat to the Nokia X family is a re-release the N9.

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Trollface

Mmm.......that's interesting.

"My guess is that Microsoft know the carriers will not tolerate Windows Phone being successful on their networks. The carriers understand that being locked into Microsoft technology leads to becoming a Microsoft Partner (then it's bend over and trouser down while Microsoft empties your pockets)."

Given that the US carriers have bent over to take up the back passage from Cupertino ever since the first iPhone was released one would assume that having to reach for the vaseline was something they were entirely used to.

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Re: history is always repeated.

Microsoft does not want to be Apple. They would like to have Apple margins I'm sure, but to 'be Apple', no.

Nobody but Apple actually wants to be Apple. Sure, the money right now is fabulous, but the way Apple operates is the most stressful and precarious way to operate a business in any industry. I know some of the CEO's who run the largest tech companies on Earth and nobody envies anything but the money Apple makes and regardless of what the proles believe, even most debilitatingly greedy business professionals will only go so far to make their money.

Apple is the paragon of micromanagement gone mad and it's a company only a parent could actually love, and it killed its father (stress being more of a growth accelerant for cancer than smoking and boozing combined). At the staff level there's no flexibility, no creativity (which is hilarious), no individuality and no thinking about anything other than right now.

At the executive level there's nothing. As close to the Void as you can get in this dimension. The only individuality ever expressed by any Apple executive was Steve Jobs wearing a turtleneck, but that was like a king wearing a crown or carrying a scepter, simply an identifier for the public. He took it off when he wasn't speaking in his official capacity. I never once saw him outside of an official Apple function wearing one. It was top grade marketing, not an eclectic fashion choice.

Apple has perfectly good products, leadership marketing efforts, great accounting and gloriously effective manufacturing capacity built into their designs and the company is completely lifeless and moving into a glass donut that will only make it worse.

Nobody wants to be Apple. Besides, they've got no business presence, so it's just too far to go to emulate Apple. Why bother. You can still make more money than you can spend in a lifetime and you actually get to enjoy the yacht you commission before you die just by hammering the business market.

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Re: history is always repeated.

Good point. Once upon a time Hotmail was the No.1 *free* mail service. MS got hold of it, tried to change it (as you stated, MS servers couldn't do it for ages) and now, basically, it's gone.

The same was with ICQ. MS bought it, tried to change it to run on their stuff... now it's gone.

Nokia? *poof* in a few years.

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Headmaster

@Don Jefe A very interesting perspective.

I will admit that the possibility that at least some of the senior managements within the industry might not think that game was worth the candle is a thought that had not occurred to me.

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Re: history is always repeated.

Microsoft bought ICQ?

Was that before or after AOL bought it?

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@Arctic Fox

Big time executives are people too (except for the Lizard People) and lots gets made out of a few extreme cases, but overall it's about the same mix of people types you find anywhere else. The absolute loons are somewhat over represented once you pass the $1B point, but again, that entire level of individual wealth is extreme fringe.

When it's just a bunch of people with similar jobs and levels of wealth the desires, actions, conversations and everything else are no different than you'll find in any expat pub on Earth. The giant table everyone is seated may have cost $400k, but the Heineken from the 7-11 everybody is drinking cost the same, and still tastes like shit :)

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Mmm.......that's interesting.

The carriers might get screwed by Apple but they probably feel its the best sex they have ever had,

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LDS
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Re: history is always repeated.

Yes, but it was UNIX - Solaris, IIRC, not Linux. Back them MS server operating systems suffered from the lack of 64 bit versions and lack of Intel 64 bit hardware to run on... things changed a bit since then, didn't they?

Even Linux then was a little operating system with several limits.... IIRC Hotmail was acquired in 1997, about the same time Linux released kernel 2.0, IIRC 1.0 could handle only one CPU... and probably only an Intel one too.

It's funny how people repeat themselves stories twenty years old without understanding what's happened meanwhile....

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Thumb Up

Re: history is always repeated.

"Yes, but it was UNIX - Solaris, IIRC, not Linux. "

I wondered if anyone would mention that.

From what I gather, Sun Solaris run the backend mailservers and storage, whilst FreeBSD/apache the front end web servers and cgi's

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Coat

Re: history is always repeated.

They want to be Apple, and they think that being in peoples pockets and being a brand that they see many times a day will help move them to this position.

To bad its not a brand that I want to see outside of my Windows 7 Desktop, much less on my TV after having suffered though two dead 360s. The closest MicroSoft will ever get to my Pocket is the Coat with the USB Thumb Drive executable installer of Windows 7 in it.

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Re: history is always repeated.

> IIRC 1.0 could handle only one CPU... and probably only an Intel one too.

Let us compare that to MS-DOS 1.0 and Windows 1.0 then ..

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