Feeds

back to article In MASSIVE surprise, world+dog discovers Nokia checked out Android

Reports have emerged over the weekend that Nokia had run up research lab versions of its Lumia phones running Android, and that this was somehow linked to Microsoft's decision to finesse the Finns. Kicking off the clickfest was the New York Times with this post that offered the following analysis: A team within Nokia had …

COMMENTS

This topic is closed for new posts.

Page:

Nokia becoming more like M$oft alredy

Paid billions to NOT do something. Nice gig, that will destroy Nokia.

18
7
Bronze badge

Re: Nokia becoming more like M$oft alredy

I'm not so sure.

You say "M$oft" but a lot of people aren't so... adolescent about things like $s. Don't you need $s? Or £s or something? Doesn't Apple need $s? We can't all be Linus Torwhatever he's called.

In reality Nokia could have gone to the wall and sacked all its staff. As it happens it's been bought by a company which has taken over its debts. Good news for people who like great Finnish tech.

10
31
Silver badge

"Nice gig, that will destroy Nokia"

Not really, Nokia dropped their mobile phone unit, collected some cash, and is now free to do new things. Maybe they can go back to being an obscure Finnish company (now with a lot of money in the bank) or maybe they can come up with the next big thing.

7
2
Anonymous Coward

Re: Nokia becoming more like M$oft alredy

Your adult logic is outstanding! It's no wonder the economy is is such a good state.

2
8
Silver badge

Mistakes

Nokia, once the leaders made mistakes years ago, holding on to Symbian for too long then bottling it with Meego and failing to jump on the Android band wagon.

Now part of he 'empire' innovation will be stifled by the needs of MS.

Independence turned to dependence. How sad this has been for the maker of the worlds most iconic phone ever, the 8210.

9
2

Re: Nokia becoming more like M$oft alredy

What Finnish tech? Manufacturing is in Asia and the software is US, Nokia doesn't do it's own thing anymore.

Nokia will soon lose symbian and as even the cheap end of the market will die off as Android seem to run on lower and lower spec with each iteration.

M$ will simply make Windows phones and eventually realise the % is too low to make money and can the job, like Zune and all their other failed attempts.

7
3

Re: "Nice gig, that will destroy Nokia"

Nokia have nothing left. They sold the Nokia and Lumia brand name to Microsoft too. Even if TKFKAN wanted to make a mobile they couldn't use the Nokia our Lumia names.

In short they can only really make Wellington boots.

1
8

Re: Nokia becoming more like M$oft alredy

"Android seem to run on lower and lower spec with each iteration."

Ha ha. Ha ha ha ha. Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha *bonk* <- sound of man laughing his head off.

Er, no. Android on low end hardware is rubbish - I love Android on high-end hardware, but that's the only place it really shines. But it's cheap so low-end manufacturers will keep sticking it where it don't shine (as it were)... Its only other saving grace there is that low end hardware is slowly getting more powerful to the point it will run Android acceptably. Windows Phone does actually run pretty well on low-spec hardware; that was one of its design goals from the outset.

8
7

Re: Mistakes

Weird. Every forum has a declaration like yours 'the most iconic phone ever, the xxxx' and they all say different phones.

That last Nokia phone I saw before the Lumia series that was worthwhile was the N95.

5
0
Bronze badge

Re: Mistakes

> holding on to Symbian for too long

Letting it stagnate too long, yes. Taking to long to make the UI nice, yes.

> bottling it with Meego

Definitely,

> failing to jump on the Android band wagon

Once they gave up their own systems, they were doomed.

5
0
Bronze badge

Re: Nokia becoming more like M$oft alredy

> Nokia will soon lose symbian

Are they still producing Symbian phones?

I thought they were completely Windows and S40. (I notice the latest S40s have features like SIP clients and Maps that previously were only in Symbian devices)

0
0

Re: Nokia becoming more like M$oft alredy

Seems to be a lot of blind loyalty on these forums...anything remotely criticising Android seems to always get a downvote! I agree completely, Android is great on high end (although I still think it's often inconsistent and fiddly for the non-techy user compared to iOS and WP8) but awful on low-end hardware. Windows Phone runs incredibly well on very low-spec hardware, and the UI is consistent, clean and easy to use (yeah yeah, some people hate Metro but I happen to like it).

I just can't understand this blind hatred of a copmpany and its products...WinPhone is a good product (and yes, far better than Windows 8, so credit should be given where credit is due). You think Microsoft is evil? I'm really not sure Apple or Google are any better these days. I can only guess people here are so loyal to Android because you can fiddle about with almost everything on it in a really geeky way...which is great (I enjoy this myself) but almost everyone else I meet couldn't care less about that stuff. Go out in the street and ask any Samsung Galaxy user what 'rooting' means. Hell, ask them what Android is. You'll get a lot of blank looks, I guarantee it.

I'm sad that Nokia's devices division has now been sold - I still use Symbian - but I think that Nokia's management made the right decision at the time...I don't think Android would have allowed them to diffrentiate their handsets enough and as mentioned, Android runs like a dog on low-end chippery. Unfortunately it's all gone to shit now, but you never know, the new MS Lumias may be really good if they keep the Nokia division autonomous enough. I however shall be looking to Jolla from here on in, eagerly awaiting my pre-order!

10
2
Bronze badge

Re: Nokia becoming more like M$oft alredy

Er, no. Android on low end hardware is rubbish

That would depend on what you define as low end hardware and what you want to do with it. Jelly Bean runs quite fine on a 1GHz single core chip with 512MB memory. Good enough for some simple gaming, music listening and even some video watching, if you can live without HD content.

3
1
Silver badge

Re: Nokia becoming more like M$oft@ Ian 7

"Windows Phone does actually run pretty well on low-spec hardware; that was one of its design goals from the outset."

Which surely was a pointless goal. All the money is made on premium handsets so that's where user experience counts, and buyers at the bottom end are unduly influenced by whatever is topping the charts.

Samsung tried selling cheap phones with a non-Android OS (I think LG did, too) and the market still turned to Android. We'll see how the cheap phones with Firefox sell - my suspicion is that neither Firefox nor Ubuntu will endure.

If MS are banking on the capability of WP8 to run well on landfill handsets, then they're saying that phone purchasing decisions are logical. If that's the case, then why have so many of the expensive Lumias come in Chad Valley colours, why don't they have replaceable batteries, and why constrain their phone UI with an opinion polarising tile interface, with each one of these choices further sub-setting your potential market? Indeed, why produce the technically impressive, yet comically coloured, zero-battery life, camel humped 1020 if you think that the buyers of cheap handsets simply want a fluid user experience?

3
2
Anonymous Coward

Re: Nokia becoming more like M$oft alredy

It's amazing that the press is shocked by Nokia looking at Android before taking Microsofts money.

Both Google and Microsoft courted Nokia.

Microsoft not only brought more cash, but also gave Nokia a way to differentiate from other handsets.

The reason Meego was a non starter is that there was a high barrier to attracting developers to designing apps for the handsets.

It's just the cost of doing business.

There's more but even this is a tough pill to swallow for the Microsoft haters.

3
2

Re: Nokia becoming more like M$oft @Ledswinger

Quote:

""Windows Phone does actually run pretty well on low-spec hardware; that was one of its design goals from the outset." Which surely was a pointless goal. All the money is made on premium handsets so that's where user experience counts, and buyers at the bottom end are unduly influenced by whatever is topping the charts."

I think you are looking at the point of low end hardware especially from the WP perspective a little short sightedly. Obviously every company wants to make as much money as possible however with a long term business strategy you cannot put the chicken before the egg.

The market share for WP is low which means that developers are more hesitant to create applications for it than for iOS/Android. Multiple countries and users in every market of the world either choose not to or cannot afford high end spec cell phones therefore to drive interest in the platform, create additional market share and as such then increase developer interest in the platform it is critical to provide multiple price points for the market. The profit per handset at this particular time for the platform as a whole is less important than increasing the overall market share % numbers.

Check the web for sales information on the lumia 520/521 and you will see why its important, you could even try using Bing to search :)

I also enjoyed (can you sense the sarcasm) your random comment about the 1020 (comically coloured, camel humped, zero battery life) seems you could not resist going there. Comically coloured...thats why many major handset producers are now going with colours e.g. HTC, Apple, Motorola (errrm I mean Google), if you want a camel hump grab your backpack and pick up a GS4 Zoom not a 1020. I heard you need at minimum some kind of bag to carry the lens!! Also based on your opinions of WP I highly doubt that you have even tried using a 1020 so forgive me if I take your battery life comment as a complete waste of time and energy.

0
3
h3
Bronze badge

Re: Nokia becoming more like M$oft alredy

They didn't even really try with Meego. (I was interested in it but they purposefully didn't want to sell to the UK).

The Symbian UI's never bothered me really. (At least compared to the benefits on battery life).

The Apps though put everything on one screen which was great for me and there was usually only one or two good choices for each type of app.

(For me good user experience is open the app and see everything I want as fast as possible. The modern definition seems to be make it look nice above all else.)

0
0
Silver badge

Re: "Nice gig, that will destroy Nokia"

"Not really, Nokia dropped their mobile phone unit, collected some cash, and is now free to do new things."

Maybe they could have collected more cash back when their mobile phone unit was still worth ten times as much, if they wanted to get out of the consumer product market.

0
1
Bronze badge

Re: "Nice gig, that will destroy Nokia"

"Nokia have nothing left. They sold the Nokia and Lumia brand name to Microsoft too. Even if TKFKAN wanted to make a mobile they couldn't use the Nokia our Lumia names."

Nokia has plenty left. NSN hasn't gone anywhere and is generating revenue. Also had you done some research, you would know that they only licensed the Nokia name so if they really wanted to they could make a mobile under Nokia name.

Those are damn fine wellington boots. Highly recommended.

1
0

This post has been deleted by its author

Anonymous Coward

Who "finessed" who?

Could those fiendish Finns have wanted to offload their mobe arm? Perhaps sensing the sector has peaked and leaner cut-throat commodity times lie ahead? By low, sell high: If you can find a stoopid enough mug. Just need to find a dimwitted tech dinosaur with no significant mobe manufacturing interests but reeking desperation to get some... fast... in a big way... and with the requisite $beeeeelions to burn. Damn. Not many of those around... Uncle Fester to the rescue!

I wonder what the future holds for Noksoft... and how the refugees are getting on in their jolla. Hard to imagine a more cunningly planned, iron clad, beautifully executed "complete refresh".

7
0
Silver badge

Re: Who "finessed" who?

That only works if you care exclusively about the continued existence of the Nokia parent company, and don't care about the public brand, the staff or the shareholders.

Sounds pathological to me.

3
3
Anonymous Coward

Re: Who "finessed" who?

Sounds exactly like the correct perspective of Nokia (its directors and its shareholders) to me. If the business is unsustainable then let someone else preside over the decline. The staff would be in the same boat regardless of company ownership and as for "brand cache" ...well if you're cashing out anyway, who TF cares?

4
1
Bronze badge

Re: Who "finessed" who?

> Could those fiendish Finns have wanted to offload their mobe arm?

I seriously doubt that was the plan prior to the burning platforms fiasco. (Hasn't their share value lost 85% or something since Elop's been in charge, I recall the burning platforms knocking a huge amount off,)

However once they had wrecked their smartphone market, they effectively became a dutch auction. (Though a dutch oven might be more appropriate), this tactic could well have been to force Microsoft to make a move, before the price dropped even further.

Nokia pulling the plugs on Windows phone would have killed the platform.

3
0
Silver badge

Re: Who "finessed" who?

You are aware that Elop bought high, sold low?

He presided over (and probably directly caused) the biggest crash in shareholder value Nokia has ever had.

Perhaps it would have fallen anyway, but it probably wouldn't have been as fast or as far, though alternate futures are hard to predict.

3
0
Silver badge
Meh

Why wouldn't Nokia try to do what anyone can do?

Especially when they have MS and it's tens of billions in Windows (Read: not Windows Mobile)-related hoarded cash to bail Nokia investors out of a failed business?

2
2
Silver badge

fun to watch

the next year of watching them flail helplessly will be hilarious

7
1
Anonymous Coward

Thank god!

Mmmmmmm I love the fact that Microsoft bought Nokia. It brings joy to my heart to know that we will never, ever, see a Nokia phone running the spyware abomination know as Android. It will hopefully silence the small but vocal bunch of retards that post comments on tech websites along the lines of ‘I would buy a Nokia 925 if only it was running Android’ etc.

Bliss!

11
35
Anonymous Coward

Re: Thank god!

Morning mmeir.

Don't worry, your friend RICHTO/TheVogon will be along to play in a few hours. Hang in there.

11
0
Silver badge

Re: Thank god!

It will run the spyware abomination known as WIndows Mobile.

Not that much difference actually - they are aiming for the same business model. MIcrosoft is simply being less successful in their execution.

16
4
Anonymous Coward

Re: Thank god!

"It will run the spyware abomination known as WIndows Mobile."

Surely you mean 'Android, Blackberry and IOS"?

http://gizmodo.com/the-nsa-can-access-basically-everything-on-ios-android-1272773413

Windows Mobile even though it had over 50% of the smartphone market at one point was actually never hacked, and Windows Phone is (so far) the most secure of current generation handsets.....

2
12
Anonymous Coward

Re: Thank god!

Windows Phone is (so far) the most secure of current generation handsets.....

Only because so far no-one's cared enough about it to hack it.

9
0
Anonymous Coward

Re: Thank god! @AC 07:30

"Only because so far no-one's cared enough about it to hack it."

Your statement is false.

Plenty of people have expressed their desire to run Android on Nokia handsets but nobody has achieved to do it. There's many people in the world who like to hack all sort of gadgets and WP is no different.

2
10
Anonymous Coward

Re: Thank god! @AC 07:30

It's not that no'one's bothered to "hack" it because no-one uses it - although that's close to a compelling explanation in itself. Rather, why would the USNSA hack something when they've already got a gaping backdoor to slip in through? Always have done. On the desktop too. NSA_KEY anyone? If you run an MS OS then USNSA pwns you... this was OBVIOUS before the Snowden "revelations" and is obvious and CONFIRMED now.

8
2
Anonymous Coward

Re: Thank god! @AC 07:30

What have Android and Nokia got to do with Windows Phone being considered secure against hacking? Windows Phone is not widely used, so no-one has bothered to look for security flaws yet.

1
1
Anonymous Coward

Re: Thank god!

> never, ever, see a Nokia phone running the spyware abomination know as Android

Yes, because the NSA just has to tell its bitch Microsoft they want access to a phone, and they will bend over. No need for hit and miss spyware.

4
0
Anonymous Coward

Espionage?

" because the project was confidential. Microsoft executives were aware of the existence of the project"

That deal with the NSA is a two way street.

7
1
Anonymous Coward

low memory

Is this why the first Lumias were released with only half a G of ram? To discourage hackers from getting Android working?

2
0
Anonymous Coward

Re: low memory

"Is this why the first Lumias were released with only half a G of ram? To discourage hackers from getting Android working?"

No - because Windows Phone is far more efficient and doesn't need it...

5
12
Bronze badge

Re: low memory

Indeed it is, that's why the first lumias only needed seven seconds to switch between apps

14
0
Bronze badge
FAIL

Re: low memory

Ribosome:>Is this why the first Lumias were released with only half a G of ram? To discourage hackers from getting Android working?

No. The first Lumias were released with 512MB of memory because the built-in OS worked well with that. Sure, there were 1GB Androids available, but there were 512MB Androids available back then as well. (which probably remained at Gingerbread and never got the ICS treatment)

I also browsed through a few Lumia 800 reviews (Engadget, GSMArena, cnet) and none were bitching about the RAM.

The highest-end iPhone (4S) at the time had 512MB and worked pretty damn well, and has had constant updates, including the soon to be released IOS7. (which is admittedly much better than the WinPho 7.8 with the first gen Lumias)

Have the tables turned re Linux and Windows now that the battle has move onto the mobile front?

Linux dominates with significant market share, the hardware requirements are highest, they have the biggest app selection (or maybe IOS does, dunno), and Android is also the only current platform with a serious malware problem.

3
3
Anonymous Coward

Re: low memory

Android runs on 512Mb or upwards. All Lumias have needed more than this.

If you want an Android phone to work like a Lumua, go into the developer settings and disable multitasking (background task limit = 1). This replicates Windows Phones rubbish task switching precisely.

The short is: The more memory you have, the better you can multi-task. and if you have an entry level Android phone with less than abouit 768Mb of RAM, your multi-tasking experience may be sub-par, just like Windows Phone... Android is actually more efficient with memory than Windows Phone, simply because Android can do so much more than Windows Phone with the same hardware. Like proper multi-tasking for instance.

4
6
Anonymous Coward

Re: low memory

Linux dominates with significant market share, the hardware requirements are highest, they have the biggest app selection (or maybe IOS does, dunno), and Android is also the only current platform with a serious malware problem.

Android != Linux

Android includes Linux as it runs upon it. Android is a whole OS layer on/in a JVM and that's what makes it comparatively heavy... and offers opportunity for lean & mean Linux based alternatives like Jolla, Tizen, Ubuntu, Firefox, etc...

3
2
Bronze badge

Re: low memory @AC 08:37

>Android != Linux

Android is just another distro. Ubuntu or Yggdrasil (add your favorite) users in general claim to be linux users. OK, some do add the GNU/ prefix just in case...

3
2
Anonymous Coward

Nokia on Android?

Trojan horse Elop would have none of it.

After all, what has his role other than to decimate Nokia's value within two plus years and then have Microsoft acquire Nokia at a great bargain?

Now watch as Microsoft, too, will slowly 'die' like IBM, Kodak etc.

4
5
MJI
Silver badge

Re: Nokia on Android? decimate

He has knocked a LOT more than 10% offthe value of Nokia

7
1
Anonymous Coward

Re: Nokia on Android?

IBM made profits in 2012 of $16.6BN they have ~430k employees. That's a pretty good "death" by anyone's reckoning. Just because you use android and do a little computing at home, doesn't mean that you know about the IT industry as you have just ably demonstrated. Just so that you know, Google made $10.74bn in the same period with ~44k employees, they are by any measure a smaller company, unless you count number corporate jets, I guess.

IBM don't do consumer, so there is no way that you'll come across their products or services, unless you actually work in IT and you've adequately demonstrated that you don't.

8
0

Re: Nokia on Android?

Because....there was no way that Nokia was already heading towards the ever-approaching spiral of doom before Elop got involved....no way at all....

Jeezy Creezy. Elop may have been a facilitator, but I'm so tired of people acting as if Nokia had a strong forward presence and success ahead of it as it was going. The company was going to collapse just as much, if not more, before MS got their grubby paws near it.

Even if Nokia had produced an Android phone (which, if you'll remember at the time would've been as hated as Windows Phone - as the Nokia fanbois were all raging about Meego being the future) it would've been just another range of tedious handsets with that bloody slow operating system on it. Instead, at least the company has managed to push forward in a direction that wasn't Google or Apple driven.

5
3
Anonymous Coward

at least the company has managed to push forward in a direction that wasn't Google or Apple driven.

An interesting use of the word forward.

5
0

Re: Nokia on Android?

In September 2011, Nokia had an arguably viable smartphone product with the N9, at the time Android had 50% market share up from 25% the previous year. Windows Phone had 1.7% down from 2.7%. Elop bet that version 8 of windows phone would be so mind bogglingly good it'd be worth burning both Nokia's platforms, and delaying having a viable product in the segment for a whole year when they were already very late to the party.

I think Elop's reputation as the CEO who sank Nokia is well deserved.

2
0

Page:

This topic is closed for new posts.