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back to article Bolivian president's jet grounded so officials can look for Snowden

Bolivian president Evo Morales was obliged to land in Vienna en route home from attending a gas exporters' conference in Moscow over suspicions that NSA-contractor-turned-whistleblower Edward Snowden might be aboard the presidential jet. According to the BBC, Austrian officials who searched the jet have given the all-clear, …

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Gold badge

This has now officially..

.. turned into a farce.

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Happy

Re: This has now officially..

Where are my trousers? The ambassador's coming to tea in a minute, and I can't find them anywhere. Oh no, that's him at the door now! I'll hide in this cupboard while he's here.

G'Day ambassador mate! I've got the consul's trousers here, I was just borrowing them for a nice young sheila I got back there on the sofa. D'you know where he is?

in walks a loveable policeman

Oi! You're not allowed in here. Diplomatic immunity!

'Ello ello ello sir, you're right. I'd better hide in the bathroom, before the ambassador spots me, and I cause a diplomatic incident.

[probably best I don't give up my day job]

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Re: This has now officially..

Oh no it hasn't.

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Facepalm

Re: This has now officially..

It would have been a farce if young mister Snowden was on the flight but didn't get caught because he changed his first name to Eduardo.

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Go

Let's see if they make it this time:

http://www.flightradar24.com/data/airplanes/fab-001

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Thumb Up

Lady Penelope in that one? Didn't know Parker was a pilot as well

Jeff will be happy to see her.....

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Black Helicopters

Stop the Pigeon

Starring Barrack Obama as Dick Dastardly

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Facepalm

Re: Stop the Pigeon

Psst.

Lady Penelope was in Thunderbirds. Dick Dastardly was in a cartoon with a different Penelope - Penelope Pitstop. Hopefully, nobody will notice your continuity error, though... I won't tell anyone. That's why I'm whispering.

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Re: Stop the Pigeon

It's more complicated than that. The studio liked to reuse their popular characters in different settings: Dick and his sidekick appeared in three programs: Wacky Races, Perils of Penelope Pitstop and Stop that Pigeon. Penelope appeared in two of those, as did the Ant Hill Mob - but not appearing as the same named characters or professions.

It could be seen the animated equivalent of the same actor appearing in many different films playing different characters, but always the same archetype. Think someone like Laurel and Hardy: They played different characters every film, but really they were always playing their own act and everyone loved them for it.

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Stop

Re: Stop the Pigeon

I think I can untangle this.

The Lady Penelope being referred to by the honourable JayBizzle is a totally different character to the Penelope Pitstop of Wacky Races fame (and The Perils of Penelope Pitstop)

I'm assuming the association JayBizzle was making to Lady Penelope was as a result of the link to FAB-001, F.A.B. being the radio acknowldgement of the Thunderbirds pilots.

I was making a reference to the OP defining the situation as a farce, Stop the Pigeon was a farce and I was drawing a parallel to the nature of the Pigeon (being a spy messenger) and his pursuer the repeatedly foiled Dick Dastardly. I was not building on the Thunderbirds reference.

Now that that's all sorted out everyone else can all go back to their lives safe in the knowledge that there is someone who is anal enough to read the replies to his own posts, try to understand them, point out continuity errors or misunderstandings and how they were derived.

Unfortunately I have to live with myself.

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Re: Stop the Pigeon

Ah, okay. I thought you were mistaking Lady Penelope for Penelope Pitstop - you clearly know they are different, though.

However, @Suricou Raven:

"It's more complicated than that. The studio liked to reuse their popular characters in different settings: Dick and his sidekick appeared in three programs: Wacky Races, Perils of Penelope Pitstop and Stop that Pigeon."

My recollection is that Dick Dastardly didn't appear in The Perils of Penelope Pitstop - the only one in which they appeared alongside Penelope Pitstop was the Wacky Races. I'm pretty sure Penelope's nemesis in The Perils was a character called something like The Hooded Claw (who I think was the alter ego of someone she thought was a friend).

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Re: Stop the Pigeon

You're right about the Hooded Claw trying to get our beloved Penelope. I could be wrong here, but I seem to recall the 'friend' was her lawyer trying to get his hand on her fortune. The Ant Hill Mob was there to protect her.

A quick trip to IMDB http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0173587/?ref_=fn_al_tt_1 has just confirmed the ol' marbles are basically intact for the mo.

What were we talking about?

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Re: Stop the Pigeon

I dunno. Something about a pigeon not being found on a grounded jet, flown by a bloke called Parker.

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Land of the free... home of the brave

The U.S.A. needs to get its house in order and Cameron could be seen to be a player on the world stage if he gets some balls (not the Ed kind) and says to Obama, "listen Bara me old chum, hows about not bugging everyone, yeah? Other NATO countries don't like it, especially if you don't tell them"

There is no longer a cold war and you will not reduce the threat of Terrorism from pissing off all of your mates.

Team America World Police.. Fuck NO!

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Land of the free... home of the brave aka Team America World Police (OT)

Off topic, but if someone has NOT seen "Team America" - DO, it's hilarious.

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WTF?

Re: Land of the free... home of the brave

"There is no longer a cold war and you will not reduce the threat of Terrorism from pissing off all of your mates."

You honestly think that no other country in the world spies on its supposed allies when it suits them? Where do you live , Innocent Cottage, 1 Naive Street, Dumbville?

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Land of the free... home of the brave

So? Because it's done, it should be accepted? Because it's done, it's automatically effective? You think it's right and you're fully behind the practice? You believe that freedom and democracy are meaningless words? That people who dream of making the world better should just let it go, and we should be happy to be on the path to a perfectly fascist society where your opinion does not matter a bit to your government?

If that's what you want, as you pointed out, there are countries like that already. Why don't you emigrate there and applaud happily at their governments actions?

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Trollface

Re: Land of the free... home of the brave

'Fuck yeh'

I can't watch the whole of Team America, reality documentary films tend to bore or upset me.

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last month the US was complaining about China's spying as though nobody ever did such a thing

There is normal spying for military security threats.

Then there is industrial espionage.

But then there is capturing all the internet traffic from every single citizen.

What is the purpose? It clearly is NOT to fight terrorism.

Looking at what they capture their motivations include:

1. Turning over the trade secrets of EU companies (like Siemens) to US companies (like Intel and Motorola).

2. Capturing the bargaining positions of the other side.

3. Gathering background information on our political, military and industrial leaders with which to blackmail them.

Yes, other countries do spying too. But the CIA includes reading over foreign newspapers in its definition of spying.

I do not believe for a minute that Belgium is taping all the internet traffic in and out of the UK or USA.

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Paris Hilton

What kind of a "world cop" is the USA?

With their bald-face mantra of "exceptionalism", they're a 1960s era "white cop in a black ghetto" type of cop.

Do what I say or I'll beat the heck out of you with my club kind of cop.

There a "the law is there for YOU to obey" kind of cop.

Shock and awe ? Shock and awe at their hypocrisy !

Paris, because she's their main ideological guru.

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Big Brother

Re: Land of the free... home of the brave

Dear Boltar,

I didn't say that no one else did it, but since the U.S.A. is currently in the focus, I focused my comment on them.

zài jiàn

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Land of the free... home of the brave

...followed by the rapid exodus of banks from the City of London, cancellation of numerous contracts and the collapse of the £.

Kipling was right: high levels of trade reduce the prospect of war. But he missed an essential point; that when word trade is predicated on a debt-funded currency retaining its value, the US can do what it likes because nobody dare upset the applecart. It is the old saw about you owe the bank £1000, you have a problem, you owe the bank £1billion, they have a problem.

If the dollar falls, oil and commodity prices go haywire. So, paradoxically, nobody can afford to upset the US.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Land of the free... home of the brave

You haven't got it, have you? Or perhaps you only read the news through the NSA firewall.

This is about the US spying on everybody else, and subcontracting their spying on their own citizens to the UK, so as to maintain a figleaf of legality.

Really it's high time US citizens flooded our Government with FOI requests to find out what information it is storing on them, Yes I know they will be refused...come on guys, you can crapflood the UK Government with FOI requests until they have to agree not to cooperate any more, and the whole stinking rotten system starts to unravel.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: last month the US was complaining about China's spying as though nobody ever did such a thing

"I do not believe for a minute that Belgium is taping all the internet traffic in and out of the UK or USA."

Not a UKIP member, then.

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Re: last month the US was complaining about China's spying as though nobody ever did such a thing

Only because they don't have access to the fibers. The UK is probably tapping all internet traffic in and out of Belgium though. Guess where the ocean-spanning cables land.

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Yag
Big Brother

Re: Land of the free... home of the brave

More like : Land of the free market... home of the brave new world.

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Facepalm

Re: ribosome Re: Land of the free... home of the brave

".....you can crapflood the UK Government with FOI requests until they have to agree not to cooperate any more....." Please do, it will be an excellent source of income for HMG when they charge you £50 for a photocopy of a sheet saying "No information found" (https://www.gov.uk/make-a-freedom-of-information-request/how-to-make-an-foi-request).

But, before you get your hopes up, you may want to read the FOI Act 2000 first (http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2000/36/schedule/1) as it specificaly excludes GCHQ and chums: "....except—......any unit or part of a unit which is for the time being required by the Secretary of State to assist the Government Communications Headquarters in the exercise of its functions....."

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Land of the free... home of the brave

That would be very nice indeed, but the only problem is Cameron and the British gov/civil service etc are the US's lapdogs. Indeed GCHQ spying is even worse as Snowden has revealed. Why do you think they denied flights to the UK for him the moment this all came out. We need a European and US Spring, and fast before it's too late.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Land of the free... home of the brave

Yeah you don't want America as the world police until you want to intervene in another country and you realise you armed forces can't do it. Ohh we hate America but please come help us in Libya. America, rightly or wrongly, can project force. That is why they were hired by the Saudi's for the first Iraq war (no bad, being able to hire half a million troops for $35 billion)

As for spying, yes what was going on was very wrong and some people need to be sized up for orange jumpsuits, but GCHQ is at it as well and just as much. That doesn't excuse it, but your preaching may need to be dialled down a little. Theres probably much more to come and theres going to be quite a few countries with some explaining to do so don't be so quick to attack others.

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Pirate

Re: ribosome Re: last month the US was complaining about China's spying...."

<Sigh> It is really rich of Brussels to be complaining of US evesdropping given their long and secretive history of doing exactly the same if not worse (http://www.wired.com/politics/law/news/1998/12/16588)! The whole basis of the EPCIP program is that the EU will be able to "identify terror threats to critical infrastructure" (http://europa.eu/legislation_summaries/justice_freedom_security/fight_against_terrorism/l33260_en.htm), and partially entails EU countries sharing data on their citizens and their communications without any form of warrant, nor oversight, and under the control of non-elected EU beureaucrats. Compared to the NSA's activities that's like comparing grand larceny to pickpocketing!

The Fwench are not kicking up too much of a fuss as they have had their own equivalent of ECHELON for years too:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frenchelon

Even the Swiss and the Swedes are at it:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Onyx_%28interception_system%29

http://www.nbcnews.com/id/25252111/ns/world_news-europe/t/sweden-adopts-contentious-eavesdropping-plan/#.UdQmhKyovrQ

Oh dear, did that info puncture a few reality bubbles?

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Land of the free... home of the brave + subcontracting

the guardian (well, you know) suggested, that it might have been a little different to the popular form of subcontracting, i.e. both parties stored data - but the data captured by the other partner, thus enabling both to claim that it was "all legal".

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Land of the free... home of the brave

"You honestly think that no other country in the world spies on its supposed allies when it suits them?"

Only William Hague is so dumb <b>he does the spying for them</b>. That's the true scandal here, that a man can be so stupid he gives them a network tap and just naively thinks they won't spy on Brits for commercial and political gains.

Wow, when he started spouting how US protects its citizens as if Brits are US citizens (!).

You can see the Prism leak, you can see Brit data from the filter GCHQ put in goes straight into that database, not deleted after 3 days. Did he imagine otherwise?

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Re: Land of the free... home of the brave

America pays us for the spy base in North Yorkshire. They drive on the right and use dollars. (And have Disney Land like facilities). They even give you free unlimited beer after playing Rugby with them. (Junk American beer but it is free).

The whole set up is stupid. If you are going to do something just say you are.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: ribosome Land of the free... home of the brave

Which is why I wrote that it would be refused. I know that FOI only applies to stuff the Government doesn't care about. But presumably someone would have to send out all the emails saying why it had been refused. 300 million Americans could certainly overload the UK Government's email system.

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Boffin

Re: What kind of a "world cop" is the USA?

This kind: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-UUbvM2Lyh4 (SFW)

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Unhappy

Re: Land of the free... home of the brave aka Team America World Police (OT)

Not off topic at all. Our duly elected government behaves more like the characters in that movie every day.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Land of the free... home of the brave

Actually I've had some microbrew there - v nice

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Mushroom

Re: Land of the free... home of the brave

...followed by the rapid exodus of banks from

City of London, cancellation of numerous

contracts and the collapse of the £.

sounds good to me, bring it on and give the US the finger.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: ribosome last month the US was complaining about China's spying...."

Unfortunately I am a strict constructionist when it comes to markup languages, and as your <Sigh> tag was not terminated, I was unable to parse your post.

Or in ordinary wetware language, I am programmed to ignore completely any responses from people who think it is clever to put <Sigh> at the start of their posts. It's intended to indicate casual superiority - and all you ever do when posting is try to look superior to others. But I can't find the Matt Bryant who is a specialist in international law, so until you verify your credentials your posts would seem to have no special value.

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FAIL

Re: Land of the free... home of the brave

"You believe that freedom and democracy are meaningless words? "

If it wasn't for the actions of security agencies carrying out covert operations the freedom and democracy you talk about probably wouldn't exists anymore.

"That people who dream of making the world better should just let it go"

Cue angelic choir and some pictures of smiling multi ethnic clip art pictures of women holding babies...

"we should be happy to be on the path to a perfectly fascist society"

You wouldn't know true fascism if it bit you in your deluded liberal backside. For people like you that word is a catch all term for anything you don't happen to agree with because it doesn't fit into the fluffy cuddly hippy world you naively believe we'd all live in if only The Man didn't go around doing nasty things like spying.

Well newsflash my friend - human nature being what it is doesn't allow for that. The Man is actually keeping your backsde safe from the real enemies out there , you know, the sort who fly aircraft into a building with 3000 people in it, the one who blow up trains, bomb buses full of kids, shoot women dead if they dare to try and get an education? But hey , those are minor transgressions compared to storing emails, right?

Grow the fuck up!

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Vic
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Re: Land of the free... home of the brave

> Junk American beer but it is free

It's hardly novel that someone gives away piss...

Vic.

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Rol
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Obama says US won't scramble jets or twist arms for Snowden

I think the American term for that has something to do with forked tongues.

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Holmes

Re: Obama says US won't scramble jets or twist arms for Snowden

Or perhaps "Obama is an utter fucking liar"

Which statement is easier to believe?

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Obama says US won't scramble jets or twist arms for Snowden

And he WAS true to his word. To the letter too. All they did, is "asked". And because they say so, I believe them, absolutely. They wouldn't be lying, would they?

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Trollface

Re: Obama says US won't scramble jets or twist arms for Snowden

He could take a lesson from the JFK playbook: " The USAF won't intercept Snowden. The CIA with their ex cuban/whoever pilots on the other hand...."

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Big Brother

They could have dressed Snowden in spare inform and passed him off as cabin-crew

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Anonymous Coward

nah. He's onboard the Venezuelan presidents plane. The Bolivians were sent ahead to raise indignation, leaving the Venezuelan plane to fly home free

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More to come?

This lot are getting spooked at the slightest whisper lately. I wonder if there is a biggie they all know about but don't want the public hearing.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: More to come?

Snowden knows:

The whereabouts of Lord Lucan

The pizza joint where Elvis is currently doing the cooking

The exact location of last year's snow

The datacenter that has all of temps perdu on it, and the admin password

The IP address of the Yeti webcam

The secret hideout in Arizona where Osama bin Laden, Saddam Hussein and Quadhafi (the real ones) live in comfortable retirement.

The actual contract between the UK and the US governments that specifies that every UK Prime Minister is the current US President's bitch (which is why there can never be a woman President)

The launch codes for all the Minutemen

The combination of the bathroom immediately off of the Oval Office where US Presidents go for some quality time.

Where to get polonium in Moscow

He does not know:

Who the Hell gives Michael Gove his ideas.

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Re: More to come?

I'm sure theres a comedy sketch in that secret hideout \ retirement home one. Wasn't there a python sketch about a bunch of Nazi leaders in a brighton b&b or am I going senile?

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