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back to article Torvalds unveils first Linux 3.10 release candidate

The first release candidate for version 3.10 of the Linux Kernel is upon us. Linus Torvalds released RC1 of the new kernel on the eve of Mother's Day (in North America and Australia), together with some advice on how to treat Mum/Mom right on the occasion. “So this is the biggest -rc1 in the last several years (perhaps ever) at …

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Trollface

and now over to Eadon...

For some ill-informed commentary about how this release is somehow an MS FAIL and that somehow Linus shagged your mum...

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Re: and now over to Eadon...

Looks like Eadon downvoted you thirteen times...

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Thumb Up

Re: and now over to Eadon...

looks like you got a lot of "-1 presentient" votes there!

Although it did take a while for Eadon's post on how this is an MS FAIL to show up!

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Re: and now over to Eadon...

Actually about 26 minutes elapsed between by (as it happens) extremely prescient post and Eadons. One mention of the actual 3.10 RC1 release followed by a three paragrah MS Rant...

As a troll it was reasonably successful though :)

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Anonymous Coward

mothers day

was obviously in March (for the country that El Reg is registered in) so the mothers day context to this story is weak

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Re: mothers day

Modern mother's day started in the USA, it has no real connection to Mothering Sunday. Mothering Sunday was to do with visiting one's "mother" church. Although Mothering Sunday has, overtime, acquired the trappings of the USA's Mother's Day (but keeps it's original date).

Just like Father's Day, Mother's Day (and Grandparent's Day and Secretary's Day and...) is just an attempt to get people to buy more cards and tat. Seriously, if it takes Hallmark to advertise a day in the calendar for you to remember to say to your mother/father you love them (or your secretary that are doing a good job or whatever); then you are a cock of the highest order.

Semi-rant ends.

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Re: mothers day

"was obviously in March (for the country that El Reg is registered in) so the mothers day context to this story is weak"

Not if you actually read Torvalds' release statement...

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zb

Re: mothers day

In England there is no "Mothers Day". We do have Mothering Sunday which is a christian festival falling on the 4th Sunday in Lent.

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Re: mothers day

Actually the origin of mothers day is in the US civil war. After the war had ended, there were many families which where torn apart from being on different sides. Ann Jarvis worked to establish a holiday to promote the reunification of these torn families (c 1868). Her attempts did not catch on, until her daughter Anna took up the cause to honor her mother after her death in 1907. Even then it would not receive national acceptance until 1914.

The holiday wouldn't be commercialized extensively for another nine years, and Anna would go to her death-bed regretting the commercial mockery the holiday she had promoted became.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: More and better support for 64-bit ARM chips

Had to upvote as you seem fairly chipper considering the beating you've got over the last few days from the pitchfork-wielding MS-supporting Reg crowd!

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Anonymous Coward

Re: More and better support for 64-bit ARM chips

And remember folks, if you can trust anyone when considering your options, it's a personality cult worshipper on the Internet!

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Anonymous Coward

Re: More and better support for 64-bit ARM chips

Well there was this story about an "alleged" MS developer over at ZDnet saying Linux is ahead.

http://www.zdnet.com/anonymous-msft-developer-admits-linux-is-faster-than-windows-7000015236/

Make your own minds up on this one folks.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: More and better support for 64-bit ARM chips

"Had to upvote as you seem fairly chipper considering the beating you've got over the last few days from the pitchfork-wielding MS-supporting Reg crowd!"

Pretty feeble, Eadon ...

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Anonymous Coward

Re: More and better support for 64-bit ARM chips

Quick, run out an buy a GNU/Linux touch-laptop running on ARM right now.

Oh, you can't.

Because no household name OEM ships GNU/Linux consumer machines.

This is down to the fact that GNU/Linux is still too demanding on the non-technical user and even if OEMs did ship GNU/Linux, they would have to pay MS for the 200+ patents Linux infringes upon. As OEMs are finding out with Android!

LINUX EPIC FAIL (again)

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Coat

Re: More and better support for 64-bit ARM chips

Dell do OEM Linux still do they not, and Alienware are getting in on the act WRT to SteamForLinux?

And who wants a touch laptop? I work in PC retail, and I've *never* been asked for one. I have, however, had people ask 'why would you want one' when the subject comes up. These are normal people, not IT loons like us, too. It's a human-machine-interface disaster for those who like our shoulders joints being smooth rather than achy and creaky.

Still, good Eadon retort B-)

He says, posting from his OS X laptop, shuffling some files around on his Linux box upstairs, about to go and prep for a Windows server install ;-)

Steven R

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FAIL

Re: More and better support for 64-bit ARM chips

>>This is down to the fact that GNU/Linux is still too demanding on the non-technical user

I installed Ubuntu 10.04 on my non technical neighbours laptop three years ago.

I have had no calls for technical support, none. It is still working perfectly, no virus or trojan has crippled it.

When I eventually upgrade it to 12.04 it will have a state of the art kernel unlike Windows8's relic from the past.

Anonymous Troll FAIL

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Re: More and better support for 64-bit ARM chips

Mostly right - however one of the main reasons MS are screwed on ARM is legacy software - mostly MSOffice. They just cant get that to run properly on ARM and, like RT - who wants to pay for Windows if it doesn’t do what it used to do. They've got away with dumping a lot of support for older documents but there is a lot of stuff that they just cant dump as its the only thing holding a lot of customers in their fold.

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Re: run out an buy a GNU/Linux touch-laptop running on ARM right now.

I'd like to see one - but as far as I can tell its Windows failings that prevent me from seeing one and not anything to do with Linux technical stuff.

Like you say I'd have to pay, not for 200+ patents - which would evaporate in daylight - but for MS terror tactics.

Why is it companies with money hate capitalism so much...

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Anonymous Coward

Re: More and better support for 64-bit ARM chips

"Dell do OEM Linux still do they not, and Alienware are getting in on the act WRT to SteamForLinux?"

Yeah, but those units are overpriced for what they are, especially given Dell's...suspect build quality (IME anyway).

"Still, good Eadon retort B-)"

Thank ye, glad one person got it.

"He says, posting from his OS X laptop, shuffling some files around on his Linux box upstairs"

The power of POSIX compels you! I borrow the g/fs Mac by times. Then do a quick bit of X-forwarding. Works well.

"about to go and prep for a Windows server install"

Commiserations.

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Anonymous Coward

10.04->12.04 heads up

I had a machine on 10.04 ... ran nicely although I had to do a *lot* of research and trial-and-error stuff to fiddle with the Polkit stuff so you could actuall administer it remotely (I don't like VNC - prefer to use NX but that comes with a whole hatful of sorrow).

Finally pushed to upgrade as I wanted a couple of new features in some apps that wouldn't install because the kernel was too old. Never again. Everything broke (machine failed to reboot !) and even trying to run the retrofit GNOME package wasn't stable - loads of apps crashing every few minutes.

Had to move to Debian - so far so good.

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Re: More and better support for 64-bit ARM chips

With ARM Hardware beware, if your stupid enough to actually fund Microsoft any pay for a Windows 8 based ARM device you don't even have the choice for installing most versions of Linux - thanks to MS's anticompetitive (and shortly no doubt to be declared illegal in the EU) policy of making it mandatory that the user **cannot** disable secure boot on ARM based H/W.

Be it a tablet, desktop, laptop, server..

The other day it was announced that the ISS were replacing the OS used from Windows to Linux

http://www.redorbit.com/news/space/1112844374/linux-windows-xp-os-iss-international-space-station-opslan-051213/

If they had today chosen to install Windows 8 on ARM hardware in the first place they would not have the choice to replace the OS with Linux in the future (at least most versions), you are stuck with Windows like a terminal disease thanks to secure boot, you can't even install Windows 7.

i.e if an organisation today made the decision to today run Windows 8 on ARM based hardware (servers, laptops, etc are coming out now) then they would not have the choice to run (most versions of) Linux on it in the future.

i.e the use of Windows is a shortsighted solution that may bite your ass in the future.

To see a good post as to why MS's kernel is about 1/2 a decade behind Linux see this interesting post from a Windows kernel dev - explaining why Windows kernel is far behind alternatives.

http://blog.zorinaq.com/?e=74

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Re: More and better support for 64-bit ARM chips

Which patents would those be?

I know MS has gone 'It infringes! It infringes!' but unless they can point to which ones they are talking about, and where the infringing code is, it's just FUD of the lowest kind. Remember, they have - as everyone can have - the source code to look at, and I would be amazed if there had not been a very close look at one point or another.

It's just a pity they hadn't learnt more from it.

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Re: Eadon, a minor point

LINUX EPIC SUCCESS

Sadly not even Linux is going to turn EPIC into the success which was hoped for it.

Glad to see someone appreciates Torvalds' management style, too many people get upset because he doesn't give a s*&t about being politically correct, and only cares about making Linux correct.

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Unhappy

Re: More and better support for 64-bit ARM chips

Have a down vote - I've got no axe to grind against any of the OS providers but Eadon is a class A troll and deserves much of what he receives

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Re: More and better support for 64-bit ARM chips

I'm still trying to work out whether this is the same Eadon:

http://www.eadon.com

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Eadon, a minor point

Suggesting that it's in some way desirable to flout "Politically correctness" is the last resort of the intolerant, in my day it used to be called politeness mind, but anyone who can only manage by shouting and swearing is a pretty lame manager.

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Re: More and better support for 64-bit ARM chips

My granny uses a linux laptop, and she still gets me to "program" her telly - two remotes was incredibly confusing for her 86 years.

And by "linux" she means firefox, as that is all she can use, and only with the bookmarks I added to her tool bar.

Still, it runs fedora.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Eadon, a minor point

When Linux uses swearing, it's because he has lost his temper and can't control himself, he is using it to belittle the person he is swearing at. It's unprofessional and betrays a lack of self control. That you deify this person says a lot about you and your opinions about politics and inter-personal relationships.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: More and better support for 64-bit ARM chips

>I'm still trying to work out whether this is the same Eadon:

http://www.eadon.com

I see what you mean... references to himself in the 3rd person, no evidence of any commercial (or even decent open source) software used to create the website or graphics. There are allusions to Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance, but his rants in other sections suggest that he didn't grok it. The MS hate is a little buried, but is present: "Joking aside, never buy or use micro$oft products. Ever. Their software is poor and they are evil. That's not feng shui, that's a fact!". Upper case is used in places, but not as much as the Eadon that we know and, er, know.

There isn't enough for a watertight conviction, but plenty of merely circumstantial evidence: A jury might acquit him, a mob would lynch him.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Eadon, a minor point

You are perfectly allowed to criticise things while still being PC, you just shouldn't be a dick about it, or criticise things which you know nothing about.

That said, you show yourself up to be the archetypal "it's PC gone mad" type of Daily Mail reader - suggest that PC is something it isn't and then suggest that it's just like 1984.

I remember growing up in an area people who use the "P" word, who would openly say that "women can't do X,Y,X", people who thought it was ok to call names of gay people in the street, indeed, I was often called a "fucking fag" merely for having long hair. This just doesn't happen any more and that's PC, if it has gone a little to far, it'll find it's way back, but we live in much more enlightened times than we did a only 20 years ago and that it what political correctness is about. Politeness, is not a conspiracy.

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FAIL

Re: More and better support for 64-bit ARM chips

I think it is the same Eadon. Look at the footer:

www.eadon.com is powered by linux, apache, php and mySql.

For your safety, security and pleasure, this site contains no Microsoft software whatsoever!

The site really hurts my eyes.

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Holmes

Re: More and better support for 64-bit ARM chips

proof that you can write just as vile code in open source software as in microsnot.

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Windows

Re: Eadon

Honestly can't this icon be specifically for himself?

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Re: Eadon

>Honestly can't this icon be specifically for himself?

There's an idea- a compulsory 'icon of shame' for commentards who consistently go out of their way to earn one. Icons such as 'frothing at mouth', 'Eadon' or 'broken record' will be shown next to all posts by the guilty for a period of one month, or until they have shown improvement.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Eadon, a minor point

No, Eadon, I'm not mistaking anything, if you need to raise your voice and swear, you've lost the argument. It's about basic self control, and controlling your impulses, no matter what you think. There is no "being a good manager" and shouting and swearing and ranting, especially when this is done in public. It's a childish exercise in impressing your power over people and certainly doesn't obtain good results, basically it's bullying.

That said, I'm pretty sure that nearly all people who think that "PC has gone mad" also think that bullying is just fine and people should toughen up, that health and safety shouldn't exist and that everything was just fine in the 70s before all this kicked off.

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Re: More and better support for 64-bit ARM chips

"Because no household name OEM ships GNU/Linux consumer machines."

And of course you can't buy a computer from any vendor except a "household name". Oh wait, you could buy ANY COMPUTER at all, format the hard drive, and install Linux.

Or, if you are competent and that way inclined, you could build your own. Complete instructions in your friendly local W.H.Smug (or wherever).

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Re: 10.04->12.04 heads up

"I had a machine on 10.04 ... ran nicely although I had to do a *lot* of research and trial-and-error stuff to fiddle with the Polkit stuff so you could actuall administer it remotely (I don't like VNC - prefer to use NX but that comes with a whole hatful of sorrow).

Finally pushed to upgrade as I wanted a couple of new features in some apps that wouldn't install because the kernel was too old. Never again. Everything broke (machine failed to reboot !) and even trying to run the retrofit GNOME package wasn't stable - loads of apps crashing every few minutes."

Ubuntu Desktop Edition isn't configured for remote access by default. It's aimed at mainstream consumers, the vast majority of whom will never use SSH or any other form of remote management. Is it really so hard to walk over to the computer, delete / and do a fresh install (presumably you have /home on a separate partition)? If you're running it on a file-server or something similar which has no monitor or keyboard then you're really just using the wrong distro for the job, that's hardly Ubuntu's fault.

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Re: Eadon, a minor point

> When Linux uses swearing, it's because he has lost his temper and can't control himself, he is using it to belittle the person he is swearing at. It's unprofessional and betrays a lack of self control. That you deify this person says a lot about you and your opinions about politics and inter-personal relationships.

The other way of looking at it is that Linus fully understands the person he is addressing his comments too and has an extremely good grasp of inter-personal relationships. Feeling the need to kowtow to political correctness is just a pathetic excuse for failing to understand either who you are talking too or what you are really trying to achieve.

Generally speaking developers and techies are a cynical load of bastards. We don't respond well to bull shit, we'd much rather people a) don't lie to us and b) don't try to engage our enthusiasm circuits, because we're a cynical load of bar stewards, as I said.

So personally I think most developers would much rather that Linus just said it like it is. Don't pussy foot around. Don't treat us like fragile marketing zeebs who'll go to pieces if no one strokes our egos. When you've earned sufficient respect to swear at us if we f*&^ up then tell us.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: 10.04->12.04 heads up

Yeah, I lost three machines in a 10.04 -> 12.04 upgrade. They were running mythbuntu as frontendx2 + backend. The backend was working on VMware 4.1, so I was very surprised that it didn't upgrade properly. They all three required a full rebuild and the main frontend machine lost the ability to see the usb wifi, which it had previously detected automatically and lost it's ability to see my telly's 1366x768, I've still not managed to get it back...

I have other linux boxes, both real and virtual and they run centos/fedora, I've never tried to upgrade them, just rebuilt them.

I love linux, in particular the ability to have an almost free, almost unix system at home, but it doesn't half get on my tits from time to time. (As do all OSes...)

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Anonymous Coward

@yossarianuk

"...thanks to secure boot, you can't even install Windows 7."

Supposing it did let you install Windows 7. Just how well do you think it would run on ARM hardware?

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Trollface

Inquiring minds want to know

Will the new audio drivers mean PulseAudio finally works?

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Re: Inquiring minds want to know

Hmm. Well.

Seriously though, how long before this Kernel appears in mainstream distributions like Ubuntu, and how long before it gets to the stable 'enterprise' distributions like Red Hat and Debian?

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Re: Inquiring minds want to know

Will the new audio drivers mean PulseAudio finally works?

Let's not get ahead of ourselves!

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Re: Inquiring minds want to know

It will be in Ubuntu (or if you have sense Kubuntu) by 13.10 - however anyone can run it right now.

Of course you can compile it yourself (I also do compile my own to get the old oss sound modules...) or if your not skilled in this are you can use the mainline ppa

http://kernel.ubuntu.com/~kernel-ppa/mainline/

- i.e you can get it now.

I imagine Arch will have the kernel days after the final release also.

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Headmaster

extremely nit picky but

"Torvalds unveils...."

in what way was it 'veiled', then? It's open source, right?

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