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back to article Apple 'dismayed' to find over 100 kids building its iDevices

Apple found 106 different ongoing cases of underage workers in its suppliers in China and 70 historical cases, according to its seventh annual supplier audit. The fruity firm said it was "dismayed to discover" that one supplier, Guangdong Real Faith Pingzhou Electronics (PZ), was rampantly violating the policy, with 74 different …

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Well

Fault em all you like, but its refreshing to see such honesty and openness - what makes it stranger is the subject is secretive Apple.

Fact is everyone who makes stuff in that region probably has these issues, but most are happy to play on a see-no-evil basis, only acting when it's shoved in front of their noses.

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Meh

Now

Will Samsung follow suit?

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Well

They do this every year and they are completely open about it, unlike many of the other companies who don't get attacked in the media, so don't bother.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Now

The abuses were in Samsung's own factories, so they know damn well they're going on and choose not to give a toss.

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Trollface

Re: Well

Yep really nice of them to finally start showing any concept of social justice after they have become the biggest company the world. They did it basically by manipulating people with more money than brains in the 1st world to buy things made by child/slave labor in the 3rd world. Apple is the super high end Walmart.

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FAIL

Re: Now

> "The abuses were in Samsung's own factories, so they know damn well they're going on and choose not to give a toss."

Yes - because as we all know, Samsung celebrated its record earnings by re-branding itself with the much more catchy name "Guangdong Real Faith Pingzhou Electronics (PZ)".

Bit of a FAIL there, AC troll.

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Re: Now

To do so would be to copy Apple, so... probably.

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Re: Well

Yes, I will fault them all I like. They knew this was going on, and now they've been found out, they're SHOCKED.

Enjoy your slave-labour products, iTards. Do they come with the salty tang of childrens' tears?

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FAIL

Re: Well

iTards? salty tears of children? STFU. You are either Amish/Luddite or a hypocrite/twat. Circle as appropriate.

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Re: Well

You sound upset. Don't take things personally, it's just a job, defending Apple on the Internet.

Anyway, I'll take 'Luddite' if you don't mind. Unless Apple have a patent on that as well.

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Unhappy

Re: the salty tang of childrens' tears...

I agree. I had to return all four of my new iPads. Damned salt residue trapped under the screens. One of 'em even had a bit of young thumb trapped behind the bezel. Bastards. Care and attention, Apple. Care and attention.

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Thumb Down

Re: Well

"Enjoy your slave-labour products, iTards. Do they come with the salty tang of childrens' tears?"

So where do you think HTC, Samsung or LG phones come from? Do they have the salty tang of childrens' [sic] tears?

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Thumb Down

Re: Well

You four (or is it five now?) thumbs down tards really need to ditch your iCrap and get a REAL phone.

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Anonymous Coward

And cue anti-Apple rants in 3, 2, 1...

I wonder how all the other consumer electronic firms are getting on with their audits???

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Meh

Could this be translated into sales ?

In the same way *some* people are willing to pay a premium for "organic" food, could there be a group of users who would pay more for a product guaranteed to be made ethically[1] ? Possibly by being built in the UK. Or US ?

[1]Yes, I'm aware there's the provenance of the raw materials ...

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Devil

Re: Could this be translated into sales ?

I would be quite happy to pay extra for things that are not built in the dodgy parts of the far east, nor do i really want anything to do with China, but needs must when the devil drives.

Devil for obvious reasons...

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Re: Could this be translated into sales ?

I think its in this case a reverse factor... People aren't buying Apple because its "Ethical", but they might not buy if its very "unethical"... Once you throw "China" and "manufacturing" in the mix, you're never going to get the "Ethical" buy, the "Chineese Manufacturing" brand is just too tainted... But if abuses are being commonly shown, it might put other soff.

That said, with Apple bringing some desktop manufacturing back to the US, maybe they are slowly moving to have this as a key product differencial. We in the west are beginning to wake up to the problems to the local economy of losing manufacturing jobs... Maybe "Built Here" is the next "Grown here".

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Could this be translated into sales ?

It's actually the other way around.

The smaller cheaper items that people need really quickly tend to be built in the US and places close to where they are needed and the larger less regular purchases are made in China.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Could this be translated into sales ?

USA? You mean cheap Mexicans?

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Stop

Re: Could this be translated into sales ?

No, Jimmy. Organizations have no Ethics. "This" can only be translated into racketeering.

disclaimer: I live in the American South which does not enhance one's Ethics credibility, but please read on ...

Years ago I was going to do something which would potentially annoy my employer. I ran it by my boss who said "do what you think best, They can fire you, but they can't shoot you"

What he was really saying is that:

1. things which cannot kill you (Organizations) have no other behavior constraints

2. things you cannot kill have no fear of lying to you

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Re: Could this be translated into sales ?

"I would be quite happy to pay extra for things that are not built in the dodgy parts of the far east"

Buy a Lumia then, made in Finland.

The thing to remember is that the US and UK probably couldn't bring their manufacturing back from the Far East any more. All the skills that could make this stuff have long gone or never existed (in today's scales) in the first place.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Could this be translated into sales ?

"Buy a Lumia then, made in Finland." With most of the electronic parts made in the Far East...

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Nothing to see here:

Anybody who believes that any product made in China, India and other Asia-Pac, is totally free from child labour is clearly deluding themselves.

Wherever there are additional profits to be made by exploiting cheap labour it will happen.

Apple must be applauded for naming and shaming, but unfortunetly it won't remove the issue, as human greed will always be part of the equation.

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Par for the course

Child labour is normal in Chinese products. As almost everything is now built there (Nokia, iPhone et al) then frankly buy a phone, employ a child... buy a toy, employ a child, buy some furniture employ a child...

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WTF?

The...fsck...?!!!

"92 per cent of its suppliers were compliant with a maximum 60-hour week with at least one day off and only voluntary overtime."

Well, so long as nearly all of them only have ten hour working days and 'voluntary'* overtime, I guess it's all ok.

* Student experience in a supermarket taught me that you can either volunteer for it, or be made unemployed, so I can't imagine it being a different story in China.

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Anonymous Coward

How old were these under 16's?

Were they 10?11? or were they more likely 14/15, if so then stop calling them kids, my grandfather emigrated to canada when he was 14 and worked on a farm, 14 is a perfectly acceptable time to leave education and start a job if your not planning an academic carear! aside from reading/writing & basic maths, there is little that school offers for the average person that will not be learned on the job, it makes much more sense to learn working than to sit in a class room....

I really get angry at young adults being treated as children, mainly because I remember how patronising the adults could be at times, especially Americans, hell when I was 18 I was treated as a child when I went to the USA...

Now the other issues, such as low pay, 'bonded workers' & long hours need to be addressed for everyone!

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What you say resonates with me, but they explicitly mentioned forged documentation. If this was in violation of local law, that is a matter for their society.

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Anonymous Coward

Up to a point I have to agree. At 11 I had a paper round and by 15 had a weekend/evening job while doing O/A levels. Never felt I was being exploited. My father started as a Page Boy at aged 14 in the Grand Pump Room Hotel in Bath, in those days it was common practice.

BUT...times do change, and as long as they aren't forced to work or denied an education and their hours are limited then I see no problem with it.

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they could be 6/7 for all we know.

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Anonymous Coward

"if your not planning an academic carear"

For reasons to plan an academic career, see above.

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Happy

Re : Grand Pump Room Hotel

That reminds me of the Sofa Of Time line, (paraphrased),

"....and the younger kids played stab the witches eyes out with icicles, while the older boys went down to the pumping house to become men."

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Pint

"and as long as they aren't forced to work or denied an education and their hours are limited then I see no problem with it."

In this case, they're doing 60 hour weeks, on a production line, doing repetitive work.

That's not educational, it's not learning life skills, it's not improving oneself, it's not healthy, or character-building, or any of those things that part-time paper-rounds and such-like are. It's just exploiting people because they're cheap and setting them up for a life of meaningless unskilled drudgery.

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Apple 'dismayed' to find over 100 kids building its iDevices

it thought 46 were enough!

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Anonymous Coward

Its bad enough child labour is used by loads of these companies but Apple are worse. At least all the other companies are using cheap labour to sell cheap stuff, Apple are just using it to inflate their profits

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Anonymous Coward

Oh please, EVERYBODY does it to inflate profits.

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"Oh please, EVERYBODY does it to inflate profits."

Indeed. Some are just bad at it.

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Childcatcher

Quando, Quando, Quando?

And here I thought Apple was going to set up manufacturing in the States (again)? When is that going to happen?

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Re: Quando, Quando, Quando?

Just assembly, so they can proudly print "Assembled in USA" on the back of their products.

Everything will still be manufactured in China, Korea, etc. as usual.

HOWEVER - credit where credit is due. At least Apple does these yearly audits and does something about it. Maybe other manufacturers do as well, but you don't hear much about it if they do.

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Devil

Re: Quando, Quando, Quando?

when they make a deal with the NRA to manufacture iLocknLoad rifles I suppose. Apple is doing anything publicity wise to keep its share price up during its back to prejobsian times death slide. Sorry, buit it didn't feel right to end the week without sticking one in

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Quando, Quando, Quando?

Soon — work conditions in the US are on the verge of becoming similar to those in China:

I Was a Warehouse Wage Slave

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Unhappy

Re: Quando, Quando, Quando?

Wow. I had no idea, but i should have suspected something like this. Thanks for posting the link.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Quando, Quando, Quando?

They have all the materials, machinery and experience in production. We've lost all of that due to the decline of manufacturing.

We've also lost the engineering skills to install the machinery, commission it and maintain it. My father is in his 70s and is still working in engineering, he says there's nobody with anywhere near the level of experience as he has in the company left.

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Trollface

About as 'dismayed' as...

Jimmy Saville was when he landed his first TOTP gig.

Feel free to add your own analogies. Winner gets a banana. (not necessarily from me)

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PS

I think 'crestfallen' would have conveyed thier malicious indifference far more effectively, not to mention ornately.

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Pint

Here's the video ...

Apple also discovered eight facilities with "bonded labour" ...

http://video.pbs.org/program/slavery-another-name/

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Anonymous Coward

If they weren't working in the Apple factory, they'd be in some bazaar sat on a tea-chest selling skinned-alive toads.

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Anonymous Coward

HTC, Samsung

Or whichever other brand you are buying, where are there publicly reviewed audits. Loathe them if you like, but at least apple are open about it, Korean firms have terrible working conditions (It's cultural and they treat people dreadfully)

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Joke

100 Children?

That's terrible!

Can't we cut that back to 50 and just work them longer hours?

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