back to article Restaurateur jailed for customer sex profile revenge plan

A restaurant owner is facing 90 days of jail time and two years of probation after waging an online smear campaign, including setting up a fake online sex profile, to get revenge on a customer who gave her establishment a bad review. The saga began after of Canadian Elayna Katz went out to dinner at the Mambo Nuevo Latino …

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Bad form?

Bitter and not sweet.

Food for thought.

Maybe the restaurateur will taste "legal" "just desserts"?

Not tasty.

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FAIL

Waiter, there's a troll in my soup!

Revenge, a dish best served in gaol.

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Big Brother

Yeaak... talk about crazy overreactions...

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Meh

In Ottawa, you say, the boring city on the Rideau Canal? Will keeping them talking for months!

For a country's capital city, Ottawa has to be one of the most boring perhaps only surpassed by Pyeong Yang.

The best view, apart from the roads departing the city, is of the Parliament Buildings sitting atop a cliff and viewed from Hull, Quebec. They also skate on the canal when t freezes over.

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Re: In Ottawa, you say, the boring city on the Rideau Canal? Will keeping them talking for months!

Boring is just what you want for a seat of government.

Over-excited parliamentarians are a danger to themselves, and their country.

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Anonymous Coward

Boring is just what you want for a seat of government.

Australia got that right ;-)

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Boring is just what you want for a seat of government.

Hang on Bruce.

I actually like Canberra.

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Re: Boring is just what you want for a seat of government.

Like the god forsaken poor excuse of a makeover if a sheep paddock?

You belong there.

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Anonymous Coward

So rather than retrain the staff and ensure good service he waged war on a customer?

Sounds like a nice place to go for a meal.

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Alert

I thought the restaurateur was a 'she' not a he. Or perhaps they really ARE transgender after all, as they claimed in their smear campaign!

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Marisol is a woman's name

en Espanol.

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WTF?

And I thought the UK was bad?

I finally got around to registering here (I have avoided it for a very long time :-) just so I could post this...

"Criminal libel"? Are you serious Canada?

Libel is a civil offense in the UK. Under common law, you claim damages. i.e. money.

The basic assumption under UK law is that one citizen cannot prosecute another person and they go to prison (despite the attempts to change that under copyright law). That is the perogative of the Crown and only they can prosecute criminal offences.

As an aside, we do have stupid rules in the UK based on mob fads and "political correctness" where you can go to prison for using "bad words", less stupid "bullying", and good rules like "incitement to violence". The restrictions on speech is one of the reason I no longer live in the UK (and it is not because I want to use the bad words or bully people :-).

For completeness, you can go to prison if you lose a civil case and don't pay the fine. It is called "contempt of court".

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Headmaster

Re: And I thought the UK was bad?

Down voted for significant errors. Criminal libel as another poster mentions. Also Private Prosecutions are possible (although rare).

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Stop

Re: And I thought the UK was bad?

I believe that this was the correct course of action in this case. The restaraunteer massively over reacted and started a hate campaign over something that was posted online about her restaraunt. So yes lock her up, fine her and give her community service, she might think twice before doing it again.

To come back to your "aside" what restrictions on speech do we have in the UK, I am not aware of any. Have just read through the correct part and their are restrictions that are writ in law as follows:-

Article 10 of the European Convention on Human Rights provides the right to freedom of expression, subject to certain restrictions that are "in accordance with law" and "necessary in a democratic society". This right includes the freedom to hold opinions, and to receive and impart information and ideas.

“ Article 10 – Freedom of expression

1. Everyone has the right to freedom of expression. This right shall include freedom to hold opinions and to receive and impart information and ideas without interference by public authority and regardless of frontiers. This article shall not prevent States from requiring the licensing of broadcasting, television or cinema enterprises.

2. The exercise of these freedoms, since it carries with it duties and responsibilities, may be subject to such formalities, conditions, restrictions or penalties as are prescribed by law and are necessary in a democratic society, in the interests of national security, territorial integrity or public safety, for the prevention of disorder or crime, for the protection of health or morals, for the protection of the reputation or rights of others, for preventing the disclosure of information received in confidence, or for maintaining the authority and impartiality of the judiciary.

So the restrictions on freedom of speech are there to protect others got it. Its got sod all to do with stopping you from having an opinion the government doesnt agree with.

Why is it those that spout off about freedom of speech forget about the second half of that act?

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Megaphone

Criminal Libel

Some quick wikipedia-ing suggests criminal libel was only abolished in the UK in 2010. Too soon to shout, me thinks.

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Headmaster

Re: And I thought the UK was bad?

We had criminal libel in England until 2010. Nowadays it would be an offence under the Malicious Communications Act.

I don't think there should be absolute unrestricted freedom of speech, because you have to balance it with other people's rights. The line has to be drawn somewhere, and this case is very definitely on the wrong side of the line.

The basic assumption under English law is that one citizen most certainly can prosecute another person and they go to prison. The police are employed as full time "good citizens", who spend their time doing it on our behalf.

Finally, what is this "UK Law" thing you refer to? There is English (and Welsh) Law, there is Northern Irish Law which is very similar to English Law, and there is Scottish Law, which is very different.

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Anonymous Coward

"for the protection of health or morals"

So whatever happens to be <newspaper>'s enemy du jour?

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Facepalm

Re: And I thought the UK was bad?

So what happened to the guy who burnt a poppy in protest on Facebook. Was he endangering public safety? He may have upset a few, but endangering, I don't think so. What's in the law, and what's practiced aren't always the same thing.

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Re: And I thought the UK was bad?

In UK it would start with harassment, which is a criminal offence, wouldn't it?

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Re: And I thought the UK was bad?

The police will argue that the message was "grossly offensive". I don't think it was grossly offensive, just slightly offensive.

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Re: And I thought the UK was bad?

Thanks for that - I keep mentioning this too.

At the root of this lies a VERY simple, basic principle: rights tend to come with obligations. I notice with interest that the obligations side tends to be casually overlooked when people go on about their rights..

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Headmaster

Re: And I thought the UK was bad?

And what is this "UK citizen"? Did you mean British Subject ;-)

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Re: And I thought the UK was bad?

The basic assumption under English law is that one citizen most certainly can prosecute another person and they go to prison. The police are employed as full time "good citizens", who spend their time doing it on our behalf.

----------

YES.

I get so annoyed with the term 'civilian police employees'. Everyone in the police is a civilian, some have warrant cards and wear uniforms. They are not the army, they are not a militia, therefore they are all civilian.

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Headmaster

Re: And I thought the UK was bad?

From 1949 until 1982 all persons born in the United Kingdom were both British Subjects and UK Citizens, unless they had inherited citizenship of another country, so you are both partially right.

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Vic
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Re: And I thought the UK was bad?

> I don't think there should be absolute unrestricted freedom of speech

I do.

However - and this is the important bit - I also believe that freedom comes with an associated responsibility towards others. So I *do* have the right to shout "Fire" in a crowded theatre[1], but if there is no such fire, I can expect to pay a heavy penalty for so doing.

Vic.

[1] Although I wouldn't actually do that - it's unlikely to get many people out of the door...

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Unhappy

Re: And I thought the UK was bad?

Because the 2nd half of the act amounts to a charter to overrule the first; maintaining the authority of the judiciary and protection of morals are both classics used by authoritarian governments (of which, sadly, I fear the UK's has become). Maybe I should use the tinfoil-hat icon (damn, don't have one - Ed., please add before you go to the pub) but there's a reason I now routinely use a VPN-that-isn't-like-HMA (see https://vpn.hidemyass.com/vpncontrol/privacy.html and http://security.cbronline.com/news/second-lulzsec-hacker-faces-arrest-following-hidemyass-disclosure-report-270911) and have a high Wife Acceptance Factor despite the inconvenience (I'm also lucky enough to have a great wife :) )*

* the alternative statement commanded a 2nd try at virginity...

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"criminal libel"

Is on the books in the UK too - it's for stuff like smear campaigns which may put someone in physical danger (such as the current trend for naming innocent people as kiddy fiddlers)

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Re: "criminal libel"

It is not called criminal libel any more. It is an offence under S 1 (1) (a) (iii) of the Malicious Communications Act 1988 as amended by S43 of the Criminal Justice and Police Act 2001.

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Mushroom

Re: "criminal libel"

Because near total "freedom" of speech has worked out ever so well for the yanks hasn't it...

Personally I like that in Commonwealth countries there are reasonable restrictions on the shit you can say before someone smacks you down.

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Unhappy

Criminal libel in the UK

is a very nasty charge to face (luckily only rich people can do it). Basically it's an accusation that the originator of the libel is so deliberately defaming, they need jailing. It also makes any part of the distribution chain responsible. For those interested, read up on the "Goldenballs" incident from the 1970s, where Private Eye was sued by Sir James Goldsmith. He launched a criminal libel writ, and had W H Smiths prosecuted (which is why they stopped selling Private Eye for years in the 70s and 80s).

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So...

...she doesn't like olives but still to went to the ' Mambo Nuevo Latino restaurant'. I would have thought the clue is in the name. I wonder if there is anything they do there that doesn't contain olives/olive oil/olive products. Did she also go to the 'American Big Beef Steak Diner - Steaks House' and say she didn't like steak?

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Re: So...

So by inference you feel the restaurateur's reaction justified?

I don't know the specific details of why she went to that particular restaurant (and I doubt you do either). Maybe she went with a group of friends, so didn't have free choice of venue?

In any event, can't see your point having any relevance to the case. It does say something about you though.

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Holmes

Clueless?

" ' Mambo Nuevo Latino restaurant'. I would have thought the clue is in the name."

New Latino Mambo restaurant

Don't see any 'olives' in the name - nor any indication that olives would be in everything they serve.

Maybe some good music, but not olives.

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FAIL

Re: So...

So if you're a veggie married to a steak lover you should never eat out together?

The restaurant can always say "[sorry] we can't serve anything without olives". If they agree to provide something and you don't get what you've asked for you have a right to complain. They have been known to do that for my daughter to whom nuts may be fatal, we just have to say sorry we can't here then.

There is often a case to complain to the boss, minions can't change things, may not change their own ways, ... If the waiter/ess ordered no olives and the chef put them in then it requires the management to sort that out, bollocking the serving staff about what isn't their fault is no help to anyone.

Dave

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Re: So...

Poor from you.

So you'd recommend avoiding all Chinese restauarants because you dont like Beansprouts for example?

And olive oil is hardly the same as Olives -- no-one said she disliked olive oil which is a completely different experience...

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Unhappy

Re: So...

Ok. so the olives thing was a complete overreaction but I'm so pissed off with members of my extended family who seem unable to choose a restaurant that servers what they want to eat and prefer to go to one that doesn't and try to force them to change the menu.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: olives

Did you really have to add that last line? That she's challenged in the logic department seems to be fairly clear, but I don't quite see how this leads all the way to a desire of seeing her physically harmed, nor a reason for gender based name calling.

Just out of curiosity, would you express yourself thus too in real life?

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Re: olives

The clue was in the troll icon.

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"Huh. Good thing I didn't tell her about the dirty fork!"

[/MontyPython]

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Customer from hell. . .

... meets restaurateur from hell. I've no sympathy for either of 'em: one detects just a leetle superiority in a customer who complains about olives in a place where olives are likely to be served in abundance and then hands out her business card, FFS, with the instruction that she be contacted with an explanation. Well of course, ma'am. Seeing as you are so-oooo very important.

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Thumb Down

Re: Customer from hell. . .

"Customer from hell"? For asking that they leave olives out of the meal and then behing unhappy with the staff's attitude? Do the words "Customer Service" not mean anything to you??

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Unhappy

Olives in Jambalaya?

The restaurant owner should be jailed for Crimes Against Creole.

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Anonymous Coward

"The saga began after of Canadian"

I was going to make some kind of light-hearted witty comment about this syntactically adulterated phrase, but actually I'm getting pretty bored with the fact that EVERY SINGLE FUCKING ARTICLE on this site is riddled with this kind of nonsense.

I'm going to try to find a source for my news that isn't run by illiterate monkeys.

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Headmaster

Re: "The saga began after of Canadian"

News that isn't run by illiterate monkeys? If you find one, please let me know the source (hell, these days I'll be happy with literate monkeys, or any other literate species [better not be discriminatory at either a phylum or kingdom level]

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Re: "The saga began after of Canadian"

Not allowed to downvote myself, sadly, but I missed the closing bracket which deserves a serious kipper

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Wow now that is an overreaction.

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WTF?

For Real

This woman made all that fuss about a couple of olives . . . takes high maintenance to the next level.

Thing to bear in mind. . . Jambalaya is extremely unlikely to be prepared/cooked individually so any olives in there are kinda there to stay. What they should have done was let the woman know there were olives in it and ask if she wanted to change her order.

Of course pragmatism on her part would suggest she simply take out the olives as she ate. . but hey. . . leaving a business card asking the manager to call her is hardly something I would consider a productive use of my time.

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Vic
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Re: For Real

> pragmatism on her part would suggest she simply take out the olives as she ate.

That might not be enough.

If she has some sort of reaction to the olives, the food might still make her ill even after removing the olives[1].

I have an explosive reaction to mushrooms. It's painful having to explain to waiters that I'm not going to accept this meal that they assured me was free from mushrooms, and I'm not going to pick them out as that will still make me ill.

Vic.

[1] If she does have a reaction to olives, it would make it a rather silly thing to do to go to a mediterranean-style restaurant. Nonetheless, that doesn't excuse the restaurateur's behaviour...

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Happy

Is it just me?

.... or am I the first to use the phrase " bunnyboiler " in response to this article? Seems like many people missed the opportunity here!

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