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back to article Ay caramba, Ubuntu 12.10: Get it right on Amazon!

There's much to admire in Canonical’s Quantal Quetzal, which continues to refine and improve the Unity desktop, but you'd be forgiven if you missed the positives thanks to the late injection of a little Bezos since Ubuntu 12.04. As if the move to Unity hadn’t been contentious (and bumpy) enough, Canonical has dipped into …

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Sending search terms to 3rd party

So does this version of Ubuntu send all search terms to the likes of FB & Twitter or only when you say you want to search their sites? I don't do social networking so I have no desire to have my search terms sent to such sites.

I think it's time to investigate whether the gf's netbook can run Fedora, Canonical seem to have made deliberate decisions in recent years to make me ditch them.

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Linux

Re: Sending search terms to 3rd party

With Fedora you will be reinstalling every so often, and the standard interface will be changing as they develop Gnome Shell.

If the significant other wants something that won't change much and that is in the RHEL world, I'd suggest CentOS/Scientific Linux/PUIAS currently at v6.3. Solid and support until 2018 or something daft with point increments. Just remember no mono libraries by default so no Banshee or Hugin Panorama...

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Linux

Re: Sending search terms to 3rd party

I've moved to Arch when Canonical dropped Kubuntu, in the 12.04 version. I was already pissed with a few questionable decisions (like disabling hibernation) and some idiotic moderators in the forums, so I started checking other distros. OpenSuSe almost won me over, until I had to use Yast. I had forgotten how bad it was... It has improved since I first used it 12 years ago, but it is still awful. I can't point exactly what, but it always seems to get in the way, instead of helping setting things up.

ArchLinux works very well, is always up-to-date, and now even has a couple of derivative distros that let you use a live version and a gui installer. It also has a vibrant and very knowledgeable community, so for me moving to it from kubuntu is a win-win situation. Give Manjaro a try, if installing from a console is not your thing.

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Go

Kubuntu is still there!

My home PC runs 12.04. Kubuntu - I really couldn't get work done with Unity...

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Re: Kubuntu is still there!

It is still there - but has been relegated to a "community" flavour, down from its semi-official status. No official support from canonical, etc.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Sending search terms to 3rd party

I don't think Ubuntu sends search terms to Facebook or Twitter at all. I think this is a poorly researched article which has blurred the distinction between the new WebApps functionality and the Dash shopping results.

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Re: Kubuntu is still there!

Kubuntu's future actually looks brighter than before now.

Blue systems is owned by a billionaire and they have hired the main kwin developer as a permentment meber of staff - the first project will be migrating kwin to wayland

http://blog.martin-graesslin.com/blog/2012/10/kwin-hacking/

It does sound like change in Kubuntu to being sponsored by Blue systems could be good for the entire KDE world (and thus good for us users seeing as both gnome3 + unity are just not usable desktops imo)

IMO KDE 4.9.x is the best desktop for any OS - if you look at windows future (windows 8) there is no alternative for people who aren't children/trendy teens and actually want to get some work done.

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Re: Sending search terms to 3rd party

It isn't Yast that might end up killing openSUSE for me - it's some of the senseless revisions that they have stuck under the bonnet. A combination of Yast, Control Centre and Webmin have done me over the years but the attitude to end users is really winding me up.

Trouble is that this article seems to indicate that Canonical have a similar approach, and I've been burned by Fedora in the past too.

I've no problem with openSUSE 11.4 but both the 12.x versions have pissed me off. If Kubuntu is no more as somebody has mentioned here, then that's another distro I'll be striking off my list. I've heard good things of Mint...

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Boffin

Re: Sending search terms to 3rd party

@keithpeter

Just remember no mono libraries by default so no Banshee or Hugin Panorama...

Hugin has a dependency on either the autopano-sift library (which requires mono) or autopano-sift-c (which doesn't), so one can run Hugin without mono.

Hurrah!

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Boffin

Re: Sending search terms to 3rd party

"...and some idiotic moderators in the forums..."

If that was ubuntuforums.org I'm glad it wasn't just me.

Try a Live SciLi or an install of PUIAS Linux. RHEL based and very nicely done.

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Pint

Re: Sending search terms to 3rd party

@dajames

"Hugin has a dependency on either the autopano-sift library (which requires mono) or autopano-sift-c (which doesn't), so one can run Hugin without mono."

Excellent, I shall try to compile from source as I can't find Hugin in any of the RHEL repositories.

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Coat

Integrating popular websites into the desktop is hardly a new idea

"Active Desktop" anyone? That was singularly useless as well. Hmm something's not right, things can't be "singular" and "as well".

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Boo

Canonical have lost a hell of a lot of goodwill with this idea!

Ubuntu used to be the posterboy of the Linux community.

If anything it will make people equate Linux with "open" intrusion.

No link to the grep defect in the article?

https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-terminal/+bug/1055766

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Boo

Canonical have lost a hell of a lot of goodwill with this idea!

Actually, the rot set in a lot earlier. I can accept they are following a vision, but I have come to the conclusion that it's not a vision I share. For all my respect for Shuttleworth, I suspect I won't touch much of Ubuntu again - i came off that distro quite a while back when they started making a heaving mess of the UI. It may work for some people, but I think I'm not one of them :)

From the article: Like the Lens, the Amazon app – and web apps in general – are another gamble on Canonical's part.

A lost one IMHO. Part of my reasons for using Linux (and other Unix-y variants) is because it has less BS floating around that ships you data off to 3rd parties. So, not happy with Ubuntu there either.

Nope. Not for me. Hasn't been for me for quite some time..

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Re: Boo

Luckily you can run Kubuntu - this has all the improvements that Ubuntu brings without having to use their horrible tablet (windows 8) style desktop.

I.e you can have all the packages, HW support, etc that Ubuntu has without being forced to use the crap that is unity (what choice to Windows 8 users have?)

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Joke

I can see it now...

But wait; there's even more. If you order now you'll even get Amazon's widely known, heavily discussed, user friendly, super duper search engine which doens't only allow you to search your desktop; it searches the Internet too. Everything you always wanted in one box!

If you order within the next 3 hours we'll even throw in our self proclaimed ultra violent firewall which will help you to keep your computer safe from anything nasty on the Internet AND improves your searching experience too. Ever saw someone use a browser where the website looked like a pile of uninteresting words?

Thats because they used programs such as AdBlock or NoScript. With our self proclaimed ultra violent security suite you don't need those any more. So we did you a huge favor and removed them from the repositories entirely!

Now you can be sure to always get the information which you want and require!

TIME IS RUNNING OUT... Please call the number on screen now and order YOUR copy of the highly popular Ubuntu desktop!

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Trollface

Re: ...where the website looked like a pile of uninteresting words?

Yes!

And I used to vote those articles "Utterly terrible," but I can't do that any longer.

Open and shut, I suppose.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: I can see it now...

Why don't they gust go the whole hog. Disable the Internet and link to Amazon

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WTF?

Bloat

I recall one of the old "selling points" of Linux vs Windows used to be that it was streamlined, and there was nothing in there that you didn't want/need as bits could easily be added or removed as required.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but whilst this Amazon Lens can be turned off, it looks like it can't actually be removed. So here I'm carrying around in Dash something that I actively turn off and don't need/want/use, but must still carry around in the search coding?

And it also seems somewhat at odds with the other article on el Reg today about Canonical pushing Ubuntu as an XP replacement for business. I'm sure most businesses are going to love the idea of Canonical's servers asking Amazon's search engine every time a user searches for a locally stored document (or the content therein) if they accidentally haven't disabled all such commercial lens features, or they've been re-activated or added by an update or even by local user action.

I'm serviously wondering if the Linux partition on my netbook will need to change flavours soon to something that isn't bloating.

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Paris Hilton

Re: Bloat

Well to be a Windows replacement it needs to suck just as hard so things like this are what's required so that users get the same kind of user experience!

Paris because she likes to analyze things

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Re: Bloat

Surely anyone with any sense will have known from the outset that a large commercial organisation pumping money into a free OS wasn't perhaps doing it completely altruistically? Just as with facebook, what initially was a freebie now has to make a return as a business proposition.

The beauty of LINUX is that this isn't a problem - simply hop distros, even a newboe should be able to work out how to do that these days if they got as far as installing ubuntu in the first place. I think Canonical have done a lot to raise the profile of LINUX, this isn't a massive intrusion and it can be disabled. I'm not going to get too het up about it, that's the joy of choice. Personally I'm platform agnostic, I run Win7 on my desktop, mint on my 17 inch laptop, ubuntu on my netbook - I'll upgrade the netbook to latest when it's released, turn the search feature off, and if I still don't like it I can install another debian based distro without any significant hassle.

I can see where the privacy advocates are coming from, but given the options available from my perspective there's not much unexpected to see here, and to make out there is is simply slinging unwarranted mud at LINUX as a whole, isn't it? What am I missing?

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Bloat

QUOTE: Correct me if I'm wrong, but whilst this Amazon Lens can be turned off, it looks like it can't actually be removed. So here I'm carrying around in Dash something that I actively turn off and don't need/want/use, but must still carry around in the search coding?

You're wrong. It can be removed, and quite easily too.

sudo apt-get remove unity-lens-shopping

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Pint

Re: Bloat

Thanks - I'm at the stage of just playing with Linux at the moment (my machine came with Win7 Home Prem which does what I need it to, but I like to see what's what elsewhere too) and so wasn't so sure if it was removable or not.

Anyway my partition changed flavour yesterday from Ubuntu to Lubuntu, which seems somewhat more happy on the machine (an Aspire One) anyway. But have a pint anyway for the educational tip :)

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'Bye-'bye, 'buntu?

I doff my cap to Ubuntu and Canonical for all they (and the open-source developer-contributors) have done to get desktop Linux where it is today - in the sense of "at best, it works better than Windows" - but the more I hear about the path Ubuntu is taking, the more I think I wouldn't put it on a new PC in our house.

A colleague has asked me which Linux distro they could put on an old WinXP PC they have. I replied along the lines of "for a works-out-of-the-box desktop, Mint; for a fast and lean tinkering system, Arch". I'd now only consider Ubuntu for someone who wants a truly "consumer" Linux - if I was going to be a PC's regular sysadmin, I'd install Arch (as I already have on my netbook and Raspberry Pi).

That said: maybe I'll give Ubuntu QQ a spin, and reserve a proper judgement until then...

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Re: 'Bye-'bye, 'buntu?

I've given up on Ubuntu - too bloated, too crufty, too horrible - but I have found Lubuntu great for slower machines and Xubuntu for the others.

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Re: 'Bye-'bye, 'buntu?

Xubuntu for the win!!!

Actually, Linus himself (all bow) switched to XFCE a while back.

I switched to Xubuntu and it's great. I'd also recommend it for normal users - Menu, task bar, fast - what more do you want?

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Anonymous Coward

Re: 'Bye-'bye, 'buntu?

Indeed. In fact, you don't even need to reinstall to get the benefits of Xubuntu. Just pop the xubuntu-desktop package onto an existing Ubuntu install and choose it as your desktop the next time you log in, If you really want to save space and avoid loading updates to stuff you don't use then you could rip out the Unity packages but that is a bit of a pain and it isn't really necessary.

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Re: rip out the Unity packages

Is the first thing I do with a new install of Ubuntu, after installing gnome-session-fallback.

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Trollface

Troll the stats

I wonder if they keep a top ten list of searched for items through the lens? Might be worth seeing if "Windows XP/7" could be brought to the top of the most popular search list with a little gaming.

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Sticking on 12.04 for now.

Yes, the amazon crap can be removed (sudo apt-get remove unity-shopping-lens, or something like that - but it should be opt in, and in it's own scope, rather than the home page), but it's buggy as hell for me. Sound is screwed (on a system that's been fine with Ubuntu sound for the past 4 years), Unity is slow as hell, and well, there's nothing here that makes me want to upgrade.

Maybe I should look into Arch. But I do actually like unity as it is for now...

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Coat

Back to Debian, I suspect

I've been using Ubuntu for about four or five years now, and to begin with it was great. I have always been quick to install the latest release, and have lived with 12.04 since it came out. I've been feeling increasingly disappointed with recent releases, and I realise I'm just not all that happy with Ubuntu any more. I really don't like Unity, and I sure as hell don't like the sound of the Amazon Lens, so I will most likely pass on 12.10. 12.04 is a long term support release so I'll be OK to stick with it for a while but I reckon in due course I'll probably just head on back to Debian, which is where I came to Ubuntu from. It's always been a safe, if boring, choice but I now appreciate that boring is good for something like an OS.

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Big Brother

Lost the plot

They lost me when they brought Unity in.

They seem to be going further and further away from my path, especially around the privacy/data side.

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Linux

Re: Lost the plot

Perhaps it always was just a rich man's toy, but this is the point where that became obvious.

(12.04 here, with MATE desktop)

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Re: Lost the plot

I said the same. Then a co-worker inspired me to actually try it - to just install 12.04 and live with it for a couple of weeks. So I did, with just the stock 12.04 experience, no tweaks, no add ons, and I adapted. It's really not that bad.

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Boffin

Re: Lost the plot

Yup, it seems to take a couple of weeks of 'just using it' to get your head around Unity. Same with Gnome Shell on Gnome 3. I'm sort of flitting between those along with a mad scientist desktop involving IceWM with the Ambiance theme/Thunar/dmenu and a lot of customised shortcuts.

I'm trying not to 'distro-hop' but just stick with the LTS and get some work done on other projects. Debian Squeeze on the laptop.

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FAIL

Re: It's really not that bad.

"Not that bad," is what one puts up with in the MS-no-choice world. We even pay to put up with it.

"Not that bad" is not good enough in the free-choice Linux world. It doesn't even begin to be acceptible.

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Facepalm

NSFW insta-searches

I'm a slow typist. I'll have to stop searching for Scunthorpe United, or Dildo Run Park in Newfoundland.

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Anonymous Coward

"...if you're a slow typer"

I was going to type a n i c , honest I was! You can't blame me if the "a" and "s" are next to each other.

And, you mean typist.

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Coat

Re: "...if you're a slow typer"

And yes, it was a big titanic I was googling for. It was big! And I didn't want to waste my time with reults for models of the titanic...

Models? Hmmm...

Mines the long raincoat

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The reason for Ubuntu's fall from grace?

I wonder just how much of the current dissatisfaction with Ubuntu can be laid at the door of Mark Shuttleworth's increasingly stupid release names?

Techie to Managing Director: "I think we ought to investigate installing Linux on our desktops."

ManDir to Techie: "You mean the thing known as Rabid Rhino or Sizzling Sausages? You must be joking - I'd be laughed off the golf club committee!"

Remember the old tagline: "Can Compaq be any good at making PCs when then can't even spell their name correctly?"

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Anonymous Coward

Re: The reason for Ubuntu's fall from grace?

There are a lot of reasons to mock Ubuntu, their release names are not one of them.

If you are not smart enough to use the release code 12.10 when trying to present the technical options to your boss then I suggest you go get a job that requires less intellectual capacity.

Perhaps flipping burgers would be a better match for your talents?

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Stop

Re: The reason for Ubuntu's fall from grace?

Now what comes after Quantal Quetzal? I breathlessly await the arrival of Unctuous Uakari.

But what happens after Zombie Zebra? Does Mad Mark go back to Anxious Antelope, or "Just Call the Whole Thing Off"?

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Re: The reason for Ubuntu's fall from grace?

You know that R comes after Q, right?

There's a few years left in their first run around the alphabet so I think we're ok for now.

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Only choice

Randy Rhino

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Linux

Re: The reason for Ubuntu's fall from grace?

I wonder just how much of the current dissatisfaction with Ubuntu can be laid at the door of Mark Shuttleworth's increasingly stupid release names?

I used to hope we'd have Perfect Penguin by now ... but as 12.04 was spoilt by Unity it would have been an empty claim.

[I don't think Unity is as bad as most people say, especially on very small screens. It's a valid successor to UNR, but should never have been made the default environment on a desktop PC.]

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Only choice

Surely Rampant Rabbit?

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Happy

Re: Only choice

And I wonder how the Amazon Lens would respond to your search for an upgrade for your "Rampant Rabbit" ?

;)

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