back to article 'Mapsgate' fails to dislocate iPhone 5 demand

Were you steered away from the iPhone 5 by Apple’s ‘Mapsgate’ controversy? Were you tied by the introduction of a new, incompatible Lightning cables? If so, you're not like most potential buyers of Apple's latest phone, it seems. New research suggests these issues have had little or no impact on demand for the iPhone 5. In …

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Joke

May I be the first to say

Stop suffixing every scandal with Gate for fuck sake!

Watergate wasn't a scandal about water, so it's not even like it's appropriate usage

Right, might actually read the article now!

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Holmes

Re: May I be the first to say

Can I just add I think there's a conspiracy to add Gate to the end of any possible conspiracy or controversy. I'm calling it "Gategate".

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Flame

Re: May I be the first to say

The only part of this comment I don't agree with is the "Joke alert" icon.

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Silver badge

Re: May I be the first to say

iconGate?

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Silver badge

Re: May I be the first to say

Or even the BBC's celebrity sex scandal... StarGate. Or is it Saville Row?

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Anonymous Coward

Re: May I be the first to say

Conspiracy theorists keep repeating conspiracies as though they are true, even though they are inherently uncertain about their veracity . I'm calling it Heisengate. Not sure if I believe what I just wrote though. My god it's recursivegate.

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This post has been deleted by its author

Anonymous Coward

Re: May I be the first to say

The quality of these gate jokes is so bad, I ran out the house screaming, only there was no escape; Gardengate.

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Coat

Re: May I be the first to say

I think Bill's behind it:

GatesGate.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: May I be the first to say

Be of good cheer and trust in a higher power:

HeavensGate.

Of course, if you are of the Hindu faith, that could lead to:

CattleGate.

Or, if you are an EE, you need something that can handle power:

FETgate.

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Silver badge

Re: May I be the first to say

I blame the church. Bishopsgate.

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Anonymous Coward

More questions...

Did they ask those who wanted an iPhone...

Are you aware of how bad the maps app is?

Are you aware your existing cables, docks etc are incompatible with the iPhone 5?

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Anonymous Coward

Re: More questions...

"Are you aware your existing cables, docks etc are incompatible with the iPhone 5?"

that's irrelevant to new iphone owners (you imply they would be new iphone owners by using "those who wanted an iPhone").

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Anonymous Coward

Quote: "...the numbers still suggest iPhone users aren’t being as troubled by Maps’ failings as the headlines would have us believe"

Or the 'failings' are generally nit-picking. Apple's maps are better than Google's in our area. For example, Google's satellite images are at least 6 years out of date whereas Apple's appear to be right up to date. Everyone's experience will vary, but acting like Apple is the only one with Map problems is a bit disingenuous.

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Anonymous Coward

How's the streetview on Apple maps? And how out of date is it?

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Anonymous Coward

When I bought the iPhone 4 it was competitive, the camera performance was excellent and the design was really nice. The phone felt solid and the buttons nice and clicky (my current phone feels less good).

But that was over 2 years ago and very little has changed.

It seems other brands are doing the innovation and actually thinking about the phone and how the general use of it can be made better (not just slapping loads of features onto the spec).

I didn't mind paying the Apple premium when you were getting something better, but it seems all you get now is problems and broken promises.

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Stop

What did Apple promise to you that they failed to deliver?

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Anonymous Coward

Well, given that Apple didn't invent the touchscreen, the mobile phone, the smartphone or much else, its hardly surprising that other people are doing the innovation. You want "Apple innovation"? I offer you rounded corners.

Or more likely, there is no money left for innovation, because it has all been spent on lawyers. So fast cars for lawyers is what your Apple premium buys. Nice.

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Happy

> Or more likely, there is no money left for innovation, because it has all been spent on lawyers.

I know lawyers are expensive, but given that Apple has accumulated a cash pile of over $75 billion, it seems unlikely.

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Innovation

Wikipedia says:

"Innovation is the development of new customer value through solutions that meet new needs, unarticulated needs, or old customer and market needs in new ways. This is accomplished through different or more effective products, processes, services, technologies, or ideas that are readily available to markets, governments, and society. Innovation differs from invention in that innovation refers to the use of a better and, as a result, novel idea or method, whereas invention refers more directly to the creation of the idea or method itself. "

Apple may not invent very much at all and still be bloody innovative.

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Anonymous Coward

@The Baron

"I know lawyers are expensive, but given that Apple has accumulated a cash pile of over $75 billion, it seems unlikely."

Recent newsflow indicates that last year they did spend more on lawyers than they did on innovation. Pardon me for suggesting it, but that's a bit of a tipping point, when you've not actually invented much in the first place.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Innovation @uhuznaa

A very valid point in relation to Apple, but companies still class innovation as the "D" in R&D, and Apple spend less on R&D than they do on lawyers.

And that shows - if Apple management weren't arsing around with so many expensive legal actions, they might have time to better consider the development of a maps application that doesn't generate a lot of critical comment. Or concentrate on making sure that punters can't short circuit the antenna simply by holding the device.

Apple didn't get where they are by patent trolling, they got where they are (as you say) by innovation. Recent releases have shown minimal innovation, just some very minor upgrades, so it seems that this is a company that is running out of steam. With so much cash and more rolling in they won't disappear any time soon. But go back to the original iPhone, and it wiped the floor with contemporary smart phones, despite some shortcomings. Now look at the 5, and well, there's no clear water between it and several other phones. The iPad - great when it came out, not sure that I see anything truly new in the newer versions. At this rate Apple will become a stodgy corporate like MS.

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Re: Innovation @uhuznaa

The difference between Apple and MS is that MS has/had about 95% of the market while Apple has much less. Apple just can't afford to be that lazy.

I totally agree by the way that Apple has shown a very visible lack of pushing iOS (and OS X) forward. I'm not so sure about the hardware, there's not much they could do here apart from small things. The iPhone in 2007 was a Big Bang and you can't have these every year.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Innovation @uhuznaa

"The difference between Apple and MS is that MS has/had about 95% of the market while Apple has much less. Apple just can't afford to be that lazy."

Well, what's the Apple share of the tablet market? Or back in the day, what was their share of the portable music player market? And in phones, they are largely contesting the high end premium price range. So the Apple market share in phones is basically (iPhone sales)/(iPhone plus Samsung Galaxy S2 and3 sales) or something similar. Likewise, Apple aren't contesting most of the business computing market, and only compete against the higher end PC's. There's no way that Apple are competing against a £300 bottom of the range Dell desktop, are they? Maybe against the high end XPS and All in ones, but I suspect Apple outsell those many times to one.

I think that in the segments that they choose to contest (stylish, high margin), Apple do have a dominant market share, and that is why they are becoming lazy.

There's also the point that Jobs is dead, and he did bring a demanding obsessiveness that made Apple products unique. I'm not sure that the corporate monkeys now in charge will be able to hold on to that, although there's a cash mountain and a vast brand legacy to keep them going for a while yet.

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Re: @The Baron

>>"I know lawyers are expensive, but given that Apple has accumulated a cash pile of over $75 billion, it seems unlikely."

>Recent newsflow indicates that last year they did spend more on lawyers than they did on innovation. Pardon me for suggesting it, but that's a bit of a tipping point, when you've not actually invented much in the first place.

I didn't say they had spent their money on innovation, only that they hadn't spent all their money on lawyers, which was the original comment to which I replied.

Apple's R&D spend is generally around 2% of their revenue, which is not very much... as a percentage, it's less than HP spends, around half of what HTC spends, and around 1/3 of what IBM spends.

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Anonymous Coward

no maps problems so far

I heard about this problem with the maps application from different websites. But I fail to see the problem in the cities I used them (Germany, Austria), it was very accurate. Sometimes the new businesses are not listed. This whole maps thing is blown out of proportion in my opinion.

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Anonymous Coward

"If it’s good enough for a close relative, it’s safe to assume it’s good enough for the buyer too."

Nope - I recommended an iPhone for the missus, but would always (at the moment) prefer Android for myself.

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The truth is...

that the 5 is still a bloody good smartphone. It has its own share of disadvantages, true, but still: Its a nice, stylish, very responsive and fluid, easy to use smartphone with a great, quick and easy to use camera, the panorama feature works extremely well and with no fussing around at all, there are lots of very nice apps for it that don't reek of "computer" at all (as opposed to many Android apps)... Basically it's a joy to use if what you want is an appliance and not a computer. The maps suck a fair bit, the cables and adapters are bloody expensive, but these are things you can live with.

And I even don't own one. I also don't like Apple as a company. Still, nice phone. Don't pretend everyone buying one is an idiot.

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Anonymous Coward

"The researcher asked iPhone 5 owners - and folk with other handsets since upgraded to iOS 6, of which the new Maps app is a part - about these issues, and almost all of them - 91 per cent - said Maps had caused them little or no bother."

The problem with asking owners when they've spent almost half a month's wage (or more) on the thing, they feel the need to defend their purchasing decision.

It doesn't matter whether it's Apple, Samsung or anyone else's customers. If you've spent £500 on a phone and someone tells you it's shit/points out a flaw, of course you're going to be a fanboy.

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Thumb Down

iOS 6 doesn't cost £500

> and folk with other handsets since upgraded to iOS 6

These people (also surveyed) didn't spend £500 on a new handset. They downloaded a free OS upgrade. They got the new maps app. They may (or may not) have an issue with it. The crossbreaks in the survey would let us know.

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Was the survey US only?

Apps may be tolerable in the US. In the UK, it's beyond crap and certainly useless.

Try navigating to Shepherds Bush and you end up in Teddington High Street at the offices of a management company.

Maps might be usable once Apple works out that we number our roads in the UK, and that most of them are numbered, not just the dual carriageways.

On the up side, London is in the right place. So that's something.

From a dev pov, I'm not sure how many devs realise that turn-by-turn isn't available to developers. If your app plots a route, iOS loads Maps to display it and kicks your app into standby.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Was the survey US only?

I've just typed "Shepherd's Bush, London" into Apple Maps and Google Maps and they both suggested the middle of Uxbridge Road about 100 metres from Shepherd's Bush Market tube station.

BUT, if you just type "Shepherd's Bush" into the search on Apple Maps, it will show you the nearest match first. And if you're near Teddington, then that may well be the company that calls itself "144 Shepherds Bush Road Management Co Ltd " and actually resides on Teddington High Street. Interestingly, this company also has offices in Richmond, so you could presumably find the same problem if you started somewhere near there.

These particular problems sound very much like the stories you got when satnavs became popular and people would either miss-type their destination or not realise there were several places of the same name and then end up brainlessly following the directions from the magic box before working out that there may be a problem when they've been driving for eight hours on what should have been a 15 minute journey.

And, naturally, the fault lies firmly with the magic box, not the operator.

I think the issue is that Google Maps only searches for the place, whereas Apple Maps also searches for businesses and people aren't expecting that. Is that behaviour more helpful or less helpful? I don't think you can say either way at the moment, because what it definitely is is "different" and some adjustment time is needed first - changes to familiar things are invariably "crap" to the general population until they have time to become accustomed to them.

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Devil

The maps is a test

The next one will be seriously reduced in cost and functionality, while sold at same price. This will allow longer battery life.

They will sell just as well and make more profit. For phone calls it will actually be better due to less complexity and longer battery. Win-Win

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Decent mid-market phone

The iPhones are perfectly decent mid-market phones (at market-top prices), although some of the apps I use every day are a bit absent (streetview, for instance).

Personally I'd rather get market-top technology for market-top prices, and have to say am currently tempted by a Galaxy Note 2 with LTE which seems a far more powerful device.

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WTF?

Why the surprise?

Fanbois bought the Antennagate version of the handset knowing that it was defective.

They are so desperate to fondle the latest offering, with the unique tactile feedback of scratched aluminium. Most manufacturers finish their product to a smooth finish which, I guess, can be boring to some. Could be they are also into S & M or self-abuse. Or ribbed condoms.

Crappy Map App is a nothing, it's the feel that makes their days.

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Anonymous Coward

It's Friday I can't be bothered....

To read the article, or the other comments, but at a guess, people are blindly buying the iphone because its an iphone?

Has this video been posted yet?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FL7yD-0pqZg

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Mushroom

Re: It's Friday I can't be bothered....

Best line (from the iPad 2 vs the library)...

Your stupidity has caused me to spontaneously combust.

The pain is incredible.

Are you happy?

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Anonymous Coward

Re: It's Friday I can't be bothered....

Yes, yes I am.......

Pure evil!

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FAIL

Proof indeed

that iPhone owners are idiots.

Apple could sell them a colored Lego brick for £500 and tell them it's an iPhone and they would love it.

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Re: Proof indeed

What a deliciously innovative and original opinion you've expressed. Well done.

Now, while the rest of the world are happily going about their business quite happily using their appliance of choice, why not pat yourself on the back once again and congratulate yourself for being the only true messiah of technological justice the Internet has ever seen. Go on, post another banal, predictable comment slagging off other people's personal choice of handset whilst you sit there happily sucking on the scaly phallus of whatever corporation you happen to approve of. You're simply amazing. You're worth it. You're the BEST.

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Stop

Re: Proof indeed

Why should anyone worship a particular corporation? Unlike you, I am a fan of TECHNOLOGY, not any particular company. Any company that makes good products, and drives the industry forward gets the Shitpeas seal of approval.

Crap technology hiding under slick marketing is my nemesis. This usually (but not limited to), means Apple and any Microsoft product that isn't software (although Windows 8 has broken that mould).

Don't judge everyone by YOUR fanboy corporate worshipping.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Proof indeed

"I am a fan of TECHNOLOGY, not any particular company" Bullshit. Source? Your posting history.

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People don't use maps that much and I suspect it's not as bad as some people think. It certainly isn't perfect but then again none of the mapping services have 100% update info and quality imagery for the whole world. Hell they have pretty big gaps in populated areas of the western nations still.

Mapping the earth and keeping it up to date is a monumental task. That's why people should pool their resources and support open street map.

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Anonymous Coward

Google maps still fails on Android at my place

My work mates rock up with their new Samsung phones and they still get directions from Google maps navigation telling them they have arrived at their destination 2 very long streets away from my address. This is the prime reason after owning a Samsung I went iPhone as the next phone as it directs me right to my property. I was worried about the map switch with iOS6 but to my relief it still navigates me right to my address as before.

This whole map-Gate thing is such a non-issue in my area.

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Silver badge

Wait...what?

Do Samsung phones not use the same Google Maps data that iPhone used to? How is it that Samsung phones were navigating you two blocks from your house but iPhone directed you correctly pre-iOS 6 (I'm assuming this because you say with iOS 6 "it still navigates me right to my address as before")

Additionally you state that because of this navigation error, you switched to iPhone, but then go on to say that map-Gate is a big non-issue in your area. So if iOS 6's new maps had directed you elsewhere would you switch to Nokia, hoping they get it right? Or would you decide between Android and iPhone based on which came closer to your house? Does map accuracy only matter to get people to your house, but not elsewhere? Where do you live, a roach motel? ("roaches get in but they don't get out")

The only thing in your entire post that makes sense and I agree with is where you say "this whole map-gate thing is such a non-issue". I haven't had any problems with the new maps. They are better in some ways than before and worse in some ways than before, so it's basically a wash but they'll improve a lot now that Apple is in sole control (and the bad publicity will only help speed that along)

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