Feeds

back to article Apple wins second round of Samsung patent slugfest

Apple has won a round of their ongoing battle with Samsung, scoring a complete four-patent victory at the US International Trade Commission. Samsung had filed the case with the trade arbitrators alleging that Apple, with the production of its iPhone and iPad, had infringed upon four of the Korean smartphone and tablet maker's …

COMMENTS

This topic is closed for new posts.

Page:

Coffee/keyboard

Lol @ the comments on that MDN article. I thought I'd seen blinkered fanboyism here on the Reg but apparently this is just the tip of the crazy people iceberg.

23
5
Anonymous Coward

They appear

To be bullet proof

2
0
Anonymous Coward

They are right

As title. Stick with your fandroid forums if your prefer the chocolate tinted version of reality.

7
42
Anonymous Coward

Wow

That's impressive and very amusing. Thanks for the headsup as I wouldn't have waded that deep into the cult on the offchance of amusement

5
0
Anonymous Coward

You obviously haven't read anything by Obviousy! here if your think Apple fans are blinkered.

3
4
Mushroom

Re: They are right

@AC 22:54

What's this? The enemy of my friend is my enemy? I'm the first to admit I'm no fan of Apple, but I'm equally no fan of Android either. I was referring to the shitbrained Woz-haters on the MDN article's comments. Either you didn't bother checking that out, or you did, chose to interpret my comment as anti-Apple rhetoric and arrived at the retarded, blinkered fanboy conclusion that I must of course be a "Fandroid". Either way you're a blithering idiot.

Man, the quality of comments here is going further down the tubes every day.

With apologies to everyone here who is not AC 22:54 or his/her ilk.

22
2
Boffin

And just for clarification on my original comment: when I said " I thought I'd seen blinkered fanboyism here on the Reg" I was referring to both the Apple and Google/Android variety. I don't dig these special spellings and intonations you crazy kids have for telling the two apart.

5
0

This post has been deleted by its author

Anonymous Coward

Most comments there are actually quite reasonable, with the a few exceptions. It's a known fact that Woz's business acumen is not that great. He's a genius, but spoiled, engineer who got lucky with whom he partnered in business.

If he had stayed with HP or some other company, or even went solo, he wouldn't be sitting in the pile of cash he has now and probably no one would even ask him for the time of day. Maybe he should appreciate that a bit more instead of going around shouting out opinions about stuff outside of his expertise. That's what I got from the comments anyway, and is true imho.

1
29
Silver badge
Holmes

He partnered in business with a sociopathic control freak with a knack for marketing who got lucky 3 times out of 6 or so.

It could happen to anyone.

39
1

Agree mostly with that, which is why I made no value judgement on Woz's statement.

> Woz ... got lucky with whom he partnered in business.

Likewise you could say Jobs also got lucky - very lucky - with whom he partnered in business. If not for guys like Woz then guys like Steve go nowhere, and vice versa. For startups, it's the genius/spoiled/lucky engineers' free exchange of ideas that creates the products to be sold in the first place. There has to be a bit of give and take. Apple is busy killing that ethos for corporate gain. It's shitty behaviour, but it's what corporations do and whilst it won't be the end of Apple, they will become Microsoft. All that remains to figure out is whether or not Google will beat them to it.

12
0
Anonymous Coward

Actually there are some interesting comments on that thread.

I didn't know Woz never implemented floating point in his Apple BASIC compiler and in the end Steve Jobs had to go and license that from Microsoft in order to have the fully functional product that users were asking for.

3
1
JDX
Gold badge

The only crazed fanboism on El Reg is from the Linux/Android/FOSS crowd.

4
23
Anonymous Coward

@JDX

Lol. What was DF118 saying about blinkered?

7
0
FAIL

"The lesson is, if you want to get relief against Apple, it's going to have to be in a foreign forum where it doesn't have the clout or the cachet it has at the ITC or the northern district of California."

LMFAO. So justice is NOT blind in the USA? I thought it was just their brain-damaged patent system that was the problem, but if this guy is to be believed (and it's a big IF) it's the entire US Justice system that's SNAFU.

2
0
Silver badge

get with the programme!

merkins have the best justice system money can buy... it's a fact! just ask Ojays ex wife :-)

2
0
Silver badge

Wasn't Integer Basic an add-on on the 16k expansion card?

1
0
Anonymous Coward

Woz is okay. But he's also pretty blinkered and overstates Apple's success and involvement in the early days of home computing. In reality it was Commodore and MOS technology who were driving it all, anything using a 6502 CPU owes its success to Chuck Peddle and Commdore/MOS.

Woz wasn't even a proper engineer until he went back to finish off his degree.

Chuck Peddle had to get his Apple 1 working and Apple were only allowed to sell it after removing video output jack as the computer created so much RF interference that it wasn't authorised to be sold complete.

0
0
Stop

@DF118

blinkered fanboyism here on the Reg

There is no blinkered fanboyism on elReg, if you want to see blinkered fanboyism, have a look at the documentary "MacHEADS".

I found the film somewhat disturbing, because these 'fanbois' are more than just fans, they are cultists, it is the The Cult of Mac.

The Steve Jobs reality distortion field seems to have affected some people rather badly judging by their contributions[1],

(1) "Steve knows what we want and he gives it to us"

(2) A musician who could not be creative unless she was using a Mac. I can't rmember her name but she was dressed like a member of the Nox

(3) Guy Kawasaki's title at crApple was "chief evangelist". WTF!!!! It's a computer, but this guy has a religious title!!!!!

(4) A Macintosh museum, where after showing row after row of Original Macintosh (colour beige) , Mackintosh II (colour beige), Mackintosh portables (colour beige), Classic Mackintosh (colour beige), Mackintosh 128Ks (colour beige), Apple Lisas' (colour beige) and a pile of other crap (all colour beige) I didn't recognise, calmly states that apple are "fighting against the beige banality of IBM". Worst case of the reality distortion field I've ever seen.

(5) This is the best one of all; a comment from Violet Blue, a Mac blogger and sex columnist, right at the start of the program who states that "I've never knowingly slept with a Windows user".

There are more examples I could give you but give the program a look yourself, it's not a particularly good bit of program making but it does give an insight into the insular world of the real fanboi.

[1] Doing this from memory so may not be exactly what they said, except (5) - Google it.

0
0
Anonymous Coward

Actually the lesson is

... just accept that the American market is broken beyond repair. If you aren't a US company things are stacked against you in any legal disputes to such an extent that it really isn't worth the hassle. If your products are geared towards consumers then don't even bother trying to sell to them. It's a big world out there so focus elsewhere, just leave their market alone and wait for it to implode in a haze of mediocrity. And yes, I do own an IT company so I realise the price being paid to make that stand and will do it anyway.

38
4
Anonymous Coward

Re: Actually the lesson is

Did you miss the Apple win in Germany earlier in this week? Blows your theory out of water.

4
23
Anonymous Coward

Re: Actually the lesson is

And Samsung is Korean?

That may be where their HQ is but if you look at share ownership the company then foreigners own 82% of the company.

1
0
Anonymous Coward

Re: Actually the lesson is @ AC 23:07

You seem to be misunderstanding the situation as Apple being able to always win in a given location != Apple being unable to lose elsewhere. The point was that when the 'home advantage' is as severe as it is in this case, sometimes it just isn't worth the effort to play there, meaning that for the sake of short term profit a situation is created where the whole notion of a free market is undermined and there is a detrimental effect on innovation because of a lack of genuine competition. The only people who are going to suffer as a result of that are the consumers in countries that encourage this sort of protectionism and quite frankly, as they've collectively voted for the people who are allowing this to continue, I don't have a huge amount of sympathy.

13
1
Anonymous Coward

Re: Actually the lesson is

@ AC 22:50:

"Actually the lesson is ... just accept that the American market is broken beyond repair. If you aren't a US company things are stacked against you in any legal disputes to such an extent that it really isn't worth the hassle"

Sadly that has been my approach even with my own small software company; too many possible risks in that market, mostly involving lawyers, which is why the insurance companies ask 'will you be doing business in the United States', and if so, the cost doubles compared to doing business with the rest of the world!

8
0
Thumb Down

Re: Actually the lesson is

Yeah but the layman jury don't know that.

0
0

This post has been deleted by a moderator

Apple cultists

You have got to love the almost angry devotion that the apple cultists here have. Even during the darkest days of the Microsoft era the fanboys weren't this rabid. My guess is that the fanboy cultists know their time is going to be very short before apple's hubris rebounds on them, probably when the rest of the world decides to give apple a much deserved patent enema. I am looking forward to that. Even Microsoft's collapse is not nearly as satisfying as watching the fall of the cult of Jobs.

21
5
Anonymous Coward

Re: Apple cultists

The anti-Apple cultist's devotion is still a lot angrier, as exemplified by your post.

7
25
Stop

Re: Apple cultists

I would have to concur with the AC, that if you look at the comments or votes on any of the Apple related articles the majority of commenters/voters take an anti-Apple stance. It also seems that most initial comments are in the same vein. Objectively, anyone can review the comments and measure this themselves, but please let me know if my casual observation is incorrect.

2
8
Silver badge
Mushroom

Re: Apple cultists

You're damn right we're angry.

We're angry because we're sick of corrupt, greedy, biased, Apple-share-owning-bought-and-paid-for judges, politicians and lawyers perverting and destroying justice systems the world over to further Apple's holy grail of being the only fucking electronics corp on the planet.

We're sick of the endless perversion and abuse of the patent system by a corporation that makes Niccolo Machiavelli and Gille de Rais look like fucking Mother Theresa and Mohandas Ghandi.

We're sick of their corporate-terrorism-supporting fanboi retards buying their shit and making them this powerful. There used to be such a thing as choice, where you could decide what brand you wanted to buy. But noooo, fanboi idiots would rather one company to rule them all and no choice at all because making such decisions taxes the single neuron possessed by appletards too much.

One day, that anger will spill over. The huge number of people who actually possess more than one brain cell who like the right to choose, will turn on Apple and tear them and their fanboi supporters to pieces. I live in hope and anticipation of that day.

56
7
Anonymous Coward

Re: Apple cultists

You are one of those 'hate anyone successful' people - cup half empty as well?

Perhaps stop for a second and consider these courts are not corrupt and perhaps they genuinely have a case and how you would feel if you spend a load of time and money developing something only for Samsung or someone to come along and (blatantly) rip it off.

No-one is saying don't make a phone but you don't need it to look so similar and have such similar functionality and Samsung are just another corporate gorilla - they are trying to sue over their patents (but mostly failing).

4
34

This post has been deleted by its author

Anonymous Coward

Re: Apple cultists

@Steven Roper

Oh do get a grip

4
27
Anonymous Coward

Re: Apple cultists

Rantastic!

2
0
Anonymous Coward

Re: Apple cultists

"@Steven Roper

Oh do get a grip!

I think he does have a grip........ a very good grip if you ask me.... I couldn’t have made the point any better if i tried !!

10
3
Thumb Down

Re: Apple cultists

Or maybe apple just arent liked by the average reg reader any more. It's a democracy. If anti apple sentiments exist it's because people don't agree with apple... The days of the cool, witty and wily underdog are gone, welcome the new snide and über confident megacorp.

I had a 3GS, own a 4S and will go for the 5. I have a Cube, a PowerBook, a mac mini, a PowerMac and a brace of G4/5/intel iMacs and yet, if someone were to ask my, "would you recommend Apple?" I could no longer say, "yes" with a clear conscience.

Love product, hate company... In the words of Father Ted, a shower of bastards...they honestly make me sick, the direction they have taken... With theor petty and ultimately self defeating patent war... All the kings men springs to mind...

/rant

3
0
Anonymous Coward

Re: Apple cultists

A grip on his male appendage i would posit

0
0

Re: Apple cultists

No, you're angry because you're a fanboy and you can't stand that everyone just can't see the light and do everything you do.

0
1
Silver badge

Re: Apple cultists

Yet you are still buying into their crap and justifying their behavior?

if you arent part of the solution then im afraid you are part of the problem

0
0
Silver badge

Re: Apple cultists

One post on a forum outdoes the endless hype, fanaticism and free advertising from the near entirety of the mainstream media?

One post on a forum where it's on-topic to discuss phones outdoes all the people who'll randomly tell you they have an Iphone, Ipad - when they first buy it, every day when they use it, or when the CEO dies - whether it's to evangelise, or what it's a completely irrelevant comment? If you say so.

And an opposition to fanaticism isn't fanaticism - it's just being fed up of the whole thing.

0
0
Anonymous Coward

Claiming judges are corrupt is just desperate anti-Apple chatter. People have little sympathy for Apple as they are large / rich / successful - but Samsung are not the plucky underdog just trying to scratch a living. They ripped off the design of the device and it's workings and all the time being an Apple supplier - talk about biting the hand that feeds it.

Imagine you were Ford - you got another company to make the engine and some of the other components. Your new car does well and your supplier does well as a result - but that's not enough for them. They decide to design their own car - yet it looks almost the same as yours and they you see almost everything is the same - not just that it has 4 wheels - but it's almost a facsimile. They then think it's 'ok' to sell their own car in direct competition to you AND remain as a major supplier. Ford - what would you do...?

4
35
Anonymous Coward

They are corrupt

Apple are an all American company (even though they manufacture abroad) and with the xenophobia rampant in the US at the moment and the economy being fubar to go against them would be seen as un-American. In other parts of the world* the exact arguments that Apple are winning with in the US are being thrown out as childish nonsense. Even South Korea has a much more impartial judiciary as seen in the latest court case where the judge said they were both being as bad as each other and awarded them both pennies then told them to go away and grow up. If they had followed the American way of doing things, Samsung would have won and been awarded lots in damages.

If Apples case is so strong then why aren't going after every single mobile manufacturer? They just want Samsung out of the way because they are running scared. Samsung have far superior products and are out-selling them in every market. Apple just can't compete and therefore have to rely on the legal system to keep them out of the market. I just hope Samsungs lawyers have the sense to counter sue Apple over the iphone 5 using Apples own tactics just to see how the US manages to defend them.

4" screen, we did that 1st

16:9 format, we did that 1st

5 rows of icons, we did that 1st

and so on

Now we all know that Samsung did not do these things 1st, but neither did Apple. If the US then sides with Apple and declares Samsungs claims invalid it will just show the world that rampant protectionism is the US way as they granted Apple stupidly high damages for the exact same arguments. This will stop a lot of companies doing business with the US as it clearly isn't a level playing field and will make the economic situation even worse.

*Except Germany, fuck knows what they are thinking. their decisions recently plainly go against European law but nobody seems willing to prosecute them for it.

21
3
Bronze badge

I have no special sympathy for Samsung, nor own any Samsung kit other than TV, Blue Ray, and monitor. Neither can I find any rational justification for buying a tablet or new phone (2009 Droid still works well). It appears to me, as a somewhat detached observer, that current Samsung phones and tablets (except for latest iPad display) equal or superior to Apple's on a hardware basis, and the OS/software interface is a matter of taste. Anybody actually confused enough to buy a Samsung phone or tablet thinking they were getting an Apple product is not smart enough to be trusted with the amount of money spent. Apple (in Apple v Samsung, recently decided) appeared to benefit significantly from trial court decisions and jury conduct that some might characterize as bias and improper conduct, respectively. Apple's efforts to exclude competitors based on the flimsy patents offered won't hurt Samsung much in the long run, but suggests it has lost confidence in its ability to design outstanding products and lost faith in its customers ability to recognize them.

7
1
Anonymous Coward

"Imagine you were Ford"

oh ffs, not anotehr car analogy. its just a twist on godwins law....

ford was a success for one massive reason. His manufacturing process using a moving assembly line churned out so many cars, so quickly that he could sell them cheap. almost all car maufactures have copied this. Imagine the shit we would be in if fords managed to patent this and banned other companies from using the same process or got other cars banned from being imported because they used the same manufacturing techniques.

The car industry has benefited from years of other companies taking the best parts of other cars and incorporating it into their cars. because of this we have had over 100 years of car development and bleeding edge technology propelling some production cars to way over the 200mph mark. If fords played the game like apple then we would all be still driving ford model TS's and the colour option would include white as well as black....

after reading the results that apple have gained in the courts it fails me on how the decisions that the courts came to the decisions they did. In the recent apple vs Samsung case, the fact that there was so many mistakes in the papers from the jury, like awarding damages for things they had decided Samsung did not infringe on. the fact the sums did not add up. the fact that there was no way they spent enough time to digest what was presented to them in court..... all they did was scribble a few bits down and got their asses out of their, and they allowed it to stand.... don’t tell me their was no corruption...

oh and i could put 50 de-badged cars in front of most people and if they could tell the make and model of more than half I would be surprised... but it does not hurt the car industry....

4
0
Silver badge
Facepalm

AC 08:10

That's what happens every day in the motor industry you moron!

That's kinda the point, cars have a wheel in each corner cos that's the sensible (obvious) way to do things. apple are trying (and succeeding with the help of the massively broken us legal system) to patent 'having a wheel in each corner'

are you really suggesting that the design and _function_ of every carburetor, injection system, braking system, steering system is unique?

screw it - im gonna patent 'doing things with stuff' and sue the fuck out of everyone!

2
0
Silver badge
Pirate

Re: AC 08:10

Indeed imagine if ford had patented an aerodynamic cabin with four wheels one in each corner. Windscreen with opening doors on either side.

That is effectively what apple is trying to do. Try to argue that a truck is not a car? Irrelevant, the design patent would still win.

Lunacy!

0
0

Unfortunately Apple go after others in court over some features that are to be honest so simple as to beg the question; should they even qualify for a patent? Ironically they then fill their iphone 5 with a lot of features from elsewhere. The panorama feature has been on my Sony compact camera for years, they make out like they invented it but its already out there (and no doubt patented). You can't throw stones for patent breach then go ripping off other ideas. Pot meet Kettle. They might have paid for them sure, but I doubt it.

I like and own apple products, I have an Imac and a Macbook pro but my out of contract iphone 4 will probably be my last iphone, at least for a long while. Like the products, not a fan of the company and how it does business at the mo. So I need to vote with my wallet which I will do, any suggestions on my next phone? ;)

0
0
Anonymous Coward

"Banging his head really hard in a plane crash probably didn’t help matters, either."

Woz disagrees with your view of things and therefore his opinion is completely wrong and might be due to residual brain damage from his plane crash. Because no one can possibly have opinions different to yours especially if they were one of the founders of the company you are in love with. Classy.

19
0
Stop

@AC 08:10

First thing I will say is that I'm NOT a "fan" of either Android or Apple, or of any smart phones for that matter. I own an iPod (classic) because it gave me what i wanted from an MP3 player, equally I own a couple of Samsung products; my mobile isn't even a smartphone. Thought I'd get that out of the way before being accused of being a "fan" of anything and the ranters assume everything I type is based on some perceived bias!

It's not quite the same as your analogy. I like cars, I take notice of them and watch for new models from different manufacturers etc. Now compare the modern cars with each other - even as someone who notices cars & their looks, performance, specifications etc if I see a new model I can't always tell who made it until I see the badge. Sometimes they look so similar to another make I need to check even if it's a reasonably common model. What happened here was one manufacturer decided to change the general look of their car which proved polular, so other manufacturers moved in the same direction (e.g. MPVs or chunky hatchbacks with straight backs & rounded corners). New technology allowed for upgraded spec details like better in-car audio, air-con, even sun roofs. These were "copied" by other manufacturers as they'd proved popular. What you DIDN'T get was one car manufacturer trying to patent the whole idea of having "an aperture in the roof of a car that has a moveable cover". They may have patented the very detailed mechanism of HOW the cover is moved by the operator, but I doubt even that. And this is what Apple seems to be doing in this case, they are patenting the concept & general look & feel of the object rather than very specific details.

The modern smartphone didn't suddenly come into being created from scratch by one company, there's been a gradual evolution over the last few years from a basic mobile phone with small changes being made at different times by different manufacturers, and when these small changes have proved popular with customers then other manufacturers have followed. NO ONE COMPANY is responsible for the current smartphone format, the shape, the touch scrreen, the type of applications & uses that can be made of them.

25
1

Page:

This topic is closed for new posts.