back to article HTC's 4G patent beef could get iPhone 5 BANNED in US

Apple may be banned from importing its new iPhone into the United States if the International Trade Commission in Washington DC finds that Cupertino has violated an HTC patent for connecting to the 4G network. Apple is subject to an ongoing investigation by the the International Trade Commission under Judge Thomas Pender, after …

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Anonymous Coward

Please please please

Let it go HTCs way and get apple battered by the system they have abused so much.

Probably too much to ask though as it's a US court

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Please please please

Anyone who thinks that Apple will be banned from selling the iPhone 5 in the US must also believe in fairies, leprechauns and the wizard of oz.

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Anonymous Coward

Come on bios

Fandroids sharpen your knives, sharpen your wit because this is being served up to you on a plate. Don't let me down now.

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Anonymous Coward

I have always wondered why El Reg fails to put an age restriction on the site. It would prevent the large number of pubescent teenagers who appear to enjoy fondling their Androids because, as the old argument is regurgitated time after time, 'I want to do what ever I want with my phone,' Personally I use mine to make calls, however it you want to stick it up your ars* then I have no objection. Whatever rocks your boat.

Now I know going through puberty has quite an effect on your brains, tantrums, shouting, thinking you are always right, mood swings etc but please if you post be constructive. It's just that the Juvenile ranting is just... Well juvenile, I mean most of you that rant about Apple have never owned one and only have Android phones because you can't afford an iPhone or can't persuade your parent(s) to buy you one for your birthday. It will soon be Christmas maybe ask them again?

I know it's tough seeing people walk past with the latest and greatest of iPhones and iPads, and you can only afford a middle of the road Android phone, I know you will tell me it was your choice, but we know deep down it wasn't.

That doesn't mean that you should let the big green eyed monster take over your life. Maybe soon you will be promoted from low paid job, get a chance to go to college. The whole world is out there for you, once you get a good job you won't have to rely on the Bank of Mum and Dad and can finally buy one for yourselves. Good luck to you.

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Alert

Tinfoil hat alert!!!

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Holmes

"why El Reg fails to put an age restriction on the site..."

Because it seems that making anonymous, juvenile trolling posts can't be pinned down to any particular age group...

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Anonymous Coward

OK I'll feed the troll

I posted the 1st comment and just to put you straight -

I am mid 30s, wife, kids, car, house with a decent job and could afford an iphone many, many times over. I wouldn't buy one though even if it was the best phone on the market (which it isn't) because of the truly shitty way Apple have behaved over the years. As for juvenile, re-read your post and see who comes out the most childish here. Did I mention android? My statement made it blatantly obvious that I don't want Apple to win because of their behaviour, nothing else.

Why is it Apple fans automatically assume that the only reason people don't buy Apple is because they can't afford it? Why do they have to throw a screaming tantrum every time somebody disagrees with them and start name calling. Is it because they don't have the brains for an intelligent rebuke?

That brings me to the other reason I won't buy Apple, which is the exact same reason I didn't buy a BMW last year when I bought a new car even though I did like it on the test drive and that reason is because everybody knows that a very large percentage of those who buy those brands do so because they are egotistical, arrogant cocks who just want to show how well off they are and think themselves so much better than everybody else and I prefer to distance myself from such people.

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Anonymous Coward

Self deprecating

Self deprecating humour, something that Fandroids don't have.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: OK I'll feed the troll

Not your fault you drive a Kia.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: OK I'll feed the troll

Big chip on little shoulders.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: OK I'll feed the troll

What's wrong with Kia? They make solid reliable cars, but for your information no I don't but I certainly wouldn't be bothered if I did. You will notice that I didn't mention what I ended up buying because it doesn't actually matter. I don't need a brand to make my life feel complete.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: OK I'll feed the troll

Methinks you have a car worse than a Kia, you are obviously intensely sensitive about the subject.

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Bronze badge

Re: OK I'll feed the troll

I get lost reading AC arguments, it's like watching someone with multiple personality disorder argue with themselves.

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MIc

IT Pros?

I think there are a lot of PFY non IT-Pros on this site. But to be fair El Reg has broadened its appeal of the years. So the kiddies cometh in droves to say emotionally driven hog-wash. And the smartphone market whips them into a froth.

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Linux

Re: Please please please

I am trying to cry over the possibility of Iphone 5 being banned from the US, but it always comes out like I am laughing.

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Silver badge

Re: IT Pros?

IMO it all started when Reg Hardware got it's own site. It seemed to become a Mecca for teenagers to argue about iOS vs Android, PS3 vs Xbox, or just come up with as many childish names as they could think of for Microsoft.

Then they appeared to discover the forums on the main site and we ended up with this crap. The only good news is that the summer holidays are ending pretty soon.

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Boffin

Re: OK I'll feed the troll

Actually I no longer buy Apple for the same reason I don't drive a BMW: the cost of ownership of both is unnecessarily high. Thirty years ago a BMW was significantly better than, say, a Peugeot or a Toyota. Nowadays I'm not sure that is true, but they certainly cost a lot more. Twenty years ago a Mac was better than any IBM PC, and was very significantly cheaper than a Unix workstation. Now I have to ask whether a £20 aluminium case and pretty attachments is really worth paying about £600-£900 more for - yes, the Powerbook display is nice but you can't actually see the difference when working (and if I need high res I'm connected to a 27 or 32 inch monitor anyway).

It really is time that a judge or two stepped firmly on the myth of Apple exceptionalism, because the litigation frenzy they have triggered around functionality that, in the great scheme of things, isn't very significant is bad for the industry. If the only way products can differentiate is on a few minor, barely functional software features, that's a sign that the ideas factory has ground to a halt.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: OK I'll feed the troll

I've suggested we replace my wife's Kia with something a little more upmarket, but she won't hear of it; it meets her needs perfectly and is cheap to run. One of her friends went and bought an identical one on the strength of a trip in it. Anyone who thinks brands are important either works in marketing or is a loser, I'm afraid; what matters to sensible people is how well something actually does the job. Every manufacturer has had rubbish products, some have had good ones, some have had excellent ones. The Internet makes it possible to find out what these are. Life is that bit better if we make sensible use of it and don't get swayed by prejudices.

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Bronze badge

We've known for 2500 years that name calling was a fallacious argument, so why are you using it?

Then you claim that you need to own something to evaluate it. I've evaluated lots of stuff I've never owned, and gotten paid good money to do it.

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Re: IT Pros?

In Canada, most PFY have Apple products. Also fashionistas are big into Apple.

Here it is IT Pros who are anti-Apple (and I own an iPod Touch and have in the past been stuck with Macs on my desk).

We are anti-Apple because Apple is anti-standards, anti-competition, charges way above the going rate, inhibits customization, and for the past several years has technologically far behind.

I find it hard to believe that anyone with more than 5 years programming or level 3 tech support experience would (overall) defend Apple over its competition.

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Thumb Up

Re: OK I'll feed the troll

All of the Kias that I have bought in the past have been exceptional, hard working cars that were great value for money.

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Silver badge

Why Apple fans assume people don't buy Apple is because they can't afford it:

Simple: for the same reason Apple haters call them overpriced toys. They hate that others have made a different choice as they did and assume the others chose wrongly, so they feel a need to justify their own choice by denigrating those who chose differently.

It is funny because an iPhone costs pretty much the same as a GS3, so obviously every GS3 owner could clearly afford an iPhone if they wanted one. Since both cost a similar amount to build, both Apple and Samsung are making a huge profit margin on each one sold. Thus both easily qualify as "overpriced", if you are using the "Apple is overpriced" definition of overpriced as creating large profits for the company selling them. Everyone who bought either one obviously believed they were priced fairly, or they would have bought one of the many phones that costs far less than either.

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As much as I hate Apple, I don't agree with it.

“I have to be pretty darn certain a US patent is invalid,"

A strong candidate for "Fuckwit of the Year".

The burden is on the plaintiff to prove validity, not the defendent to prove invalidity.

To say otherwise is to wade deeper into the shit-for-brains US Patent mess they have made for themselves.

The Courts should be turning their backs to any software patent claimant.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: @Shagbag - As much as I hate Apple, I don't agree with it.

“I have to be pretty darn certain a US patent is invalid"

I am pretty sure this was a statement by an ITC judge, not a circuit court judge, and it was in regards to an Apple motion to invalidate the patent completely. The ITC only decides on whether or not to issue an import ban and generally "assumes" a patent is valid. If the patent is questionable, I think that part of the case goes to a circuit court.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Why Apple fans assume people don't buy Apple is because they can't afford it:

@ DougS

But most Android phones out there are not S3 but mid and lower range android phones.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: IT Pros?

"We are anti-Apple because Apple is anti-standards, anti-competition, charges way above the going rate, inhibits customization, and for the past several years has technologically far behind.

I find it hard to believe that anyone with more than 5 years programming or level 3 tech support experience would (overall) defend Apple over its competition."

I'll give you a heads up since you clearly have no idea what you're talking about. From a developer's perspective, Apple is extremely pro-standards, and if you have any development experience on any non-Microsoft platform (Linux, FreeBSD, QNX, etc. etc.) then you will feel right at home with OS X. Which explains why, e.g., almost all developers at Google use Macs. And those guys are not sub-par or inexperienced.

Frankly it is great to see a company with the size and influence of Apple using standards, helping improve standards, and working to create standards when needed (e.g., OpenCL). They're the opposite of Microsoft, who is constantly creating new tools and languages and libraries for no reason other than to lock you into a Microsoft ecosystem (e.g., dropping support for OpenGL and creating DirectX, etc.).

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Re: OK I'll feed the troll

@ribosome

I think you'll find the TCO of Apple laptops/desktops is actually significantly lower than other brands due to the insane resale values. This is particularly true if you buy refurbished gear direct from Apple, which usually yields a 20-30% discount over list, basically new products and a full warranty.

Just as an example, I sold a 4 year old MacBook Air a few weeks ago for 70% what I had pay for it...

I'm not saying you have to run OSX on your hardware (you could run Windows or Linux), but from a purely economic standpoint, buying Apple gear makes sense. This is also true for tablets & phones, although then you are pretty much stuck with iOS.

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Re: OK I'll feed the troll

"because everybody knows that a very large percentage of those who buy those brands do so because they are egotistical, arrogant cocks"

I resemble that comment, I bought my 2nd hand BMW because its fun to drive. It's only a complete coincidence that I look like a complete cock when I drive it with the top down.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Please please please

Funny how those who moan about Apple going for bans of rivals are all too happy for the same to happen to them or anyone else.

It's all or nothing. Either everyone is allowed to do it or nobody is allowed to. You can't be selective in who you condemn.

HTC's patent is probably bullshit and should be a FRAND item anyway.

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Anonymous Coward

I agree. I was talking about having access to 2G being important when out in the sticks. Hence me not being on 3 for my phone. Some pratt on here said "2G? that's like dial up Internet speeds" lol.

Erm, have you never heard of using a phone for calling people? especially in emergencies if you break a leg mountain biking or walking.

I'm sure the phone part could be removed on my Fandroid phones and nobody would even notice.

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Re: IT Pros?

Hmm, I'm in Silicon Valley where we have a lot of experience devs, to say the least.

Macs are by FAR the most common computer in use, probably 80-90% of devs use them, particularly laptops. Going to a conference, you are surrounded by a see of Macs, other machines stick out like a sore thumb. No only that, but a small but significant portion of devs is switching to iPads (with external keyboards).

Here, basically 'IT pros' are anti anything NOT Apple (at least for desktops & laptops). It's the PHBs who argue for MSFT, mostly due to cost and accounting systems running only on Windows. Like someone else said, Google runs on Macs, so do most startups. MacBook + Amazon + coffee = Silicon Valley startup.

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Anonymous Coward

I have an iPhone and I'd still like it to go HTC's way.

I quite like my iPhone 4, but I like choice and competition more as it encourages innovation. Personally I think Apple is a bully and wants to stifle competition and innovation.

Let's face it, the iPhone was a game changer when it was released, but since then what has Apple done with it that's been really innovative? Not much; instead they've started copying features from Andriod (the pull down notification panel is a good example).

Apple is quick to copy and adopt good ideas from others, but then act indignant about competitors using rectangles with rounded corners, as if they thought if the idea.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: OK I'll feed the troll

"All of the Kias that I have bought in the past have been exceptional, hard working cars that were great value for money."

I can't afford a Kia because I just have to buy a new iPhone, iPad, iPod Touch, iPod Nano, iPod Classic, iPod Shuffle, iMac, MacBook Air and Mac Pro every single year to look kewl to my latest bff and they all work exceptionally hard... At fleecing me of all my hard earned money that mom and dad give me.

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Anyone who thinks brands are important either works in marketing or is a loser...

...or both!

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Anonymous Coward

Re: OK I'll feed the troll

So what you're saying is that people buy Apple because they can't afford Android?

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Anonymous Coward

Re: IT Pros?

>Macs are by FAR the most common computer in use, probably 80-90% of devs use them,

I guess you're talking about San Francisco when you talk about Silicon Valley.. A fair few of the "devs" in SF are basically posturing wastes of space. It's not surprising that so much of what comes out of SF is barely working "fluff".

>portion of devs is switching to iPads (with external keyboards).

So the "devs" you are talking about are scripters .. probably working in Ruby?

>Here, basically 'IT pros' are anti anything NOT Apple (at least for desktops & laptops).

You don't know enough 'IT pros' then... maybe you mean "I'm the best thing since sliced bread" Ruby devs that seem to make up so much of the 'IT pro' population in SF?

>MacBook + Amazon + coffee = Silicon Valley startup.

From my experience of Silicon Valley startup the guy with the MacBook + Amazon + coffee is the biggest waste of space in the whole place.. The self appointed ideas man.. maybe the guy that put in the most cash but won't get out of the way enough to actually make the company work. The people that are actually trying to get shit done so they still have a job at the end of the day so they can pay the rent for their shitty hovel across the bay don't really care what computer they have (except maybe iPhone devs, they are a bit fooked if they don't have a mac).

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Bronze badge

Re: "why El Reg fails to put an age restriction on the site..."

Speaking of juvenile behavior in the forum, i do not know whether anonymous people can down or upvote because i have not tried. Also, i do not down vote, but i definitely do upvote. I feel that downvoting should come with the burden of exposing oneself and having to make 3 counterpoints to justify the downvote, at the peril of permanent banning for rank and ranking abuse of a site. Will, alas, just have to accept the fact that it is ok to anonymously or without counterpoints assail my comments (most of them taking apple and that other judge to task), knocking me down by over or almost 100+points in a few days, as if to negate not WHAT i say but THAT i say something at all.

Well, just as karma and payback are being a bitch to apple, i will prognosticate it will so be for those who bully or harbor bullying, too. One day, i foresee, major sites will be forced to identify, track, warn, and route bullies. I see the downvoting as a form of bullying. Jst as apple's conduct is being seen as such.

Some may be interested in this:

"Is Apple Turning into a Patent Troll?

http://koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/tech/2012/09/133_119451.html

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Re: OK I'll feed the troll

"The burden is on the plaintiff to prove validity, not the defendent to prove invalidity."

This would be the exact opposite of how the legal system works, and the exact opposite of common sense for that matter. The defendant proved the patent was valid when they registered it (in theory anyway). If you want that overturned, you better come with a case. The onus is on you any time you want to attack an established position, why is this weird? Much less warrant calling the judge a fuckwit?

"No only that, but a small but significant portion of devs is switching to iPads (with external keyboards)."

Are you kidding? I mean, the first statement was implausible, but this is just ludicrous. Quick: Name a C++ debugger for iPad.

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Bronze badge

Re: OK I'll feed the troll if only all site devs would take a little INTIATIVE

anon posts could be made sense of if they had suffixes, not just time stamps. And the suffixes should help identify those appearing to come from the same person who appears to be using the sam browser, machine, and tping pattern. Yes, i am aware that one ip address may be serving a hnadful of simultaneously reading followers (or stalkers)...

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Bronze badge

Re: OK I'll feed the troll if only all site devs would take a little INTIATIVE

anon posts could be made sense of if they had suffixes, not just time stamps. And the suffixes should help identify those appearing to come from the same person who appears to be using the sam browser, machine, and tping pattern. Yes, i am aware that one ip address may be serving a handful of simultaneously reading followers (or stalkers)...

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Please please please

They should be being patriotic and buying home-manufactured goods anyway, none of this foreign crap :P

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Anonymous Coward

Re: OK I'll feed the troll

Like this kind of Kia? Built in USA also.

http://www.motortrend.com/photo_gallery/sedans/1202_2012_kia_optima_limited_photo_gallery/

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Windows

Re: Please please please - Prediction

The verdict will be in favour of HTC but the ruling will be judged as "unconstitutional" and Apple will get the win.

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FAIL

AC 18:35 GMT,

speaking of «a car worse than a Kia», does Apple make motor cars ? Has the company sued all the other manufacturers for infringing on its patents on a design resembling a box on four wheels ?...

Henri

(proud owner of a 27-speed bike with aluminium frame)

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Facepalm

Re: OK I'll feed the troll

"Did I mention android? My statement made it blatantly obvious that I don't want Apple to win because of their behaviour, nothing else."

Let me check that for you....

"I have always wondered why El Reg fails to put an age restriction on the site. It would prevent the large number of pubescent teenagers who appear to enjoy fondling their Androids because, "

Yes, yes you did. In your old age you appear to have gained dementia.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: IT Pros?

It''s not like that in other countries.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: AC 18:35 GMT,

It would be an underdeveloped car with HUGE profit margin. So, basically an SUV, built in China to the Western companies spec from other peoples' components, but with a Western badge on it, plus the design would "nearly" catch up with others every 10 years or so ;)

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Anonymous Coward

Re: IT Pros?

Plus, most likely many are buying the gear as obvious status symbols to "prove" they are "serious, highly-paid developers".with lots of dough to blow. Yeah, yeah. Most developers I've met wouldn't be seen dead with Apple gear, or MS for that matter, both are deeply uninteresting and uncool for them.

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Meh

Re: IT Pros?

Erm, what?

Okay, i'll go and tell the lads in systems that we all need macs now but i can tell you, i don't think they are going to go for it.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: IT Pros?

Even among the developers I know who use MacBooks, they usually own Android phones, it is only the Media types and managers who own iPhones/iPads...

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