Feeds

back to article Top plods reconsidering mega deals with Olympo-blunder firm G4S

Cambridgeshire police are reviewing a potential contract with troubled Olympic security provider G4S. The deal on the table would see G4S take over back-office functions inclusing ICT for three forces - Cambridgeshire, Hertfordshire and Bedfordshire - and would result in 1,191 staff being rehired by G4S, according to the …

COMMENTS

This topic is closed for new posts.
Silver badge

G4S are not cowboys

they are bandits.

"We don't need no steekeeng project management, it gets in the way of the gold"

8
0

OK, so who's getting a job with G4S soon?

They obviously have somebody in their back pocket if a council was contemplating making a private company in charge of enforcing law and order. Selling the police is surely and act akin to treason?

1
1
Facepalm

Re: OK, so who's getting a job with G4S soon?

Selling the police, and everything else for that matter, is Tory policy.

7
2
Silver badge

Re: OK, so who's getting a job with G4S soon?

So, if selling the police is treason, and selling the police is Tory* policy, then ... ?

* It doesn't matter, though, which group of venal persons are in power - they are all the same. The inability of the LibDems to use their power to stop the worst excesses of the Tories by simply saying "we'll withdraw from the coalition", as happens all over Europe (and probably elsewhere in the world) shows that they are as bad (presumably because they don't want to force an election, since the chances of any of them being re-elected after their spineless performance is negligible).

0
0
Bronze badge

Re: OK, so who's getting a job with G4S soon?

No one is, you just don't understand how it works. G4S has a compelling commercial offering, I know, I work for a competitor, and I've seen it, it is very hard to beat. The problem is that all of us have to play catch up, and come up with something better, at a better price. If you have this kind of offering, and you are bidding into a bunch of contracts, all the same, remember all Police forces are doing this over the next few years, you get economies of scale your competitors can't match, and you have a successful track record, and in part they do.

So they bid 4 contracts, and win 1, great, no problem, win 2, resourcing issues start, the people who know the job are already on contracts. So the more you win, the more resource problems you have, win all 4, and it's a disaster, you can't deliver any. So bid one, ah risk, you might loose, and you're not in the game for the other 3.

Ultimately all the procurements are run independently, yes the forces talk, but they will go for the best bang for the busk, and you have to have a damn good reason not to award to the best value solution.

The olympic cockup will temper the G4S reputation, but they will still get a lot of work, and it will still be more than they can manage. The alternative players are Serco, Amey and Capita, and their consortium partners.

At a guess, some forces will go for distinct services, others for monolithic contracts, and they will all use the free consultancy for the services they have no intention to outsource.

The process is not corrupt, but it isn't intelligent either.

0
0
Silver badge
Stop

Outsourcing

The idea of outsourcing is that by giving your internal operations to an external company those operations will run just as well or better, they will cost less, *and* the external company will be able to make a handsome profit on the deal.

Now that might be a possibility if the external company is extremely experienced, specialised and well run. Or if there's some kind of tax 'efficiency' which can be claimed.

But in the general case it is a pile of bovine excrement.

11
0
Thumb Up

Re: Outsourcing

Equine excrement?

0
0
Thumb Down

Profit from pain

When a company profits from wrong doing (running jails) and also has the ear of government (lobbyists), whats to stop them from influencing legislation soley to increase profits?

14
0
Bronze badge

Re: whats to stop them from influencing legislation soley to increase profits?

NOTHING!!!!

The proof is in the US prison industry.

8
1
Bronze badge
Devil

I considered...

...registering Omni Consumer Products as a company in the UK and pidding on one of the plod contracts but, in the end, it wouldn't have been funny enough to justify writing reams of bidding cobblers.

4
0
Joke

From the radio this morning...

How many G4S staff does it take to change a lightbulb?

Six soldiers and a policeman.

17
0
Anonymous Coward

G4S don't actually do IT as such

They have pretty much outsourced that already. Who to? AC because ...

0
0
Anonymous Coward

Outsourcing public services

You just have to look at the recent case of a lfeguard working for an outsourced service in Florida that got sacked for saving someone outside his designated area to see why outsourcing public services isn't always a good idea.

7
0
Bronze badge

Re: Outsourcing public services

I remember hearing about that one.

IIRC, the stitstorm around that bought the company involved some really bad press.

They relented, and offered him his job back.

Wisely. (IIRC) he told them to fuck themselves (however in a more civilized manner).

I do have to give some of his co-workers a pat on the back for quitting in solidarity.

In case you haven't heard:

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5itTTqL5HqAKUBN46DwgLvy-W4ztA?docId=9d3542c2b68642f8bbf6cd05991377cb

2
1
Anonymous Coward

Although the advantage might be

If one of them beats up and/or murders someone, at least they can be had up in a public court instead of the IPCC whitewashing it all away...

2
0
Thumb Down

Re: Although the advantage might be

Wanna bet?

5
0
Silver badge
Big Brother

Re: Although the advantage might be

Nah, they have proper plod for that...

Allegedly.

0
0

There is no problem in hiving things off to the private sector. Unless you hive off everything to a single supplier. Then if they screw you up you end up screwed yourself. The mistake is put all your eggs in one basket.

0
2
Silver badge

"The mistake is put all your eggs in one basket."

Another mistake is to have a patchwork of allegedly interoperable suppliers. In fact, the whole "let the private sector do public sector work" idea is a huge mistake. There are many things that need centralised control and planning: policing and defence are but two of them.

0
0
Silver badge
FAIL

wow

The UK seems to have almost a 3rd world level of corruption when it comes to the government and private contractors. Its bad in the US also but generally the cockups don't rise to the level as seen in the UK.

2
0
Devil

Re: wow

Right, that's because - like I think Douglas Adams observed, perhaps in a Dirk Gently book - the English take a US idea like McDonalds and remove all the stuff that makes it different, like speed and price and then deliver what's left.

Mind, the US is better at hiding corruption in plain sight, hence the more polished appearance.

3
0
FAIL

Good ol' Group Four

They're guna have to rebrand again soon at this rate - may I suggest this time you call yourselves "Incompetas"

6
0
Bronze badge

> G4S have not replied to our request for comment.

How would you know unless they told you?

Errrmmm...

Ah!

I see. Sorry for doubting you.

> The UK seems to have almost a 3rd world level of corruption when it comes to

> the government and private contractors. Its bad in the US also but generally

> the cock-ups don't rise to the level as seen in the UK.

Not counting the fact that ALL US cops have guns to shoot their victims for being suspect, their rentacops do the same too -and get the local sheriff to exonerate them.

" security guard shooting "

2
0
Silver badge

G4S have not replied to our request for comment.

No, and they didn't want to talk to BBC R4's The World Tonight. Mmm, wonder why...

1
0
Silver badge
Thumb Down

Holy Cheeseburger!!!

" That includes staff working behind counters, in custody centres and suspect identification, in HR, IT and in the criminal justice unit."

Yes, a great idea, outsourcing all these services to the lowest bidder, who in turn will hire poorly paid, undertrained, unmotivated personnel to fill the positions.

Behind counters: Data theft in behalf of criminals or private enterprises, blackmail, ...

Custody centres: Drug and weapon smuggling into prisons

Suspect identification: Blackmail again, leaking data to the press, ...

IT: Think of all the horror histories you have read about IT outsourcing lately, but in the context of these 'dickensian' workplaces.

Criminal justice unit: Data theft, blackmail, data leaks, ...

What could possibly go wrong?

4
0
Silver badge

Re: Holy Cheeseburger!!!

"Yes, a great idea, outsourcing all these services to the lowest bidder, who in turn will hire poorly paid, undertrained, unmotivated personnel to fill the positions."

Normally they fire everyone, then offer them a new job with less pay and no perks with the new company. The best staff move on to better employers. You are left with under performing, low paid, bitter senior staff and your poorly paid, undertrained, unmotivated new personnel at the bottom.

Little surprise if they decide to make their own perks.

3
0

Considering...

the number of police (allegedly) on the take from journalists, private investigators and like; the number of climate protestors sent down because of improper actions of undercover police officers; the bizarre way in which a policeman was able to resign to avoid serious disciplinary proceedings and join the Met a few days later; police being found selling confiscated guns; the rather high number of deaths in police custody - to name but a few disturbing events - I'm not sure that G4S would necessarily be any worse.

1
1
Silver badge
Holmes

"and would result in 1,191 staff being rehired by G4S...

....briefly"

There, fixed it for you.

Because as soon as the ink is dry, the work will be shifted offshore. And this country will be £25,000 a head worse off for each offshored job, but Hey! we can pretend that we've saved money, and ignore the lack of quality.

0
0

Yeah, who could have foreseen the foul-up outsourcing security to that guy at the mall would bring.

0
0
This topic is closed for new posts.