back to article GCHQ's spy death riddle shines light on UK hacker war

British intelligence agent Dr Gareth Williams’ last mission before he was “unlawfully killed” was to infiltrate and report on US hacker meetings, evidence given at his inquest this week has indicated. Williams appears to have been one of a team of intelligence officers and agents sent to penetrate hacking networks in the US and …

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Wait for it...

Headline tomorrow:

"Williams killed by evil hackers"

Next weeks headline:

"HM Government reintroduce hanging for hackers"

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Childcatcher

Re: Wait for it...

He was a noob hacker and instead of learning he wanted instant power perhaps.

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Black Helicopters

Intentionally useless

Am I the only person here thinking that the investigators have been intentionally rubbish here? They seem to have spent more time trying to ruin his character than investigating who killed him.

Maybe they already know?

Maybe the investigators have been categorically told that they wont find out who killed him, if you take my meaning?

Sod beating about the bush: maybe, for reasons as yet unknown, MI6 had him killed?

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Nice idea, but...

Would the spooks really have killed someone off in a way that would almost guarantee weeks if not years of sensational coverage across TV, print, and the Web?

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Intentionally useless

Few conspiracies of that sort seem likely to stay watertight for very long. On the contrary, it seems whoever killed him was smarter than to leave the kind of trail you suggest by raising such obvious suspicions with anyone likely to have passed these on. The extraordinary fact that seems to leap out at me when reading about this case is how little of a trail the killer has managed to leave.

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Re: Nice idea, but...

well, possibly, if they wanted to divert attention away from something else.

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Anonymous Coward

Perhaps he went native

and had to be dealt with.

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Anonymous Coward

An Hero

Or perhaps he did it for teh lulz!

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Can death get any worse?

Not only died, possibly horribly in a bag. But then his web viewing history is revealed to the world plus a video of him waggling his arse. Ouch.

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Re: Can death get any worse?

At some point, the British public will grow up and accept that something like 9/10 people in this country have (a) browsed fetish sites at some point and (b) tried kinky sex. Statistically, you're more of a freak if you haven't tried bondage, I would think.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Can death get any worse?

Given that the readership of this site tend towards the Daily Mail/Clarkson/pure vanilla and angry end of the spectrum, maybe you're looking in the wrong place for open mindedness.

It's not worth expecting anything too adventurous or tolerant from the readership here :)

(AC because, well, there are some strange people out there, and head over the parapet still isn't so smart)

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(Written by Reg staff) Silver badge

Re: Re: Can death get any worse?

"Given that the readership of this site..."

Correction: "Given that the readership of this site who actually post comments..." :-)

C.

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Gimp

Re: Can death get any worse?

For the record, I post comments quite a bit and I am somebody who dose wiggle his bum, browse fetish websites and has been known to "try" self bondage! When I die it will probably be a case of 'in the wardrobe with the tangerine'!

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Anonymous Coward

Wow, anonymous really have stepped up their game.

posting as AC so I don't end up in a bag in my bath.

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Re: Wow, anonymous really have stepped up their game.

You don't really think that is any protection, do you?

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Anonymous Coward

I WENT THROUGH 7 PROXIES

GOOD LUCK

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Solved

A loner, multiple telephones, strange comings and goings, interest in photography (videos). No wonder MI6 knocked him off, he was a terrorist.

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@Chris W

You forgot:

"...two live Macs, parts of a dead Mac, four iPhones..."

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Bright young man!

"after graduating with a first in mathematics in 1996 aged 17"

Very sad the way his name has been dragged through the mud!

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RIP - If only

I feel sorry for his friends and family.

The Police investigation into his death is piss poor. His private sexual life is spread all over the media. And I bet his employers aren't being totally truethful or co-operative either.

Not the kindest of circumstances under which to grieve.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: RIP - If only

>His private sexual life is spread all over the media

What you think you know about his private sexual life is all that you've been told by the people who are investigating this and even then after the scene had been cleaned where cleaned could equally mean staged.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: RIP - If only

If the whole inquest had been done behind closed doors then that would have justified much greater public suspicion, than the suspicions now being stated on this forum, that the inquest was part of a wider cover up. Given much of it was carried out in public this unfortunately makes some release of personal details inevitable which must unfortunately be very upsetting to close friends and family.

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Stop

Re: Re: RIP - If only

".....where cleaned could equally mean staged." Staged by whom? The authorities? Puh-lease, do provide an at least vaguely realistic motive for the authorities to want to kill him, and then explain why they would do so in such a means as to guarantee plenty of media attention? The killer? How would a killer fake weeks of bondage site browsing, and then get Williams to make the video?

Williams evidently had some "unnatural" hangups (or maybe tiedowns), simple as that. People like you keep the tinfoil industry healthy.

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Anonymous Coward

@Matt Bryant

Did I mention the authorities? I'll answer that for you because you seem to lack an ability to comprehend what you read, NO.

Now let's look at facts. It was a week between not tuning up at work and his decomposing body being discovered. Bodies do not start to decompose overnight so it's likely he had been dead most of week. Someone did a bit of housekeeping. Whoever did was comfortable being in his flat and was sure they wouldn't be discovered, that takes some nerve. You decide who it could have been but don't try to say I suggested who it was.

I said, based on what has been released, that the flat had been cleaned and *COULD* have been staged. Whatever, it was left for the police to find in an un-natural state.

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PT

Re: @Matt Bryant

From the article, "Save for exceptional tidiness, Williams’ London government-rented flat was equipped as a nerd should wish..."

Exceptional tidiness? Hmmmm. I've been in a few nerds' flats. I'm inclined to agree with you that his flat probably had a visit from the cleaners before the police became involved. Whoever it was that killed him, I don't have any difficulty believing that his employers went in for a thorough search and clean up when they discovered him and before notifying the police. In that case, the competence or otherwise of the police investigation is quite irrelevant.

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Anonymous Coward

@Matt Bryant

So a rather large facet of human sexuality is "unnatural", how nice for those of us who enjoy it.

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Black Helicopters

Is it just me, or does anyone else get the nagging sensation that perhaps, you really don't want to get any more details on this case.

Perhaps there are some things we just don't need to know.

(Where's the 'see no evil' icon?)

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Anonymous Coward

See No Evil

Either the Police are actually as incompetent as we are always led to believe or the Secret Services are incompetent in covering things up. Either way the public are unlikely ever to know what really happened and are left as always with a distrust and lack of confidence in our government institutions. But perhaps they'd like us to think of them as a bunch of clowns.

To do it properly they should have out-sourced the investigation and cover up to the Chinese ;-)

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Anonymous Coward

Welcome to PsyOps ....

Let's sprinkle some rational fairy dust over this, and see what emerges ...

1) Even the official verdict on his death is that it was not a lone act

2) The "crime" scene is mysterious "clean", if we are to believe this is just a sex game which went too far. There are very few criminals who are able to sanitise a crime scene beyond a thorough forensic sweep (the ones that can haven't been caught). Let alone a non-criminal.

3) This unforunately shorts occams razor. The guy was *killed*.

4) Who by ?

5) First off, UK security services do not go round "bumping off" agents - especially not their own. Quite aside from the illegality, it has the unfortunate tendency to draw attention *to* the security services, rathet than *away* from (which they would obviously prefer).

6) It was not a UK operation

7) Who else ?

8) Any sufficiently aligned, and equipped agency which wanted to send a message

9) Message ?

10) Look at how this guys death has played out. If you were a threat to a foriegn agency, would you want to go like that ?

Of course, the tantalising question we can't really be sure of is "why ?"....

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Welcome to PsyOps ....

Methinks someone has been reading too many spy novels. Nevermind, at least you provoked a chuckle.

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Stop

Re: Welcome to PsyOps ....

Bear in mind, reality has a tendency to overshadow fiction.

Remember the bugged rock in a Moscow park ?

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Welcome to PsyOps ....

A little less David Icke here please.

As for Occmam's Razor :

"The explanation requiring the fewest assumptions is most likely to be correct"

The most likely explanation was a sex game gone wrong and maybe there was another party present. I am sure the security services have much less clumsy methods to kill and make it look like an accident. There are a long list of people who have died in similar bizarre circumstances such as David Carridine or Stephan Milligan. I am sure someone is going to make a career and a long list of (lucrative) conspiracy theory books out of this unfortunate case.

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Re: Welcome to PsyOps ....

A sex game gone wrong with someone who apparently swabbed the scene of the crime and left *no* DNA evidence, and also made sure - or perhaps SiS or the Police made sure - there was no incriminating evidence on any of the technology left in the flat.

You're right - that sounds completely plausible.

Mysteriously evidence-free accidental bondage murders happen *all the time.*

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Black Helicopters

Re: Welcome to PsyOps ....

As the original comment suggested, there was no desire from the perpetrators to try and make the death look unsuspicious.

I'm old enough to remember Stephen Milligan ... there was never any suggestion someone else was involved in his death.

At the end of the day, as you yourself say, this case will be written about for a long time.

*Maybe*, that was the intention all along ?

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Welcome to PsyOps ....

Interesting assumption hovering in these comments.

The ability to clean a scene properly and an interest in sex games are not mutually exclusive, so both could have happened..

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Always one title comes to mind

"three days of condor". It is a novel/ movie so not spoiling it.

Btw, if agency sent him to black hat circles and he went into real dark stuff, those guys aren't really polite/ passive aggressive nerds you see on movies. They just know computers and likely powerful&merciless as 1930s gangsters. Just stay away.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: Welcome to PsyOps ....

"Mysteriously evidence-free accidental bondage murders happen *all the time"

Of course, there was the strange case of Jonathan Moyle back in 1990 - found dead in a wardrobe in his hotel room in Chile. British officials initially punted the idea that he had accidentally killed himself whilst engaging in some masturbatory bondage. He had been attending a defence conference and was hoping to expose an arms deal between a Chilean arms dealer and Saddam Hussein's government in Iraq.

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Re: Welcome to PsyOps ....

In the eighties the Soviet Union was famous for setting up sexual adventures for visitors then blackmailing on the basis of photographs or cine film. You knew you were lucky if your hotel room had extremely bright lighting with no opportunity to access the bulbs. And a mirror securely fixed to the wall.

There was the tale of one young businessman in Moscow who retired to his room. There was a knock at his door which he opened to find an impossibly beautiful woman. He could not refuse such an invitation. He put a pillow case over his head and followed the script for the camera.

Williams death could have been caused by any agency. Perhaps he was identified as a spook with unusual tastes. A game went wrong. The flat was professionally cleaned.

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With everyone pointing in one direction shouting 'look'...

I can't help but feel the real story lies in the other direction, behind a big screen of smoke...

My fullest commiserations to his family, no matter what else, he died a horrible death and it must be mortifying for his family to see all this in the papers.

I would not be in the least bit surprised if in 50/75/100 yrs time when the files are released to the public he turns out to be a very different character from how we are seeing him protrayed right now. But *anyone* working for GCHQ / SIS has my respect, for generally taking risks hoping to improve the world in some way.

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Re: With everyone pointing in one direction shouting 'look'...

You really don't believe that such papers are ever filed in order to come out do you?

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Big Brother

"Let El Reg know by dropping us an email"

I know nothing about this story beyond the media coverage. However, your closing boot note made me think; does the Register publish a public key for email encryption? Particularly for whistle blowers and tip offs.

If someone had information pertaining to SIS or GCHQ they wanted to share, I doubt they'd want to send it in the open.

Just a thought.

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(Written by Reg staff) Silver badge

Re: "Let El Reg know by dropping us an email"

Re: public key

Fair point, which had occurred to us.

#include <std/healthwarning_about_email.h>

C.

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Anonymous Coward

Lets say.....

To quote from the quintessential BBC TV series Between the Lines -"Lets say" that the Police were asked to look at the Laptops / Phones of this poor individual. These were the phones and laptops that were found at this address. Who's to say who got to these devices before the police? It would be wrong to say "cover-up", more like "housekeeping". Didn't want the cops finding anything they shouldn't did we? They had to be seen to be going through the motions of an investigation - but they couldn't risk anything getting out into the public arena, so what they examined was a sanitized version of his laptop and phones. This was probably a sad accident during some kind of sex game - nothing more or less, but unfortunately "there are people out there who can weave a conspiracy out of the fluff in their belly-buttons" (Between the Lines, BBC). AC of course, as I don't fancy waking up padlocked inside one of those Nigerian shopping bags !!

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Bizarre

The case is quite bizarre and gets more so the more that comes out.

Aside from the obvious elements, it seems curious that a very bright, computer savvy man would record intimate videos and browse to potentially embarrassing web sites without taking precautions to cover his tracks.

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Re: Bizarre

What you mean just like dozens of Anonymous should have known better?

Even if it's your job it's hard to stay paranoid 100% of the time. Especially if you only want to keep things private rather than actually keep things hidden.

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Re: Bizarre

Yeah, but he makes a very good point if you consider that:

a. it was in his job description to mingle at Blackhat/Defcon etc

b. (assumption) he had unusual private interests

c. the *really* (in hindsight, natch) obvious route to having a hold on him would be to obtain access to his browsing habits etc in the interests of blackmail

d. we (or any black hats so inclined) wouldn't know all of the above, but he did - all along

e. I'm not buying that he had a careless personality that would have ignored such a threat

The whole thing stinks, and his family have my deepest condolences - almost any other death in recent memory hasn't been followed up by quite such an awful line in sordid detail.

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Re: Bizarre

@Gordon: I'd have thought it quite easy to stay paranoid all the time if you were as smart as this guy. Surely browsing for your wanking material using the minimum of a live cd/USB would be a start?

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Anonymous Coward

SIS team leader

So he testified under oath but the phone records contradict it. And in fact directly imply he is lying because they show he phoned later "in a panicked fashion" (it's not just that he used an untraceable phone or something).

Why is he not under arrest for perjury and attempting to pervert the course of justice? Oh wait never-mind, I forgot that there was one rule for them and another one for everyone else.

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Anonymous Coward

Your mission should you choose to accept it

is to look in the back of 2600 magazine and attend one of these super secret meetings that take place in public spaces. its highly dangerous but we think your up to it

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