Apple TV third-generation (2012)
Well, at least we can get the hardware over and done with quickly. The latest Apple TV looks exactly like the old one, and it's innards aren't really any different either. 3G Apple TV Box steady: no change to the look, little to the spec For the record, there's an A5 processor on the inside in place of the previous model's A4 …
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I buy all my content digitally rather than getting discs so iTunes is a good place for me, my friend acquires his films in a rather more dubious fashion so has installed XBMC on his and it works a treat.
The thing I mainly use it for is streaming music to the good speakers in the house.
When having a party leaving an iPad hooked up to your remote iTunes library is brilliant as people can pick it up and change the house wide music in an instant.
iPad > iTunes Library on computer > All airplay devices in the house > win
your friend could run all his files through something like Handbrake to turn them into mp4's and then use Identify to tag them, and then the videos work fine in iTunes and AppleTV and iPad, etc without the need to jailbrake. avforums contains many methods of automating this process using the Automator app that comes with OS X.
I've resorted to viewing all my many many dvds as hardcopy backups and am in the process of importing them into iTunes using the above two apps to that i can start watching any film at will from the AppleTv. When you have as many dvds as i have, it's no simple matter to find the film you want to watch. having it all streaming from iTunes makes life a heck of a lot easier.
The Usability Paradox
Transcoding everything by hand is really an absurd suggestion. At least something like Plex offers the illusion that the ATV can play everything and doesn't require you do go through a lot of upfront fuss and bother. Plex (and XBMC) also offer superior media management.
This is one part of the process that some people like to gloss over. This is where XBMC shines and most other solutions (iTunes, MCE) tend to fall down badly.
Re: The Usability Paradox
XBMC will UPNP to DNLA devices (pretty much any modern phone and device). So if you can put XBMC on these ATV then thats a winner in my book.
He really wouldn't need to transcode them
You can get tools that remux to pretty much any format. Avidemux would be one option; that can mux to MP4 (despite the name). Transcoding is *slow*, it loses you quality, and it burns a lot of CPU time. Remuxing on the other hand takes almost no time, and doesn't degrade the quality of the video and audio.
Re: The Usability Paradox
There is a huge difference between Apple TV and MCE codec packs - I've found nothing that MCE won't play with a small collection of codec packs installed.
AirPlay
Ideal to AirPlay enable your amplifier. Low power, small, discrete. £99.
Go on, someone say they can Hacintosh a RaspberryPi and it'll only cost £30 instead of this ovepriced bit of Apple kit.
Re: AirPlay
I can go one better.
It's already been done using one of the Alpha boards.
You don't even need to "Hackintosh" anyway, as a ported AirPlay service already exists for Linux.
Re: He really wouldn't need to transcode them
Remuxing doesn't do you any good if the format inside the container is not supported or it uses features that are beyond the ability of the appliance to deal with.
Needing to remux is no less stupid. Really is just shows MORE contempt for the end user because it demonstrates that the appliance already has the ability to deal with the content in question. It simply chooses not to.
The vendor has made a conscious choice to ignore the wider world and to make the device more inconvenient to use than it really needs to be.
Remuxing n+1 files is still n+1 worth of bother.
Re: He really wouldn't need to transcode them
"Remuxing doesn't do you any good if the format inside the container is not supported or it uses features that are beyond the ability of the appliance to deal with."
Of course. That goes without saying. In that case if he's still wanting to run on the ATV he'll have to transcode.
"The vendor has made a conscious choice to ignore the wider world and to make the device more inconvenient to use than it really needs to be."
Totally true, though I'm sure there are arguments (none of which I'd find convincing) that enforcing the use of MP4 containers across the entire iTunes ecosystem aids stability, or implementation, or whatever. The thing is that even Apple can be flexible on this, since iTunes copes with MP3s as well as MP4s (or M4As or whatever you want to call them) - there just isn't even that tiny hint of flexibility for video.
Sadly I don't think you can jailbreak the ATV3 yet.
My ATV2 is hacked and XBMC installed making it an amazing bit of kit.
My dad has an atv
He's got XBMC on it. Nit sure which it is, but it has the third UI, so possibly atv3?
got it too
the ui doesn't fit in the tv anymore, I don't like that, having to scroll to see what's on the bottom. And I thought It would take advantage of HD in displaying the movie icons. Nope, still way too big. Since I barely have full HD content, no advantage for me, I only bought it 'cause I needed another one in the bedroom. So basically the software is a bit dragging it down. Not to mention that itunes has some quirks which are illogical and you have to learn them one by one. It makes a big difference connecting the AppleTv to the network through the mains (for instance), I recommend it, especially when browsing with the youtube app. Streaming from itunes wirelessly works very well, almost instantly, even though the file is on a NAS actually.
but only iTunes fans need apply.
Shouldn't that be
"but only locked in iTunes users need apply."
I mean surely in 2012, the only people still using iTunes, are those that bought alot of content and have no choice to use it.
Re: but only iTunes fans need apply.
True in the same way that "in 2012 Linux is a popular desktop OS" is true
Re: but only iTunes fans need apply.
Wow, posting snide linux comments in an Apple thread, surely you meant to use the troll-incognito icon ?
Re: but only iTunes fans need apply.
Sorry bazza, but locked in?
iTunes will play DRM-free content you buy elsewhere, no problem. It's drag and drop.
Also, unDRMing iTunes content is no biggie either.
The author was correct in his statement. You just hate Apple, to the point it blinds you.
Re: but only iTunes fans need apply.
no because I'm not a Mac fan either.
Re: but only iTunes fans need apply.
> iTunes will play DRM-free content you buy elsewhere, no problem. It's drag and drop.
No it isn't. Not even close.
It's easy to "hate Apple" when fanboys make up rediculously fraudulent claims.
iTunes does NOTHING for video management of alien video formats and has very limited support for anything.
This is why people jailbreak this device.
"Access LAN-linked iTunes libraries but not Nas file-shares"
Icon says it all.
Re: "Access LAN-linked iTunes libraries but not Nas file-shares"
Its ATV what did you seriously expect? Import your library into itunes then (and fool around with conversions). Failing that wait for a jailbreak and install XBMC. Failing that dont buy one, noone is forcing you to.
The new UI is a fucking horror. Just the clumsiest thing I've seen in ages. I mean the android UI is even better for goodness sake. Can I degrade back to the previous version please?
I read somewhere that the UI has been kicking around for a while but didn't get released till Steve, well, kicked it. Guess the dev was literally waiting for the 'over my dead body' command to just work itself out.....
As a die-hard Apple fan...
I have to agree. It almost pains me to say so, but first time I saw the new interface I thought I'd been conned and they'd sold me some cheap Chinese knock-off instead. I almost expected some bright pink and yellow chinese characters with bluebirds and hummingbirds and shit flashing up on the screen - just like the fake iPhones.
Fucking horror is right.
what idiot would actually buy one of these? WDTV Live has this thing beat hands down, and cost the same. I can play ANY movie format on it, no "hacking" required. I can stream music from the net, or hook my Ipod up to it (why I would want to is beyond me).
No apps grant you that one, but.... why would I need an app?
I've got something called a "laptop" that runs any "app" I want or need that hooks very nicely to my TV, again, no hacking required.
I'm thinking more and more that people who buy Apple products have more money than brains.....
You can't stream to a WDTV Live from an iPad or iPhone; and like it or not, that's probably the target market for this. I have all-Apple at home and for me the ATV is brilliant, but I'm quite prepared to accept that if Apple's not your fruit there are other products out there that would fit the bill.
And for the record It's not intended to replace a laptop.
Solution for self-inflicted problem.
Streaming from your phone is just a stupid parlour trick. It's something to impress the clueless. It's a very limited feature that mainly exists to cover up the limitations Apple artificially imposes on the ATV2. If the ATV2 were allowed to have it's own apps, the idea of using a $500 device to hack around the limitations of a $99 one would be moot.
First your streaming to one device and then to the other on wireless networks that aren't great to begin with. You're doing all of this despite the fact that the overpriced tablet isn't actually any more capable than the cheap little puck by the TV.
Just let the iPad without a monitor do it's own decoding and run it's own apps.
Not allowing the user community to improve the user experience is major fail.
Re: Solution for self-inflicted problem.
"Streaming from your phone is just a stupid parlour trick"
No it isnt. I have many many movies on my phone. I'm always recording things and whilst I use DNLA to stream from my phone to other devices I imagine apple people do the same. If they are already an apple house then this would work wonders I suspect. I also use a n150 network quite happily. 720p goes across to my LG600 nicely. Of course its horses for courses people are free to do as they will and for 99 its not a bad device if it suits you (a brace of cables from apple could cost you the same!). Otherwise there are other devices that will do the same.
Re: Solution for self-inflicted problem.
correction,
"Otherwise there are other devices that will do the same."
There are other devices that do the same, a lot more, and are NOT locked down, and cost the same.
Re: Solution for self-inflicted problem.
If these devices were allowed to be treated as the PCs that certain people like to pretend they are when it suits them, then all of these "appliance" protocols would be moot. All you really need is a rudimentary file sharing protocol and the freedom to use it.
Of course you have the problem of limited format support. That's a key "feature" of most of these devices. AirPlay doesn't help that. It just adds another layer of indirection.
Being able to push content
from a device with a rich user interface and easy control (be that a PC/MAC, phone, tablet etc) is infinitely preferable to trying to navigate a file system hierarchy on your TV using a remote control. NON of the streaming devices I've seen to date are much good for finding content.
DNLA was a step in the right direction, but it's too hit-and-mis over whether it will work between any two devices and it's too hard to configure. Airplay has the advantage of being idiot simple to use and pretty decent in quality.
Formats aren't much of a problem either. MKVs are normally H.264 encoded video, so you can re-MUX them to Apple compatible MP4 in fairly short order. Audio support covers the most common bases (MP3, AAC) and AirPlay accepts PCM audio, so your client can decode from whatever format it is using and play back the result (Spotify's OGG format plays perfectly for example).
Re: Being able to push content
It makes some sense to use a tablet as a UI but that is the extent of it.
Pushing the actual content is just stupid.
The moment you talk about transcoding or remuxing, you've just lost the argument.
That is the opposite of the sort of "just works" experience that Apple is supposed to be famous for.
XBMC
So my G2 Apple TV sits like a very small quiet out the way thing, connected via HDMI to my amp and to all my NAS shares via cabled ethernet (well, the switch is in a cupboard 3ft away), all controlled effortlessly by a logitech harmony remote. Even my total Luddite spouse can use it.
Of course, I had to jailbreak and install XMBC - and now it plays anything (even 1080 content, tho downscaled to 720) - so I have the flexibility of using the iTunes ecosystem; AirPlay for music, or photos when friends visit; and the ability to play just about any media type.
At €99 its hard not to justify really. As soon as the xbmc / jailbreak option works on ATV3, I'll be having one for the bedroom, thank you very much.
Re: XBMC "Of course, I had to jailbreak and install XMBC". I am pleased to see......
.....that you and your good lady are happy with this kit. However, what about the ordinary punter's out of the box experience?
Re: XBMC
A total luddite spouse can control any HTPC running XBMC. The only advantage the ATV2 has is price.
The ATV2 still has decoder limitations if you are using XBMC or player limitations if you are using Plex. You don't need AirPlay for music or photos.
An ATV2 is still limited ARM hardware that isn't fully functional unless you burgle the device so you can install better software on it.
iTunes is not unique any more and is very replaceable.
Re: XBMC
I don't know what sort of hd you enjoy, but I found atv2 dreadful at the task...
I was willing to put up with 720 downscaling as he atv was to go with the bedroom tv, and but feed the thing anything over about 4GB and it's welcome to the stuttering! My 40GB content doesn't even start! this is over a 3x3 n speed network or a cat6 cabled gigabit network, the little processor just can't cut the mustard!
It's now relegated to airplaying photos and videos from my phone when the parents visit.... But even that is delt with better by my revo xbmc machine.
Oh and the new ui, and we'll that's just crap!!
ATV3? No thanks keeping my ATV2
The menu on the ATV3 and upgraded ATV2 is horrible, I much prefer the drop down clean look so that is why I haven't upgraded my ATV2 to the latest firmware. Rather than use XBMC after the jailbreak I installed the Plex client and have the Plex Media Server set up on the main PC... lovely!
ATV1 with XBMC still a smart choice
I nearly bought an ATV2, in the end I bought a modified ATV1 for $145 inc shipping - why?
Well it runs XBMC, has the Broadcom decoder chip in so does 1080 just fine thank you, just slots into where the WiFi went (you can't have both), but streaming HD over Wifi is not pratical anyway, so no great loss there.
So, I paid about the same as I would for an ATV2, but also have USB tethering 1080, composite out, still handy from time to time, can't do that on the ATV2, all works fine with my Logitech Harmony remote, all fed of my unRAID media server.
Mirroring
To my mind this article glossed over the main selling point of the ATV, namely mirroring from any iPhone or iPad. The ludicrous ease with which I can mirror the screen of an iDevice to the TV is excellent. It's a very capable, quiet and energy efficient Netflix player too, unlike the noisy PS3 which the ATV shares a shelf with.
Some more UK specific services wouldn't go amiss but for now I have access to a plethora of UK on-demand services through my Virgin Tivo box so no great loss personally.
Awaiting the Jailbreak.
I bought one, turned it on, realised it was completely useless without a jailbreak and re-boxed it.
Just waiting the jailbreak now so it can become a useful device.
Re: Awaiting the Jailbreak.
You HAVE read the threads that enumerate all of the reasons why the ATV3 will be the most difficult Apple product EVER to jailbreak, and it is not likely for some time? I did, returned mine after three days, and bought a Mac Mini just to be done with it. Runs XMBC, has local storage to buffer to, and a does a whole lot more, and not at the mercy of a wait for a jailbreak that may not come for some time (and some speculation is possibly never, due to the lack of good attack vectors as it has no browser).
Re: Awaiting the Jailbreak.
I have, but I'm an optimist ;)
It's a 99 quid box, essentially disposable. If it never gets a JB, I'll just give it to someone who might like it.
I'm already using a Mac Mini but it's a bit OTT for the small usage a bedroom media player demands (and it's not totally silent).
I want to spend twice as much for the same thing
having used a wdtv for many years i saw an earlier version of the appletv at a HAV's house (hopeless apple victim).
doesnt really do anything I havent seen before or need but was unexpectedly heavy when i picked it up.
Wonder if they are following the british HIFI scam of heavy slabs of engineering to justify the price for not much performance.
Maybe this one does something more but I doubt it. Just another thing they can plug into their betamax computer and coo that there was no setup required.
Re: I want to spend twice as much for the same thing
A HAV? I'm shocked and appalled you'd spend any time at the house of such a person.
"There's no shortage of UK content Apple could add if it had a mind to."
Oi, Bitch.
You'll have what we give you and YOU WILL LIKE IT!
Good ole Apple and their clones.
iClones always bang on and bloody on about Apple, but the reality is, everything that Apple does can and is done far better by its competitors.
Get over it, you're stuck in a bloated, dated and expensive eco system, and you really can not justfy the waste. Though "thinking differently" is probably enough justification for you.
Love the ATV, don't like the new interface
Our ATV2 gets used almost every day. I and all my friends have iphones or ipads, so when they're at mine (or I'm at theirs), we connect to the wifi network and can instantly play movies, music and show photos on the TV or just play music through the stereo, using itunes, spotify, or whatever you happen to use.
We use it for watching the Orange thursday films that get downloaded to the ipad, and mess about on youtube and vimeo.
The point is not how much it can do, but that it can do the basics really, really easily. And I don't want a NAS, linux box and a laptop just to watch a film on the TV.
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