Feeds

back to article Google tramples over Euro data protection law – French watchdog

Google is hours away from changing its terms of service for its users, just as French data protection authority CNIL once again urged Larry Page's company to postpone its planned cut-and-shut tweak to its privacy policies. It said in a letter (PDF) to Page that CNIL's "preliminary analysis shows that Google's new policy does not …

COMMENTS

This topic is closed for new posts.
Unhappy

Opt out ?

Unless the new policy offers the user the option to entirely opt out of being subject to all this data aggregation then the length of the "consultation" is irrelevant since it is of no purpose.

Admittedly I am one of the many people who have noticed the "this stuff matters" prompt but , other than a quick scan , haven't thought it mattered enough to actually bother to read it in any detail.

2
0
Silver badge

Re: Opt out ?

I never bothered to read the 60 original policies, I just assumed that Google would use data from Youtube in Gmail ads and vice versa, etc. Now they do and I'm supposed to be under threat from something!

5
2
Gold badge

Re: Opt out ?

Oh dear. I really, REALLY recommend you read what you get yourself into. In your defense, few people do (QED in the main article), EVEN THOSE THAT HAVE A PROFESSIONAL OBLIGATION to protect your information. It is astonishing how cavalier people have become with personal information, even when it doesn't even belong to them, and even when they have a legal obligation to protect it.

Contracts follow a general trend: the start giveth, and the end taketh away. The idea is to get you so fed up with reading you stop reading as soon as you have seen the positive stuff. You can see that work in Google's present Terms & Conditions: chapter 8 states all wonderful stuff, but in chapter 11 you discover that Google basically awards itself the right to your data and IP, in perpetuity (reading on you will discover there is no termination process either). Even though 11.2 seems to limit what they grab for themselves in 11.1, analysing what the words actually mean will make you soon realise that 11.2 is essentially no restriction whatsoever.

Farcebook is the same, by the way. If you read their T&Cs you will notice that you basically permit them to use your face and data to endorse whatever they feel like. Without your permission or say-so - you agreed to this when you started using the service.

PLEASE spend the time reading the T&Cs of especially "free" services. Because nothing ever is, and privacy is an exceptionally high price to pay. Because once it's gone, there is no turning back.

IANAL, but I found that reading this crap (and having it translated by a tame lawyer where required) is worth the effort.

2
1
Silver badge
Devil

Re: Re: Opt out ?

Sorry Fred it doesn't matter.

You read it. Great. But your best buddy Barney didn't and uses a Google system. So again, your personal information is being shared by Barney now becomes the property of Google.

So those pictures of you and Barney snorting a line of coke off that dead hooker's body in Rock Vegas is now the property of Google in perpetuity.

0
0
Devil

Don't know why they said "This stuff matters".

Should have said "We own your ass."

More to the point, don't have to read the notice to figure that out.

0
0
Anonymous Coward

Re: Re: Re: Opt out ?

"So those pictures of you and Barney snorting a line of coke off that dead hooker's body in Rock Vegas is now the property of Google in perpetuity"

Someone took pictures? :)

In that you are right - it's something I plan to mention in a new review of privacy laws (which Google will REALL not like as it beats the crap out their T&Cs with an almost new topic). But that doesn't mean we should give up - that's what they want..

0
0
FAIL

Errm, you don't think this could be related to..

The French government getting all pissy over Google Maps being too good and making French GPS software look totally shit?

http://boingboing.net/2012/02/02/french-court-rules-that-its.html

0
12
Silver badge
Alert

No Barry, I don't

Next question?

0
0
Silver badge

Don't forget...

... if you go to google.com/history and sign into your Google account you can click on the “Remove all Web History” button deleting its record of your actions whilst signed in.

This also automatically pauses Web History, meaning no more information will be collected until you click the blue “Resume” button at the top of the page.

For more information see the full article on Digital Trends http://www.digitaltrends.com/web/how-to-delete-your-google-web-history/

1
0
Silver badge

Re: Don't forget...

"deleting its record of your actions whilst signed in."

Don't you mean "removing your view of the data Google hold on you"?

7
2
Silver badge
FAIL

Re: Re: Don't forget...

Paul,

It removes the data. You can also use the following links to opt out of personalised ads in gmail, search and the web.

https://www.google.com/settings/u/0/ads/preferences/?hl=en

https://www.google.com/settings/u/0/ads/onweb/?hl=en

If you do any of the 3 opt-outs you will notice a difference in the type of ads you get, so they do work. No conspiracy here, I'm afraid.

5
2
FAIL

Re: Don't forget...

So.. I have to identifiy myself to google before it will forget[1] my history?

Kinda defeats the purpose of not signing into google, dosen't it.

0
5
Silver badge

Re: Re: Don't forget...

If you don't have an account you have no web history to remove.

3
2
Bronze badge

Re: Re: Re: Don't forget...

Not really. Google can and will still track you via cookies, beacons, and other identifiers. Who gives a crap that they 'anonymize' your IP address when they track you through other means. You may not have an account, but you are still being tracked and recorded.

1
0
Silver badge

Re: Re: Re: Re: Don't forget...

If they don't know who you are then having to log in (and tell them who you are) to delete a web history which doesn't exist but would, if it did exist, identify you to your data, cannot possibly "defeat the purpose".

0
0
Big Brother

Re: Re: Re: Don't forget...

"If you don't have an account you have no web history to remove."

Yes you do. it's just tied to your IP addr, not your google ID. If you log in and delete searches from your history for "Japanese fart fetish", google still knows that you have an interest in Japan and will serve you ads for travel agents trying to sell you travel to Japan.

I once listed one of my interests on farcebook as "guitar", almost immediately farcebook & google started sending me guitar related ads.

1
5

Re: Re: Re: Don't forget...

These guys are good ....

"The opt out functionality of this page requires that your browser allow third party cookies."

1
0
Silver badge

Re: Re: Re: Re: Don't forget...

> I once listed one of my interests on farcebook as "guitar", almost immediately farcebook & google started sending me guitar related ads

Hard to tell without the specifics, but that looks completely unrelated to Google keeping your web history. If you choose to plaster personnal info on the web, it's hardly evil for them to use it.

I do believe that Google keeps tabs tied to IPs, but for most people it's not too worrysome, as you can use different search engines tu muddy the water (unless you're using Chrome, in which case you are pretty much screwed) and IPs are not terribly accurate at identifying a person anyway (contrarily to what the MAFIAA goons would like to have us believe). Again, there is a downside with that: your SO might wonder why they suddently see a lot of ads for WiFi-controlled inflatable dolls and anal beads.

2
0
Gold badge

You're never anonymous

The problem is that Google retains that data and keeps attempting to match it against an identity. The moment Google ads find you logged in on a website, you have added identity to this so-called anonymous stack, at which point this chain too has a person - even though you don't know Google knows (ergo, you have no way of asking them to delete this data). This is the same principle Farcebook uses when Apps ask for the details of your friends. All it takes is one of your Farcebook friends to play a game and your privacy is blown - without you having ANY ability to prevent this.

That's why it's never a good idea to supply too much personal data to such companies. You never know who they sell it to.

BTW: there is also such a thing as mosaic matching. This takes a volume of data and does does a probability assessment of identity. This is the process the TSA et al use to identify bad guys, but nobody ever bothered to tell the end users that the results are not absolute facts, but probabilities. Duh.

1
2
Anonymous Coward

Re: You're never anonymous

"Farcebook" - LOL, I see what you did there. Genius!

Obviously as someone too clever to use Facebook or Google what exactly have you got to worry about?

2
0

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Don't forget...

Hard to tell without the specifics, but that looks completely unrelated to Google keeping your web history

That wasn't s google specific comment, it was more along the lines "see they are watching you"

If you choose to plaster personnal info on the web, it's hardly evil for them to use it.

I'd hardly have called it personal information, it was some throwaway remark I put in interests, some like "I like children, but I couldn't possibly eat a whole one"

0
0
Bronze badge

regarding the low percentage of people reading the new policy.

Privacy policies at the best of times are overly complicated (not that they should be simpler - they are in effect a legal document - they need to be as complicated as they are in order to iron out ambiguity). So the majority of us - rely on the tech blogs and YOU (El Reg) to break the legalese down for us. If there is something to be worried about - the tech blogs would have picked up on it - and it would have been reported all over the place. So far - all I have seen is countless blogs telling me how to remove my web history - but nothing about why should I want to. As I have stated many times in the past - if I must see adverts while I am browsing the web - I would be much happier if the ads were something I was actually interested in.

0
0
Anonymous Coward

ads?

what are they?

6
1
Bronze badge

Curious conflict here....

Does anyone else find the contrast between the French attitude with Google and their attitude here -->http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/02/29/france_authors_rights_compulsory_acquisition/ a little strange?

If you are a big corporation you may not keep data which pertains to how people use that corporation's services (OK, possibly a little more than just that) however if you are a country you can take ownership of everything ever published and make money from the author's efforts.

1
1
Bronze badge
Thumb Down

Re: Curious conflict here....

No, not really, as the spirit of the law is to make books available that have not been on sale since 2001... though the phrasing of the law in the adopted version does sound a bit ambigious...

0
0
Silver badge

Re: Curious conflict here....

Not really, no. The article you point to is incredibly biased and twists the facts in a manner rarely seen before.

0
0
Boffin

Re: Curious conflict here....

It's not really a "French" issue since the CNIL was mandated by Brussels to carry out this work for the entire EU. Their letter is pretty much on point, EU legally speaking.

Also, shameless self-promotion of my legal commentary website:

http://empir.is/?p=314

0
0
Silver badge
Big Brother

Another question...

You can sign in Google services using your Yahoo!, AOL or Microsoft account. Presumably, it works the other way too. My question is, how much data (other than your login info) do these company share?

0
0
WTF?

What?!

Do you mean that Google will make use of the information that I willingly give them while I voluntarily use the typically very good (but admittedly crappy, on occasion) services that they provide to me for absolutely no charge?! How dare they! Government bureaucrats worldwide *must* unite to quell this evil and vile threat to my anonymized privacy!

2
0
Bronze badge

Lobbyists?

Competitive corporate pressure at work maybe.

Anyone thinking the same?

0
0

Let's face it

No matter what Google or anyone else says everything is a giant conspiracy designed to track everyone doing everything and they're all evil sh!ts, hell-bent on enslaving the entire population of the world to do their terrible bidding.

At least according to El Reg commentards.

1
0
Anonymous Coward

Re: Let's face it

Actually, no. But I deem it reasonable to insist that my rights are respected - if I don't argue for them those companies will casually ignore that in oder to pursue the big buck at my expense. I read T&Cs, so I know under what conditions I can use outfits such as Google.

What pisses me off is the gaming to bypass the law, and then claiming they are too big to comply when caught (remember Streetview?). No thanks.

0
0
Pint

Fire up yer Firewall

Mine is Comodo, ymmv considerably.

See all those I.P. addies screwing your CPU and your 'leccy bill?

That's google that is!

Wonder what they are doing?

Can I stop them Mummy?

"You CAN stop them Son, but you will have to give a large chunk of your time and attention to do so! - Are you prepared to fight the good fight my son?"...

Fuck it Mummy, I think I'll just browse some pr()n in private tab mode.

They CAN'T get me then can they Mummy?

"You would be surprised what those EVIL Bastards can do Son!"

Google will break all the laws they want, with carte blanche provided by government.

To quote the great Laurel And Hardy - 'Just like two peas in a pod'.

They act with impunity, because they have immunity.

If you or I did that, we'd get a quick twat spank,

Then it wouldn't be so funny.

There is poetry deep in my words somewhere....

1
0
Unhappy

Google's New Goal of "Stickiness"

I wish Google would stop aspiring to be yet another stupid Internet portal. If I wanted a service like that, then I would have signed up with Yahoo years ago.

0
0
Anonymous Coward

untracked

Google should take a leaf out of El Reg's book, with regard to refusing to indulge in online user tracking.

Even when I tick every box in sight, saying "remember me on this computer", neither the full-fat nor mobile website, on any of my devices, seems capable of remembering who the feck I am, from one browsing session to the next!

10
0
Silver badge
Happy

Yup... Just had to log in, again, to upvote you.

0
0
This topic is closed for new posts.