back to article Nintendo cuts full-year forecast – by BILLIONS

The mighty yen and weak sales have combined to take a whack out of Nintendo, forcing the Japanese gaming firm to forecast an even bigger full-year loss. MARIO_POWER_UP The Wii and 3DS maker had previously estimated a net loss for the financial year ending in March of ¥20 billion (£164.2m), but it's now preparing itself to …

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Silver badge
FAIL

Design fail

have you seen a 3DS?

Someone should tell Nintendo the 80's called and they want their industrial design back.

Seriously I think Ninty see it as an iconic style thats part of the companies unique brand statement. In reality it looks like a cheap chinese OEM import in a world full of iconic looking phones, tablets and PS Vita's.

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Have to agree

I actually have a 3DS and it's spent most of it's time gathering dust on the shelf because there's a dire lack of decent games for it. The ergonomics are not amazing either and if the rumours of a 3DSi are true with the dual stick function, then I really wasted my money. =/

I'll probably trade it in this weekend for something else.

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Silver badge

It is ugly

The screen size is small, the battery is too weak, the 3D is an eyestrain inducing gimmick that many players turn off or put on its lowest settings, and good quality games are thin on the ground. The biggest abomination for the 3DS which has to be seen to be believed is "Circle Pad Pro" that supplies a second analog stick by way of a grotesque strapon sheath.

I expect Nintendo will release a "lite" version which corrects many of the flaws but it begs the question why they released it in this state in the first place. Hopefully they'll also see fit to put the second analog stick on the device this time.

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Bronze badge
Mushroom

3DS?

I can't believe they scrapped the GB Micro in favour of that top-heavy DS dinosaur.

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Anonymous Coward

Indeed,

What idiot would buy a Wii-U, when a PS3 can be had new for £150 these days, and when combined with a Vita, does everything the Wii-U does and a whole not more besides, and the PS3/Vita combo already has a killer list of exclusives, rather than just ***ANOTHER*** Mario game and another zelda rehash.

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Anonymous Coward

Re: "PS3/Vita combo already has a killer list of exclusives"

What? Like: 'Generic FPS VII'; '3D Platform Adventure Clone 4'; 'Vanilla Racer XII (Reloaded)'; 'Football Game 2013'; etc, etc, e-t-fucking-c?

Why don't you just sod-off back to Sony HQ?

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Recycle, recycle, recycle

Your comment is quite funny considering Nintendo have hardly released anything really new and different in over a decade. They just keep rehashing the same games and characters over and over and over.

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Anonymous Coward

Re:"Recycle, recycle, recycle"

FAIL! That wasn't the point I was making.

Cudos on the Max Headroom related alias though.

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Anonymous Coward

if you sell something

People actually want then.........

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Thumb Down

An idiot who has never seen anything good on PS3?

Racing games? Really... come on.. I have a PC for that.

DCUO I have a PC for that.

Final Fantasy... yeh it's good, but buying a console for one game, not worth it.

Little Big Planet... seems neat... but it's a game you play for a week.

PS3 games are insanely expensive and frankly, they are focused on hard core gamers... and well the PC is getting to be better at that. The graphics on the PS3 are pretty lame these days anyway and everything takes SOOOOO long to load. Skyrim is a great example of that... 5 seconds to load on PS3, instant on a PC. Oh... and a lot of us HATE the PS3 controller's layout.

I may buy a Wii U... more than likely not as I already have a Wii and it's great. I don't need anything newer... and now that I have a component to HDMI adapter, my only reason to "upgrade" is gone. You just don't buy Wii games because of their awesome graphics... you buy them to get awesome games. But now that most of the games are getting playable on the PC anyway using emulation, I probably will move to that.

I just don't see why I should pay for console games when PC games are generally much better these days and PC is getting most of the good titles too. And what's best is, I can still play PC games dating to 1983 on a modern PC. When my Wii breaks or I am forced to upgrade... well there goes that.

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WTF?

5 seconds?!

When I were a lad, etc., etc.

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FAIL

too bad

i've been a huge fan of Nintendo for years, but in recent years i felt like they turned their backs on the hardcore gamers. The Wii was a piece of crap, which failed far too quickly. it may have paved the way for the future, the hardware was of inferior spec and broke down far too easilly. Mine broke just after a year of use, the laser just gave up (an often heard complaint) and Nintendo refused to fix it. In stead, they gave me the option of buying a replacement unit at a discount price (discount being 10% under retail). i was furious. At that moment i decided to never go back to Nintendo. There are hardly any good games for hardcore players on their stuff anyway and their customer service sucks.

they brought this on themselves.

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Silver badge
Facepalm

Missed opportunities

Whenever I think of Nintendo, I think missed opportunities. Take the Wii for example; phenomenonally successful, but so many missed opportunities.

- It has a DVD drive but doesn't play DVDs. Why don't Nintendo release a downloadable "DVD Channel" to enable the functionality? Hell, homebrewers managed it. You could even charge for it.

- For that matter, it's a wifi enabled box. Sell a Media Centre channel. I know it only handles 420p maximum but the current lowish price of the console would make it very cool for second TVs and kids/grandparents.

- Wii Fit was a massive craze. "Maybe for the next version we could allow people to connect up their wii fit accounts and get some kind of competition going? Nah, we'll just add a few more exercises and call it Wii Fit Plus"

I think that Nintendo make very good software but are at best lucky with their hardware choices. It will be interesting to see what ideas they come up with regarding the next Wii, and what they do to ruin the whole thing.

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Silver badge

Nintendo are a relic

I would dearly love for them to be a worthwhile competitor to MS and Sony, but the fact of the matter is they just can't cut it these days. The fact that the article mentions super Mario just goes to show how stuck in the past they are: When was the last time Nintendo took a gamble on a new intellectual property? Yes, the other two milk cash cows for sequels but that's not exclusively their lineup, unlike Mario 400, Zelda 92 and Kirby 10. They do occasionally have a massive hit (like the Wii) but then fail to implement or capitalise on it properly (Graphics less capable than older consoles, motion tracking turned out to be shit.)

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Thumb Up

To be fair to them, the Wii has done well and is nearing the end of it's life. The 3DS looks like a minor "upgrade" to the DS, focusing on a gimmick (a gimmick which doesn't seem to have taken off in other places i.e. televisions either) and actually making things like battery life worse, so none of this should really be a surprise.

On a personal note, I think this might not be such a bad thing for them. I have a minor disability which is going to prevent me playing the new Zelda, and when I contacted customer services for clarification on how the control scheme worked and if there were alternatives, I waited 3 weeks for a response and then got some canned stuff about how Wii Motion Plus is more accurate than the Wii remote on it's own. I complained about that and another 3 weeks later got a response confirming I would not be able to play.

Ten years ago, I contacted them with a similar query regarding the GameCube controller and the response I got then was excellent. Helpful, and answered my questions. The only difference I can see is that they have been riding high with the success of the Wii and the DS over the last few years, but 10 years ago the GameCube was being outdone by the PS2 and they needed their customers.

In short, the ideal situation here would be that the losses push them into improving customer service and their products, and they survive as a better Nintendo than they are now.

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Unhappy

They are frustrating

They have pretty much abandoned the hard core gamer market. Those people who made them a success to begin with. The Wii was an excellent console for the first year I owned it, then it sat gathering dust until a new Mario or Zelda game got released. Even that isn't anything new. The GameCube and N64 suffered very similar fates. They just can't seem to attract good 3rd party games. Its probably got a lot to do with them being so precious about what does and doesn't get on the consoles they make.

The Wii U just looks like a joke. I have no idea how anyone came up with that tablet controller design and thought it was a good idea. I thought the Wiimote was fantastic from thr outset, but this monstrosity doesn't look intuitive, easy to use or comfortable. to hold.

I guess we will just have to wait and see,, but the days when I spent a year frothing with excitement about their latest console are long passed :(

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Anonymous Coward

"They have pretty much abandoned the hard core gamer market."

Sorry but this is 6 of one half a dozen of the other. There was a percieved notion that nintendo abandoned the hardcore market (a "market" btw that only seem to emerge this generation, and most people claiming to be part of this market play 3rd person or 1st person online shooters, not what i would consider hardcore, as hardcore gamers as i see themdon't really give a crap about platform and like playing games that challenge them and that they enjoy). This was mainly started by the PS3 and 360 fans who based it for not having HD graphics etc (apaprently this means it nto the current geenration of consoles, forgetting that the current generation is defined by the iteration, not what it does, again a bit of a fallicy)

Basically gamers said its abandoned the hardcore and there are no hardcore games.

So hardcore games were released, No more heroes, madworld , hell even the resi evil shooters.

No-one bougt them because "its on the wii".

So they stopped releasing them because no-one bought them, and so people used the fact that they stopped releaseing them to say that NINTENDO arn't supporting the hardcore.

This is rubbish, the people shouting didn't support nintendo because its abandoned hardcore (most of the peopel shouting just didn't like nintendo, it has no xbox live to act like a big man on , and it was beating there console in sales hands down), and as such set up a self fullfiling prophacy.

Nintendo never abandoned the hardcore, there games have not changed , the playerbase set up a new market and just excluded the console, and as such developers did the same.

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Anonymous Coward

@ MKB1985

100% correct! *REAL" hardcore gamers don't give a fuck about HD graphics or insane polygon counts. ALL they care about is the GAMEPLAY - and that is something that Nintendo can still pull off.

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Silver badge

Pffft

"Hard core gamers" don't play with consoles.

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WTF?

am i an exception?

I consider myself a true hardcore gamers. i cannot count the titles i finished on PC and am the proud owner of the following:

Super Nintendo.

N64

Gamecube

Wii

Gameboy

GBA

DSlite

PSP

PS2

Xbox360

All my consoles and handhelds come with a slew of games, all bought from my own money.

I don't play FPS games, as i hate them, i play RPG's, Adventures and racing games mostly, but also have tons of platformers and such.

When i bought my Wii, i got most titles that i liked from the past. I got Final Fantasy for the Wii, which sucks. I got Dragon quest for the Wii, which sucks even more. I got another Final Fantasy and guess what, it sucked too!

played madworld, gave up after ten minutes, because it......

you guessed it again, it sucked.

i have about 20 Wii titles in total, the only two games i actually played for more then two days where House of the dead - Overkill and another on rails shooter, those worked well.

The only "hardcore" titles on the Wii are a handfull of poor FPS games, which didn't cut the mustard.

I've been one of the most loyal supporters of Nintendo since the '80's and feel like they abandoned me with the Wii. What other reason can you give me for the fact that i always played Nintendo, up untill the Wii? why would i switch to Xbox if the Wii has plenty of hardcore games? and don't tell me it's the graphics, i still regularly play my SNES on my 40'" LCD TV, which looks like shit.

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Van

What games do you consider to be hardcore on the SNES?

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off to join Sega

how the mighty have fallen.

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Silver badge
Unhappy

Anyone could see this coming

The problem with Nintendo is that they have sat on their laurels for too long. The Wii was great when it came out, but they have waited to long for an update while at the same time keeping their prices relatively high. In the same time Sony and Microsoft have improved functionality and dropped prices. Also while MS and Sony have moved their consoles to become media centres, the Wii has remained a one trick pony.

Not only that but the number of games you can get is still poor, with only little support from the major game manufacturers. I think I have about 5 games, and 3 of those I bought with the console and while games like Mario Carts was great, a sensible company would of bought out a replacement years ago.

In the handheld market they are being really hurt by smart phones. Even kids now days have these devices so there is little incentive for other game devices(especially with the high cost of the game cartridges). The 3ds was a gimmick which had fail all over it.

Basically they have not been aggressive enough and are now paying the price. Its possible the wii replacement will reverse the trend but it feels like a company that has run out of ideas.

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Alert

I wouldn't count them out yet...

I think that they might be struggling for ideas at the moment, but lets be honest, its very hard to second guess where they might go with their technology. no-one saw the Wii coming before it was announced and even when it was, i'm not sure that people expected it to be as successful as it has been.

So yeah, they need some new ideas, they have always struggled to get third party games and their online needs a fundemental re-think, but out of the three manufacturers, I reckon that they are the one most likely to think up something completely new...

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Unhappy

Eagerly awaiting Super Mario 87 and Metroid 56 here [/sarcasm]

Honestly, when all their titles are just rehashed versions of old software, you have to question what is going on. I bought my old DS for Phoenix Wright and a couple of other titles that Ninty had no hand in developing and sold it once I had had my fill as there were no titles coming out that I was keen on. Nintendo pander to children who don't realise they are being spoon fed the same old games time after time and seem to ignore the hardcore guys. It's a sad state of affairs when my Game Boy Pocket gets more of my attention than anything new.

I would love to see Ninty be a credible option, but it's quite impossible these days.

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Meh

They may be struggling right now but let's not forget that the Wii and DS have absolutely crushed both Sony and MS in terms of raw units pushed, and the Wii hardware was also profitable from the start, unlike the other two. They're the undisputed "winner" of the current generation in those terms.

Hand-held consoles seem to be on the edge of a precipice with smart-phones essentially redefining that market but no-one saw that coming. Nintendo took a hit on 3DS (and have only themselves to blame for its poor catalogue), and I expect Sony will take a similar hit on the Vita.

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Silver badge

Nintendo may have sold more units but I haven't read anything recently about SCE(1) or MS's xbox division(2) running at a loss. Unit sales are all well and good but profit is everything.

Before the downvotes flood in from fanboys, I'm a PC gamer. The last console I bought was a second hand Game Cube about 6 years ago.

1) http://uk.gamespot.com/news/sony-posts-317-billion-loss-playstation-division-sees-434-million-profit-6315481

2) http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/36011/Microsofts_Xbox_360_Division_Sees_132_Billion_Profit_For_Fiscal_Year_2011.php

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Anonymous Coward

"Quick get some new shit out"

"I don't care if it's unfinished".

Really Nintendy (so to use their cutesy name) are really in the shit, as unless the Wii U is less than £100 when it launches, consumers would be far better upgrading thier Wii with a PS3.

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Anonymous Coward

Anyone else think that the reason for the loss might actually be that they are between products atm? Its basic economics, they make profit after items are released and lose money while they are being developed, there will always be a period in the middle while the development is going on but the previous released items are out of hte cash cow area.

Unlike MS and Sony they don't have the other business areas to prop them up and hide this area, hence it gets reported.

Oh and stop witt eh 3ds not doign well crap, its broken sales records for gods sake, and unless the vita has pulled a really good week this week with the new tales of game its STILL beating it in japan. Even if you only count the first x weeks of 3ds sales against first x weeks of vita sales.

Theonyl people saying its failing ar people who want it to fail, setting up another sodding self fulfilling prophacy.

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WTF?

The question is...

How can a company which is infamous for making a profit on *every unit sold* (hardware and software) be making a loss? Where is all the money vanishing to?

It's not being pushed into new games - for all that Nintendo has a significant number of first/second party development houses on it's books, the number of releases they produce is tiny. Wikipedia's "Wii game list" page indicates that they only published 13 games in 2011 - and several were from publishing agreements with third-party developers (Arita, Artoon, etc).

And from memory, their half-year results indicated that only 50% of their expected losses came from currency issues; the rest came from sales failing to meet expectations. And even then, they'd managed to write off a significant chunk of their losses via some tax-law jiggery-pokery.

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Facepalm

'Nintendo - Making outdated consoles since 2006!'

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Anonymous Coward

Guess the name of the new console

Guess the name of the new console:

My guess: given the progression of

Wii

Wii U

The next one will be

Wii U Mii (1st person plural, 2nd person, first person singular).

either that, or

Wil U Buy Mii?

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Anonymous Coward

It was supposed to be the Puu.

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Anonymous Coward

Sales figures

If you look at the incumbent generation of consoles and portables, I'd say Nintendo were the clear winner in terms of console sales (revenue from actual games sales is harder to find):

http://www.vgchartz.com/analysis/platform_totals/

I think a lot of their success was derived from the Wiimote and Wii Fit board "gimmicks", but also their hugely popular franchises like Mario and Zelda. Personally I'd prefer to play New Super Mario Bros on a far more appropriate controller, but I still admire the quality and effort that Nintendo put into their games. Primarily I buy a console to enjoy playing good games, not because it's more powerful than some other console.

It would be nice if the Wii was HD resolution to begin with, but not the end of the world. The Wii's loss in this respect is a gain for the PS3 or XBox 360. I would hazard a guess that most homes that own two of the three consoles, will more often own a Wii and one of the others. There isn't enough distinction between the PS3 and the XBox 360 in terms of hardware and game genre coverage.

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Anonymous Coward

Well...

What you get for publicly announcing you support SOPA and PIPA I guess.

Anon, because they'll wipe my Wii if they find out who I am.

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This post has been deleted by its author

Facepalm

FFS!!!!!!!

Nintendo, release a smartphone with a decent slide out control pad FFS!

With games playable by DS cards and Nintendo market downloads!

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Van

And be outdone by a whole new bunch of competitors, every year? The share holders will love that.

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Van

Price point

Unlike the PS3 and Xbox 360 (released earlier) The Wii was designed to fit a low price point, a small size and be a quiet running machine and last but not least make a profit from the off.

Nintendo are tight, they avoided DVD playback because it cost money. They used as little as possible RAM and flash storage as that was expensive too.

Nintendo should be commended as a business for not only acheiving their goals, but bringing new gamers into the hobby and older gamers back into the hobby with the Wii's simplicity, fun and retro gaming side.

Most of the criticisms of the Wii come from the Playstation generation, who would've never had entered the hobby if Sony hadn't made gaming trendy.

NIntendo design a console to play the games they wan't to design. I imagine if they end up like Sega, the constant mario rehashes will still out sell the constant rehashes of war hero and boy racer games. One of the biggest fails in gaming, is Microsoft's under use of the RARE studio and lack of flagship game or character.

Let's not forget, new generations of gamer are born all the time. Nintendo has always been ready for them, as opposed to trying to keep up with the likes of the Apple sheep. Who wish the 3DS to be more of a lifestyle object, which the likes of Blackberry, Samsung, Motorola, Sony, Asus are contstantly trying to battle with Apple with their latest 'look at me' gadget.

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Nya
Alert

Nintendo in 10 years time won't be Nintendo

I think Nintendo's biggest problem is the general market as it is today. Hand held gaming now is dominated by phones. It's that simple, why go buy a gaming device for £250 (ok it's come down now) and £40 a game when I have a phone already in my pocket with better graphics capability already, and I can have a game "instantly" for a few quid. The markets moved on, and this same issue is going to bite Sony on it's ass also with the Vita. It'll sell some, but it's a end of line product which was dead at launch if only for the fact the little kids couldn't use it due to price and the messed up 3D system. The markets moved on, and hand held game devices are no longer part of it.

As for the Wii. It was always pretty much a fad. Many users only bought a couple of games tops, and it only got wheeled out at Xmas etc. Nintendo tried with all the exercise stuff, and to some degree succeeded but again the market these days is in a state of flux. I actually think MS and Sony will also have a huge difficulty shifting another Xbox720/PS4 whatever due to the market slowly moving. Let alone the Wii U which is another 3DS waiting to happen. It's an interesting concept on paper but it really should of stayed there.

We are still pretty much on the very early steps of that change at the moment what with streaming media channels and streaming gaming. But 5-10 years down the line, why will any of us want a dedicated high end console at home when everything will be provided down the interwibble as and when we want it, to our multitude of devices. And in 5-10 years time we will no doubt only see Nintendo as a publisher of Mario and Zelda titles and very little else, on our internet connected TV's, phones and tablets. As a hardware maker can't see they having much of a market at all after the Wii U. Although even saying that, actually suspect one of the big companies to buy them up solely for those titles. MS has always sniffed at buying Nintendo, and am sure Sony would be in the running for them also if at a good price...heck even Apple or EA might be interested in them. But on there own in 10 years time? not a chance.

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h3
Bronze badge

That is another thing I don't get so called "hardcore gamers" playing FPS's with a pad "?" on consoles.

(The title is meaningless now)

I always thought those hardcore gamers were playing FPS's or stuff like Starcraft in competitions.

People always discount Nintendo.

(At least in Japan there is a fair amount of people who would buy whatever console required to play the next Dragon Quest game (Including a system if necessary)).

Most of the PS3 games I have wanted to play (That I have seen on both consoles) run far better on my PC. Whereas Nintendo games you have no choice.

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Anonymous Coward

Dolphin Emulator

PC boys please give this a try. Piece of cake to get running. Nintendo playability with 7 graphical enhancements in High Resolution. Needs battery powered sensor bar, bluetooth and Wiimote (available from all the big online retailers). You can backup *your retail* games to a USB stick or HDD using a friends softmodded Wii (Homebrew being quite a big Wii scene now, so so much for gaming dying).

Try playing Super Mario Galaxy and Arcade shooters on your phone.

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Anonymous Coward

"That is another thing I don't get so called "hardcore gamers" playing FPS's with a pad "?" on consoles."

It's a lot harder than using the overly clinical and laid back keyboard/mouse combo on a PC.

The Wiimote and nunchuck is probably the most involving input method for a shooter so far.

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