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back to article Scottish gov moans over broadband cash handout

The Scottish government isn't happy about the trifling amount of cash UK.gov's culture secretary splashed on the rollout of broadband in that country yesterday. Jeremy Hunt allocated £68.8m to Scotland from the £530m pot set aside as part of his ambitious plans to gift the UK with the fastest broadband network in Europe by 2015 …

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"Scottish gov moans over broadband cash handout"

It is innate to the character of scotlands political class to need to whinge about unfairness from the 'south'.

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Anonymous Coward

re:whinging

Surely the role of a national government is to represent the people, so by ‘whinging’ they are only trying to get a better deal for the people they represent. As the old saying goes, “If you don’t ask, you don’t get”.

Gone are the days that the ruling party in Scotland was the same as in the UK parliament, which meant that they did as they were told and didn’t complain.

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Mushroom

well

people in England deserve to get the same level of treatment from the NHS but we have to pay for our prescriptions, whic those north of the border don't have to. Even when they did it was less than half what we have to pay so what goes around eh?

Flames, cause I expect to get some for posting this....

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Not a flame..

But if you want the same deal, vote for a party that will deliver it.

Personally I think it's the usual socialist buy-votes-with-someone-elses-money con that worked so well for 13 years, if wee Eck ever gets his independence vote i'll piss myself laughing as he has to fess up to the stuff we won't be able to pay for any more.

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Anonymous Coward

Err...

The UK and Scotland did have the same government (more or less) for quite a while when this was happening. The New Labour/Lib Dem coalition in Scotland were rather more focused on delivering services in Scotland than New Labour were in the UK.

Nothing to do with New Labour having a large amount of very senior people having their seats in Scotland, oh no.

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FAIL

Well...

England is now the only member of the UK that pays for prescriptions...

So wouldn't be moaning about the Scots.. if your not happy.. go complain.. oh wait you just did..

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Devil

Exactly

Reminds me of the old classic joke about Andropov's telegram congratulating Cheushesku on the Romanian sportsmen successes in the LA olympics.

Dear Comrade Cheushesku comma We congratulate you on the successes of your sportsmen in the Olympics stop Gas stop Electricity stop Food stop ...

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FAIL

Devolutions a bitch

that is all.

Now fuck off and stop moaning. You wanted devolution, sort out your own fucking broadband...

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Thumb Down

RE: devolution

"You wanted devolution, sort out your own fucking broadband..."

Erm, thanks for that wonderful insight, but broadcasting and communications of this nature is Reserved to Westminster.

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Mushroom

Whinging cnuts!

"We're Scotland... we want independence... we don't need the union... we'd be much better off on our own..."

So fund your own fast broadband if you want it! Or do you expect UK.gov to pay stupid amounts so a few thousand arran sweatered farmers and fishermen can watch YouTube and buy from eBay and Amazon (oh no sorry they charge extra to deliver that far out)..??

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Bronze badge

we would....

....but you damn UK'ers keep stealing all our natural resources

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Flame

You mean the natural resources

the *UK* government helped pay to extract ?

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yes

yes your right. but im fairly sure that the oil has more than paid for the extraction by now.

plus, what makes you think we couldnt have got it our ourselfs?

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Headmaster

Because they didn't?

BP had five years of exclusive rights to prospect those waters for oil and gas, and they didn't bother trying. Amoco and Shell then went looking and hit paydirt, and within another five years Aberdeen was richer than Glasgow. Even now, though, the major work is done abroad because it's easier, with Aberdeen serving only as the administrative centre.

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Anonymous Coward

Once again Scotland gets too much

This works out at £13 per person for Scotland and less than £7 per person for everyone else.

Scotland's share should be decreased

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Flame

Oh the irony ...

Some things never change ... didn't the great Dr. Johnson make a remark about the Scots wanting indepence from everything English except her money ?

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Mushroom

You wanted devolution...

Pay for it yourselves, stop relying upon the English you so stridently abhor yet still use to bankroll your free prescriptions

Now for the down-votes

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Scotland gets more cash than rest of UK

Population of Scotland: 5.2m. (2010 estimate)

Population of UK: 62.3m (2010 estimate)

Percentage of UK citizens living in Scotland: 8.3%

Cash divvied up so far: £430m

Cash going to Scotland: £68.8m

Percentage of UK cash disappearing in Scotland: 16%

So, I have this to say to Jeremy Hunt (nearly spelled his name wrong there): fuck off, you already have twice as much cash as you should, get your thieving hands off the money meant for the rest of the UK. Independence for Scotland! I would really love it.

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Wasn't that ire meant to be directed at Alex Neil?

And please remember to use the full form of Jeremy Hunt, Culture Secretary to add to the chances of a slip.

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Thumb Down

You forgot a variable

Percentage of UK cash generated from North Sea Oil in Scottish waters....?

Stupid argument.

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Hulture Secretary

What's a Hulture Secretary?

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Re: Scotland gets more...

This might be because Scotland is on the whole poorer than average. Taxes help to redistribute wealth from the rich to the poor.

If you disagree with this then thats a different matter.... and youre a git.

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Two can play at that game

"Percentage of UK cash generated from North Sea Oil in Scottish waters....?

Stupid argument."

Percentage of UK cash needed for Scottish banks (HBOS, RBS)?

I was under the impression Scotland already got extra money from the block grant for this.

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So it is poorer then?

"This might be because Scotland is on the whole poorer than average. Taxes help to redistribute wealth from the rich to the poor.

If you disagree with this then thats a different matter.... and youre a git."

OK, so either 1) Scotland is poorer than the rest of the UK, and Salmond can shut up about independence being good for Scotland, or 2) Scotland isn't poorer than the rest of the UK, and therefore doesn't need the extra cash.

I have no problem with using money from richer parts to prop up poorer parts, but I do have a problem with Scottish politicians getting annoyed at only having twice the UK average.

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Apologies to Hunt this time

"Wasn't that ire meant to be directed at Alex Neil?"

Indeed, it was meant to be. Whoops. I have a whole sackful of other ire for Hunt though, so it all evens itself out in the end.

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Stop

I feel dirty now

I didn't mean to prompt an actual apology to Jeremy Hunt, Culture Secretary.

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Re: DavCrav

I believe the independence argument is based more on self determination than economics? (though im not scottish so dont know (or care) about this). I also dont know what Alex Neil thinks about independence.

As it is though, theyre not independent and so its down to the MPs to fight for more cash for their regions.

Though I would have thought Welsh MPs would be kicking up more of a fuss, didnt someone figure out that they were getting squat?

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Coat

But they don't need broadband

They have all the pr0n they need just roaming around in fields ...

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Silver badge

Scottish Banks?

What does the 'H' in HBOS stands for?

What is their relationship with Lloyds TSB?

When did they receive a bail-out from the public purse?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7885589.stm

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Anonymous Coward

re: Oil

The oil and gas thing always comes up and it's always reported as if the Scottish own all of it. In reality a fair bit of the oil fields are south of the boarder, thus making it English, it's just all landed in Scotland.

As it happens I think the union is a good thing, and the tedious arguments for splitting it up grate on me. I do think that tuition fees and prescription charges etc. should be the same across the uk though.

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Convenient history

"What does the 'H' in HBOS stands for?

What is their relationship with Lloyds TSB?

When did they receive a bail-out from the public purse?"

What does the H stand for? Halifax. So? It was headquartered in Edinburgh. That's in Scotland, if I remember correctly.

What is their relationship with Lloyds? If I remember correctly -- and I do -- Lloyds was leant on by the government (i.e., Gordon Brown, who IIRC comes from Scotland) to take over the collapsing, toxic mess that was HBOS. Lloyds was one of the safest banks in the UK, which is probably why they were chosen to be pressured by Brown.

When did they receive a bailout? Shortly after Lloyds took over HBOS.

I fail to see how any of your questions make a difference to my point.

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Mushroom

%%%%%%

The cash is being allocated to create a network where everyone in the country can have at least 2Mbps - which means significant investment in RURAL broadband. In case you hadn't noticed, Scotland has a hell of a lot more rural areas than anywhere south of the border.

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Devil

Missing statistic

Percentage of Scottish cittizens dwelling in the corridors of Whitehall...

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Joke

Yes they do

Surely they need to be able to upload it to Youtube for everyone else's benefit?

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Re: Scottish Banks

They're international companies you div.

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Quoting the wrong figures

Area of UK: 243,610 km2

Area of Scotland: 78,772 km2 - almost one-third of the UK*, and that's not allowing for all the water in between the land.

So should that 16% should be doubled? Well, part of the cost - exchange equipment, for example - is related to population, but low density means a lot of cable and cabinets.

*The BBC, with its skewed TV weather map, tries to disguise this fact.

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Megaphone

People living in remote areas

People living in remote areas cannot realistically have the same expectation of access to mass comms or other utilities as city dwellers.

By this logic we should be paying for on-grid gas and sewerage connections to every remote cottage in the UK.

Thats not to say that we shouldn't look for solutions to access problems in remote areas - just that it's idiotic to expect parity of provision and that people might have to accept that the provision they get might not be as good as if they lived in a city.

I expect that most rural people understand this perfectly well and that this is just the usual bleating from a self promoting politico.

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re: people living in remote areas

Nobody is asking for, or even expecting parity with city dwellers. What is being done is ensuring that those in the country have access to a semi-decent broadband connection. More and more services are moving online, and having a decent connection is becoming essential. If it was left up to market economics, those in the sticks would be stuck using dialup, which is simply not going to be economic in future years. Instead, government funding is being used to upgrade the networks and ensure a decent level of service is available, this will still be a lot slower than what is available in cities.

How do you think they got phone lines, sewerage and on-grid gas in the sticks in the first place? It wasn't due to it being economically viable, that's for sure!

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I don't need no steenking title

Have they never heard of satellite broadband, this could be made part of the mix? Indeed I believe the EU has already funded an extensive roll-out of satellite broadband to many far flung European hinterlands, including the Shetland Islands.

Why the obsession with cables?

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Re: People in remote ares

People in the city shouldnt expect an inexhaustible supply of fresh water as clearly theres no space to store it all. That and fresh fruit n veg, why the hell should they get all that when clearly its the folks in the countryside who grow it (well a small percentage of it)

Oh and electricity... why the hell should city folk use so much when dont host the power stations.

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@jm83

"People in the city shouldnt expect an inexhaustible supply of fresh water as clearly theres no space to store it all. That and fresh fruit n veg, why the hell should they get all that when clearly its the folks in the countryside who grow it (well a small percentage of it)

Oh and electricity... why the hell should city folk use so much when dont host the power stations."

Answer: they PAY FOR IT THEMSELVES, rather than expect the government to cough up a subsidy for them to get their water/fruit/electricity.

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Re: paying for

Its subsidised & regulated. If (for instance) water was treated as a free market, you can bet those counties with huge resources would charge a lot more than 0.001p per litre for it.

as it is, we are a country not a selection of little regions and that means sharing stuff about for best effect.

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Alert

Missing the point...

is it wrong that I dont care about Scottish broadband but am thrilled that WWZ is finally filming?

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Mushroom

Listen you lot...

If it hadn't been for our oil for the past 40 years, you lot (The English) would be living in mud huts and selling your bodies for a rat dinner. So can it and realise who's "the man," that's been funding your lifestyles since you were born.

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oh, fuck off.

"our oil" - without England you'd never be able to afford to get it out of the sea.

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Thanks for it

"If it hadn't been for our oil for the past 40 years, you lot (The English) would be living in mud huts and selling your bodies for a rat dinner. So can it and realise who's "the man," that's been funding your lifestyles since you were born."

*cough* £850bn bank bailout for Scottish banks *cough* Gordon Brown's wonderful abilities as Chancellor *cough*. Thanks for half of the oil in the North Sea (the other half is in English waters), but does completely wrecking the UK economy for everyone else make us even?

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Really?

US oil companies did a lot of the hard work

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Scotland!

Since when was the 850bn just for scottish banks? Did Lloyds, Santander and Northern Rock not also get bailed out?

We may have invinted banks, but it was the shower of shit in london that arsed it up.

Gordon Brown was voted in, along with the rest of Labour, by a massive landslide over the whole country. No blame there for us. In fact if the SNP's dominance in the Scottish elections are anything to go by, Labour will never have power ever again. No need to say thanks

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WTF?

"We may have invinted banks"

You are Steve Jobs and I claim my £5.

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Anonymous Coward

Not all your oil

Some of it is south of the boarder, therefore English.

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