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back to article Apple iOS 5 and iCloud examined

The keynote speech at Apple's Worldwide Developers Conference may have kicked off with a demo of Mac OS X 10.7 Lion that we've seen before - the only real news was its launch date, July, and low price, $30 (£18) - but the iOS 5 and iCloud announcements were packed with juicy details. It's crucial to look ahead. Many of …

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LPF
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Regarding iMessage

From my experience its mostly used by loads of teens, then amount of people on facebook putting their PIN number up, don't underestimate this.

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Exactly this.

I'm currently at college and I'd seriously estimate that at least 70% of the people I see around college are using Blackberry's. The sole reason is BBM. It's like the new "in thing".

Now that Apple will mirror this with their own, what would keep the teens on BB? I can't honestly see much, other than the current immense popularity.

iMessage will prove really popular, I'm sure of it. It may just take a while to gain traction.

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@AnyJungleInGuy

Maybe you missed this part of the article -

"Like the iOS-only, Wi-Fi-only FaceTime, iMessage connects iOS 5 users - and no one else."

If almost everyone already has BB's then who wants BBM who are going to be the first few people to move over to Apple and lose almost all of their messaging buddies then?

Unless there's some kind of mass migration to Apple (could happen if I underestimate how much money there is for parents/students to spend on these things) then it seems unlikely, at least for quite some time anyway.

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Gimp

User base is there already

I am also currently at college – maybe a different, Ivy League college – and I estimate that 75% of the students have macBook laptops. And well over half have iPhones.

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Legalise yer torrents?

***"The question is, do torrenters feel sufficiently guilty to cough up Apple's de facto torrent legalisation subscription? Many won't but a lot will."***

Of course, the side-effect is that the likes of the RIAA won't know if a download is legal, or not, when they send in the attack lawyers.

So, kind of catch 22, really. There's no point in subscribing to Apple's "torrent legalisation subscription" because the very fact that there is a "torrent legalisation subscription" means that you don't need to subscribe to it to keep you safe from the RIAA because the RIAA won't know which downloaders are legal, and which aren't.

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(Written by Reg staff)

Re: Legalise yer torrents?

Except that you can tell 'em you paid for the download indirectly through your iTunes Match sub.

BTW, the RIAA doesn't appear to be pursuing music downloaders as much as it once did, and even then it was targeting seeds rather than leeches.

It's the movie biz that's aggressive legally these days.

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Anonymous Coward

the RIAA don't generally get you for downloading

they get you for uploading! Which torrents/p2p do as you download. Most people who have been caught have been jobbed by keeping masses of stuff in their download directory, automatically sharing it with everyone.

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Re: iMessage

Reg, you've missed the point. The messaging service is integrated so sending SMS or using Apple iMessage is not a choice users need to think about. There is one messaging centre, so when sending a message to a friend with an iPhone, the message is transported using Apple's protocol, when messaging a friend on a non iOS phone, SMS is used. It's difficult to see how this can be a fail, it will simply be used when it's appropriate. Users aren't going to neglect to use it. It won't whither and die. Indeed it is seamlessly integrated with the only universal messaging service available across all mobile devices - SMS.

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What he said

I came to post the same!

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Re: Re: iMessage

How would this work when sending a message to an iPod Touch? or will it not worK?

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@jonathanb

I'm guessing the same as FaceTime -- it uses your registered email address as the 'key' via Apple's all knowing servers.

I see this as being a pretty big thing, partly because of the integration, and partly because I'm finding it increasingly hard to know people without iPhones these days.

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Hail

Overall - it looks like a superb upgrade. However, has anyone seen it run on a 3GS ? Will it be too much for the hardware to run with acceptable performance ?

Oh and "though why no Facebook, Apple? " - they need cooperation, and perhaps they didn't get any - or will there be another Apple offering in similar space ?

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3GS

The 3GS has similar specs to the iPhone 4 in the CPU core department, although a slower clock speed.

It has half the RAM though, but the iPad 1 has only 256mb as well.

How many other manufacturers are giving owners of two year old phones the latest OS? you should be glad you're getting anything at all.

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No Facebook

...because Apple got burned with Ping - it was ready to roll with full facebook integration and was pulled because they could not agree terms to allow Apple to use the Facebook API etc.

That's my theory anyway, I would prefer FB to Twitter to be honest, but when they see what a boon it is perhaps they will be back, cap in hand, etc.

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Anonymous Coward

Partly agree

... but for the fact that they are still selling the 3GS (just checked the Apple UK site) so they better support it !

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Headmaster

iTunes Match

There's a 25,000 song limit evidently, not 20,000

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Reset the song counter...

I wonder if you cancel and then rejoin the next year if you get another 25,000 songs?

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Facebook

Given Microsoft are a major backer of Facebook is it any wonder WP7 supports Facebook and Apple supports Twitter?

Not to mention the fact that Facebook won't do an iPad version of their App.

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no FB iPad app

I think the thinking here is that FB mobile website is suitably good enough without needing an entire app for it. And of course, if this means that they get to remain in control of the advertising standards and revenue for the website without having to comply with Apple's Ts&Cs for ads in apps, then you can imagine why they won't do it. No ads at all in the iPhone App, they can't love that, surely...

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One IS somewhat peeved...

...by the pervasive Facebook and it's acolytes.

Everything I seem to look at has "like" buttons somewhere on it - and I have no desire/interest in becoming a Facebook member.

I have no intention of imitating the rabid spittle-laden invective of the anti-apple brigade:- I just ignore all such references and I'm quite happy for those who worship at the altar of Zuckerberg to continue doing so.

I'd just like them to allow me the freedom to NOT do so. Perhaps it IS that things are tailored for the majority but I, for one, would be quite happy for my Macs & my iPhone to continue to not constantly badger me with "like" and other Facebook references.

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Rip off Britain

The UK price for Lion is £20.99 according to http://www.apple.com/uk/macosx/ , not £18 as the exchange rate would imply.

To be fair to Apple, it would be £20.70 if you add Luxembourg VAT of 15% to the price - iTunes store is based in Luxembourg, not UK.

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Fair deal this time

Last time it was $30/£30. Much better this time.

Also, don't forget that the US prices are sans tax. Take 20% of our price, and add a minimum of 2.5% (up to 15% depending on state) Sales tax onto the US price, and it's actually a fair deal.

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Trollface

Problem?

Why do people continue to whinge about 'rip off Britain'?

£2.99 extra? Boo hoo.

Show me a country other than Somalia perhaps that DOESN'T charge extrortionate duty and VAT of some description on goods or services from overseas.

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No sales tax on digital downloads

I thought that the other news on Lion was that it was only going to be available via the Mac App store. Right now, there is no sales tax on downloaded items (at least not in California ... I don't know about other states).

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@Tony Luck

Apple have only said that the way to get Lion on it's first day of release will be through the App store, they haven't said that will be the only way ever.

It's a subtle point, but one that appears to be wizzing over the heads of a lot of people.

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Yawn.

As usual you've decided to remove the US sales taxes.

If you're really going to do price comparisons, you have to factor in differences in wages/houseprices/gov't services/NHS/.. etc.

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There is no national sales tax in the US

Sales tax varies here state to state. Some states have no sales tax (brilliant for buying a car!) Here in Arizona between state, county, and city taxes our sales tax is about 9%.

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FAIL

How strange!

iOS5 borrows Android notifications, wifi sync, short message chat, background downloads.

Microsoft tries to take the credit :

@joebelfiore

Feeling flattered today. Lots of great WP ideas headed to iOS. (Camera button/above lock, auto-upoad of pics, better notifications ... )

@joebelfiore

Feeling flattered today part 2 ... wi-fi sync, built-in twitter, background downlad service, short-messaging chats (though we do Facebook!)

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Headmaster

All this x copied y...

Most of these companies have been working on features for a long time and in parallel.

And also, while I'm on the subject, why is there is the consistent tendency for commenters to misunderstand the difference between invention and innovation (not OhFFS who I'm replying to I should say)?

Innovation is about being active in bring together new products and services and combinations of features to market and is not simply the sum of inventions. There is relatively little new invented in the world. Apple bringing the iPad to market was innovation, not invention, the ideas that went into it had been around for years. So the criticism "it wasn't new,.. Nokia, or Microsoft, or Palm did x, y or z" wholly misses the point.

As does all this point scoring with x invented y that we see in these comment forums. Apple were innovative with the introduction of the iPhone, Google have since been innovative with many features of Android. We all stand on the shoulders of inventors and innovators who have gone before us. Copying isn't bad - it's a good thing when it's a good idea. The only "crime" is if X copies Y, who has a really great implementation, but then X does it worse despite having the good implementation as an example.

Recognising innovation when it occurs is a strength (and we should all be prepared to recognise innovation whenever it occurs). So yes Apple did some great innovation with touch interfaces, and Google have done some of their own, and copying isn't bad per se, unless it's done badly.

Engaging in point scoring about who invented what is usually just being childish.

Sorry, but I had to get that off my chest.

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iMessage...

Hmm. If it's really true that iMessage combines SMS and an Apple-only protocol, this hardly can fail. The carriers of course will hate that. Why isn't something like that integrated with Android? Ah, yes, the carriers. Say what you want about Apple but they have the balls to stick it to the carriers now and then.

And having some (limited to iOS users) texting capabilities on iPod touches and WiFi-iPads is better than nothing. The kids will love that, especially since it's free.

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candy for carriers too

imessage will screw carriers a bit, but a lot of the other changes should result in increased data traffic, and the carriers REALLY want that.

updates over 3g, automatic downloading of newspapers/magazines, playing music over cloud etc

iphone users already use more data than other smart phone users (on average). Carriers are much more freaked about VOIP integration and wi-fi I would say.

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@cloudgazer

"iMessage will screw carriers a bit"

correction:

"iMessage will stop carriers screwing their customers"

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iUpgrade? MeBored!

an upgrade?

Putting up with a UI that is 7+ years old is upgrading.

How come?

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Trollface

haha :)

You realise, of course (I know you do, you must, no-one could be this dumb), that this article is about iOS, which is 4 years old. Of course, perhaps you mean to leave disparaging comments about 10.7 instead, only that one would be 10 years old.

The only OS that I can find released 7 years ago is Pocket RISC OS...

Still, thanks for the chuckle.

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Yes yes

Touchscreens are so old hat. What an old UI concept. I assume you carry a Kinect with your cell phone so you can have a more advanced UI?

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LDS
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Devil

How long before it becomes the de facto iOS UI, and the app list sits off to the side?

And it start to look alike a WinMo 6.x home screen? But maybe that's what many people expect a mobile device to show - useful informations - when they look at it instead of a long collection of candies?

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Anonymous Coward

Weather notifications?

I know what the local weather is, right now. How does telling me about it help.

What I might want to know is tomorrows weather - but I've got the Met Office app for that.

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Windows

There´s local and local

...As someone who does a lot of sailing as well as climbing geet big hills (the one I can see out the window is 11,400ft), it is pretty damn important to understand what the weather is doing now and what it is forecasted to do at various stages throughout the day. It might be sunny where you are, a few kilometers might be quite different. Local can mean a big difference where I live, especially when you throw verticality into the mix.

For example, the weather here today (3,000ft where I live) is stormy and very wet. Above 5,000ft this means snow and pretty nasty conditions. Down on the coast, the wind will be mild, two miles of the coast it will be a different kettle of bananas altogether.

My weather apps, with radar images/animations etc are extremely useful and something I use frequently for planning my misadventures, alongside the usual cockerel blood and unicorn tears...

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Re: There´s local and local

I'm sure knowing the current weather is very useful in some situations, but it's not likely "23, Sunny" with a pretty icon on the home screen is going to cut it in these scenarios.

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Re: There´s local and local

Not all weather apps on Android et al only show the weather now, most show a forecast of some sort for the next few hours/days

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I think it's more about what WASN'T mentioned...

Ok there are two areas I really expected IO5 to get beefed up.

1) Navigation. The mapping still doesn't do turn by turn voice navigation. I really expected this.

2) Voice Control. The amount of voice input hasn't been updated in a while. I haven't used it on Android but I understand you can voice text messages. I really expected to get more voice input capabilities.

Regarding the ToDo - Reminders app. Glad they finally added that. Now my iPhone will finally be able to do everything my PalmPilot did in 1998!

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Facepalm

Yawn

£20 to 'legalise' £25000 of downloads .... Not sure we've thought that one through.

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reporter living under a rock?

What rock has this reporter been hiding under? "Maybe if big business starts buying iPhones too, iMessage will take off"...?

I can't speak for the big corporates, but where I live, in the world of public administration (hospitals, police, public services) iPhones have taken over completely (if your phone was issued in the last 18 months, it's an iPhone). I know the same is the case for many large public hospitals nationally (Australia).

iPads likewise are infiltrating in large numbers, both in administrative areas (including IT departments) and clinical areas (e.g. clinical portal apps, theatre scheduling apps).

iMessage has the potential to be a MASSIVE hit. As far as clinical use, delivery and read confirmations alone make iMessage viable where SMS currently isn't. The potential cost savings from these devices using iMessage over wifi instead of voice calls billed by the telco are huge.

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FAIL

iCloud in Australia = fail

I have 1gig of data a month that I can use on my iphone....but I have mobile data turned off on my iphone, because over here, three / vodaphone have poor coverage, and will charge you for roaming data, even when the icon on the screen CLEARLY shows you are on a three, 3g zone.

In countries where there are restrictive data caps and useage, cloudy apps on mobile devices will suffer from low uptake.

I would rather keep my information, on my server, and on my computers. I just don't trust clouds, much less clouds run by one-foot-in-the-grave, thieving, turtleneck wearing gimps.

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FAIL

IPHONE FANBOIS...

...upgrade to iOS 5 where the camera app can talk to the Twitter app!

Alternatively, upgrade to Android where all apps can talk to any other app.

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WTF?

How is iMessage going to fail?

I'm not sure how the report thinks that iMessage is a fail, I've tried and I just can't see it.

Services like Ping and Whatsapp for the iPhone are hugely popular, but at times unstable/unreliable and in the case of Whatsapp cost money.

Almost everybody I work with, and everyone I know socially has an iPhone or an iPad (including my parents and grandparents) and as this is built into the iPhone messaging app (rather than being stand-alone) I can see my SMS usage falling considerably.

The other clever thing that Apple have done here is calling it iMessage. Which, like BlackBerry Messenger being shortened to BBM, will be shortened to IM - "Yeah sure, IM me", hopping on the back of an already popular/well known abbreviation.

iMessage is a hail, not a fail.

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