Apple is today accused of anti-gay discrimination, following the release of an iPhone app that aims to help people find “freedom from homosexuality”. A petition has been launched by Truth Wins Out, which describes itself as a non-profit organisation that fights anti-gay religious extremism on the change.org website, asking Steve …
This should be a no brainer
Remove the app. Apple should be neutral, as the article states, they would not be allowed to include a Racist related App, so the same should be for this. I'm sure this would be breaking the law in the UK under the new Equalises law.
I do not condone the app, inf act I have signed the petition for it's removal.
But, this does raise an interesting conundrum.
If Apple are neutral, then they should not censor anything, and let the purchasing populace decide, objectionable apps would have few downloads, and fall off...
Personally, I hope it's removed, but vendor neutrality means they should not bend to one argument's wishes.
AC, for obvious reasons.
Misunderstanding of 'neutral'
They appear to censor in an attempt to prevent the App Store from becoming a political or religious battleground, and presumably also with an eye toward avoiding things that'd piss off their bigger markets -- and I would wager quite a large sum of money indeed that there are far more gay people out there with iPhones than there are fundies.
neutral when it suits them
Apple are not neutral, and there is plenty of selective censoring on the App store. Gay themed picture apps get removed, but there are plenty of similar apps with female flesh on show, boob jiggling and strip games.
I think you will find out that these apps are few and far between, as they are rarely let through by the Apple thought police.
no-brainers just don't 'get' freedom
How dare those intolerant straight-hating bigots deny others the freedom to consume educational material of their choosing. No one is being forced to use or subsidise this app, they choose to download it of their own free will. If you don't like it, don't download it. Simple.
In countenance, pro-homosexual lifestyle books are being peddled to impressionable young school children. As tax payers have to pay for this, and their children are forced to read this propaganda, they have a moral case for opposing it.
RE no-brainers just don't 'get' freedom
You appear to have got off at the wrong stop old chap. The Daily Heil is just down the road on your right.
because I have to
It didn't seem like this was in jest...
You might want to include the title of one of these books, since I can't imagine some kid reading about how Jane should really try a little rug munching at recess or how Dick should take a litle from behind in the janitor's closet. I seem to remember these as being the 'I have 2 mommies' or '2 daddies' type. Seriously... include a real title of a book that a school uses so I can see for myself because I'm doubting your sincerity. Maybe you could argue that since most people in the country are white, that other colours shouldn't be shown. Woudn't want some white girl thinking it was o.k. to be with a black guy.
Homosexuality is genetic, which means I also wouldn't classify this app. as being remotely educational as you infer. Trying to convice someone, that they really aren't who they are, is pretty cruel. Gayness, in and of itself, is not a bad thing. Doesn't mean it's a good thing, just a neutral thing that doesn't matter.
Apple detractors also have to decide...
...because many of the people who slam Apple's tight control will no doubt try having it both ways by bashing them for allowing this app through.
If this were Android marketplace - apparently the 'better', 'freer' model - those unhappy about this app wouldn't have a snowball's chance of getting it removed.
Better if they didn't censor at all, but if they're going to do it, then they need to do it even-handedly.
Would the American Moral Minority...
... consider an App saying that we can "cure" extremist Christians of their bigotry to be acceptable?
I doubt it!
Good point. One can just imagine their reaction to being told that their religious orientation is a disease and that impressionable young children should not be allowed to read the bible on the grounds that it "promotes" this degenerate lifestyle.
bring it on
not american, but as a christian, I see hate, disdain and insults against my religion all the time. one just learns to let barking dogs bark, or in this case down vote your posts. no big deal.
having said that, any thing that incites hate should be censored, the world has enough problems as is.
"any thing that incites hate should be censored"
let's censor the bible and quran then.
if you don't think these books incite hatred you haven't read them.
Also known as conversion therapy and brainwashing would fall under human rights laws to be illegal and tantamount to torture.
It also has no scientific evidence to work and has an unacceptably high rate of depression and suicide in people who experience it, exactly why it was banned by British and American medical associations.
Exodus International encourages rape in Africa to cure lesbians with Aid money and their clergy who travel there so their moral compasses are as bad as those paedophile priests.
Apple would do well to remove the app before this becomes a real headache for them.
Moral compass: worse in fact
I don't believe I have yet encountered a child-molesting priest who tried to claim that what he was doing was not merely okay, but actively what God wanted him to do.
Fortunately I've not encountered any child molesting priests. But then I'm not Catholic...
And how many priests have you discussed this matter with then?
I am not buying anything more from iTunes
As long as Apple makes this offensive "app" available, I will not be buying anything more from iTunes or any other Apple product or Apple licensed accessory.
Usually when people spout catagoric statements like this, they are usually bluffing.
In terms of stickability it's right up there with New Year's resolutions...
Quite simple, actually
It really is quite simple; I use a Touch that I got for xmas, and it is the only Apple product that I have owned since I had a 2e. I also have a 4.3 inch Android tablet. I have bought several apps and a few songs for the Touch. I have no pressing need need to buy any more apps or music for the Touch. It is no hardship at all for me to not buy anything Apple.
Nah, I won't buy anything either
But then I didn't have any plans to buy any Apple-related products in the near future anyway, so it's not exactly a 'lost sale'.
That said, Apple are probably on rather dodgy legal grounds here, as discrimination against homosexuals is illegal. They control the Apple App Store and have publicly stated that they consider that this application contains no objectionable material, that certainly implies that they agree with the material.
Which isn't a great place to be.
Over-generalisation in the last sentence of this article?
I'm an atheist, so forgive me if I'm wrong, but I thought a lot of Christians would also be offended by this app?
This will be highly offensive the the vast majority of Christians that I know, myself included. The problem is that there are a minority of very shouty people who use their religion to justify their bigotry, they tend to be the ones getting onto the news because it's not news to say "Today, millions of Christians weren't offended by homosexuality" However "Today a My Homophobic Asshole said that homosexuality is an abomination and people should be educated out of it" tends to make a headline.
Very disappointed in apple here...
They should be offended
Good Christians should be offended, but Christians will seldom say anything against other Christians. An exception is that the Christians that are against gays will claim that certain other Christians are not really Christians.
re AC 1548
That should read "a Mr Homophobic Asshole" - otherwise it sounds just deeply odd... Bit of a typo there...
Censor those who would censor.
Tolerance of intolerance should not be tolerated. Yes that's a contradiction; and it also implies censorship, and yes it is essentially the ends justifying the means,
Because left to itself intolerance will breed further intolerance, and ultimately, violence, and the voices of tolerance will be drowned in the cries for blood and vengeance. That is why intolerance needs to be eradicated. Like an infectious disease it needs to be stopped even when this does infringe on personal rights sometimes.
A lot of the gay ones will be, certainly.
I don't actually think they *need* a justification. Its their sandbox.
Two false assumptions there...
1) It doesn't have to be illegal for Apple to remove it.
2) Not all Erasure fans have handbags.
The therapy encouraged by this organisation encourages discrimination, hate crime, and leads to depression and a high number of Suicides.
Democracy should not cover this and especially not since any money this organisation makes is then used to lobby American organisations and congress to remove gay rights and create homophobic laws like Don't Ask Don't Tell and the Defense Of Marriage Act.
You can't believe in Democracy and also claim this app will fall under freedom of speech and is a good thing without also allowing a Ku Kux Klan and Nazi power app in the marketplace for balance.
Dot Co Dot UK
Public schools. Ignorance.
Hmmm. What point could I be making?
Who is Erasure?
What is this Erasure that you are speaking of?
Guilty of the very ignorance you accused me of.
In an ideal world you would be reincarnated as a gay man in Uganda and know the fear, prejudice and discrimination some of us have to put up with every day.
And if you do then good luck as your family will disown you an you'll be arrested and imprisoned just for being gay, if you're not murdered before that.
Maybe it is better to allow KKK and Nazi apps. Are we assuming that sensoring that kind of bullshit is an effective way of fighting it? You need to think very carefully about the type of fire you're fighting before chucking water on it. It might be a chip pan fire, for example.
America, Canada or England
What sort of government do we have if we live in Scotland or Wales? I'm just wondering, in my pedantic little way...
As a Pastafarian...
...I'm strongly opposed to people and fish co-existing.
Religion is an insult to human dignity. With or without it, you'd have good people doing good things and evil people doing bad things, but for good people to do bad things, it takes religion.
All hail his noodley apendages..
by someone who knows nothing about religion except what he or she reads in the tabloids
I respectfully disagree
Government can also accomplish that quite well.
"by someone who knows nothing about religion except what he or she reads in the tabloids"
or by someone who has actually studied what people believe in and what people have done to each other for not having the same views on imaginary friends...
Yes, it's always religion
Or whatever your favourite scapegoat happens to be. Politicians, government, people from country X, people not from country X, whatever. I thought freedom and democracy are the cause of all evil.
You went wrong the moment you said "good people" and "evil people". You'd probably make a good fundamentalist religious type, since things are so clear cut. In fact, one could conclude you're probably just the type of prescriptive know-better "good guy" who ends up causing bad things because you "know better".
Credit Where it is due.
I should have posted the above quote by steven weinberg with a reference.
So sorry its not a tabliod source.
Good people do good things with or without religion.
Bad people will do bad things with or without religion.
Good people do bad things in the name of religion.
From the Crusades to the Taliban, the list is huge...
My personal view would be
for the really big things (like wars n ting) you can't blame the ideals of religion, but I think it's undeniable that religion enables such actions to be more devastating. For instance, the Crusades were clearly an effort by the Pope to not only make a bit of money but also to unite the warring factions in Europe. The way it was done was sickening, but at its core it was more a power and money thing. The problem I have is this, if it wasn't for the religious reasoning behind it would anywhere near as many people died? Or would the people encountered have been treated anywhere as badly?
Personally my problems with religion lie with its more insidious actions. The indoctrination of children, the criminal negligence of preaching against protection to a country ravaged by AIDS, its ability to influence country politics, or the suppression of women, or how about just the plain violence that's ok because it was done in the name of some beardy? Bashing babies' heads out on rocks, ethnic cleansing, and the treatment of women in captured towns. Sorry, no thanks, I'm not in the business of accepting that something is all right because it's 'religious'.
Every day that I make any effort to find out something new about religion (it still interests me, even though I am more than happy and secure in my 'beliefs') I get more saddened by how easily it pervades everyday life. I really don't bear a grudge against anyone that wants to be religious, but that doesn't mean I'll accept hatred just because it's 'what they believe'.
Apologies for rambling shouty thing.
The Register has a sense of humour!
Got to admire the editorial staff for placing this 'gay-cure' item next to RIM, Woman fingers ex and Yahoo! To! Offload! Not to mention the nude photo actress. Nice one. LOL
Will be funny, if on judgement day, "God" says,
YOU FOOLS! How DARE YOU DESTROY HOMOSEXUALITY! I SPENT TWO *MONTHS* WORKING ON THAT ASPECT OF HUMANITY!
1. Force Apple remove the app
2. Fine Apple at least one billion for puting a hainous app on itune
3. Jail. the creator for the app for LIFE for CRIME AGAIN HUMANITY
4. Force Apple to remove ALL religious based app from itune
I know it's Friday, but...
...is it really the thing to start quite *this* early, old chap?
If his days is anything like mine, he's still feeling Paddies day.
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