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back to article Phorm's losses top $100m

Phorm will shift some of its operations from London to Brazil to save money after announcing another heavy loss for 2009. The web monitoring and profiling firm lost $29.7m last year, it told investors today. That's down from $49.8m in 2008, mainly thanks to layoffs at the beginning of 2009. Phorm also said it may seek more …

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Oh dear!

[Quote]The firm's circumstances "may cast significant doubt upon the group's ability to continue as a going concern"[/Q]

Oh, shame - and to think they might go under is depressing me in ways I'd never expected. I mean, I might have to go down the pub to recover. Don't 'spose anyone cares to join me?

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Pint

5 minutes

and I'll be on my way, see you there

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Happy

Mine's a Newquay Steam Bitter...

I was having such a bad day until I read this. It's not all over yet, but it's good to see Phorm clinging on to the ropes.

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Pint

Ohhhh the pain, the pain!

as Doctor Smith may have said

Couldn't be happening to a nicer company.

Mine's a Budvar or a Staropramen, please :oP

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That optin rate - employee trials do have good optin!

I understand that the very localised and small scale "deployment" in Brazil was actually amongst partner employees. So the optin rate is fairly irrelevant as a pointer to consumer reaction at a commercial scale.

As of May Phorm have just over $7m cash. Which is about three to four months worth of running costs. They are embroiled in complex legal and parliamentary proceedings in their target markets of Korea and Brazil.

Their promises of multiple simultaneous international engagement? We've heard those before - Kent Ertugrul was forever talking about being in advanced talks globally.

The only new things in this years report are the admission that their original model failed technically, the recognition that Korea is going badly, the admission of "material uncertainty" about the cash situation, the recognition that the scale of the trial in Brazil tells them little about how it will scale up, the recogition that further dilution of Phorm Inc's capital is simply unrealistic, and the complete absence of the words "tremendously exciting".

Given Ertugrul's tendency to over-egg the pudding, the 2009 results statement reads like someone filing for bankruptycy.

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Anonymous Coward

Yes

That is all

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@ Ball boy

I'll gladly join you as long as you promise not to make the mood too sombre.

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Yay!

That is all.

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Tragic

It is sad to see yet another UK firm deciding to Offshore operations. Also looks like they are getting some sort of legal hassle from UK Government, why can't the Government support UK SME rather than forcing them abroad.

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Anonymous Coward

They're most certainly not British

Phorm is an American company, registered in Delaware I believe.

And do you really want the government assisting companies break the law?

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Jobs

But the job loss will be in the UK.

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JCL

your point?

Yes, but what's your point exactly? It's going over my head.

You'll be telling me you're worried about seal clubbers next and the loss of jobs there because the EU banned seal fur imports.

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Linux

and yours?

Don't seal clubbers live in Canada? This is hardly going to affect the UK unemployment statistics. Whereas yet another story of a UK based tech firm offshoring jobs to a country with cheaper labour costs, possibly due to excessive interferance from goverment, is of a great deal more concern?

Well I would have thought so anyways.

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Anonymous Coward

You really want to talk about job losses?

Then perhaps you could consider the job losses that could be caused by the likes of Phorm tracking the products that people look at in websites and then serving up ads from that site's competitors. This sort of industrial espionage is something that this country could really do without.

You don't seem to realise that this isn't just about personal privacy. There are also sound commercial reasons to stop Phorm and it's ilk from ever gaining a foothold in the UK - or anywhere else in the world for that matter.

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Troll

Please do not...

...feed the trolls!

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Grenade

UK ID card workers work in the UK (or did)

But, you'll still get the same comments on here for that as well - i.e. shame..go get a job more valuable to the country and its citizens.

Good riddance to bad rubbish.

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FAIL

It's not rocket ...science

"why can't the Government support UK SME rather than forcing them abroad."

Because they broke the law whilst trying to foist an unwanted product on the public without their knowledge.

Personally, I run an SME that focuses on punching grannies for money. Why must the government keep giving me legal hassle when I'm trying to run a business?

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and yours?

Do you even know who/what Phorm is and what they do/did?

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Grenade

Really, and how long have you been employed by said company?

Two possibilities:

a) You've not been on the internet very long atall and are something of an oddball here in terms of experience.

b) You're posting that in defence of your scumsucking malware company.

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Anonymous Coward

Hang on a minute...

How is making sure people follow the law is 'excessive interference'?

I seriously doubt that there is more than a small handful of Phorm employees in the UK at the best of times. The development team was Russian, and worked for a company owned by an American registered in the US.

The majority of the work appears to have been done outside of the UK.

With the possible exception of the continuing help of an ex-Labour MP on the BT board and a former Tory chancellor as a non-executive director of Phorm I seriously doubt there will be more than a handful of people affected by this.

As for interference, you obviously have a short memory. Don't you recall the emails where the home office were asking BT/Phorm if they were 'comforted' by the advice they were going to give out?

They weren't trying to stop Phorm - they were bending over backwards to accomodate them, unlike Brazil, Korea and the US.

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Happy

Damn shame.

That the company hasn't folded yet. With any luck the investigations will find them guilty of various data breaches and the investors will loose all their money. With any luck the founders will be depressed enough to top themselves -- well, we can only hope...

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This post has been deleted by a moderator

Hoping the next Phorm headline

Here's hoping that the next Phorm headline we see in The Reg will be the news that they've gone titsup. Although a couple of prosecutions along the way would also be nice...

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Dont bet on it!

They could be around for years yet.

I give you SCO.

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Happy

I'm gutted!

Really gutted!

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Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaaaaa!

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaaaaa!

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaaaaa!

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaa!

That's it.

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WTF?

wtf

Seriously how dumb are these venture capitalists?

$100 million down the pan versus total billings of stuff all.

I guess the dot com bubble is back and Phorm could be the new boo.com

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Venture Capital

Thats your pension that is!

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Anonymous Coward

True, but...

Pension funds could also invest in child prostitution - there appears to be great demand and returns would be great. Not sure I would want that, or Phorm, to be keeping me in champagne and M&S ready meals in my Autumn years though.

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Pirate

MIS AD-Venture capital

So Please ask those Financial Whiz kids(twats) to NOT WASTE any more of MY money!

(Good Money after Bad!)

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Justice or Karma.

You decide.

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Have they tried China?

I'm sure they'd be popular there. Pakistan? Turkey? Iran?

Thanks for that. After watching our pub side's early return from their free South African holiday, we all needed a bit of cheering up.

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Sir

Do we have an extradition treaty with Brazil?

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Boo hoo

I'm shedding teeny tiny packet inspected tears for Phorm.

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@ NSLD

Phools and their money are easily pharted.

Sorry... parted.

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Happy

The graph that makes you feel warm inside

http://tinyurl.com/phormstocks

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Happy

Cue up the music....

Ready to play "Ding dong the witch is dead" as soon as the death rattle ends.

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No, no, no, no...

I'm reserving that song for the day Thatcher joins the great stock market flotation in the sky.

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Anonymous Coward

I was (am) going to use it for steve jobbies demise

[This section left blank intentionally.]

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Thanks!

I really needed some good news

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China?

Ah they've finally found their true home. Though whether the Communist Party will be happy about an upstart foreign rival snooping on their citizens is another matter.

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when it happens...

http://forums.theregister.co.uk/forum/1/2009/07/07/phorm_shares_again/

Excellent news, & its almost time to start holding my pee for the unavoidable certainty

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Good to hear a spyware company making a loss.

Long may it continue.

Or better still, soon may it go out of business. Companies that employ spyware (and the companies that employ the services of other companies that employ spyware) are the scum of the earth.

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Unhappy

Phorm still trading at £1.8.

They have a *lot* further to fall.

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Anonymous Coward

Well...

When they say "does not adequately reflect the nature of the global opportunity that we face"

do they mean "We'll be trying to get companies to install this in countries where they really don't care about privacy"?

If so then I expect to see it in North Korea very soon. That's if the Israelis don't force it on the Palestinians first!

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$100m - NIL

Haha.

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Pint

Hey man! How do I go about betting against this stock?

Like they big city traders do? What? I need some money for that? Oh well, crap idea anyway.

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Dead Vulture

Crap

Did they come out with that crap while having a rectal insertion with the Financial Times?

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Pint

Oh thats sooo nice to hear :-)

Nice warm feeling.

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Not sure I've been happier to see FAIL

Than this. It's possible I've been more pleased to see a company lose-however, I prefer to see success so it's unlikely.

Well chuffed that the intrusive w**kers have f'*d off due to the law being sensible in their case.

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