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back to article More iPhone 4 angst: fanbois howl over head sensor

As they complain of yellow splotches, screen scratches, and left-hander discrimination, disillusioned fanbois are also howling over problems with the not-so-holy handset's proximity sensor. "I'm having an issue with the Proximity Sensor not properly detecting when i'm holding my phone to my ear," says one user in a post to the …

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FAIL

In the style of the simpsons...

Ha Ha!

-or-

Screen $30

Processor $15

Assorted bits and pieces $ 70

Paying twice that in mark up & gullibility led profiteering...? Priceless...

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markup

Here in Europe, you can buy it without a contract for $732. A 635% markup!

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Argh

I do hate this recent trend of throwing around stripped down component prices as absolute fact.

I'm no Apple defender, but you're not factoring research and development, marketing, support staffing, actual profit (it's the reason they make them, you know) etc. etc.

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Headmaster

Some basic economics

1) those component prices are facts. Or, to be totally correct - it is fact that those are the prices of those components.

2) the cost price of an object is the cost to produce a new one. R&D, etc. are important but not when calculating the cost* though I'm not sure about the severance payments made to the relatives of terminated Foxconn employees.

So, it's stonkingly good business for Apple and all credit to them for creating such demand. And while it's an impressive profit margin it's still way off what you can charge for luxury goods. Probably just as well now that other companies are producing equivalent hardware for significantly less.

* Low-value products like cola may include advertising in cost, because without it no one would pay a premium price.

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FAIL

#Argh

>but you're not factoring research and development

Glad you didn't mention product testing. Apple don't do much R&D either for that matter, that's mostly down to the OEMs - though marketing must have one hell of a budget.

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Happy

a title

They do do testing, but as they stuck the phone inside the old case it has limited value....

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Better options exist, but no matter

iPhones are awesome devices, but really, what was Jobs thinking with his customer service email exchange? Not smart.

Anyhow, there are better products out there now than the iPhone, but they have a large and devoted installed base. Could sell those folks salt soup for $5 and they would buy if it was called iSalt

Check out this article about Jobs and the iPhone and the chain reaction that Job's statement created. Wicked funny and safe for work.

http://www.dailygoat.com/2010/06/steve-jobs-claims-iphone-works-great-rubber-band-tin-foil-metal-coat-hanger-coaxial-cable-ceos-inspired-candor/

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Re: Some basic economics

"2) the cost price of an object is the cost to produce a new one. R&D, etc. are important but not when calculating the cost* though I'm not sure about the severance payments made to the relatives of terminated Foxconn employees."

By whose definition of cost?

None that I've come across ignores set up and development costs, which are traditional amortised across each unit sold.

More importantly, the *value* is in the configuration, not the components.

Which isn't to say that the iPhone isn't an overpriced piece of consumer tat -- it is. Just it's overpriced by the value of the configuration.

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Back to school for you...

Actually, R&D and non-value added component (ie packaging, user manuals et c.) costs are factored into product costs, as are logistics for instance - warehousing and distribution are costly, unless Apple and Foxconn have secretly perfected JIT for the entire supply chain. You need to differentiate between manufacture and retail/point of sale, where profit margins are added and marketing costs are accounted for. This isn't really a question of 'economics' either, rather the manufacture process which is a different subject entirely, but that's for another day...

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FAIL

@Some basic economics

That is the cost price of the *components* only. Assembling a device is not going to be that expensive. Paying the hundreds of software and hardware engineers for a couple of years to create the device, OS and application software is *extremely* expensive. Not to mention the cost of all the equipment they have to use in the process, the premises rent, the travel costs etc.

And then there's the UI designers, testing, marketing, sales, admin staff...

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WAKE UP!!!!!

It's not a new phone!!!! it's an updated OLD phone!!!!

They started designing it back in 2004 and released it in 2007, the two and a half year development program was huge, it's been paid for over and over again by iFans and for the last three and a half years they have been "tweaking" it (what development?), the real gravy is the 3rd party developers that Apple "let" develop software for their iPhone (which Apple get get paid for!), it literally is "Money for old Rope".

It's a bit of a let down to have so many problems, but it's no worse than previous releases, the difference is it's not so much better than the competition that people ignore the "quirks" this time.

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@Wake Up

Of course they're leveraging the existing platform, and yes it probably cost less to develop than the first model (you don't know this for certain incidentally, there might have been significant costs researching avenues which were later rejected - but lets say it's a reasonable assumption).

Doesn't change the fact that adding together the price of the components and saying the rest is profit is wildly inaccurate. That doesn't even stand up for baking a loaf of bread never mind a piece of technology.

This argument has been had over and over again on The Register. I'm not sure why people are adamant that manufacturers can produce something and sell it at no cost to themselves whatsoever, it defies common sense.

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Heart

Yup. The word you're looking for is...

>> I'm not sure why people are adamant that manufacturers can produce something and sell it at no cost to themselves whatsoever, it defies common sense. <<

"FREETARD"

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Megaphone

Politics

Ahh .. That'd be socialism, socialist never have managed to understand money needs earning ! and so many people have been duped by them, they all think stuff just appears & they're entitled to the products of other people's sweat as a right.

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title

I think what it is is that people expect to be sold a product and to purchase it at a reasonable mark up. It's when markup starts getting into the rediculous hundreds of % of cost range that the insult starts happening.

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Anonymous Coward

CyberSub

"My wife and I both have the same exact problem with out phones."

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You

beat me to it.

I say: "Without phones they shouldn't have any problems at all!"

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FAIL

Atchoo whoops!

Seems like the latest Apple is actually a lemon, which is a big shame as I fancied swapping my near 2.6 year old original iPhone for one.

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Anonymous Coward

Man and I got pissed

With Nokia when my N95 would periodically only work hands free.

What sort of brand loyalty do Apple manage to instil for their customers to put up with this sort of thing.

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Gold badge

Reality distortion field

"What sort of brand loyalty do Apple manage to instil for their customers to put up with this sort of thing."

Steve Jobs' reality distortion field. He persuades people that whatever he's talking about at the moment is the greatest product ever made and you really should buy it. And regarding any bugs that turn up 1) It's not a bug, you're using it wrong. 2) "Learning to use the device properly" is worth it for the other intagibles of the device in question. 3) Again it's not a bug, but it'lll be fixed anyway, if not in this version, in the next one -- just buy one now, then buy that one when it comes out.

In all seriousness, this has no affect on me, I'm not impressed by Apple products -- but I think basically he's highly charismatic, and makes what I will call "charismatic devices".

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Reality Distortion Field hmmmmm..........

Are you a Douglas Adams (Hitch Hikers guide to the Galaxy) fan? If not get hold of a copy of the books and look up 'The Sirius Cybernetics Corporation' who basically produce devices whose superficial design flaws mask their fundamental design flaws. The theory is that after battling with a device for ages to get a minor function working you don;t have time to realise the fact that overall the device is useless...............

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Early adopters: PRE-ORDER new "Pattern Recognition" from Basic Human Capabilities Inc.!

Seriously, if I had even a US nickel for every time I've heard somebody whine about how the first-release camped-out-for-a-week-to-get-it only-three-in-the-state gizmo they've just bought doesn't work right, I'd be rich.

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re: Early adopters: PRE-ORDER new "Pattern Recognition" from Basic Human Capabilities Inc.!

I thought up-to-date Pattern Recognition was a POSIX requirement for any wetware distribution. But sometimes it may be turned off by default?

# sh /etc/rc.d/rc.pattrecd start

http://dilbert.com/fast/1995-01-22/

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Jobs Horns

Hmmmm

What? No fanboy defense? NO fanboy excuses or rationalizations? Where are the fan boys to defend their beloved Jesus phone?

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Jobs Halo

How about...

The problem is clearly that these people have faces so ugly that the sainted iPhone doesn't even recognize them as faces.

Only such people would complain about Steve's gift to us all.

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they can't get on the net!

Problem is, they can't get on the net to read these articles as each time they hold the phone it drops the signal. Clearly a clever plan by Jobs to show Fanboi's that there is no longer any negative criticism!

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Paris Hilton

Simple solution

Dont use it as a phone

Not that big of a deal

Steve

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Pint

This post

is Pure Win.

100% TRUE FACT

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a little bit too keen

"Having purchased every version of iPhone on each launch date, I have never encountered this problem"

Wow, as much as I knew about people spending hours in a queue for a phone and there being a "following", I would never have thought that someone would rush out and buy a new model of the <same phone> on each and every launch day. Seems a bit loopy to me.

NOTE: The iPhone is great. I love my 3G which I bought the year after it came out and I might go for the 4 but am also keenly looking at the Android range. (written on my Ubuntu Netbook just to show that even techies love the iPhone)

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Linux

@Hedley

>written on my Ubuntu Netbook just to show that even techies love the iPhone

FYI real techies don't use:

a: Ubuntu

b: Netbooks

c: iPhones

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re. a little bit too keen

"...Having purchased every version of iPhone on each launch date, I have never encountered this problem...."

As you said, this person has a much more serious problem they ought to be worried about.

Yours are relatively minor ones.

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Paris Hilton

Why?

Why, is there some sort of rule that I'm not aware of?

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Paris Hilton

If you're a techie...

Why are you running ubuntu on a netbook?

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Paris Hilton

Real Techies...

Real techies run the latest release of Fedora on their netbooks

/Paris, because she's always game for some thrusting technology on her laptop.

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WTF?

Real techies

are so busy being techies for their living rather than a hobby that they don't have time for the frequent disruptions of major Fedora releases for their own systems, so use Ubuntu LTS releases instead.

And why not netbooks if they work well enough. Damned useful devices. If I could afford one, I might get an android phone to replace my Palm Treo, and use that instead, but until I do, my EeePC is more portable than my Thinkpad, and runs a full Linux distro just fine.

Amateurs.

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Anonymous Coward

@Real Techies

>>frequent disruptions of major Fedora releases for their own systems, so use Ubuntu LTS releases instead.

Been working with Linux for over 10 years in enterprise enviroments, other than a brief flirtation with SuSE a few years back, its RHEL all the way. Ubuntu is an enthusiasts distro and even then just a user-friendly stepping stone to Debian.

EeePCs are aimed at folk who leave the house/office - real techies have VPN.

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Linux

No

Real techies run Debian on their netbook...

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Joke

Perhaps...

... but they still get questions about'em.

"Of COURSE you can run Office 2010 on an iPhone! Just set your microwave oven to defrost, place the iPhone in it....... and don't worry, that smell is a *feature*!"

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Silver badge

RHEL vs. Fedora

Yeah. RHEL not Fedora. And of course YOU pay for it, don't you!

Your VPN solution requires network connectivity. Try VPN'ing into a government or financial institution! I thought I would be able to work from home at least some of the time when I first went contracting, but sadly, that wasn't the case in the real world.

BTW. Been working as a UNIX deep techie for 25+ years. Linux is the new-boy, and enables me to have a UNIX-like environment with me, especially on my netbook.

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Real Techies...

"Real techies run Debian on their netbook..."

^ This.

Plus a bit of well thought bloat stripping of course.

My objection to Ubuntu on a netbook (or on ANYTHING) is the bloat.

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Anonymous Coward

Haircut

Get a haircut.

-Steve

Snit from my iPhone

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Unhappy

@TFA

"One fanboi has purchased, um, three iPhone 4s, and the problem occurs with each one."

Are you even allowed to buy three of them? How come he gets to circumvent the rules that us lesser mortals are apparently subject to?

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Anonymous Coward

You really don't want to know

But it involves an evening with his Jobsiness, a greased ferret, 3 iPhones set to vibrate and a very strong stomach.

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playmobil

Playmobil reconstruction or it never happened!

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Headmaster

playmobil

Grow up!

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Happy

mmmmmm...

... greased ferret!...

Uh! I mean EWW!

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Jobs Horns

@a little bit too keen

Your techie status is revoked when buying any Apple product as apple products are designed for the dumb masses with anything remotely technical disabled and controlled.

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Jobs Halo

Yeah..

because we all know techies CANNOT be real techies unless they are busy spending every Friday and Saturday night writing their own apps for their own phones, that only they will use, because (let's face it) they have nothing else to do on a weekend night.

- Number of "techies" screaming on this site about how locked down the iPhone is and how it hurts their sensibilities: seemingly millions

- Number of "techies" on this site that have actually produced a _working_ mobile application: a few tens or maybe low hundreds

- Laughing at the irony: Priceless...

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@ Robert Hill

...and number of "techies" that don't give a flying f... about writing their own mobile applications, but would at least like the option of deciding WHAT they will install on THEIR phone...

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WTF?

Ummm

Robert, you do know that programs can actually be distributed, right?

Just because I personally might never write an app for the iPhone doesn't mean I find it's restrictions frustrating. Someone else could potentially write software I might want to use...

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