back to article Met terror squad beats all complaints

No public complaints against the Metropolitan Police's elite counter-terrorism squad have been upheld since the unit was formed three and a half years ago, new figures reveal. Data on complaints against the Counter Terrorism Command, SO15, were released to The Register under the Freedom of Information Act. Since the beginning …

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Silver badge

The Stasi would be proud

To have another member join the "elite" group of intelligence organisation, who by definition, can do no wrong. Everyone else should be very, very afraid.

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Yup

Sounds like good ol'fashioned police work.

Is Gene Hunt head of that unit by any chance?

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Black Helicopters

We know where you live.....

And if I can't come for you then my mate over there will come.... or you may not even know we have come until we blow your brains out.

Your occupation Sir: Electrician... hmm intresting. Big coat you are wearing today Sir

Is that Black Helicopters I hear coming,,,,,,,,

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167 - nil

What a spotless track record, it makes you proud! *sniff*

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Silver badge

Simple arithmetic

They are an anti-terrorist squad.

If you are anti them, then you are anti anti-terrorism = a terrorist.

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Black Helicopters

Nothing to see here

Now move along, or we'll shoot you.

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more of the same

But not before the body cavity search and 6 months of house arrest without charge, or sight of the evidence against you.

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splendid

All this tell's me is that it's not worth making a complaint about this lot since they seem to have special imunity or their bosses turn a blind eye "as long as they get the job done"

bastards

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Joke

Aye-aye

I'd hope armed police were the last people to have a blind eye...

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Joke

Their past performance...

...might suggest that is a vain hope...

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The Untouchables

This can mean one of two things

1) They are whiter than white and cleaner than clean

2) They are legally untouchable

I'd say that the latter is most likely to be true. Theses days being anti-terror is almost like being granted immunity from prosecution.

I wonder how many of these accusations regular police could have gotten away with?

As I recall, there were very few successful prosecutions of Stalin's secret police during his time in power.

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Stalin's Secret Coppers

I'm doing this from memory so forgive rough details. Secret police were in terrible danger throughout Stalin's rule. Served them right, sort of. I'm not absolutely sure -- I can't remember Abakumov's sucessor, but I think there is a clean sweep -- every head of the NKVD/MGB from the period of Stalin's unchallenged ascendency until his death died suddenly.

Yagoda: Convicted in the first (I think) of the great trials for the murder of Kirov. He was shot. He may even have been guilty of a minor role in the murder, though it was ordered by Stalin. He had comitted many terrible crimes with Stalin's approval. Many NKVD officers fell with Yagoda.

Yezhov: Convicted in (IIRC) an administrative process for being inconvenient. He had committed many terrible crimes, but for certain Stalin never minded at the time. He was shot. Many NKVD officers fell with him.

Abakumov: Convicted in (IIRC) an administrative process for involvement in a fabricated crime. He had committed many terrible crimes, but Stalin ... He was shot. Many MGB officers fell with him.

Beria: Assassinated by fellow members of the politburo after the monster died. Many internal security personnel fell with him, but some were not executed.

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Coat

I have a complaint

Officer: What complaint? *points gun*

Shifty person: *Er, no complaint officer*

I for one welcome our gun toting overlords and already work in kahoots with them.

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Pirate

Mao TseTung Said..

This place would be a paradise tomorrow if every department had a supervisor with a submachine gun.

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Pint

Or...

...change must come through the barrel of a gun, even.

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Thumb Up

Err I think...

That particular quote is more directly from World Class Wackadoo Jim Jones.

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Coat

Good work if you can get it

You can do anything you want and, if anyone should complain, you can be your own judge and jury, find yourself innocent on all counts ( with maybe a minor wrist slap on occasions ). And you've probably got all the details of the complainant and can make their lives hell for having the audacity to complain. And if anyone complains about that; it's just another name to add to the list.

I made a mild off-the-record complaint after a police car pulled-out in front of me on a roundabout ( turning its lights and siren on having already pulled-out in my path ). I stopped but the poor sod behind rammed my car up the rear. I'm the innocent party but felt it wasn't entirely the poor sod's fault and said so. Next thing I received was a "we will not be prosecuting you for your part in the accident" letter. Damned cheek.

Mine's the one with the copy of 'The Police Can Do What They Bloody Well Like Act 2007' in the pocket.

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Anonymous Coward

Absolutely...

It's not just the anti-terrorist mob, it's the whole bloody lot - they simply do as they please these days. In my area, when it comes to trouble and criminality, they're the source as often as they're the answer.

In my small town I'm tired of seeing police (never seen anywhere in the vicinity of serious crime) arrogantly swaggering around, especially at night, deliberately provoking trouble where there isn't any. One female officer is particularly notorious for provoking drunk (but otherwise harmless) people until an inevitable but totally avoidable incident occurs. It's clear that all they care about are regular cheap pinches.

But complaining is a total waste of time - complaints are simply dismissed out of hand, and used to single out the troublemakers, as I and my wife have found to our cost.

Our police forces need sorting out as a matter of national urgency - but it's just not going to happen even after the Election - too many funny handshakes and too much petty power in the hands of small minds. Not every officer is a bad apple, but the barrel infects the contents, especially when so many of the bad apples are at the top.

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Coat

Fascist bastards

That story confirms what I suspected.

Also, wasn't the Met involved in information exchange with Scientology? Looks like they've got a lot in common.

AC for obvious reasons.

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Anonymous Coward

Yes.

Not sure what the position is since they appointed the new Commissar - sorry, Commissioner - but the Met was notoriously and disgracefully connected to Scientology for a while. They were among a select list of organisation provided with privileged security information.

It's barely a couple of years since the Met arrested someone simply for calling Scientology a cult during a demo, at a time when the force itself was apparently handing out Scientology leaflets in schools. And there was quite a storm I recall over alleged gifts and entertainment to the Met from that organisation.

All a thing of the past I trust?

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Anonymous Coward

Not much

difference from the ordinary mob then......

http://dixonof.blogspot.com/

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This post has been deleted by its author

Hee, hee, fuc*king hee

Independent Police Complaints Commission

INDEPENDENT??? Probably greet each other with the same funny handshakes as the folks they're 'investigating'.

From their homepage* "The IPCC works in partnership _with_ the police service, police authorities,...."

*http://www.ipcc.gov.uk/index/police/working_with.htm

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Anonymous Coward

Its true

If you claim its for fighting terrorism you can do almost anything.

Last week I saw a policeman walk into my local Tesco. He picked up two packets of Lemon Puffs and a Twix then just walked out the front door. When the cashier asked why he hadn't paid he simply said they were suspected of being linked to terrorism and continued walking.

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WTF?

Bustin' heads for justice!

Vic Mackey would be proud!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Shield

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Thumb Down

No results found

http://www.google.com/search?q=%22terrorists+killed+by+the+metropolitan+police%22

Not really the best method to determine this, but you get the idea.

At the moment, the Met seems to be a device for inefficiently getting rid of random , non-terrorist newspaper vendors and electricians.

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WTF?

West Midlands Serious Crime Squad

Anyone remember these muppets: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/West_Midlands_Serious_Crime_Squad

Remind you of anything?

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Gold badge
Coat

AC@15:58

You mean the group that though they were meant to *cause* Serious Crime, rather than investigate it?

The core investigators for the Birmingham 6 pub bombing?

I don't know what you're talking about. British police are the best in the world...very hard job under difficult circumstances.... one bad apple...

Mine's the one with a copy of The Job in one pocket and the local Lodge newsletter in the other.

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Silver badge
Black Helicopters

Of course they're innocent

1,500 coppers and every single one is as pure as the driven snow.

In further news the pope is a muslim and bears all use WCs

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Right...

In other news, the fox says there are absolutely no chickens missing from the henhouse. Any that have left have done so for their own reasons, and a few unfortunate accidents were only to be expected in the current security climate.

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Something like...

...this?

http://yle.fi/uutiset/news/2010/04/shock_not_fox_killed_majority_of_flamingos_at_korkeasaari_zoo_1623089.html*

Yeah, OK. After all, Finland's the home of Santa Claus, and the Met has the tooth fairy on the payroll.

*My G/F is an 'old bird'. Remind me not to give 'er a 'fox' on a Friday Night. I'll have a bit o' "meditation" in my shed, instead (Christ, I'm a poet, and didn't know it...).

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Unhappy

Beats all complaints ...

Beats all complaints, beats all complainants, beats all foreign nationals, beats photographers, innocent bystanders, Brazilian nationals ...

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Oz
WTF?

Met terror squad beats all complaints

I smell bullshit, and plenty of it. It's obviously not worth complaining about the Terror Squad as 1) they'll cover it up and 2) they'll bust your ass over some made up offense.

Makes you proud to be British!

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Anonymous Coward

I made the mistake of complaining

It really isnt worth the effort even when you have the evidence you would be amazed how much stuff can get "lost" when it has to be handed over to the police standards unit for the investigation.

As for the IPCC, they only get involved when the plod kill someone or do something major otherwise its left to the local PSD to try and work it out and the level of co operation they receive from the people they investigate is appalling.

The police are like a mafia only with lower ethical standards than the Sicilian original.

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Bronze badge
Thumb Up

Blair Peach?

"Data on complaints against the Counter Terrorism Command, SO15, were released to The Register under the Freedom of Information Act."

Was this connected in any way with the 'Investigation into the death of Blair Peach' that was published a couple of days ago?

http://www.met.police.uk/foi/units/blair_peach.htm

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Anonymous Coward

Ah yes the Met...

Do ,you REALLY think that ANY coimplaint against the Police is seriously investigated ?. If you do then you are in cloud cuckoo land I tell you. The ONLY way to make them take a complaint seriously is issue CRIMINAL proceedings yourself in Magistrates Court (easy to do as the

Magistrates Court will draw up the information and serve it) and name the individual Officer/s

personally NOT the Police Force. The key to success is naming the Officer personally. They hate that !!.

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Spotless record?

Well - how very strange! (Cynic mode engaged). A spotless record in all respects, eh? And I'm the Queen. Off with their heads!

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Altogether now..........

"happiness is a warm gun...bang bang...shoot shoot"

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Linux

Damned stats

It would be interesting to know how many of the 167 complaints resulted in successful civil action (settled in or out of court). A judge and jury examining a complaint might have a very different opinion to a fellow officer who is sure in 100% of cases that his colleagues are purer than pure.

Interestingly, only half of the complaints were rejected. The other half were mainly "informally" or "locally" resolved. This happens when a formal complaint is made and the police offer to fast-track the investigation process if both sides agree up-front. The result - whether it goes in favour of the complainant or not - is not revealed and it's kept off the official stats. It would also be interesting to know if these 80 or so complaints were also 100% rejected, or whether the police are using this process to cover up misconduct.

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Silver badge
Stop

You're under arrest...

...put down that complaint form Laddie !

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Black Helicopters

Maybe it is all legit

Probably the first thing an aggrieved suspect (which probably makes up most of the people these guys go after) does is make a complaint - "help help i'm being oppressed/beaten/setup by fascists/racists" etc. And doubtless they all have to be recorded these days regardless of how unfounded they might be. So maybe it is all legit.

It should be noted that i am writing this of my own free will, and am not being coerced in anyway at all. (sorry, how do you spell that? c-o-e-r-c-e-d? OK got it)

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WTF?

Has it occurred to any of you blubbering lefties

having not seen the charges filed, that this might actualy might be all above-board?

If roughly half have been handled in-house, as it were, that's a tacit acknowledgement of wrongdoing in 50% of cases. What more do you want? A self-flagellating security service, afraid of its own shadow? Or replace them altogether with bearded hippies brining peace nad harmony through yogic flying?

These are armed, trained men, sent only into the most difficult situations. Sometimes, sh... things happen. Get over it, and stop pouring the whine.

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Boffin

Yes, right, but...

you are right, bad things happen sometimes, police officers make mistakes in difficult situations, and someone has to bear the consequences.

That is not the problem. The problem here is that, statistically, police are sometimes at fault and need to be held responsible for their actions. There should be an investigation, and in case of police wrongdoing, an appropriate punishment meted out, perhaps a note in the officer's file or something.

1500 officers, 167 complaints over 3 years, and no actions is not a statistical anomaly, it means that either the investigation is not thorough or (more likely) the policeman is let off with a slap on the wrist and no record of the problem. In other words, there is no disincentive for the officer to not repeat his/her actions the next time. The complaints are, for all practical purposes, ignored... There is no real restraint on police action. For 95% of policemen, this is not a problem, they are honest and good people. But for the 5% who should not be policemen, they are not caught and remain on the force to the detriment of society.

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Wow. Zero 'failure' rate. 'Mazing.

Ian Tomlinson, anyone? The infamous "There were no cameras in the area" 'mistake'? Copper who 'allegedly' (means he did it, bit like Plod saying 'helping police with enquiries' means you're just a witness - riiiight...) hit and pushed Tomlinson to his death shouldn't even have been in the Met.*

Even in the case of De Menezies, conveniently "a workman broke a CCTV camera cable".

I look forward to this.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2009/jul/05/query-g20-assault-case-officer

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Stop

Stop Press

Police investigate police, find no wrongdoing.

Colour me suprised, but I think they've all been watching one too many episodes of '24' and think they can do anything they like now.

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IT Angle

Benefit of the doubt?

Perhaps we should give them the benefit of the doubt - many of those cases could have been marked as "not upheld" where informally the officers in question have offered unconditional apologies to the "vitcims", which is often all they are looking for - but this then goes as an "invalid complaint" in the statistics.

With all that being said, if these guys are anything like the uniformed muppets we see on the likes of "Road Wars" etc etc then I feel sorry for anyone who has to ever deal with them. You know, the one where the guy is asking the copper to "stop hurting him" and the copper is bashing his head off the car door whilst repeating loudly "I'm not hurting you" :)

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This post has been deleted by its author

Big Brother

Police not subject to the law

and proud of it !

I have attended several talks about the work of the SFO. One that stick in my mind was showing a video of a raid where the guy busted down the door after shouting police. Basically his colleagues were taking the piss because they never shouted police....although it was a legal requirement of the search warrent. The Office defended himself from the piss taking by saying that he was being videoed so felt he had to follow the legal requirements this time.

There were chuckles in the audience, but it just left me wondering how many times they had lied in court ("of course we identified ourselves before entering Your Honour. We ALWAYS do!"), but more scary, what else they think they could get away with.

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