back to article Apple said to have axed Atom support from OS X 10.6.2

Apple has axed support for Intel's Atom processor from the as-yet-unreleased Mac OS X 10.6.2, it has been claimed. If true, the move will hinder anyone keen to create a micro Mac laptop from any of the many netbooks on sale today. The claim comes from a blogger called Stell who posts on matters pertinent to the hackintosh …

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Gold badge

Hackintos*ers

Who is saying these guys buy OSX?

If they're breaking the licence agreement by messing about with it then why would they go to the trouble of buying it?

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Jobs Halo

Like I said

This is because Apple are about to launch a NetBook not a tablet.

I've told you this before.

They have specifically targetted non-apple branded machines with Atom processors. Think about it.

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Stop

@Giles Jones

Because that licence agreement is on questonable legal ground.

Anyway, if Apple sold the software for use on any computer there wouldn't be a restriction in the licence, so your point would go the way of the Newton....

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Atom != Core2

Is Atom 64 bit or 32 bit only? I certainly believe it lacks all the virtualisation extensions, and it doesn't support ECC memory (limits its value server side). So maybe, just maybe, there are legit reasons for removing atom support.

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We are good customers.

I have a netbook with OS-X installed on it, dual boot with Windows XP. I use OS-X on the netbook mostly, but if OS-X stopped working, I would just go back to using Windows.

I also have two genuine Macintoshes running OS-X on hardware that I have paid Apple for, and I also own various other Apple products. Yes, the OS-X on the netbook thing is not legal, but it is mainly just a hobby - I enjoy playing around on it. I can't really imagine why Apple would want to annoy me and people like me. They make plenty of money off us.

I can certainly understand why they would want to kill of the Psystar thing, just the same.

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Stop

64bit support?

Could this be more to do with certain chipsets - such as the base level N270 - not supporting EMT64bit fully? I was of the understanding that OS X was dropping 32bit legacy code in favour of being pure 64bit.

I'll happily be proved wrong on either front though - but I know the N270 doesn't support full 64bit [if at all] as I tried to throw WIn7 64 bit on this Aspire One last night and only had a 64bit image to hand, and it spat it out and told me not to bother.

Quick google gave told me about the Atom 64bit stuff:

http://www.sevenforums.com/general-discussion/1591-64bit-intel-atom.html

But as I say, I'm a bit flakier on the OS X bits.

Steven R

Stop - because that's what I did when I did that last night, before USB-installing Ubuntu 9.10/EXT4 on this thing, and it's probably the best Ubuntu I've used so far. Even the legendarily useless JMicron SSD isn't as bad as it was...

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Jobs Halo

Apple is going ARM

We already know that Apple's upcoming 'Slab' tablet device, which is basically an e-book reader and media-playing tablet, will run the iPhone OS. Therefore, we can deduce it will have an ARM processor, so it won't be x86 at all.

It makes sense. ARM will give it better battery life. iPhone OS will allow it to be a multi-touch screen interface. It could only run iPhone apps instead of Mac OSX apps, but that probably doesn't matter for an e-book reader anyway.

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copy

I seriously doubt these people have bought a copy of OSX.

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Brand damage

"Indeed, it's surely better for Apple to sell a copy of Mac OS X than have one of these guys run Linux or Windows on a machine Apple's going to make no money out of one way or the other"

Not necessarily. If any Tom Dick and Harry can run OSX without the conspicuous consumption of paying for an Apple machine, it's not going to be good for the brand.

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Boffin

@Giles Jones

Hrm, maybe because breaking an EULA is a civic duty on behalf of all consumers, but using software that isn't free, but that you haven't paid for is likely unlawful?

Both my current hackintoshes run fully paid-up copies of Leopard. The OS isn't actually half bad, but pretending to make it and the computer it runs on a single, proprietary product is dishonest.

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FAIL

were you asleep for the last time Apple allowed 3rd party h/w?

"Indeed, it's surely better for Apple to sell a copy of Mac OS X than have one of these guys run Linux or Windows on a machine Apple's going to make no money out of one way or the other."

Not if you're so obsessed with stability that you want to be gatekeeper of primary hardware. The guys who would hack their way to an OSX on non-Apple are the same ones who will bitch on the interwebs if there are any crashes.

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Virtualization?

Maybe it's something to do with virtualization. Current Atom processors do not support VT-x as far as I am aware.

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Jobs Halo

@Giles Jones

I purchased my copy of Snow Leopard -- a family pack for my three real Macs and two hackintoshes.

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Grenade

HackinKosher

I have a netbook running OSX (Leopard 10.5.8), with a retail OSX disk I purchased from my local Apple store. I have the receipt, and I've only installed it on the one machine.

"Why not by an Apple?" folks will cry..

They don't sell what I need is my response. I have a sub-notebook WITH FIREWIRE (Via EXPRESS SLOT). With Apple merrilly eliminating firewire from anything that isn't the size of the Bismark, along with eliminating Express slots and interchangable batteries there isn't a product they make that is useful to me.

Actually they haven't made any hardware that meets my needs for some time, although I've bought a fair pile of BRAND NEW gear from the over the years

Desktops

Performa 400

PowerMac 6100/60

PowerMac 7100/80 (with Dos Board!!!)

PowerMac 8100/100

PowerMac 8600/200

PowerMac 9600/300

PowerMac 9600/200DP

PowerMac G3 233 Tower

PowerMac G3 300 Blue

PowerMac G4 350 Graphite

PowerMac G4 400 Graphite

PowerMac G4 667 Graphite

PowerMac G4 733 QuickSilver

PowerMac G4 1GHz Dual QuickSilver

PowerMac G4 1.25GHz Dual Mirror Door

Laptops

PowerBook 160

PowerBook 540C

PowerBook 5300cs/100

PowerBook 3400c/240

PowerBook G3 250

PowerBook G4 400

PowerBook G4 867

Other

Newton (Now referred to as Original)

Newton 110

Newton 120

Newton 130

Newton 2000

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And this means....

....what exactly?

Forgive my ignorance, but, if I'm not part of the hackintosh community, why do I care?

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I'll do it

>> "So far there has been no third-party corroboration the claim."

OK, I'll corroborate it.

No, I have no proof, I'm also making it up. But what's the difference, it's all news, right?

-dZ.

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Pint

Or maybe...

...they aren't going to continue to explore the atom as a platform and have taken their developers off coding support for the atom and have removed it from the next build to stop junk piling up in the system.

I'm sure that you can go download the darwin source and preserve the atom support and compare it with the next version if you worried.

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@ Giles Jones

Yeah and every one who boot camps windows doesn't just visit p2p first. But of course it's case do as i say not as i do. grow up

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Linux

Hmm.. this is interesting.

Most netbooks are not AMD64 (let's call it by its rightful name, intel did NOT invent this) compatible but I believe some of the 5xx ones are. Going 64 bit itself would make most atom netbooks incompatible. I doubt a such small version number change would mean a full switch to a 64 bit kernel.

BUT, they could effectively hobble all non-64 bit compatible machines by not providing any 32 bit userland essentials, with the next release. This will of course, be problematic for people with older Apple hardware.

Well, what do you reckon lads? They gonna check for atoms?

If they do I will only have more contempt for Apple. I own 2 macs, so I can tell you if anything I've paid for the right to call them evil bastards.

I don't nor do I recommend OSX for a netbook but nevertheless I understand some people want this, and I do not see any moral problem with people doing this. Apple so far have provided for this even kind of in an acquiescing manner with the 'apple label' clause.

If Apple do this, I can only say to those afflicted, seriously, you have the motivation enough to install OS X on 'non-standard' hardware, take a look at a linux. You obviously don't want windoze. Try linux.

You may have to do a bit more tinkering, but when you have it done, I can only tell you, IT'S SWEET. There is very little you really can't do and if you run into a brickwall, chances are someone else out there has already been there and done that and come up with a workaround. You'll learn a lot too.

Try it.

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Anonymous Coward

@Slappy Frogg

>Forgive my ignorance, but, if I'm not part of the hackintosh community, why do I care?

Forgive my ignorance, but, if I'm not you, why do I care whether you care?

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WTF?

Rubbish!

BS! Lots of people have already started to upgrade to 10.6.2 alread on Atom chips and they are working fine!

Only two points Apple don't like, a) the EULA says you can't and b) more importantly to Apple, it tarnishes the cultivated image Apple has built for themselves when their shiny O/S is seen by average Joe, running on a £150 netbook!

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Removing Atom support

Affects only a small subsection of the Hackintosh community and they are already a small subsection of PC/Mac (must I really make that distinction since Macs are simply PCs now) users. From reading the hackintosh forums I got the impression that most of them liked to use the legal copies for compatibility with updates and the challenge. And quite a few of them also had Macs anyway.

If the move is deliberate then its very petty, more likely its due to the Atom not being officially part of the Mac lineup in the first place and compatibility was an accident.

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Anonymous Coward

@Giles Jones, @Mark Dowling

The netbook hackintosh community is a bit different from the wider hackintosh community. One key thing is that it is based on installing from a genuine OSX install disc. It doesn't rely on installing from hacked, p2p versions of OSX, but instead simulates the EFI environment so that it can be installed from standard OSX install discs. This is somwehat pragmatic (since it makes updates and maintenance easier) but is also a moral choice by the main developers. The installation guides emphasise this, as do discussions in the forums.

As for whinging when something doesn't work, that doesn't happen. Everyone recognises that this is an installation which can causes problems (although surprisingly few). And any discussions around problems take place in that context.

Many of the people using netbook hackintoshes actually own other macs too (I own three myself) but like the netbook for various reasons. Personally, I like the form factor and that's why I use one. Apple aren't losing a sale from me, because they don't make the machine that I'm after (i.e. an Apple netbook). In fact, they are gaining a sale of OSX from me (well, two actually ... first Leopard, then Snow Leopard).

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Jobs Halo

Or maybe ...

Or maybe it's just about generating publicity. Rumours are good for doing that.

Apple fanbois will buy Apple, the rest of us ( Linux and Windows fanbois ) will simply wonder why anyone wants to run OSX at all. So while the minority of poverty-struck OSX fanbois who cannot afford Apple hardware bitch, everyone else looks-on bemused, Apple get a heap of free publicity.

Hackintosh fanbois need to wake up and realise Apple has no love for them, the rest of us don't really care. Apple has little love for anyone but Apple fanbois.

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Troll

@windywoo

Correction Apples have always been PCs (personal computers) as opposed to mini comps, main frames etc it's just most people don't actually know any real computing history anymore. Hackers do not attack comuter systems they are crackers and the ones who used to attack phone systems phreakers. Pendant over.

Personally I couldn't give a flying as I use GNU/Linux and FreeBSD

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Jobs Halo

Hackintosh leads to salvation...

I've been a Microsoft guy since the days of MS DOS to Win 3.1 and I stopped at XP cos Vista was so pathetic. I found the early Linux OS too awkward to use as a family PC, so I started investigating the OSX. Now, I don't have the kind of money to burn to invest in a Mac, and then find out that its too complicated to use for the whole family and that all the things I had in XP don't work. SO I install 10.5.7 on my PC to trial it, after a few weeks, I find its fairly stable, a few problems with some software, so I still dual boot into XP sometimes to do stuff, until after a few months, I find that I can now use OSX and have found solutions for all my problems. Now I have the equivalent of a MacPro (Q6600 Quadcore Processor, 4Gb RAM, ATI HD4850), but at the cost of less than a Mac Mini.

So my dilema now is, do I go for salvation and jump in to buy what I can currently afford, which would be a Mac Mini, or do I continue on living a life of sin with my Hackintosh which is as powerful as a MacPro?

Either way, I know eventually I will go for a real Mac, now that I've had a chance to play around with it in my own time. If Apple actively try and stop Hackintoshs, they will be losing out on others who will try similar methods in the future. You will always get those evil people who want everything for free, but they wouldn't have paid for it in the first place, so Apple wouldn't be losing out anyway.

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FAIL

@BeefstirFry

"Now I have the equivalent of a MacPro (Q6600 Quadcore Processor, 4Gb RAM, ATI HD4850), but at the cost of less than a Mac Mini."

I guess you have never looked inside a Mac.

Nope the MacPro costs that kind of money because it users server quad Xeons and ECC parity RAM all more expensive than your toy computer. I guess you have never looked inside a Mac.

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Jobs Horns

BeefStirFry has a point

Consider this:

If you wanted to buy a desktop, you'd want it to be reasonably cheap, and reasonably capable, and reasonably expandable. (I'm thinking a core2 duo/quad/i5 box not a frickin' xeon).

With Apple, what do you have?

Mac Pro... or ...

Shitty iMacs... WTF ... I never could understand this... All the _DISADVANTAGES_ of a _LAPTOP_ and _DESKTOP_ combined into one 'sexy' package. Puh-leeez......

Mac Mini? Cute, yes. Cheaper, very portable, like a brick, can chuck it in a corner and use it as server. Ultimately slightly better than an imac, but still... not what I would consider a desktop.

Why do Apple have such a gap in their product line?

@BeefStirFry - if you are really looking at salving your conscience, just buy an OS X install. I believe you can find Apple stickers, stick it on your computer and there you are, heh. If you already are running a 'real' OSX I think you're feeling guilty for nothing :P

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