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back to article Lloyds TSB's online banking system shows no love for Firefox

Many Lloyds TSB business customers who use Firefox as their default browser are currently unable to access their online banking accounts. Several readers have contacted The Register telling us that the service is throwing up an error message when they attempt to logon to the site via the world's second most popular browser. …

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Dont bank online until Lloyds gets a clue about security

http://www.securecomputing.net.au/News/157767,nsw-police-dont-use-windows-for-internet-banking.aspx

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/securityfix/2009/10/e-banking_on_a_locked_down_non.html?wpisrc=newsletter&wpisrc=newsletter&wpisrc=newsletter

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I just tried www.netscape.com

And I can't find anywhere to download Netscape Navigator...

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Happy

Works for me

OK, just read this and cant see what the issue is. I use firefox on my works windows PC and I use firefox on my linux laptop and have never had a issue. At work I use 3.5.2 and at home I use 3.0.

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Happy

LloydsTSB supports Opera, Chrome and Safari though...

I use those regularly and there's no problem.

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Linux

Mozilla ? How many people use that this decade

Seems like they are stuck in the dark ages. Par for the course for these muppetts. Took me 4 months to get a new PIN from them. Gave up in the end and moved to a bank that does support Firefox.

AND given the advice that has been floating around this week about NOT using Windows for Internet Banking, I wonder how much of that £5B that HMG is giving this mob will end up in Nigeria?

Tux because you know deep down it makes sense (At least for Internet Banking...)

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Happy

Opera

No problems with Opera 10.

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Happy

Fsck that

You forgot their press release:

"This bank supports the use of insecure browsers only. In the case of identity theft, fraud or other malicious act.... it's your fault, not matter what the circumstances. k thx"

Banks are funny :D

If mine did this then I would complain, complain again and then move bank to somewhere with a brain.

How the hell this got this far is beyond me but suggests the IT illiterate CIO/IT director is more than retarded and down right dangerous. Like most then.

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FAIL

Aaaand the Netscape website...

... Encourages you to download Firefox!

http://browser.netscape.com/

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FAIL

Helpdesks -- why?

Since Lloyds TSB have supported Firefox for *ages*, it is inconceivable that they've taken a Top Level decision to withdraw support. The helpdesk must simply have taken your correspondent to be a complete idiot who could be fobbed off with a load of bollocks whilst they (the helpdesk) went away to find out what had really happened.

Gee, thanks. For the record, Mr Helpdesk, my opinion of you is even lower.

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It's working fine for me

with Safari (on my Mac).

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Security?

Why would anyone use IE for secure applications? I think Lloyds TSB needs to have a thorough examination of what it recommends. I suspect their IT department is a bit out of date with what browsers are current, plus the fact that Firefox out to be capable of anything that Netscape is/was.

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Anonymous Coward

No problems here...

Running 3.5.3 on centos and it works fine..

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Not shocked

Given what I know from the inside of the HBOS and lloyds take over. The infrastructure for Loyds is ten years old.

Modern DB's and server networks using the latest protocols are being binned in favour of Windows NT and windows 2000 because that is what Lloyds have. As Lloyds bought the HBOS major share, they go forward with what they want.

However it is all sourced to IBM anyway and HBOS had in house developers, it will all be done under IBM's rules and they don't like "change"

I pity anyone who is a customer of either bank, it will all change for the worse.

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Linux

Not just firefox.

It also dilikes my browser of Choice - Opera.

And woe betide you if you use a decent operating system.

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It can work ...

... if you go into private browsing mode.

It still works on 2 of my pcs - xp home & pro with FF 3.0.14 - without going into private mode.

However on my other 2 pcs - xp pro with FF 3.5.3 and Vista 64 Ultimate with FF 3.0.14 - it only works in private mode now.

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FAIL

lloyds.com/any stupid people

I checked as you suggested using FF and Konq and noticed that the file extensions are .asp, meaning of course that they are using Microsoft. It does not bode well for their system security.

I also wonder how they take the recent recommendations from both sides of the Big pond that on-line banking should be done with non-installed OS's, as the live CD's that I have seen do not include either Exploder or Netscrape.

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No problem

It worked fine for me. Logged in fine just before I saw your piece. Checked again just now and it's still okay?

FF portable, 3.5, user agent switcher off.

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Paris Hilton

Oh the delights of Windoze...

...I've just checked mine using Firefox on Ubuntu with no issues whatsoever. Paris cos their policies on compatibility are clearly lucid and well thought out...

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Flame

Pretty standard fare, really

Banks - they're all bollocks, especially Lloyds Banking Group who recently notified me they'd be moving my account to a simpler one (with no credit interest and massively higher overdraft charges). Simpler, sure, and also very profitable no doubt. But it will also mean a current account move for the first time in my working life. Still, if this is an indication of their idea of support, I'll be happy to leave.

Usual crap, I guess - it's hard to make a site work properly in IE, so they just bin everyone else and focus on the IE crowd. Idiots.

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WTF?

Works fine for me

I use Firefox on Linux and OS X to access Lloyds online banking and have done for years, and I've never had issues. I logged on only this morning without problems. I do have NoScript blocking clickshift, which is mentioned as a possible issue in the forum you linked to, but I wonder how many people are actually affected by this?

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Eh?

People still bank with Lloyds TSB?

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LloydsTSB problem

It's not just business accounts - it's personal ones too. I can't get in via Firefox 2.0.0.20 (XP) but can from Firefox 3.0.10 (XP). So they've cut off older Firefox browsers. Which makes the netscape bit even more baffling. I have not yet been able to test Firefox (Ubuntu) but I will be doing...

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Anonymous Coward

Your Life

"Your life" followed by a big red cross. Like it.

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Personal users

works fine on personal users...maybe ill steal the phrase from the iPhone for FireFox users.

"Cant get on Lloyds TSB business with Firefox? Theres an addon for that!".

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Unhappy

@ AC 10:24

I did many years at Lloyds and they were ahead of the curve when they developed the .COM site, but they were crippled when they merged with TSB and couldn't continue updating their systems. Core Lloyds infrastructure dates from the eighties and the TSB stuff is older and cr@ppier! They should take the chance afforded them by the new merger to chuck the lot out and start again.... but they won't. Too many people have their power bases tied up in the status quo. Rant.. etc...

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Happy

Dont use ie/for linux users:

http://browser.netscape.com/releases

stop complaining and install that now!

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works fine here

verion 3.5.3

windows 7 trial

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WTF?

Not as bad as Abbey

I've just tried it with FF 3.0.14 on XP SP2 and it's fine.

Has anyone seen Abbey/Santander's efforts at online security? Their single logon page asks for your Personal ID, passcode and registration number all on one page with no challenge/response - if you've got a keylooger you're fscked. Not to mention that it keeps saying I'm using an unsupported browser when I use IE8 (I know, I know...)

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WTF?

Well...

No problems for me :)

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FAIL

the other end of the scale...

My bank, FirstDirect support every browser I use, and they also ensured the UI was compatible with the iPhone within only weeks of the release of the jesusphone.

Why other banks can't do this, I'll never understand

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FAIL

you could see it coming

LLoyds are trying to integrate all the HBOS systems at the moment. They've taken the decision to more or less ditch the more modern HBOS systems and integrate all their functions into the ancient Lloyds systems, with inevitable comedy results.

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N2
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I dont belieeeve it

Lloyds TSB using ASP for online banking, the silly bankers! (with a silent W)

Im off elsewhere

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works here

ff v3.0.14 on ubuntu

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WTF?

@ AC 10:47

WTF are you talking about? TSB always had the most modern systems of all the banks e.g. circa 1990 they could actually credit an intra-bank transfer immediately, unlike any of the big four, including Lloyds.

ObWorksForMe: Chrome, Windows Vista x64, no problems, same as always. Perhaps a minor not-really-worthy-of-a-news-item snafu on parsing the user agent string?

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Black Helicopters

Lloyds Must Use The Same Programmer as HSBC!

I try to bank with HSBC and it's not-so-secure web site which includes a secure messaging system.

Because their software crew screwed up, people can only use the most basic characters otherwise, when you try to send your message, it complains you have used illegal characters.

One message I received said that when I use a < or a > character it can mess with their Java scripts. Even the more basic, free, messaging system can send the whole keyboard set - but I guess HSBC and Lloyds try to to things the hard way.

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Unhappy

Lloyds-TSB was working

with Firefox 3.0.14 until a few days ago.

Now I get the reported error message. What the hell have L-TSB done to screw up the system?

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FAIL

Teasted a few..

Firefox 3.5.3 on Vista 64 - works

Firefox 3.0.14 on Ubuntu - works

Firefox 3.5.3 on RedHat (work desktop) - sticks in a loop at login, used to work

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WTF?

Not the only one.

I've seen similar support claims elsewhere: shockingly old versions of Internet Explorer and Netscape Navigator as the alternative.

Since neither are currently available, I wonder if their liability exclusion would hold up in court. But they have more money to pay lawyers,

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TSB

Weren't they the bank that liked to say YES ?

Now they merged with Lloyds it seems they like to say "We really couldn't give a fuck", and that's from personal experience in dealing with those pillocks.

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WTF?

@Fifi

In terms of customer service, there is a reason that many organisations say that they want to "be the First Direct" of whatever area they operate in - I've heard that they are really quite good.

By the way, it's quite easy to change banks these days - usually one phone call and it's done (so i hear). In fact, probably easier than installing and living with MSIE... Yet people hardly ever change banks.

Banks are a business providing a service. If you don't like the service, move your business.

Funny old world.

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meh

Just means they've not updated that particular error message in the last 5 years - no-one had seen it before since they'd not screwed up whatever it was they they screwed up to trigger it in the first place.

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Flame

Banks of the Britards

Suspend that surprise for a moment, Britards! Even though your political masters own large chunks of these banks on your behalf, their chums will never be brought to account when it comes to ripping you off with their supposedly necessary charges and general extortion. And heaven forbid that the government's chums at Microsoft be disadvantaged in any way by having publicly-owned entities support actual open standards.

While the rest of Europe gets to send money around at minimal cost, it's all "have to send that account transfer request to London for manual entry in a ledger by someone old enough to have known Jesus personally (or perhaps a first-generation COBOL programmer of similar vintage), and that will be £25 for the trouble" from the banks of the Britards.

Now meet the new Minister for Banking and Finance: the Sheriff of Nottingham!

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Trust Lloyds?

About as far as I could chuck the Stock Exchange building.

Unsolicited phone calls, ignoring requests to stop and advice that the person they were trying to contact didn't live there any more.

Promises - repeated oh, so many times and in writing too - which were broken.

Calls not returned

money disappearing

Letters sent to addresses advised long ago as no longer current.

And that was just my son.

I did have a Lloyds credit card but after benefit of contact with them I decided it simply wasn't worth the risk.

Even then the bank wouldn't accept a signed written instruction to close the card account, because it "wasn't secure" - I did ask how a cheque (you know, signed written instruction) worked if I sent it through the post, but I never did get an answer.

Fsckwits

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Works sometimes

It works with some of the machines I use and not others.

Desktop at home, FF3.5.2, Win2K, only works in Private mode, worked fine until about 10 days ago.

Laptop at home, FF3.5.2, Win 2K, works fine all the time.

Desktop at work, FF3.0.14, Win 2K, works fine all the time

Other desktop at work, FF 3.5.3, XP SP2, only works in private mode.

To Shane 8, this is a personal account I am trying to access, not a company one. We use Natwest Bankline for our work banking and that works on all 4 of my machines, at home and work.

All the machines have the same add-ins, NoScript, ABP, FlashBlock, ShowIP and DownThemAll

I had the "we only support Internet Explorer" from their help desk as well

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Troll

@ AC 11:13

TSB did have a psuedo realtime update facility as a result of their requirement to cobble together the 14 ancient pre-relational Unisys systems that their core accounting system was based on. This was given as the reason they would not migrate to the mid nineties rewrite of the core Lloyds accounting system. Both banks are running on their old duct taped 70's and 80' systems becase of the decision to can the rewrite (after p1ssing away £55m on it!) The system is bad but the TSB bit is the worst of it!!

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Heart

HAHAHA! Do u expect Lloyds and secure to be in same sentence?

HAHAHA! Well no surprise from Lloyds there! Just another example of why I hate them :-) Use an insecure browser, or a date one, or the most installed. Do not use anything rthat might be new, upcoming, securER, 2nd most popular etc etc.

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Linux

Firefox will work with IE Tab

The IE Tab addon will open the website and allow you to browse with Firefox. I know of four banking/business sites here is the USA that are only accesable with IE Tab since Internet Explorer 8 is a no go for those sites.

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FAIL

Doesn't bode well for HBOS...

If Lloyds decide to move HBOS infrastructure to their systems and thereby breaking compatibility, then I'm off.

I thought this kind of thing stopped a long time ago.

Does User Agent Switcher fix things?

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Interesting

I bank with both Lloyds and Bank of Scotland...

There are a few people above commenting that thr LTSB site is using ASP and that the Decent HBOS systems are being dumped in favour of the ancient LTSB ones... I dont think (from looking at the site) that this is correct.

HBOS Internet banking has always been .asp files, LTSB has always been .ibc files.

HBOS dont allow you to have special chars in your password, LTSB do.

So if the article is correct (which by the way I cant confirm as it works for me on My PC using FF, IE and on my iPhone) then what is actually happening is the LTSB stuff is being shunted over to use the HBOS system.

Of course this is based entirly on me using both banking sites over the last few years, I dont know what is actualy happening within IT at either of these banks.

It is odd though that it seems to work for the majority of people... Please tell me its not people running Betas of firefox that are complaining?

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@David Cotterill

> decent operating system.

Works fine on WIndows 7 for me.

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