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back to article Texas cop tasers gobby granny

A gobby 72-year-old Texas great-grandmother who got a bit physically "non-compliant" after being pulled for speeding copped a light tasering for her trouble, ABC reports. Dashcam vid shows Bieze tasering Winkfein Officer Chris Bieze collared Kathryn Winkfein en route to Austin doing 60mph in a 45mph zone. The Travis County " …

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What a cowardly bully

It's not clear from the picture, but it is quite apparent in the video that the cop is a good 12-18 inch's taller and a lot rounder then the little old lady he is abusing.

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Black Helicopters

Quelle surprise!

There's certainly footage been cut from that vid.

Have Texan plod been trained by the Met, perchance?

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fair nough

should be respectfull to the police

gobbing off at one wont get you anywhere ....

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Coat

I'm not normally one to side with the coppers...

But seems pretty clear here:

"Stand back or I will tase you"

"Go ahead, tase me!"

"OK"

Bzzzz

Move along, nothing to see here....

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Anonymous Coward

The signature

http://stillanightowl.wordpress.com/2008/11/25/some-traffic-ticket-myths/

A quick search suggest this:

"Signing a ticket is not an admission of guilt. The signature is merely an acknowledgment you received the ticket and a promise to appear in court. Refusing to sign the ticket — and there are drivers who think that if they don’t sign, they can lie in court and say they weren’t there — will do nothing but agitate the officer and invite more scrutiny. In some states, such as Texas, refusal to sign a ticket can mean a trip to jail. Houston attorney Robert Eutsler says that if you don’t sign the ticket, the officer has the choice to either take you to jail or write on the ticket “refused to sign.” “It’s a promise to appear in court on a certain day — that’s all it is,” says Eutsler. “It’s certainly a myth that if you don’t sign it, it’s going to get dismissed. You’re more likely to get arrested, and the officer is going to get very upset.”"

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Happy

not just our coppers then..

good to see it's not just wacqui jacky's storm troopers that know how to beat up on defenceless citizens

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Coat

Tase/Taser=Lase/Laser

Given that Taser is a proper noun (like Roger or Derek) and not a device that "tases", then there is no correct verb as such, but given the history of Laser usage (an acronym), then tase would be justifiable, as this has been the case with lasers for many years. a Laser lases you as a taser now tases you. I presume in star trek world, one would be phased in a similar manner.

Given the proper noun though, maybe you could indeed be "roged" by some new weapon called a Roger.

Mines the one with the "Homer" in the pocket, getting ready to Home you.....

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Black Helicopters

GILT

Serves her right, sure enough. As the guy said...

"...she made a very simple interaction with the police a very difficult task."

And heaven knows we ought to make things easy for the guys with the guns.

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"By the book!"

WTF? Who wrote that fucking book? They could use a good bit of e-justice themselves. I'm guessing the book says, "Fuck it. Just use the taser. They have to put up with your shit but you don't have to put up with anything you don't want to. You don't have to feel threatened in any way, remember, you are the law!"

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Anonymous Coward

Health and safety

I noticed from a recent article about UK police taserings (tasings?) that the thinking nowadays seems to be veering towards use of the taser in preference to physically restraining people, possibly because there's less likelihood of accidental bootings, broken limbs, suffocations, and stuff, and subsequent lawsuits and claims of brutality etc?

So really it's modern PC PCs protecting themselves by keeping their distance from perps!

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Go

Tase

As in "Don't tase me bro!"

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if you think the cop was in the right here..

..then you think it's ok to electrocute an OAP for having an opinion that you don't agree with. doesn't matter if she said "tase me" or not, it was the act of a COWARD and a BULLY. He is meant to set an example as an officer of the law and a responsible member of society, good character and all that, and here he is demonstrating, and being backed up by his superiors to boot, that it's perfectly ok to incapacitate an elderly lady just because she mouths of, using an often lethal "non-lethal" weapon to do so. If she'd been coming at him with a knife, even then it would have been wrong. he had the physical presence and training to deal with her in many different ways but no he pulls out his taser. what a hero. If she was my granny and i lived in America I'd go and break the b*st*rd's legs, copper or not.

after all if a copper can't cope with harsh language from whatever source without getting violent then they aren't coppers, they're just thugs in uniform. god help her if she'd been a young black man, i imagine that she would have been shot whilst resisting arrest.

there's something fundamentally wrong with you if you think what he did is ok or excusable. but then there's something fundamentally bl**dy well wrong with the world these days all over, isn't there?

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"simple encounter very difficult"

well, i thought police are supposed to be trained for difficult encounters, if there weren't any difficult encounters, then i don't think we would need so many police.

Problem is that some uniform sporting taser toting Marine wannabe finds it easier to tase someone into submission than to try to deal with them properly first - its just easier isn't it, it doesn't involve thinking. Even if she was relentless, and i mean totally impossible, don't tell me he couldn't have still dealt with it better.

From the video i'd say the granny was definitely being...upfront, but no where do i see a threat to the officer or anyone else, and if she wants to dispute the ticket, thats her right. Tasers wind me up, they're a cop out....

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Anonymous Coward

Good job she didn't have a cell phone

http://www.dvorak.org/blog/2009/06/07/high-school-student-tasered-for-using-a-cell-phone/

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Crap

She deserved all she got. Why does age allow you to be abysmally rude, as she was?

I think the noun should be taser, but I'm conscious that words get their own life. Over a century ago, toilets produced by the excellent business of Thomas Crapper carried his name on them. After a while they came to be known as Crappers. The rest was history.

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Flame

Not so innocent grandma

If you've seen the longer version of the dashboard video, this altercation went on for over 7 minutes. The grandma was foul-mouthed and obstinate, to say the least. The cop was trying to arrest her when he got her out of the truck and she basically resisted arrest. I'm not one to favor the cops, but whether she's 72 or 27, she should have done what she was told and had her day in court.

Even more telling was the outright lie she said in her statement that she was neither abusive or disruptive...the video certainly tells a different story.

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Anonymous Coward

Good

I'm sick and tired of people thinking they can be arseholes just because of their age. For the good of society mouthy shits aged 1-18 or 60-death should be tased* at the first sign of any belligerence.

There are days when you just have to love Texas, even if it was stupid enough to elect George Bush as governor.. twice (why does no one ask why George Bush Jr is the only member of that family that speaks with a Texan accent).

* Both tased and tasered are spelling errors apparently.

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Anonymous Coward

@Tawakalna

Seems more like resisting arrest to me. Better she tasered than gunshot, no?

I have a piece of little known news for you, ready? in America, many people have guns. OAP's with guns can usually be considered rather dangerous. Gobby resisters of arrest who have been warned vis. a vis. said tasering should naturally be considered potentially dangerous and therefore fair game.

And you sir, are a prick. A prick, sir.

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Zap her again!

Granny needs to chill the hell out. I think if the cop had tried to cuff her w/o tasering her, she would have hit him, and then she'd be in jail for assaulting an officer. So he actually did her a favor. And after she gives him that much static, she's going to get cuffed. No two ways about it.

"not argumentative/not combative" my left butt cheek! She needs to spend a couple weeks in jail to sit and think.

I had a granny like that, and she'd go off like that regularly. I wished I'd had a taser.

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lethal force?

considering a taser is a substitute for a gun that's less likely to kill and is to be used in the same circumstances as any other lethal force...

is that officer up on charges of attempted murder (it was obviously premeditated, he said so himself prior to doing it)? has he been asked to justify his decision that is was appropriate to use lethal force against someone who is not any form of physical threat to him and is not directly endangering his life?

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Anonymous Coward

This speeding senior thought she could outbluff the law

but she got more of a charge than she bargained for.

/Sheriff John Bunnell

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Anonymous Coward

@ Tawakalna

Hear Hear

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Demolition Man

Am I the only one who is reminded of Demolition Man wherein the police department sees Phoenix being violent and one of the officers says "We're police officers. We're not trained to handle this!"?

As for the "I'm not normally one to side with the coppers..." AC, I suppose it would have been OK for him to shoot her, too, if she said "Go ahead and shoot me"?

And as for Mr "should be respectfull to the police", no, not necessarily. Respect is earned, not given. Courtesy and tolerance should be given to everyone, but not respect. All of the police officers I've had contact with do not deserve respect. I don't doubt that there are good cops out there who became cops because they want to help and protect people. But I think you'll find that the majority of them became cops because they have a god complex and get off on the control it gives them.

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Anonymous Coward

You will obey!

"She turned a simple interaction with an officer into something difficult..." Sheriff T. Pepper

And so she was physically punished for making things 'difficult'? There was me thinking that only violence, or resisting arrest was enough to warrant a reasonable physical response and that physical punishments were illegal?

Or is it that Tasers leave no physical marks? How the world has changed.

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re knife

> If she'd been coming at him with a knife, even then it would have been wrong.

>

Disagree

1. "there are no winners in a knife fight", don't get into those, there will be cut and stab wounds.

2. Knife is a very dangerous weapon even in amateur hands.

In fact if someone ever really attacked me with a knife I would end the fight real quick in the most efficient way available (as a civilian I don't carry firearms and the leatherman is not suitable for fighting so this means unarmed unless I happen to have something resembling a stick) and the attacker will be lucky to survive with repairable damage as there will be zero consideration for the attackers safety (ie. don't bother trying to avoid breaking joints or bones, don't worry about him hitting his face or other part of the head [this is potentially lethal] to whatever terrain features are at hand, and if the knife cannot be separated from the attacker it will be directed away from me: towards him...).

Even with the local *really* strict laws about "overuse of force in self defence" (which just about automatically considers everyone who has ever trained martial arts "overuse force" if they so much as touch the guy) knife or any other deadly weapon means just about anything is justifiable (kicking his face in when he was already incapacitated in the ground is not, though).

The whole "attackers safety" is bit weird concept, but that's the state of the law here, if someone comes at you with just their fists and boots you are expected to subdue then without causing damage (if you have a good reason why you could not simply run away), martial artists are supposed to be able to do this (even if they have only trained for a few months, which is absurd, I have trained little over ten years and still don't consider myself much of an artist), "regular joes" get small bit more leeway.

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Anonymous Coward

don't verb nouns

the verb is clearly "to tase" and a "taser" is an object/person who tases, while the recipient it clearly the tasee

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Stop

What kind of world are we creating?!...

Police Officer quote: "She made a very simple interaction with the police a very difficult task."

What so that's reason to risk killing her?! ... She used harsh words at a police officer ... so thats enough to risk killing a 72 your old woman with 50000 volts?!

My god, what kind of world are we creating where words can be so violently suppressed. Yet we are suppose to just accept this behavior!?!

Its yet another example of how our societies are going backwards not forwards.

Also so much for "land of the free" where this kind of behavior is just accepted against a little old 72 your old woman! ... I've always been suspicious of a country that tries so hard to keep convincing and so brainwashing its people into believing they are free, when the evidence like this video, keeps on showing they are not free. They are just oppressed by a different set of rules and these rules are very clearly backup up by considerable violence.

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Still wondering

How she could have been charged with resisting arrest? If she did, the tase(r) people should refund the officer

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Paris Hilton

Granny zapping? Seriously?

As an officer of the law, he is expected to remain calm and in control of a situation, not loosing his cool. Using a taser of a 71 year old woman - confrontational or not - is an abuse of power. Yes she was in the wrong, and she was clearly being difficult, but a taser is a dangerous LAST SOLUTION to someone who is physically resisting arrest, surely? Something tells me this little old dear couldn't exactly put up much of a fight his this guy wanted to cart her off to jail.

Just because an irate OAP retorts "Go ahead, tase me!" doesn't warrant that reaction from officer. The are several instances where people have been seriously injured / killed through the use of tasers, most of them far younger that 72.

I for one am disgusted at this and hope that the officer is brought up on charges of gross misconduct. If he's unable to control himself. let alone a difficult situation, he's no business wearing the badge.

To those of you who condone this - do you honestly believe he'd exhausted his options? Should tasers not be an absolute last resort, short of firearms?

Paris - because we all know she loves a good shock.

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Dead Vulture

Hmmm

Don't tase me bro.

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Anonymous Coward

Is the verb to tase or taser?

The verb is "electrocute" or "assault".

Fortunately (relatively speaking) in this case, it is not "murder".

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Hmmm

I have little sympathy for her.... but my concern is that Tasers are not seen here as non-lethal, but "less-lethal" - the cops seem to consider it totally non-lethal and use it as a tool for enforcing compliance, which is a bad mistake as it has often resulted in death.

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Anonymous Coward

(untilted)

Insisting on what has been agreed here is an irrelevant signature, is bad enough. But threatening the refusnik with gaol is nothing short of official bullying; and what we have come to expect from authorities. Likely to upset the officer ?!? They should be trained to take it in their stride, or else they are falling in their job. And should realise that giving a ticket is likely to be upsetting to those they've just booked. Taking it like "water off of a duck's back" is the sensible option, stops things escalating to ridiculous levels.

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Unhappy

"You will respect my authoritah!"

*bzzzt*

Simple message sent by this: Annoy/disrespect a policeman = get a tazering.

Bad, bad things..

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Pirate

RE: Matthew 13 and cop-bashers

RE: Matthew 13

Lol! Still makes me chuckle whenever I hear that line.

RE: cop-bashers

To all the idiots protesting the tasing, do you have any idea how dangerous it is just stopping on the hard shoulder on an A road, let alone a motorway? Police officers in places like the US and UK are trained to keep the time spent stationary at the side of the road to a minimum, and to definately avoid any kind of physical confrontation that could spill out into the roadway as that is usually fatal. Age is no protection under the law - the officer may not have handled it the best way possible, but the granny was out of control and seriously looked like she was going to clout the guy. Any such struggle could have ended with the granny or the cop or both getting hit by a car, whereas the tasing put an end to the granny's behaviour and stopped any chance of a road accident from her bad behaviour. Personally, I don't have a problem with the tasing - she should have grown up by that age.

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Alert

www.Excited-Delirium.com

www.Excited-Delirium.com (do not forget the dash).

One of many blogs on the subject of tasers. Many arguments examined and shredded. Cheers.

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This post has been deleted by its author

Guh Tchuh!

This is one of those previews from a 'German Granny Sex Movie' where she gets double teamed at the side of the road by the two officers left in the cop car when their mate is unable to reload his Taser.

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What are the police?

The police are a necessary evil in all societies, but in civilised societies we should always remember that they are just as evil as they are necessary.

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Walk Away

This is really interesting as it shows the amazing hypocracy of the situation and law these days. Loads of people would say she should have simply signed and gone on her way to have her day in court later. No problem. Maybe so. Maybe she made life unnecessarily difficult. However, so did the cop. When she refused to sign, he could simply have written 'refused to sign' and then walked away. No more problem. But no, he had to take it further. Whether he intended to arrest her or whatever doesn't matter. He had the choice to do his duty fully and then walk away. He chose not to take it. Instead, he chose a route that was bound to lead to confrontation and trouble. Why? Because he's a cop and he has a god given right, that's why. In other words, he likes lording it around the place. Path of least resistance isn't of interest to him. Forcing others to do what he says or take the 'consequences' is.

So, I'm not defending the granny. She made life unnecessarily hard. However, the cop was equally guilty of the same. Difference is, he's got a badge and an ego...... And a taser and a gun. I bet he ends up shooting and killing someone unnecessarily in the future because he refused to take the path of least resistance.

Stupid and very poor cop.

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Boffin

The worst part about this

Is that Travis county tends to be very lenient with its sentencing - even considering the punishment for refusing to sign, that tasering will probably make up the majority of her punishment. Oddly enough(or not), neighboring Williamson tends to throw the book at just about everybody and throw it HARD.

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Alert

Closed Captioning

Because there is no subtitles here, I would like to point out that the people were from Texas... and it is clear as day that when the lady's response to the officer annoucing an action, what she said (written out) was...

"Go ahead, tease me!"

How is anyone that is told they will be ridiculed expected to prepare for (controlled?!)electrocution?

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@Mad Mike

in all 50 states you will be arrested for not signing the ticket. Signing the ticket is your promise to appear in court. No the officer does not have the right to walk away . Its mandatory for the cop to arrest. I've yet to seen a police dept that would allow the office to simple write refused to sign ticket. In most DMV hand books in the US, it tells you refusal to sign a ticket will land you in Jail.

Now here is the question. You have some that's is 72 and wont let you cuff them ? Do tase them , or use physical force.

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By the book? You gotta be kidding!

As far as I remember, the Taser was introduced as a less-lethal replacement for guns. To be used in the situations when you'd otherwise shoot the adverse party. So if he did everything "by the book", it means that he would have had the right to shoot the old lady. My guess is he wouldn't even have dare to *threaten* her with a gun. So he shouldn't even have *mentioned* the Taser, let alone taken it out -and certainly not used it!

Just a bullying twat using a potentially lethal weapon against a non-threatening weak person because he did not want (or wasn't able) to use words. Who said merkin coppers are armed apes, trained to kill?

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If you do the crime you do the time!

What happened to respecting an officer? If this were anyone else the officer would have been praised. Age descremination or does the law apply to everyone? If he tried to hold her physically he could have broken bones. Should we turn her loose if she has a big enough fit? Rude is rude. The guilty person is the elderly lady, Not the officer.

Where do we draw the line. I commend the officer. It is his job to enforce the law and she should have obeyed the officer.

She got exactly what she asked for and will now get thousands of dollars because she was supposedly abused. Any other country she would be in jail. If she were a LITTLE OLE' LADY,(AND I USE THE TERM LADY, LOOSELY) THIS NEVER WOULD HAVE COME TO THIS. THE BLAME IS ON HER NOT THE OFFICER.

Interesting, lady like behavior.

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Abuse of authority is nothing new.

If you have a hammer every problem looks like a nail.

In a similar story police in Cincinnati twice tasered then shot a Chihuahua. Vicious nasty creatures that they are.

You could have subdued it with a milk crate or a swift kick perhaps.

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@Mat B

Exactly.. whats more dangerous?.. A deranged old lady pushing and shoving someone (anyone) on a hard shoulder, or taking them down quickly before there's two fatalities?

If he had went in physically, then the lefties would cry 'brutiality'; he went in with a taser, so the lefties cry 'brutality'. If he had let her loose to run around her car, there might have been two funerals to attend for family and friends.

Rock and hard place.. He was on a hiding to nothing in that case.. you can also see that he has his back to the road, to stop the mad biddy from running on to it.

NOTE TO ALL DRIVERS - Sign the tickets, say yes Sir, Thank you Sir, Three Bags Fulls Sir, and fuck off home. If you feel you're hard done by, get a solicitor to sort it out after.. don't get yourself, or anybody else killed by arguing there and then*.

*Unless you're on crack and are transporting 40k's of quality homegrown... I like to watch a good high speed pursuit as much as the next man.

Can we have a Taser icon?

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Unhappy

Tasers are a non lethal last resort

You don't fucking tase old ladies.... end of.

This shit will be commonplace here soon. My (late) old man was a (oldschool) copper, he'd think nothing of a punch up with a scrote who was up for it.. your nicked, job done. Old school coppering at it's best. Tasers should be meant as a last resort to a tooled up knobhead who presents a real life threatening danger not a member of the blue rinse brigade who is a 'bit pissed off'.

Tasing fucking hurts.. bad. It would have been less painful / torture to have brained her with his truncheon. So it's non lethal... so is fucking waterboarding and that doesn't hurt.

Fuck this copper, fuck tasers and fuck Nu Labour for allowing them over here.

(I know this was a septic moment and not here)

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Flame

Get real.

Bah. 10 years ago she would've been shot. Shes lucky all she got was tazed. Technology is a wonderful thing. And for those stating "lethal force" Please, get tazed, and then go get shot. Then come back and tell me which one has more "lethal force" That makes everything have lethal force. "The cops started chasing him, his heart couldn't take it, he had a heart attack and died, Cops should no longer chase people!" Right, Next time Jimmy jobless is ransacking your house looking for money to make his next score, I'll be sure to tell the cops outside to just wave as he makes a hasty exit. Because we don't want poor Mr. Jobless to have a possible heart attack, do we?

If you ask me, bitch was looking for a meal ticket.

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Dead Vulture

The granny mouthed off...

But this poor dog ...

http://news.ninemsn.com.au/world/823986/police-taser-shoot-boys-2kg-chihuahua

copped a tasering and then shot, 3 times no less - for just nibbling some fingers!

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