Feeds

back to article Tesla and Daimler plan joint 'affordable' e-car

Daimler AG’s recent “double-digit million Euro sum” tie-up with Tesla will result in an “affordable” electric vehicle, Tesla’s CEO has announced. Elon Musk was keen to keep further details under wraps, but promised website Green Car Advisor that further details will be released later this year. It’s reasonable to assume that …

COMMENTS

This topic is closed for new posts.
Flame

Tesla has already have a Total Recall.

Give me a break! Tesla can't even do a limited production run without having to do a RECALL of EVERY car they've made!

And BEWARE of Daimler AG ... they looted and F'd over Chyrsler and then ran for the hills safe and sound in Bavaria ..... laughing all the way!

Electric cars are a farce ... WHERE does the electricity come from? Polluting electricity generation! And just wait till you get your electric bill .... it ain't free, green dopes!

0
0
Silver badge

@hmm

>And BEWARE of Daimler AG ... they looted and F'd over Chyrsler

So that's how Mercedes learnt how to build cars by copying the PT cruiser?

Lets hope they don't manage to snap up Vauxhall.

>WHERE does the electricity come from?

If harnessed properly, internet flames could provide 97.6% of our electrical needs.

A group of posters, specially selected for IQ, locked in a room and fed on Daily Mail and Fox news can provide an endless (if rather noisy) source of power.

0
0

sounds okay

Yeah, electric cars aren't really practical right now, but I think they have no problems that can't be fixed with more money - except for the "where does the electricity come from" bit, of course. For that, we'd need a lot of nuke plants, or a miracle (from what I can see, most greenies seem to be opting for the miracle). Still, if enough investment resulted in a practical electrical car, that'd be half of the problem fixed at least.

0
0
Linux

Electricity is more efficient

You might want to read the white paper on Tesla Motor's site. The "long tail pipe" hypothesis is very weak and electric vehicles are cheaper to operate and have a lower carbon signature (even including that coal makes part of the electricity generated) than regular vehicles.

The main concern for me is the range. We are are a one car family and occasionally we need to go a long distance. If we had two cars, electric vehicles would be much more attractive to us.

Warm regards, Rick.

0
0
Thumb Down

Excuse me?

Gunning for the 911 in terms of performance and ... practicality? How about something really practical, like a pickup truck or a hot hatchback or a delivery van? Oh, wait, the tech can't handle it yet.

Nevermind that Daimler has been as trustworthy as Kim Jong Il and acted like a Chicago politician towards Chrysler; nevermind that Tesla has had a higher rate of recall than either British Leyland or AMC; this will be genius and heaven on earth, using electricity to power small cars! I'm investing in coal mines and power cable manufacturers ... except the former have all been closed by greens and the latter have all been shipped to China.

Boy, I never thought dealing with Texans and Arabs would make oil look good ...

0
0
Happy

18 grand for a leccy car - do me a favour!

What planet are they on ?

Any car over 10 grand is doomed to fail now.

6 grand is closer to the needs of us Brits.

The days of Treasure Island are long gone and the bloated execs in the car industry had better wake up to that fact.

A car is a commodity just like a fridge or TV which you don't sell with with half naked bimbos.

My car is a Skoda Fabia vRS diesel which is very fast, economical, comfortable and robust. It is the type of car which our UK car industry should have been churning out 5 years ago.

Only Fiat and some Asiatic firms know that the way forward is in small, economical cars.

0
0
Paris Hilton

More vaporware

Wake me up when I can actually go out and buy one.

0
0
Stop

Refer to the laws of thermodynamics...

The amazing thing about polluting electricity generation is that it's more efficient than the polluting thermomechanical energy produced in your car by burning gasoline. Combined cycle turbines can be nearly 60% efficient, if memory serves... yes, that's 60% efficient still burning fossil fuel in some cases (though it's not that bad a deal if it's natural gas, at least in terms of particulates and other combustion byproducts)... however, that 60%+ thermal efficiency could also come from nuclear, which, if people were willing to trust something more complicated than burning things, would be as near zero pollution as you could hope to get (until fusion comes along in a few decades/centuries, anyhow). Or wind, or solar, or hydro, all of which have life cycle environmental cost, but don't necessarily involve burning lots of decomposed dinosaurs.

There is, oddly enough, still and upside even if it is polluting coal... think about the smog issues of LA, Beijing, and many other large cities. A good portion (the majority?) of urban smog comes from hydrocarbon fuel burned in the relatively inefficient (20-30%) internal combustion engines in cars, trucks, buses, non-electrified light rail, etc. From a health standpoint, moving that pollution load to isolated point sources to disperse over wide areas is probably far better than the low air quality common in cities. In short, you are correct, there is no such thing as a free lunch... but there are less expensive, and sometimes nearly free lunches, and also lunches paid for by other people which may be applicable to this conversation.

0
0
Happy

Bitten once...

It's all new technology and so the first couple of companies are bound to hit problems. Hey petrol car companies are still recalling cars IIRC.

Still I bet Tesla won't put their car into Top gear again....

0
0

@ Martin

"""...can provide an endless (if rather noisy) source of power."""

May I just say: Bahahahahahahahahah! Good thing I was post-gulp with my coffee, or I'd be hunting for some towels about now.

And I agree that a 911 is an absurb 'practicality' target. Can you carry one person and a grocery sack? Check. Can you carry two people and a small handbag? Check. Can those two people or one and groceries drive across a country (I'm thinking LA to NY, not one of your puny European Countries : -) ) in a couple days? Err... probably not.

Honestly I'd rather have something of similar performance and functionality to a GTI or WRX (For a similar price too...) before something that can go like a 911, but costs more than a 911 Turbo.

Also I've been known to drive ~24 hours straight in my GTI (filled to the window sills with my junk, natch,) which it does just fine, with only a few 10 minute stops for fuel and micturition. Wonder how long Tesla's next experiment will take to go 1900 miles.

And currently you'd have to put on some serious mileage for the electricity / gas savings to make up for the extra price in any electric vehecle. Which would mean even more serious charging. And (I haven't done the math) the battery in most cases would probably be dead long before you broke even.

0
0

Electric Mini?

Im holding out for that 540hp Mini, a motor in each wheel, 0-60 in 5s that we saw on the Reg some months back. Whats the betting I could solder on some bigger capacitors too when I get it :)

0
0
Bronze badge
Coat

I don't know...

"A car is a commodity just like a fridge or TV which you don't sell with with half naked bimbos."

I don't know... I don't think I'd mind too much if my new TV or Fridge came with half-naked bimbos. (but what about *their* carbon footprint?)

0
0
Silver badge

Not really absurd

>And I agree that a 911 is an absurb 'practicality' target

But it makes sense from a business point of view.

If you were a small Californian hifi company it would make a lot more sense to try and sell $10,000 audiophile amps than try to compete to make iPods.

Fiat/Hyundai/VW etc will knock out an electric vehicle for the masses but if you are first in the market it makes a lot more sense to pick the profitable customers.

Especially since the torque characteristics of an electric motor mean you get huge 0-60 acceleration.

0
0
Thumb Down

Affordable?

Halve the price and it might be. Have these people read the Financial Times recently?

0
0
Boffin

Sounds to me...

like D-B are having to call in help with the SmartEV...

0
0
Unhappy

£18,200? - not over here...

Yes, £18,200 / $30,000 in US, but judging by other cars, before it gets over here, it's going to be more like €30,000 or even £30,000.

0
0
Gold badge

@RichardSmith

"We are are a one car family and occasionally we need to go a long distance."

I think that's the usage pattern of a very large number of people (self included). We have an old banger that will need replacing in a few years time and I reckon it might actually be cheaper to by a small car and earmark the thousands that we'll save for hiring a larger one for the few occasions we actually need it.

But its even cheaper still to run the old banger into the ground. At least half of the cost (monetary and environmental) of a car over its lifetime seems to be the up front cost. That would seem to imply that the petrol vehicles will have an edge over the leccy techs for some time yet.

0
0
Gold badge

@Peter Revell

You forgot "and greenwashed to fuck" on the car description.

Diesels. Pollute like it's going out of fashion in all the really nasty areas, but have low CO2 emissions and that's what's trendy right now courtesy of the eyecatching "oh noes is globall worming 2 kilt us all" headlines.

In a minute somebody important'll notice the obvious connection between the massive smog problem that's building up and the dash for diesels and there'll be a handy purchase tax adjustment in this area.

0
0
Thumb Up

@Richard

Haven't you ever heard of the milk float? It's actually what people used to take the piss out of 'leccy cars for being like.

@Andy, others

£18k is fairly affordable- it's not far off Ford Mondeo costs, and no-one (in the UK) would call a mondeo driver and elitist rich bastard. Hence it's pretty much affordable.

Unfortunately it'll be nearer £30k by the time it gets to us, which will make it vastly less affordable.

@Peter Revell

No, cars over £10k aren't doomed to fail. If anything, cars under £10k should be more doomed as people go for better second-hand cars. I mean if you had £10k you could go for a brand new top end small thing or a decent former-top-end second-hand car that can comfortably do long distances and sitting in traffic.

Small, economical cars are- generally- crap for long distance driving. Yes, you can do it but I'd much rather sit in a BMW than a Fiat Panda for a 600 mile drive. Full disclosure- I did 500 miles in an old 3-series (driving) and about 120 miles in a Panda last week. The beemer was fun and I could comfortably walk / run about afterwards. The Panda left me with backache.

0
0
Thumb Up

@TeeCee

"Diesels. Pollute like it's going out of fashion "

Erm. No.

A 10 Year old Model, possibly. One built by an American manufacturer, probably. Even a modern diesel that hasn't been properly maintained - maybe.

Modern, European / Japanese Diesel Cars < 7 Years Old that have been properly maintained? No. And newer ones are even cleaner.

Not to mention that Diesel engines generally last 2-3 times longer than equivalent Petrol/Gas engines.... You wouldn't buy a petrol car that had done much more than 150,000miles and expect it to last very long.

You *would* expect a decent diesel to easily do twice that. (I have a friend with an 04 VW Bora PD TDi that has done 450,000miles and is still going strong) So how much pollution is caused by the manufacture of all those replacement Petrol cars?

Getting Back ON topic - it's good to see that they are going for a more "affordable" car, but I agree with other posters on here that by the time it gets to the UK it will likely be £30,000 If not more.

Currently the Vauxhall/Opal Ampera looks like the best of a bad bunch, but god knows how much that will be by the time they've added "Blighty Tax"

0
0
This topic is closed for new posts.