So many f*ckwits, so little time...
@ By ACoward 15:43 GMT
"Artists create for art. If they're not creating for art they're just money-grubbers, slightly more cynical than everyone other money-grubber."
You appear to be saying that if someone enjoys doing something, they should not get paid for it.
Let's see how that plays out...
"Programmers program for art. If they're not programming for art they're just money-grubbers, slightly more cynical than everyone other money-grubber."
"Doctors and nurses heal for the sake of helping. If they're not healing for the love of helping others they're just money-grubbers, slightly more cynical than everyone other money-grubber."
"Engineers design and tweak for art. If they're not designing for its own sake they're just money-grubbers, slightly more cynical than everyone other money-grubber."
"Truck drivers drive because they love being on the open road. If they're not driving for the love of driving they're just money-grubbers, slightly more cynical than everyone other money-grubber."
... Can we assume, BTW, that you hate and despise your job, and didn't end up in it because it was related to something that you enjoyed as a child? because, remember -- "(if you want to get paid for something that you get satisfaction from, you're just a) money-grubber, slightly more cynical than everyone other money-grubber."
@ ACoward :: 16:12 GMT
"Hey, why not sell the songs for a few pence a pop. I'd buy the ones I want from an album and not the others, we'd soon get better quality songs, because they're the ones that people will be prepared to buy..."
So which music site DO you buy your music from? You CAN buy individual tracks from most of them, I believe. ARE you buying it, or are you "just download(ing) the whole album for free and delet(ing) the tracks the don't want"?
Are you actual;ly putting your money where your mouth is, or just blowing wind?
On top of that, music can now be written, performed, produced, arranged, mastered and distributed by kids in their bedrooms."
First off, I'll bet that that kid is listening to music that has been written, performed, and mastered by (reasonably) skilled professionals. ...You know... the ones that the ACoward above believes should be doing it for the joy of it, not because they want to make a living at it...
Secondly, I'll wager that that kid has hopes of making a living doing something that s/he enjoys, like making music. Sorry, Kid... you're just "a money-grubber, slightly more cynical than everyone other money-grubber."
So, when it reaches the point that all that kid in the bedroom hears is music written by other kids in their bedrooms, guess what all music will sound like...?
When some kid in his bedroom creates something that is as glorious as Beethoven's Ninth Symphony, or as heart-wrenching as Gorney and Clare's "You're My Thrill" -- and releases it into the wild anonymously and for free -- then I might accept your point, as well as those of the ACowards above. Until then, not so much.
"(...) Or DJs (...)"
Again, the DJ's stock in trade is remixing what someone with more talent has created initially. You can take both a GOURMET beef dinner, and a lousy beef dinner and make hash out of them. You'll probably get better tasting hash if you make it from the gourmet dinner, so you'd better hope that there will always be chefs out there willing to create gourmet meals for free. Otherwise you'll have lousy source materials to make your hash from.
...But, in any case, it will STILL be hash.
"(...) Or anyone with a good idea, some talent and minimal kit."
Well, yes; having a good idea and talent ARE important -- you get THAT much, at least.
That point that some DON'T seem to get is that, if someone creates something that you want, tTHEY ARE NOT REQUIRED TO GIVE IT TO YOU JUST BECAUSE YOU WANT IT! It might be a nice thing to do, but it is NOT required, any more than you should be required to give me all of your money just because I want it. If I want something that you have created (and I'm differentiating here, between "want" and "need" -- a difference that most children learn before they are 10, or so, but which some people never DO learn!) I should find something that YOU want and trade you for it.
Now, that something that you want may be something as simple as me slapping my hands together rapidly and repeatedly after you give me that item, or it may be a huge wodge of cash, or something in between. If I think that the exchange is acceptable, we have a deal. if not, we don't make the exchange. The one right that I do NOT have is the right to force you to make the deal that only I want to make.
Anyone who says that artists should only create "for the love of art" is saying that the artist does not have the right to determine the value to himself of his own output , but rather must accept others' determination and abide by it.
That line of thought is one of the reasons why guilds, and unions, and Fair Trade commissions were invented. If anyone who argues that artists should only create" for the love of their art" works in a population that has benefitted from any of those sorts of groups, maybe s/he should re-think that position.