Wacky Jacqui Smith continues to believe her own increasingly insane press releases on ID cards. Yesterday she told the people of Manchester that they might be lucky enough to get their hands on ID cards earlier than the rest of the country. The Home Office is looking for "beacon areas" to further trial the cards from autumn this …
"people can't wait for ID cards" something's fishy here, right?
Looking to other countries across Europe there really isn't an issue having ID cards. They're widely accepted and probably no one feels threatened by them. But then again, I'm haunted by the feeling that in the UK "they" want the ID cards for all the wrong reason. Please, someone tell me, why is that?
This is how it begins
First there's the extreme porn law, governing what your allowed to see, next there'll be ID cards then, over the next labour government, there will be thought police monitoring for illeagal ideas via the handy Japanese mind scanning tech.
Bring out the straight jacket
the men in white suits want to talk to Jacqui.
"..shell-suited scrotes of southern Manchester.."??? Ha ha ha - I have vision's of the little sh*tes running round with illuminous yellow shell suits and big black curly wigs shouting "calm down, calm down, calm down"!! :-)
Paris in a shell suit.... Mmmmmm
Errrmmm... because it's backed by the biggest database of any size made anywhere detailing every breath you take and move you make.
wont be happy till I see people cutting them up infront of council offices alot like poll tax bills were once burnt.
Course, we may be far more sappy now days and just roll over and suck some New Lab pole becouse we're so scared of illegal immigrant, gun totting, alcholic, drug dealing, identity stealing, peado, terrorists.
To be honest I wont be happy till I see Jaqui and her puritain NeoGov comrades burnt in the fires of their own damnation.
Halt! Ihre Papieren, bitte!
Bang go my semi-regular Saturday night visits to Manchester for Jilly's Rock World. I get stopped and hassled quite enough by the Mancunian Plod as it is* without them dragging me off because I don't have a WackyCard, and therefore must be a terryrist**.
The only thing I can't wait for is to be rid of this lot. We need to learn something about civil disorder from the French and Italians, because the gov don't seem to understand that they are headed by the most despised people in the country, and we're fed up of their bullshit and draconianism.
*long hair, leathers. I thought the police stopped hassling metalheads in favour of gangsta rappers years ago, but they seem to make an exception for me...
** Asian missus and I have a beard. Nuff said, just ignore the fact that I'm usually arseholed at this time and chainsmoking, and Islam forbids beer & fags.
More lies dripping from her mouth
LLast time I checked you didn't need an identity card to open a bank account, or to travel to Europe, or to rent a flat. A passport would cover all three.
With the intelligence services saying that about 80 arrests was all that was needed to almost eliminate the threat from terrorists in the UK, what level of infringement of liberties to the whole 60 million population is justified to continue Labour's reign of fear?
Bottom line is this:
They preserve their position by giving people something to be frightened of, and nurture that fear - terrorism - and anyone is branded a terrorist if they don't agree with the party - even long time activists of the party who are appalled at the way it is being subverted.
They create a panic over an issue and then quote invalid statistics to back up the draconian methods they introduce to clamp down on what is basically a non-event - knife crime.
They continue to over legislate, introduce such diverse and complicated laws that no one but a legal professional can be expected to know if they are breaking the law or not, with ambiguous and knee-jerk reactions being trotted out to maintain the image that they are actually doing something. They measure activity, not results.
They squander the nation's wealth, placing your children, and your children's children in hock for the rest of their lives - they make the errors, they buy votes, and we have to pay for it.
In 1984 at the The Party had the dignity to admit that it acquired power for the sake of power. It should be a warning, not a "how-to" manual.
I'm ashamed and appalled that Jacqui Smith represents a constituency close to where I was born, that the people who live where I was born are prepared to support someone who pushes down on liberty and democracy in such a manner, and doesn't have the honour and dignity to accept that she is culpable for her ways.
As a good friend of mine once said, I'd rather risk a bomb than be a fascist.
I hope Manchester, traditionally a labour stronghold, stands up to the government on this issue, though I think it unlikely that they will risk another referendum after the congestion charge imposition was so roundly rejected by the people who live there.
...the only woman I have ever referred to as a 'knob end'.
The Daily Mash says it best, though...
Hopefully not Greater Manchester
I live in Wigan, which is in Greater Manchester. If she just means the City of Manchester, I'll be fine!
Presumably ID cards will help end gang violence
All Pold will need to do is check the ID. If the first name is Kevin or Shaquille or Omar, then an immediate arrest can be made.
@ Shell suits AC
Black curly wigs + "calm down, calm down" = Scousers, not Mankies
Going walkabout in Moss Side then, Jacqui?
I am quite sure the inhabitants will be rushing up to you in the street to let you know how they can't wait for you to force ID cards on them.
Nice to know, too, that times have changed since you couldn't walk around Peckham without a police escort, never mind south Manchester.
Paris, because it's a town on Mars near to the capital city, Wibble.
Basically because the ID card system that is being proposed in the UK is tied to biometric ID, which has been proved to not work. It will be a gloriously expensive system of little use, the government have not managed to come up with any justification for the introduction of the system that hasn't been rubbished straight away. The system will create a single point of attack for anyone wanting to make fake ID, because it will be the 'gold standard'. The government propose to charge any companies who wish to (and by wish to, read 'are mandated to, by the government') check an ID. We already have a perfectly good system of IDs. Furthermore they want to charge us something like £90 for the privilige of the card for which most people will have to travel a fair distance to attend an interview.
Add to this the woefull performance of the government with respect to data security and our traditional rights to freedom of association and that would seem to make a pretty good case against.
I've probably missed a few key points, but that should be enough to be going on with...
or is it the big lie?
"People come up and say they can't wait that long".
Or can she not detect sarcasm?
If she can seriously say that people are in favour of ID cards, with a straight face, her talent is unbounded.
Jacqui's quite right
I live in Manchester I don't want to wait until 2012 to see ID cards rolled out, I want to wait a lot longer. preferably long enough for the current government to be voted out and for someone else to come in and ditch the cards.
I managed to open a bank account, rent a flat and travel to europe without the benefit for an ID card years ago so I'm struggling to see that reasoning.
I don't necessarily object to the concept of ID cards, but I've not yet heard a good reason for us to introduce ours...
You could open a bank account, travel the world, rent a flat all without ID cards.
This woman is just making things up, and omitting all the people who are telling her ID cards are a very bad idea. It is scandalous really, and the definition of corruption.
They will be out soon, but I do hope they have to pay for their wastage of the country's money personally.
Why I don't like the cards
My personal objection to ID cards isn't the cards themselves, after all, I have a driving license that functions perfectly adequately as one.
One of my problems is the requirement to have or carry one, at my expense (one way or another, direct or taxes).
Secondly, the massive database that the cards will be linked to will be accessible by tens of thousands of civil servants. Yes there will be protection mechanisms in place, but anyone who thinks that it won't be abused needs to check out the number of cases of police staff (cops or civilian) abusing access to the PNC. The PNC only holds your criminal records and other crime related data, the national ID database will hold an extraordinary amount of personal data from all aspects of your life.
I also have issue with the image being put forward by the government that the whole thing is going to be "perfect" and un-forgeable. This increases the value of forging/hacking or otherwise manipulating the cards to the point where someone *will* crack it, it'll become valuable enough to warrant significant investment by the criminal world.
Then there is the significant cost, many billions of pounds, for something whose benefits have been significantly exaggerated (does anyone really think it will stop a terrorist?).
So, in a sense I don't have a problem with the fundamental idea of ID cards as they exist in many other countries, it's the UK version that I have a problem.
Black curly wigs? Calm down?
Er -- surely that's the Harry Enfield "Scouser" impersonation? Have you ever been north of Watford?
Did she mention the cost?
If she didn't start the conversation with, "This ID card will cost you £80 (but of course as an MP I get mine for free.)" I doubt she would have got a realistic assessment of the cards popularity.
you're thinking of the bin dippers. However, aside from that a+++ satire would read post again
she said: "I regularly have people coming up to me and saying they don't want to wait that long."
this group seems to be fairly self-selective, as anyone who would approach wacky with the idea that they *aren't* a good idea would most likely be held for 42days at Her Majesties pleasure before getting the chance to punch her in the mouth.
I'm glad i'm European; I can just leave and start working elsewhere within Europe without much hassle. I'm going to Finland. At least they have a decent heavy metal scene.
Care to join me, Mike?
I can't wait to get one
I live in Manchester and can't wait to get an ID card and while we're at it I hate iPhones.
Where the heck is Webster these days?
No thank you, Miss Wacky
I do not need the governments permission to travel, work or buy drinks, tyvm.
Has everyone joined their local No2ID group via http://no2id.net yet ?
But she's right
Some of us can't wait for the cards, you can't refuse to have one until they are made available.
doesn't even *begin* to describe this woman's barking-madness is she actually believes anyone with an IQ above that of a brain-damaged gerbil would think having their intimate details on this Orwellian Stasibase is a good idea.
Which is why she only talks about ID cards and not the highly intrusive and unnecessary database that is behind them.
Thank you for your answers!
Well, it was more a kind of rhetorical question. I, for my part, wouldn't mind the massive db if it was me who was in command and control of the data. And of course, I would misuse my power on any occasion, night and day all year round.
There is not much which makes me believe that others would act differently. And my confidence in the government isn't that great. After all, they didn't miss many occasion to show that they are either unable or reluctant or both to handle private data with due care.
...is a step on the ladder towards Communism.
I work in Wythenshawe, if I'd known she was here I'd have gone round and slapped her one.
As others have mentioned please don't confuse mancs and scousers. Even though I'm a Stopfordian it's still not nice.
Just out of interest...
I agree that the current government not only scares me, but disappoints me very much. I've always been a Labour supporter since I could vote, but the last 8 years have been, shall we say, "difficult". The problem is this, while it's clear that they are completely insane with power, of all the people available, I still think that big Gord has the best chance of salvaging the economy. While I wish they had a chance of getting in, the Lib Dems are, as usual, out of the picture. That leaves Cameron's blue brigade. I don't have any faith in Tory economics at all, and while it seems the Mr. Brown isn't doing particularly well at the moment, I can only imagine how exponentially worse the Tories would be. In terms of privacy, I can't see there being much difference, they'll just transfer the fear of terrorism directly to fear of immigrants, asylum seekers, and kids, and use it to their own ends. The policies they come up with are useless because they don't actually have any firm convictions, just reactions to whatever is in the Daily Mail at that particular point in time. That, for me, is even more worrying than an ID card scheme that will end up getting shelved because the public, police, and a large section of the government all hate it.
"law abiding Mancunians"
Not many of them soon, then...
"A passport would cover all three."
Or, far more wallet-friendly, a driving license. I think you'll find that rather more people have one than a passport too. Photo-ID ones have been out for some time now.
Of course, the *real* problem that they're trying to address is that not everyone has a passport and/or a driving license. Take away the compulsory aspect of ID cards and the whole thing becomes a white elephant to everyone, including the government. From this, it's fairly easy to see that any politician trotting out the official noncommital waffle on whether or not they want them compulsory is an out-and-out barefaced liar*.
*Presumably Wacky Jaqui wears asbestos pants as she hasn't burst into flames in public yet.
This bunch of cnuts aren't going to be around long enough to ever get this mad scheme off the ground, let alone paid for!
So to quote our SCOUSE cousins - "calm down, calm down"!
I love Jacqui comment that the ID card will allow us to open a bank account, rent a flat and travel to Europe for the first time.... of course so far we are all living under bridges with spare change and never go further than the kebab shop!
Paris because Gordon "Government nightmare"......
that is all....
"shell-suited scrotes of southern Manchester"??
"shell-suited scrotes of southern Manchester"
That's the same South Manchester that has Hale, Hale Barns, Timperly, Knutsford, Marple, Wilmslow etc then - hardly chav-ville what with all the footballers' wives
* "Some of us can't wait for the cards, you can't refuse to have one until they are made available."
WE ALREADY HAVE A FRICKING ID CARD
Its called your PASSPORT.
Sting in the tail
@Frank: "It's backed by the biggest database of any size made anywhere detailing every breath you take and move you make"
Ah, now I see, it's not going to be run by the police but by The Police.
i don't have a problem with id cards
i have a problem with being forced to pay to have an id card that i must own, if it's optional then fair enough i understand paying for it, but if it's mandatory that everyone must own one, then charging for the privelidge as well is just taking the piss.
not only that, you wil have to pay to update your details, not a problem for all, but if you live in rented accomodation you could potentially move every 6 months.
The worst part of this, is that contrary to all other laws regarding informational accuracy, this database and it's specially written laws, somehow make you liable if the data held on you is wrong. Unlike accepted practice, ie the DPA, which is to make the owner the database responsible for keeping the data in it accurate and up to date!
Revenge for TFI?
'you bastards. You turned down our road toll based revenue creation scheme, so we're going to fuck you over in a different way'
Why can't they just get the message and go away?
Re: Lucky us
There's a reason she's using those three examples (she could also have added "get a job"): the Labour government have been requiring you to present identification to prove you have a right to reside and work in the UK for a while now. So she can now simply say, "Oh look, this ID card solves the problem of all the other identification you would otherwise have to supply". it's not a long step from there to requiring you - under law - to present your ID card to the bank/landlord/employer before you can open an account, rent a flat or work. Of course, given Labour's definition of "voluntary", it'll still be a voluntary card - you just won't be able to function in society without it. "Voluntary Entitlement Card" anyone?
Mancunians WILL be lucky
The comparison is with Thatcher's notorious self-deception of "You WILL like the poll tax".
The reason Mancunians will be "lucky" to get ID cards PDQ, is because they were so damn bloody "unlucky" not to get the nu labour hand-out for a city-wide congestion charge. They were "unlucky" because they voted overwhelmingly against it. (Edinburghers will not be as "lucky" as Mancunians, despite also having voted against a congestion charge, because nu labour don't have the run of Scotland as they do of England - "unlucky" them). This is one whole kinky politics.
This is the lesson from the vicious Red Witch of Redditch, not also known as Citizen Smith - you must not bite the hand that feeds. You WILL lick the hand that feeds - Licky Licky Licky. This is one whole kinky politician.
"Hale, Hale Barns, Timperly, Knutsford, Marple, Wilmslow etc then - hardly chav-ville what with all the footballers' wives"
Er... I thought footballers wives were the essence of chav
"I still think that big Gord has the best chance of salvaging the economy."
Who the hell do you think sold all our gold (at the cheapest price he could get for it), spent all the countries savings, and then pension funds when he ran out of savings, and got the country into more debt that it has been in for donkeys of years.....
"big Gord's" policies have also encouraged the populace to get into record debt levels that are not sustainable in the long term no matter how much people wish they were, your average student now leaves university with £20,000 debt.
We have been changed from a nation of savers to a nation of debt whores!!!
So what is the solution to all of this? I know reduce VAT to 15% to encourage people to spend more money and get into yet more debt and borrow a shed load more money to piss up the wall..... Good one "big Gord" you most definetly are the "saviour of the economy"
Mines the one with the mostly complete emmigration papers in the pocket.....
Chav is a class thing, not a money thing. Footballers' wives *are* chavs.
I think you'll find the residents of Knutsford, Wilmslow etc all swear blind they live in Cheshire.
@ Shell suits AC
You clearly aren't from t'North. That would be scousers from Liverpool. Mancs are a completely different type of person (swagger, accent, etc.).
Ah - I remember Manchester. Lots of "our kid this..."
Here's a B3TA flash video (NSFW - lots of swearing) about vikings at a kebab shop in Rusholme...
Getting back on-topic how is the ID card going to work? The security infrastructure required probably isn't in place. Are card bureau's lined up to produce cards. Having worked on ID card projects in the past - giving these to young children/teens will resort in a huge return rate on damaged cards (using them to scrape ice of windows etc).
I would have much preferred how they do it in Sweden where the ID card is from your bank (i.e. the picture printed on the credit/debit card) along with occupation and where. They have a huge security infrastructure and the ID card applicaiton (if its a JCOP/Java Card) just needs to be placed alongside the other applications such as Visa Chip and Pin.
Travel to Europe?
You can't even fly from London to Manchester without a passport, and former colleagues of mine from Spain who could fly to France and Germany with just their national ID cards needed a passport to fly to U.K.. I very much doubt this government will suddenly relax restrictions if we all have ID cards, so that blows that argument for having them out of the water.
ID cards, my @rse
I don't particularly have a problem with ID cards, so long as I don't have to carry it around with me, don't have to show it to anyone and don't have to pay for it.
I'd just lock it away along with my passport, driving license, EHIC, Birth Certificate etc....
The thing that I don't get about ID cards is they are supposed to help in the fight against identity theft and terrorism. Surely the Government and others could help in that by keeping our personal data secure. As for terrorists, it seems to me that they wouldn't bother too much, since they seem to like posting videos on the internet advertising exactly what they've done.
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